Joe Biden Presidency thread *Please read OP - Threadbanned Users Added 4/5/21*

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809693#Comment_117809693

I know this comes as a shock, but the US and the Taliban aren't currently at war. They are no longer enemies, a peace deal has been signed and it is absolutely in the Taliban's best interest that the peace deal remains in place.

Celticfire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809743#Comment_117809743

After the 31st when the Americans are gone what do you think the Taliban are going to do with that list? Throw it in the bin, forgive and forget?

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809213#Comment_117809213

When you take the dramatics out of your post it doesn't stand up.

All the above are positions Biden backed and still backs.

Unfortunately they are common foreign policy positions for all US Presidents.

Withdrawal is supported by both parties and is the right thing to do.

People should have been withdrawn months ago. Other countries did.

They turned a withdrawal in to a deeply damaging fiasco.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809743#Comment_117809743

That's true but the Taliban view the people on that list as traitors and apostates, deserving of death.

Maybe as you say it is no longer an issue for the US to be concerned about.

Bit rough on the people on the list facing the butcher's knife in a Taliban torture chamber. An internal Afghani affairs now I suppose, maybe you are right.

Given the damage done to Biden and the US from the nature of the withdrawal, the Taliban can feel assured that the US will be even more reluctant to get re-involved.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809045#Comment_117809045

Nope it is not logical and I assume that you're not dim enough to think it is, perhaps thats a generous assumption.

I see someone desperately looking for some equivalence and mentioning the Kurds lol. The obvious comparison is the disastrous withdrawal from Vietnam.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809987#Comment_117809987

when you take the dramatics out of your post , it doesn’t stand up.

People on the list aren’t facing a butchers knife or torture chamber. Their name was handed over so the Taliban would let them through checkpoints at Kabul airport and they could evacuate.

Morally, the Taliban will always be the enemy. Their ideology is abhorrent. But right now they aren’t the enemy literally. They signed a deal with the US and appear to be holding up their end. They need to hold up their end, it’s enabled them to retake Afghanistan. The IS group who bombed the airport are the actual enemy of the US and The Taliban, they want the US and Taliban to turn on each other again. It’s important that doesn’t happen.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809974#Comment_117809974

The problem isn’t the withdrawal. The problem was caused by the complete collapse of the Afghan defence forces. The intelligence community said they could hold for months. They didn’t even try.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810089#Comment_117810089

The defence forces, like Afghanistan, have a majority in support of the Taliban.

The Taliban force itself is so small that it is stretched thin on the ground.

Christy42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810089#Comment_117810089

I am wondering how the US intelligence community didn't get a sense that they wouldn't even try. Do we know why the didn't? I mean I can see a few potential reasons but I am not sure if there was a main one for no attempt by the Afghan defense forces.

kevthegaff

I wonder did they leave all the artillery there to strengthen the Taliban against ISIS and possibly from china/Russia in the future

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809213#Comment_117809213

A few things.

I don't think many people would disagree that the US withdraw from Afghanistan, but the nature of the withdrawal has been nothing less than a disaster.

There are more options available than staying 5/10/100 years more and leaving in the hurried botched manner that the US is currently doing.

Secondly, Biden has said a few times that the buck stops with him, except in almost every press conference he passes off responsibility to others. From the State Department, the Pentagon, the Afghani government themselves, and Trump.

It is no use standing up on a podium and saying, "The buck stops with me, but.. but.. but.. let me tell you who is really at fault"

Lastly, the Americans got involved to destroy Al-Qaeda and stop Afghanistan from being a safe harbour for terrorist organisations. Now, days from the deadline, 13 American military personal and scores of Afghani civilians have been murdered by ISIS who will settle in Afghanistan and do what they do...

So, what the **** has the last 20 years been about then?

This is a shitshow and will haunt Biden and the Democrats for years if not decades. They no longer have any moral authority, because if they crow about their higher morality and ethics to other nations or the GOP at home, all one has to do and point at Afghanistan and say, "Well, it's YOU who abandoned 20 million women and girls to the Taliban to live under a brutal and medieval version of Sharia Law, so tell us again how morally superior you are?" Over the coming months and years, pictures and film will start to emerge from Afghanistan showing what the Taliban are all about, a constant reminder and dripfeed to us all what the Americans left behind and abandoned.

Faugheen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810141#Comment_117810141

And not one of the cowardly justices would sign their name to the majority opinion.

That alone shows that this is a political decision hidden behind law interpretations.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810116#Comment_117810116

Too big to move quickly and they were running out the door.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810103#Comment_117810103

Intelligence people can't read minds. ANA were likely saying/doing enough of the right things in the run-up to the withdrawal to convince the Americans they would hold out for a few months at least.

Melanchthon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810169#Comment_117810169

From what I read this was completely expected and the majority of constitutional lawyers agreed though? Not on the rights or wrongs of an eviction ban but the manner which it was extended?

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810061#Comment_117810061

It is logical that you cannot have an evacuation without an occupation, therefore if one is "entirely" responsible for the **** show then they must also be responsible for the occupation?

I mean there would be no event without the occupation and "entirely" is all encompassing.

There is a transaction cost on entry and exit, that would have been known before the invasion, it's just now we have to pay it.

I never mentioned the Kurds. Wasn't that a trump thing? You know this is the Biden thread right? Comparisons are off limits apparently, trump is some unspeakable anomaly that's exists outside of normal comparison.

astrofool

My own opinion is that Biden will get through this largely unscuffed and earn plaudits in the medium term from actually grasping the nettle that frightened his forebears.

What's happening is sh*t and they should have had everybody out by now and those that could have and didn't get out months ago are pretty stupid for staying (and they should be doing better by the Afghani staff that they worked with and be getting them safe). There will be worse things to come over the next week or so, then it will fade away (bombings and atrocities will be carried out by the Taliban and no one will stop them, there will be pearl clutching when air strikes and drones are used to counter this).

The thread will also go quieter as the recent re-reg's will lose interest and wander off to the next big shiny thing but will be disappointed that nothing much changed in the US after it.

And as I've said, getting this done in year 1 is crucial, no president/party wants to be going to midterms or an election with this going on, this is what will frustrate the re-reg's the most, nowhere to direct their memes and energy except Hunter Biden again.

MadYaker

Biden isn’t going for reelection which is why he probably gives less of a fcuk.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117810887#Comment_117810887

Terrible as the last 24hrs has been , I'd tend to agree.

Fundamentally within a few days the US will be out of Afghanistan and that is what really matters on the ground in the US.

ISIS will be far to consumed with their fight with the Taliban to get up to much else for quite some time. The bombing at the airport is an effort to get the US to stay , not to push them out. If the US stays it pushes the Taliban to focus on the US again and not go after ISIS.

Sadly Afghanistan is going to slide into a pretty ugly and violent internal Civil War between the Taliban and ISIS-K with the Northern Alliance around the edges fighting both of them. Without question it is going to be a fairly awful place for quite some time.

However , the average US voter isn't really going to care by this time next year when the Election season is in full swing.

They will be caring about Jobs, Inflation and Healthcare - All the usual stuff.

Various people will try to make it an issue, but it really isn't going to stick and in fact might rebound back on those who are trying to beat Biden with it. After all , there's no side in the US that can legitimately claim anything remotely like the higher ground on this issue.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811008#Comment_117811008

He'll be just fine for re-election, those that may face him are a pretty oddball bunch who've pretty much alienated all the swing voters.

@astrofool

@astrofool Far more likely that Biden and Democrat supporters are wishing this to be the case, hoping that the Afghanistan debacle can somehow be wished away. It isn't going away - if anything, Afghanistan is only just getting started and Biden's name will become synonymous with the casus belli.

We've already seen Biden's approval rating tank (below).

And watching Biden wobble away from the podium demonstrates that, even if he were completely mentally agile, his physical stature is in serious decline. Goodness knows how he will last the rest of his term without making even more cockups.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeXW1Ys1KHg

A recent NBC News poll found that approval of Biden’s Covid handling fell from 69% in April to 53% in August, a 16-point drop.

Meanwhile, just 25% of voters said they approved of Biden’s handling of the situation in Afghanistan.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811334#Comment_117811334

It's going away as an issue for most American voters after the evacuation is done

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811334#Comment_117811334

This is someone that actually exercises and goes cycling (I know lifting a pint of beer can be hard work for some), his physical state is nothing to be worried about.

I'm sure your favorite news channel will try and keep it relevant, but nobody is watching that anyway 🤣

But, look, if a few % points drop during the Afghanistan crisis counts as a tank, then we'll be able to use your own terminology against you in the future :)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811469#Comment_117811469

The man can barely walk, just take a look at the video above (or, better still, how he wobbled away from the podium the other night).

The man can barely talk, too, as evidenced by the below.

By the time 2024 comes around, Biden will exhibit further mental and physical decline. Operating as US President is no small task; it takes its toll. This idea that Joe Biden is "just fine" is for the birds. The man is slowly disintegrating before our eyes - and that's not what the US needs right now in what is a turbulent political climate.

Last night, too, Biden was incoherent in his speech - mumbling endlessly from one sentence to the next. Periodic breaks, and almost a breakdown itself. It was an embarrassing performance which, if your granny had done it, you'd be concerned. But for some bizarre reason, Democrats overlook what is obvious to anyone else: that Biden is not cut out to be US President and his performance with Afghanistan will no doubt become one of many examples of his incompetence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ys5VWI29R8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811524#Comment_117811524

It's almost as if this man has had a stutter since childhood and that 80 million+ Americans were aware of that and still voted for him anyway. Using, you know, logical reasoning.

Do you believe that FDR was a good president?

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117808447#Comment_117808447

The US were able to hold off the might of the USSR in Europe by stationing a relatively low number of troops in Germany post WW2. They were able to hold off North Korea and China by stationing a relatively low number in South Korea. And have been able to control most of the Pacific with bases here and there.

You don't need a massive presence to control a country and hold off enemies. The Taliban would not have taken over if a relatively small number of NATO troops remained in Afghanistan, and not in front line combat either. Major combat operation ended in 2014, so anyone who refers to this as a 20 year war as Biden did is clueless. Its the equivalent of referring to WW2 as an 80 year war or the Korean war as a 70 year war just because a small number of US troops remained there.

The US and NATO will be back in Afghanistan within 10 years to clean up the mess they have left, particularly when ISIS or AQ use it as a staging post to plan attacks on the West.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811524#Comment_117811524

Biden is in a much fitter state at this stage of his presidency than 2 of the last 4 GOP presidents, also far fitter than his equivalent in the UK, he'll be just fine :)

But look, if you want to start comparing Biden's physical and mental prowess to others, then you might want to start another thread on it where you can be duly ripped to shreds as seems to be your wont on boards.ie.

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117809987#Comment_117809987

They are already talking about getting re-involved. Did you miss the part of Biden's speech where he said the US will hunt down the attackers? You can't do that without boots on the ground one way or the other and a local presence.

Ironically they may end up with more frontline operations than they were already doing.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811608#Comment_117811608

Stock response from the deniers

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117811608#Comment_117811608

Because I've seen speeches from his predecessor 😅