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Joe Biden Presidency thread *Please read OP - Threadbanned Users Added 4/5/21*

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    #21062
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359565#Comment_122359565

    It has nothing to do with a "black and white view". Currently what's on the table is Biden and Trump. Not anyone else. That's the reality of the matter whether you like it or not, and the question of who replaces Biden if and when the Democrats decide to pull the trigger is one that a lot of people cannot answer, because the situation isn't as childishly simplistic as just replacing him with person X.

    As far as I'm concerned neither candidate should be in the running. Biden is too old and Trump is a criminal who shouldn't be anywhere near the WH.

    But that doesn't change reality either.



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    #21063
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,936 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359369#Comment_122359369

    Indeed, I'm not disagreeing, but it's on paper. In reality she'd be decimated by Trump in an election, they'd eat her for breakfast. Likewise on paper H Clinton was a no-brainer, but to the unwashed masses she was a woman and sometimes made weird expressions and "there must be something to the crook allegations"

    People give many voters in the US too much credit.



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    #21064
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359662#Comment_122359662

    You are correct; those will be the ballot options (assuming no events in the interim).

    And, with those ballot options, Trump will retake the White House, and the coattail effect will give the GOP the Senate and Congressional majorities too. It won't even be close either.

    We all wish to avoid the above eventuality, hence why so many commentators are arguing for the diminished figure that is President Biden to step aside.



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    #21065
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359681#Comment_122359681

    Trump will retake the White House

    You don't know that. Nobody knows that.

    We all wish to avoid the above eventuality, hence why so many
    commentators are arguing for the diminished figure that is President
    Biden to step aside.

    Who replaces him and why would they be a worthy replacement?



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    #21066
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,350 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359565#Comment_122359565

    This is the issue. The Democrats are dependent on voter turn out to win. The Republican base are sure to turn out. Biden is doing nothing to drive voter enthusiasm, the Democrats entire strategy hinges on people coming out against Trump.



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    #21067
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359698#Comment_122359698

    All the polling only points in one direction. Trump is even ahead in places like New Jersey and New Hampshire.

    There's not really much point in further discussion here as it has become circular. I would urge you to read the op-ed by the NYT editorial board today and see if that sways you at all - I think it makes a compelling argument.



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    #21068
    nigeldaniel
    Registered Users Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭nigeldaniel


    All I'm seeing is some folks wishing Joe to fail; so they can watch Don reduce the US to a Snake Plissken's daydream/nightmare. I am still 100% behind Joe.

    Dan.



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    #21069
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359681#Comment_122359681

    Harris is not a good idea. Too many people in the States just flat out don't like her for various reasons as far as I can gather. Republicans won't be swayed because she's black and a woman, MAGA will despise her by default, and I'd wager a lot of Democrats find her abrasive themselves and that runs the risk of Hilary Clinton part 2. Plus there are just too many racists and bigots in America in general and that includes the undecideds. The second she steps forward she be accused of merely being the token candidate and that will germinate in a lot of peoples minds.

    So that leaves Newsom and Whitmer, who are almost completely unknown quantities. And just yesterday, Whitmer said she won't run even if Biden steps aside.



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    #21070
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359721#Comment_122359721

    Snapshot polls are frequently wrong and in the end there's only one poll that matters and that's the one that will happen in November. The rest are largely nonsense.

    I see you won't answer the question put to you however. Yet another poster who cannot answer a straightforward question with a straightforward answer.



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    #21071
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,936 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    I like Biden a lot, I have more than enough confidence in him and his aides to govern, but that's irrelevant. This is about winning an election among US voters, and for that he's "too old and infirm". Many Americans will vote for a rapist/felon over someone who apparently can't function in their eyes.

    Harris is a "nobody", two-fifths of Americans didn't even know who the VP candidates were. Crucially she isn't "new" and for anyone familiar with US politics, she has too many disadvantages (already losing a few percent just for being a woman)

    If the Dems can find someone new they have a solid chance



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    #21072
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359745#Comment_122359745

    My personal reference is Whitmer. But I think anyone who is centrist enough will do.

    You seem in very irate posting form. We all want the Dems to win, remember. This posting is coming from a good place i.e. figuring out the best way to achieve that.

    You can't just dismiss all polling by the way. It is the best indicator of future voting behaviour that we have.



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    #21073
    Igotadose
    Registered Users Posts: 13,464 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359455#Comment_122359455

    I think Harris/Shapiro is a great ticket, for the reasons you give and the 'east/west' California/Pennsylvania axis.

    Pritzker's kept Illinois afloat, but it's an economic basket case and GQP love whining about Chicago.

    Harris can bring the Biden fans, he'll still be POTUS and singing her praises coast to coast.

    2028 I can see Whitmer making a move, Klobuchar, Newsome, … But this time around if it's not Biden, it's Harris+someone. Hopefully the VP is a good debater as whoever CFTrump picks will be a midget in the debate, based on the names bandied about.



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    #21074
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359796#Comment_122359796

    Both Klobuchar and Harris have form in terms of running for the nomination - and it's not exactly inspiring.



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    #21075
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359785#Comment_122359785

    Why? Why is Whitmer a worthy candidate?

    And, no, not anyone "centrist" will do. There are far more variables at play here.

    Also, as I said, Whitmer has stated yesterday that she has no intentions of running. So unless something changes she's a non-starter.

    As far as my posting form is concerned, it's not "irate". It's straightforward. There's far, far, too much equivocation and bullshitting going on in these threads.



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    #21076
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359761#Comment_122359761

    If Harris, the actual Vice President, is a "nobody", what does that make Newsom? Or Whitmer for that matter?



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    #21077
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359842#Comment_122359842

    So, just for the record, what is your own unequivocal position?

    Is it 'Biden is the candidate, he will trounce Trump in the general and bring in Dem majorities on the Hill'?



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    #21078
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359856#Comment_122359856

    Whether Biden will "trounce" Trump is an unknown, and nowhere have I said that he will.

    The only position one can have on the matter, as things currently stand, is that what's on the table is Biden vs Trump. That is the flat reality of the matter and no amount of if buts and maybes will alter that. Neither candidate is the dream option but, CLEARLY, Biden is the better choice when compared to Trump, even with Biden's flaws. Because what's on offer with Trump and the people that surround him is a dreadful prospect.

    This Presidential election really is down to choosing the least worst option.



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    #21079
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359847#Comment_122359847

    The Vice Presidency has historically been a parking lot for nobodies. Remember Dan Quayle or Spiro Agnew (you should google him, fun story)? Nobody else does either.

    I think the most useful description of the office of the Vice President was the one given by VP John Nance Garner (the first of FDR's) as being "not worth a bucket of warm piss". 😀



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    #21080
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359875#Comment_122359875

    Right, so you demand certainty from all other posters but fail to provide any yourself. Gotcha.



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    #21081
    scottser
    Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭scottser


    https://youtu.be/S9LZXheHddI?feature=shared

    I'm sure it's been posted previously, but Stewart's position is the only reasonable stance to take on the Biden shitshow.



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    #21082
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359876#Comment_122359876

    I don't need to google Quayle or Agnew.

    And again, if Harris is a "nobody" that really puts Newsom and Whitmer in the ha'penny place.



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    #21083
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359882#Comment_122359882

    I've given you a straightforward answer to the question you asked.



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    #21084
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 29,510 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359876#Comment_122359876

    It can be used that way but not necessarily.

    Biden was a VP, would likely have won in 2016 if he'd run.

    Bush Senior won as a VP.

    Al Gore as a VP in a toss up election with Dubya.

    If Harris did take over the nomination at the convention, then the media profile would shoot up overnight.

    If people don't know who the VP is, they are not going to be engaging with a primary process either, they are not going to know anything about a Governor or Senator of a distant state.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #21085
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,350 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359896#Comment_122359896

    They both have Governed states, to varying degrees of success. Harris has been a poor AG, an unimpressive Senator and dismal Presidential candidate



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    #21086
    Raoul Duke III
    Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359922#Comment_122359922

    Once you have the weight of the party machine behind you, a national profile can be built rapidly. As the previously little-known Governors Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and GW Bush could tell us.



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    #21087
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,224 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359954#Comment_122359954

    Governing a State to varying degrees of success doesn't mean you're a shoe in for Presidential candidacy though, and the three names that I see constantly being put forward in the last fortnight are fraught with issues. Harris, for the reasons I've already outlined, Whitmer isn't interested so there's no point in even talking about her, and that leaves Newsom whom millions of voting Americans haven't the first clue about.

    Out of those three, only Newsom seems to be a relative contender. But until that becomes reality, he remains simply a what if and I've seen nothing from Democratic circles to suggest that he's even realistically on the cards.



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    #21088
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,350 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122359982#Comment_122359982

    I've a bridge to sell you, if you think Whitmer isn't interested in the Presidency. All the hand wringing over national recognition is nonsense. Any candidate would get an immediate explosion in coverage. It would be wall to wall on every news outlet for weeks.



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