Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

Ficheall

I get you, but it's just posturing really.. Boris has a reputation for talking a big game and not delivering.
If they announce provisional dates, there'll be people booking weddings/holidays whatever for X date + 1, and then we'll be back to the same point with people even more disgruntled when they can't deliver.

Dr. Bre

MrMusician18 wrote: »

What got us here in the first place, oh yeah, everyone doing whatever the hell they wanted at Christmas.

Your still banging that drum

Coybig_

MrMusician18 wrote: »

What good is hope when it ends up dashed? Sure that only makes people more dejected?

Have you any factual basis for the claim that the hope given by this is going to end up dashed? You speak about this as if it is a certainty. Proof please?

Or is this just another in your long line of relentlessly negative, baseless crap?

timmyntc

Ficheall wrote: »

I get you, but it's just posturing really.. Boris has a reputation for talking a big game and not delivering.
If they announce provisional dates, there'll be people booking weddings/holidays whatever for X date + 1, and then we'll be back to the same point with people even more disgruntled when they can't deliver.

Boris may well hit his targets given a whopping 25% of UK have gotten 1st vaccine dose, & studies indicate after 1st dose you are 80% less likely to end up in hospital.

If they push on and vaccinate the vulnerable then could easily be hitting all those targets, if not pushing them forward by some weeks.

is_that_so

MrMusician18 wrote: »

What good is hope when it ends up dashed? Sure that only makes people more dejected?

A plan tells them there will be an end to it and they can then make their own plans. I don't think people need the detail in the UK plan just yet, just an indicator of what it might look like. That's the carrot. For now we don't even have a level at which such a plan might be ready to go. As for dashed hopes I think we expect that anyway and the way we will deal with that is to stop complying, not in really reckless ways but beginning to connect physically with more people.

Plumbthedepths

Coybig_ wrote: »

Have you any factual basis for the claim that the hope given by this is going to end up dashed? You speak about this as if it is a certainty. Proof please?

Or is this just another in your long line of relentlessly negative, baseless crap?

I'm guessing option 2

Monster249

MrMusician18 wrote: »

What good is hope when it ends up dashed? Sure that only makes people more dejected?

The arbitrary numbers that they've pulled out of their arse that we need to meet before they allow reopening are impossible to hit.

iamwhoiam

is_that_so wrote: »

A plan tells them there will be an end to it and they can make their own plans. I don't think people need the detail in the UK plan just yet, just an indicator of what it might look like. That's the carrot. For now we don't even have a level at which such a plan might be ready to go. As for dashed hopes I think we expect that anyway and the way we will deal with that is to stop complying, not in really reckless ways but beginning to connect physically with more people.

Already happened . People saw the negativity , no clear path , no hope , nothing positive to guide them and threw in tje towel
People are meeting in gardens now and being sensible , careful and mature about it
Without leadership people choose their own path

MrMusician18

Coybig_ wrote: »

Have you any factual basis for the claim that the hope given by this is going to end up dashed? You speak about this as if it is a certainty. Proof please?

Or is this just another in your long line of relentlessly negative, baseless crap?

Previous targets and dates have been missed, largely because adherence dropped approaching them (see December). It is a certainty that people will start to change behaviour 2 weeks out from target dates.

If you actually read my posts, I'm not relentlessly negative. I suspect that we will be largely opened up in May as vaccine starts to take effect in the vulnerable populations and we largely hold firm. Putting target dates on this jeopardises these potential successes.

Ficheall

timmyntc wrote: »

Boris may well hit his targets given a whopping 25% of UK have gotten 1st vaccine dose, & studies indicate after 1st dose you are 80% less likely to end up in hospital.

If they push on and vaccinate the vulnerable then could easily be hitting all those targets, if not pushing them forward by some weeks.

I agree - they've a huge advantage on that score. So what do people want our gov't to base their "steps to success" on? A similar roadmap? Because if we're waiting until we've a comparable number vaccinated to copy the UK, then it will be what, May by the time we reach their Step 1? Would people be happy with that "plan"? Maybe August for their Step 2?

MrMusician18

Dr. Bre wrote: »

Your still banging that drum

It's a drum that needs banging because it's the reason we are where we are.

We are quick to blame government but it's our fellow citizens we should be looking at.

agoodpunt

is_that_so wrote: »

Over 13,000 Brazilians living here legally, the vast majority are not in meat factories.

There is a brazalian dentist in phibsoro and a hansum man he is too was thinking of getting work now will hold off till i get to my home country to much info me thinks.
No rickshaw, a proper AXCS Chair
That was 10 days ago no symptoms or expectations of same

CruelSummer

Who thought we'd see the day when the U.K. and Boris Johnson would make an absolute holy show out of our 'Existing with Covid' plan that's due tomorrow. RTÉ were pathetic on Drive Time there on Radio 1 actually trying to talk it down - variants, is it too fast, someone please find us some negativity to spin...

What the Government SHOULD announce tomorrow:
- Reopening of schools
- Abolishment of 5km restriction and proper policing / ticketing of beauty spots. A busy beauty spot is not enough of a reason to keep people imprisoned for weeks on end under the 5km rule.
- Reopen outdoor sports like golf, tennis.
- Show us the goal as to what we are currently working towards - 'outdoor summer' / no indoor dining, etc. Absolutely pathetic plan and not good enough.

CruelSummer

MrMusician18 wrote: »

It's a drum that needs banging because it's the reason we are where we are.

We are quick to blame government but it's our fellow citizens we should be looking at.

Yes let's all turn on each other, report each other to the Gardaí, and most importantly keep blaming ourselves for Christmas. We need to meekly accept and swallow what our resident Zero Covid neuroscientists (Tomás Ryan), and others state without question or more importantly 'facts' to back them up.
Wear our masks and shut up, separate from our loved ones, stay home, stay safe, sanitise our hands - same answer NPHET give if they're asked for long term plans at their press conferences.

timmyntc

Ficheall wrote: »

I agree - they've a huge advantage on that score. So what do people want our gov't to base their "steps to success" on? A similar roadmap? Because if we're waiting until we've a comparable number vaccinated to copy the UK, then it will be what, May by the time we reach their Step 1? Would people be happy with that "plan"? Maybe August for their Step 2?

Keep vaccinating, and base the reopening on ICU & hospital numbers.
NOT cases. As vulnerable get vaccinated, the conversion from cases to hospitalisations to deaths will change a lot (in a good way).

So long as the Govt dont bow to NPHET in this, as NPHET will set a target of 0 in ICU - their approach of 1 death being too many doesnt work in the real world.

MethMartin

TheDoctor wrote: »

Do we see the North going with the same dates as mainland UK?

12 April - Shops, hairdressers, gyms and outdoor hospitality

17 May - Cinemas, hotels, performances and sporting events also restart at this point - including up to 10,000 fans in largest stadiums.

NI's tourism will be booming by the summer while Rep Ire will be locked down. All Irish people will be travelling up north and spending all the money they've saved.

caveat emptor

Good news, Very good news. Surprising astra one more effective than the extremely effective Pfizer one.

https://twitter.com/UniofOxford/status/1363900139891548166?s=20

Turtwig

CruelSummer wrote: »

Who thought we'd see the day when the U.K. and Boris Johnson would make an absolutely holy show out or our 'Existing with Covid' plan that's due tomorrow. RTÉ were pathetic on Drive Time there on Radio 1 actually trying to talk it down - variants, is it too fast, someone please find us some negativity to spin...

What the Government SHOULD announce tomorrow:
- Reopening of schools
- Abolishment of 5km restriction and proper policing / ticketing of beauty spots. A busy beauty spot is not enough of a reason to keep people imprisoned for weeks on end under the 5km rule.
- Reopen outdoor sports like golf, tennis.
- Show us the goal as to what we are currently working towards - 'outdoor summer' / no indoor dining, etc. Absolutely pathetic plan and not good enough.

England aren't planning reopening outdoor sports life golf/tennis until 29 March at the earliest.

MrMusician18

CruelSummer wrote: »

Yes let's all turn on each other, report each other to the Gardaí, and most importantly keep blaming ourselves for Christmas. We need to meekly accept and swallow what our resident Zero Covid neuroscientists (Tomás Ryan), and others state without question or more importantly 'facts' to back them up.
Wear our masks and shut up, separate from our loved ones, stay home, stay safe, sanitise our hands - same answer NPHET give if they're asked for long term plans at their press conferences.

No need to keep blaming ourselves for Christmas, but perhaps taking ownership of the damage this has caused would be a start. Then they start trying to make amends by actually trying their best to stick to the rules.

The quicker people do this, the quicker we get out of this mess. I don't hold out much hope for this though, we are only good at blaming government and not ourselves. It was always thus.

Arduach

agoodpunt wrote: »

There is a brazalian dentist in phibsoro and a hansum man he is too was thinking of getting work now will hold off till i get to my home country to much info me thinks.
No rickshaw, a proper AXCS Chair
That was 10 days ago no symptoms or expectations of same

WTF!

Goldengirl

CruelSummer wrote: »

Who thought we'd see the day when the U.K. and Boris Johnson would make an absolutely holy show out or our 'Existing with Covid' plan that's due tomorrow. RTÉ were pathetic on Drive Time there on Radio 1 actually trying to talk it down - variants, is it too fast, someone please find us some negativity to spin...

What the Government SHOULD announce tomorrow:
- Reopening of schools
- Abolishment of 5km restriction and proper policing / ticketing of beauty spots. A busy beauty spot is not enough of a reason to keep people imprisoned for weeks on end under the 5km rule.
- Reopen outdoor sports like golf, tennis.
- Show us the goal as to what we are currently working towards - 'outdoor summer' / no indoor dining, etc. Absolutely pathetic plan and not good enough.

Agree , totally .
While Boris's plan seems aspirational they have a lot of sensible safeguards built in .
They of course are a few months ahead of us vaccine wise , but by mid April we should we making more headway with that , for sure .

Happydays2020

timmyntc wrote: »

Boris may well hit his targets given a whopping 25% of UK have gotten 1st vaccine dose, & studies indicate after 1st dose you are 80% less likely to end up in hospital.

If they push on and vaccinate the vulnerable then could easily be hitting all those targets, if not pushing them forward by some weeks.

I agree. I don’t think it is ambitious at all. It is actually realistic. Fair play to them.

Sweet.Science

The only thing that can go wrong with the UKs UKs roadmap is that a variant evades the vaccines

Other than that they will be 100 percent be able to go ahead with getting back to normal as planned

Quite exciting

Might even arrange my mates stag in Belfast for July / August

griffdaddy

Is this not the English roadmap as opposed to a UK roadmap? Am I missing something or are the devolved administrations yet to publish their plans?

CruelSummer

Goldengirl wrote: »

Agree , totally .
While Boris's plan seems aspirational they have a lot of sensible safeguards built in .
They of course are a few months ahead of us vaccine wise , but by mid April we should we making more headway with that , for sure .

Yes their vaccine programme has been very successful - the new data emerging re one shot efficacy in Pfizer and Oxford would definitely speed it up here, or at the very least - 2nd doses should be pushed to 12 weeks.
I heard Kevin Doyle from the Independent on Claire Byrne earlier saying the constant leaks were needed to 'soften people up' to what's coming. I actually think they've had the opposite effect. They need to lay out our plan and strategy coupled with vaccination expectations and supply for the public to see.

shinzon

No press conference this evening due to the Cabinet sub-committee meeting

On virgin media news twitter just there

Shin

I would also be mindful that if the UK comes out of this strong, it will have made the EU look very scattered and mixed up, I think there's a bit of this at play, the old Empire outlook values, god save the queen, Britannia waves the rules and all that. time will tell but it's giong to be very interesting... "If Covid was a mugger!!" vintage Johnson!

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Why are they only meeting today if the plan was due this week? They had 2 weeks notice.

boetstark

If you really want to know why we will still be in the sh1tter come summer.
A group of 8 to 10 tourists outside King John's castle Limerick.
Don't blame them so much, I blame our pussy lilly liveried regime that talks the talk but that's about as far as it goes
Don't blame people getting fed up and starting to flout our restrictions. I'm sick to the teeth at this stage. In my opinion this is as much about a government and administration that wouldn't organise a p1ss up in a brewery.
Why as a country are we so inept at organising and implementing legislation

Arghus

mr zulu wrote: »

Fair dues to the UK road map, listening to Boris giveing the English great hope, mean while in Ireland, Al we have is doom and gloom.

This is the third of fourth time I've seen people fall completely for Johnson's blue-sky bullshít.

The UK's plan is wildly optimistic. And it's not the first time the government over there has launched a plan that they've had to eventually had roll back on. It's not even the second time.

Johnson and the rest of his cronies love getting people looking the other way and talking about "plans" instead of focusing on their catastrophic death toll.

Johnson has announced numerous plans and promises that have either never been delivered or have had to be rolled back on. He's a populist spoofer with a long list of undelivered promises.

People are endlessly cynical about our government, not without reason, but yet lap up every bit of weightless guff from BoJo? Even though his record through the pandemic has been utterly disastrous. Where's the critical thinking there?

I hope the UK plans work, because it offers a clear pathway and plan for everyone, but anyone with a brain in their head should be a bit cautious before we announce the genius of their plan