Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So it's the fault of those that advocated a certain approach that we didn't pursue the approach they advocated for?

Yes. Because they refused to make it realistic

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

A roadmap you say?

https://www.pbp.ie/zero-covid-strategy/

Another one here

https://www.isagcovid19.org/

TonyMaloney

Cerveza wrote: »

No, neighbour is flying off to Faro tomorrow for a week. Taking one of the small recovery trucks to get around the Garda and their questions.

haha

that's fantastic. the idiots are flying into harsher restrictions than we face here. they'll be confined to their holiday home for two weeks, and possibly face two weeks mandatory quarantine on their return

bon voyage

Plumbthedepths

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A roadmap you say?

https://www.pbp.ie/zero-covid-strategy/

I was wondering what the pbp meant . People before Profit.
Everytime I hear something from these guys I'm reminded of another politician I despise, M Thatcher. She was right about one thing ' the trouble with socialism is , you run out of other people's money to spend'.
So all welfare rates up to €350 a week as part of their strategy.

DOCARCH

alexonhisown wrote: »

Anyway, i think its wrong to stop people going away if they stick to the quarantine/testing rules when they get back.
If its enforced properly, its doable.

It still poses a risk, albeit a small one.

AFAIK, the most recent outbreak in NZ was from somebody who travelled from Europe, did their 14 day quarantine....all clear....then a week later (in the community) developed symptoms/tested positive.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Another one here

https://www.isagcovid19.org/

They presented a plan to an Oireachtas committed last August. Warned we would inevitably have a surge in infections.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/become-a-zero-covid-island-or-sleepwalk-to-major-surge-experts-say-1014050.html

Irish Steve

DOCARCH wrote: »

It still poses a risk, albeit a small one.

AFAIK, the most recent outbreak in NZ was from somebody who travelled from Europe, did their 14 day quarantine....all clear....then a week later (in the community) developed symptoms/tested positive.

It's worse now, the quarantine facility has some sort of leak in their system, or the South African variant is spreading in ways that are eluding their controls, another 2 cases have managed to get out into the community in recent days, so high levels of reaction there at present to test people possibly infected, and to work out how to ensure containment.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0127/1193506-new-zealand-covid/

alexonhisown

Irish Steve wrote: »

It's worse now, the quarantine facility has some sort of leak in their system, or the South African variant is spreading in ways that are eluding their controls, another 2 cases have managed to get out into the community in recent days, so high levels of reaction there at present to test people possibly infected, and to work out how to ensure containment.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0127/1193506-new-zealand-covid/

One theory seems to be that it spread through the quarantine hotel air ventilation system.
Or maybe the SA variant has a very long incubation period?
It is strange that they isolated for 2 weeks and still tested negative, then tested positive afterwards.

Derek Zoolander

Deleted User wrote: »

A roadmap you say?

https://www.pbp.ie/zero-covid-strategy/

thats a reasonable start but lacking in details...from the reopening section...

what influence does vaccination have on green zone - what are the criteria for green zones etc...

Green zones of limited restrictions to be created in areas that have crushed
community transmission. Red zones are areas with most restrictions and
transmission, orange zones are those that border Red Zones and those with
rising infection rates.
• Allow Green zones to re-embark on normal activity – with no restrictions
except on movement to non-green areas
• Restrict non-essential travel to these green zones from areas where COVID-19
levels are still high.
• As other areas crush the virus, add them to the Green Zones.

mandrake04

CruelSummer wrote: »

So are you advocating that by closing borders the virus will just disappear?
What about all of the Covid currently circulating here?
What about Melbourne and Victoria in Australia - as I’ve pointed out on this thread before. They had mandatory quarantine and still ended up with 400 in hospital come June/July and widespread community transmission. They had a lockdown from July - November despite having mandatory quarantine.
Would the posters here suggesting that the mandatory quarantine approach is the only way to go...accept a 4 month lockdown for the Winter while it’s in place?
This is a very real possibility as Victoria’s weather is the ‘coldest’ on the Australian continent in winter.

To be fair there is no instruction manual for this type of quarantine, it’s a working progress and although mistakes or problems happen that’s how you learn.

Closing the borders is only one part of it, you also need have resources such as testing tracing, good security and act very fast.

Living in Sydney life been fairly normal since last June, sure there was a kinda lockdown last April/May where pubs/cinemas etc were closed for 10 weeks and there was a period of restricted movements for 4 weeks but it was’nt like you were locked up or anything. I was out working, could go to the park with my kids, fly kites, JetSki etc. they were not that strict. Come June was back into restaurants, Pubs, cinemas roughly @75%; capacity. Even in Dec I had my Xmas party, 138 of us in same venue as 2019 ..8 or 10 per table etc. So one year on I haven’t really had too many issues with covid, some minor adjustments like wearing masks etc which is ironic since there dick all covid about but 2019/2020 I really needed a mask because of the bushfire smoke.

Sure if you have an outbreak it just needs to be managed properly, this happened a week out from Xmas and they closed down N. Beaches council area. The rest of Sydney were on cautionary alert, other states closed their borders. NSW (population of 7.5m) ran 70,000 tests in a single day and 60,000 of those was from the N.Beaches an area 1/4 size of county Longford. Most of these tests had results in 6-12 hours.

Melbourne winter is crap but not the coldest, Tasmania and parts of S.Australia winters are much colder. The problem in Melbourne is they stuffed up, instead of using the military like other states the leftard Dan Andrew’s government thought it “too confrontational” and used private security that paid $20/hr...these guys not only underpaid but undertrained and some were also working 2nd jobs as Uber drivers. It’s alleged they were doing ‘favours’ for some of the travellers like letting them out and running errands to 7/11...no doubt not for nothing either. It was poor management that was the problem.

Both Adelaide and Brisbane had 3 day lockdowns when cleaners got infected to help limit the spread, they are now doing daily saliva tests on all quarantine staff. Australia will be vaccinating it’s quarantine staff first, then they a rollout of 1million vaccinations a week from end of March. They should be done by September/October.

Both NZ and Australia have had to learn on the fly, sure they are in the middle of the pacific but Australia has something like 42m international passengers compared to Ireland’s 38m. This doesn’t take into account Ireland’s ferries and cross border movements or Australia’s cruise ships and cargo crews. So although geographically isolated the difference in connectivity is not really that much..and the safe distance for the virus is 2 metres anyway.

I don’t think mandatory quarantine can work in Ireland, the border is obvious problem but the biggest problem is in the Irish population there will always be a minority of idiots and chancers who will find loopholes and ruin it for everyone else. We all know those type. So continuous Lockdowns are probably the only alternative for now, how long they will go on is anyone’s guess...people suggest that vaccinating the vulnerable is enough but no one knows for sure.

seamus

Deleted User wrote: »

Another one here

https://www.isagcovid19.org/

Neither of these plans address the fundamental border issue though. PBP talks about an All-Island strategy. The ISAG one gets points for at least being serious, but it falls down on the problem that enforcement of the rules is only on one side of the border and that we lack the ability to police it. They cite Australia's cross-territory controls as an example of success, but miss out on the important part - all territories were involved in it. If QLD were policing their side of the border, but NSW weren't bothered, or took an entirely different approach, then the border policing method wouldn't have worked.

The ISAG approach would be very effective at driving down cases across the rest of country, but whether it would be any *more* effective than current policy is an unknown. There are diminishing returns with increasingly strict control of movements between counties. What we have at the moment probably reduces inter-county movement by about 90%. To get another 5% would probably require triple the resources that we have deployed right now.

It's aspirational more than practical. I doubt we have anything approaching the number of Gardai we would need to police every county border in the way they outline.

Cerveza

TonyMaloney wrote: »

haha

that's fantastic. the idiots are flying into harsher restrictions than we face here. they'll be confined to their holiday home for two weeks, and possibly face two weeks mandatory quarantine on their return

bon voyage

Swing and a miss there on your made up rules.

MerlinSouthDub

seamus wrote: »

Neither of these plans address the fundamental border issue though. PBP talks about an All-Island strategy. The ISAG one gets points for at least being serious, but it falls down on the problem that enforcement of the rules is only on one side of the border and that we lack the ability to police it. They cite Australia's cross-territory controls as an example of success, but miss out on the important part - all territories were involved in it. If QLD were policing their side of the border, but NSW weren't bothered, or took an entirely different approach, then the border policing method wouldn't have worked.

The ISAG approach would be very effective at driving down cases across the rest of country, but whether it would be any *more* effective than current policy is an unknown. There are diminishing returns with increasingly strict control of movements between counties. What we have at the moment probably reduces inter-county movement by about 90%. To get another 5% would probably require triple the resources that we have deployed right now.

It's aspirational more than practical. I doubt we have anything approaching the number of Gardai we would need to police every county border in the way they outline.

The ISAG plan is very underwhelming - high level ideas (better test and trace etc) but very few specifics, no consideration of resourcing. The large traffic of hauliers in and out of the country is barely considered - it refers to no quarantine and rapid testing (is there any reliable rapid test?), and "no uncontrolled contacts" (which is not explained, and completely impossible to enforce -are they not allowed go to a shop, for example). It's a poor document, full of soundbites. Maybe there is a plan for Ireland which would achieve "zero covid", and I'm open to the idea. But the ISAG plan is not a plan at all.

TonyMaloney

Cerveza wrote: »

Swing and a miss there on your made up rules.

The bars, restaurants, public spaces and beaches of Faro are shut. Portugal are under strict stay at home orders. You're only allowed out for essential purposes.

There's arguably nowhere worse on the planet for catching covid right now too.

You'd have to be mad to go there right now

hynesie08

Deleted User wrote: »

A roadmap you say?

https://www.pbp.ie/zero-covid-strategy/

That's proposing a harsher lockdown with a magic money tree and a ridiculous amount of new taxation...... There's a reason no one takes them seriously.

Cerveza

TonyMaloney wrote: »

The bars, restaurants, public spaces and beaches of Faro are shut. Portugal are under strict stay at home orders. You're only allowed out for essential purposes.

There's arguably nowhere worse on the planet for catching covid right now too.

You'd have to be mad to go there right now

They are only flying into Faro not staying there. Don’t be presuming stuff now.

hatrickpatrick

Rezident wrote: »

Excellent post and I think you are absolutely right.

Sadly a lot of people will be upset by the government's ridiculous comments today, but you are right, they have not got a clue about a few months out. We must try to remember that.

Leo's already talking about moving to level four in March, just two days after he was obstinate about remaining at level 5 for the foreseeable.

Nobody in power has the slightest clue what they're talking about and if the prospect of another year of quarantine is doing peoples' heads in, just remember that it's about as realistic as the prospect of reopening nightclubs next Monday. Nobody has a clue beyond around three months into the future and even that is speculation at best.

TonyMaloney

Cerveza wrote: »

They are only flying into Faro not staying there. Don’t be presuming stuff now.

Fair enough. Where abouts are they staying then? We can all google to see if the beaches are closed.

google data suggests most if not all beaches in Portugal are shut
https://www.gstatic.com/covid19/mobility/2021-01-24_PT_Mobility_Report_en.pdf

your neighbours are flying in to what will surely be the worst holiday of their lives

hatrickpatrick

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Leo's already talking about moving to level four in March, just two days after he was obstinate about remaining at level 5 for the foreseeable.

Nobody in power has the slightest clue what they're talking about and if the prospect of another year of quarantine is doing peoples' heads in, just remember that it's about as realistic as the prospect of reopening nightclubs next Monday. Nobody has a clue beyond around three months into the future and even that is speculation at best.

I think that they have probably realised what a sh1tshow it was a couple of nights ago, and how the public interpreted what they all said. They’ve realised that they need to play nice cop for a while

Cerveza

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Fair enough. Where abouts are they staying then? We can all google to see if the beaches are closed.

google data suggests most if not all beaches in Portugal are shut
https://www.gstatic.com/covid19/mobility/2021-01-24_PT_Mobility_Report_en.pdf

your neighbours are flying in to what will surely be the worst holiday of their lives

I’d say google is bursting your head open to be honest. I’ll let you know how they get on when they are back.

TonyMaloney

Cerveza wrote: »

I’d say google is bursting your head open to be honest. I’ll let you know how they get on when they are back.

you think a search engine is bursting my head open?

fair enough. wish them well from me

Cerveza

TonyMaloney wrote: »

you think a search engine is bursting my head open?

fair enough. wish them well from me

Don’t need to, he is reading this thread as a guest. Got a WhatsApp there from him and he is bursting his hole laughing :pac:

TonyMaloney

TonyMaloney wrote: »

you think a search engine is bursting my head open?

fair enough. wish them well from me

Well, I don't wish them well.

What selfish behavior.

As for the message above from Cerveza, I'm very sceptical...

Martina1991

We just passed the milestone of 3 million tests completed for Covid19, a full year since testing began.

February 2020: testing began
(7 and a half months later)
16th September 2020: 1 million tests completed
(3 months later)
29th November 2020: 2 million tests completed
(2 months later)
28th January 2021: 3 million tests completed

A monumental feat.

https://twitter.com/paulreiddublin/status/1354529188334751751?s=19

DOCARCH

Cerveza wrote: »

....he is bursting his hole laughing :pac:

See you next Tuesday! :P

Rebelbrowser

Cerveza wrote: »

Don’t need to, he is reading this thread as a guest. Got a WhatsApp there from him and he is bursting his hole laughing :pac:

I didn't think made up people doing made up things could read threads but my bad......

Lads don't feed the troll, simple as. Ignore....

hynesie08

Cerveza wrote: »

I’d say google is bursting your head open to be honest. I’ll let you know how they get on when they are back.

When do you imagine that will be?

Cerveza wrote: »

No, neighbour is flying off to Faro tomorrow for a week. Taking one of the small recovery trucks to get around the Garda and their questions.

Cerveza wrote: »

A two week break, him and his partner. They do it every year.

CruelSummer

Deleted User wrote: »

How is melbourne going now?

It's 'gone' into its summer where Covid appears to weaken and spread less easily. Are you comparing our Winter with an Australian and New Zealand summer? Which some of the Zero Covid zealots here seem to favour.

Covid will find a way in, yes border controls are necessary but they're not the only game in town and especially not now at this stage in the game.

South Korea currently has outbreaks in schools:
https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0127/1192283-coronavirus-global/

Not to mention New Zealand has managed to welcome the South African variant this week via community transmission

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0127/1193506-new-zealand-covid/

This despite the fact it's their summer time.

Wolf359f

Martina1991 wrote: »

We just passed the milestone of 3 million tests completed for Covid19, a full year since testing began.

February 2020: testing began
(7 and a half months later)
16th September 2020: 1 million tests completed
(3 months later)
29th November 2020: 2 million tests completed
(2 months later)
28th January 2021: 3 million tests completed

A monumental feat.

https://twitter.com/paulreiddublin/status/1354529188334751751?s=19

In no small part to people like yourself!
I can still remember people screaming about lack of testing and it's going to be a disaster and we'll never be able to scale up etc...
It's certainly been very quiet on that front and anyone needing a test can get one.

Let's hope the vaccine rollout will follow the same trend, just much faster!

CIARAN_BOYLE

Great to see the hospital numbers down to 1620 from a high of 2020 on 18 January.

Less good to see icu numbers remain high at 216 (up 4 from yesterday) and down from the high point of 221 on 24 January.

The rate of fall in hospital numbers started to accelerate on 26 January so it could take a while further to feed through to substanial falls in icu numbers.