Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

NeuralNetwork

caveat emptor wrote: »

Yeah UK is banning lots of places now but allowing citizens through including Irish citizens. In fairness we should be banned too. They still think we are part of the same country. (joke)


https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/1354836635716870148?s=20

They don't. It's a special bilateral arrangement that goes beyond anything to do with Brexit or the EU.

Irish nationals have special status in the UK and UK nationals have special status in Ireland. In both directions citizens are considered a status other than 'foreign' and it includes extensive rights to vote in national elections, be recognised as resident just by walking in and so on.

I mean even the Chairman of the Bank of England is an Irish citizen.

They're two neighbouring islands and despite Brexit, they will remain two neighbouring islands with a lot of intertwined connections and complex history. There's nothing particularly negative about that. It's just proximity.

Turtwig

That was a relatively positive and optimistic press briefing. Why couldn't they have that on Tuesday instead of the absolute train wreck of confusion and doom?

Tpcl20

caveat emptor wrote: »

Source?

The briefing.

caveat emptor wrote: »

As for what he is getting out of it....... A pension and a privileged position in retirement. :pac:

He has that anyway, he could at least have the best interests of the public health system at heart. Utter spin and lies from him today.

caveat emptor

NeuralNetwork wrote: »

They don't. It's a special bilateral arrangement that goes beyond anything to do with Brexit or the EU.

Irish nationals have special status in the UK and UK nationals have special status in Ireland. In both directions citizens are considered a status other than 'foreign' and it includes extensive rights to vote in national elections, be recognised as resident just by walking in and so on.

The whole UK, GB , Northern Ireland , border , republic is such a head f*ck.

If you ever want to wind someone up from the UK explain to them that Irish citizens resident in UK can vote in Westminster elections but that UK citizens resident in Ireland can't vote in Dail eireann elections.

edit: I stand corrected on that see follow on post. Thanks NeuralNetwork

Tpcl20

CruelSummer wrote: »

I actually agreed with his strategy re zero Covid. It’s an idealism not rooted in our reality as an island that’s part of the British Isles, EU and shares a land border with the U.K.
His point was interesting that the population would be very vulnerable to a ‘breach’ with Covid easily getting in, in a zero Covid strategy - and that people are using it as means to go back to normal - which wouldn’t actually happen at all in practice.

It wasn't interesting, it was a complete regurgitation of what Leo said throughout the last week, indicating a fundamental misunderstanding of the objectives of the zero covid strategy.

The point isn't to eliminate it on the island altogether, it's to get it to such a low number that it's easy to track and trace the cases and find the source of infection coming in.

It's not made more difficult by the UK connection. We just would have to make sure that people travelling across the border from the airports in NI are adequately monitored.

NeuralNetwork

caveat emptor wrote: »

If you ever want to wind someone up from the UK explain to them that Irish citizens resident in UK can vote in Westminster elections but that UK citizens resident in Ireland can't vote in Dail eireann elections.

Well, it wouldn't be much of a wind up as UK citizens resident in Ireland can vote in Dáil Éireann elections.

Arghus

Turtwig wrote: »

That was a relatively positive and optimistic press briefing. Why couldn't they have that on Tuesday instead of the absolute train wreck of confusion and doom?

Because it was our politicans on Tuesday.

Ficheall

Tpcl20 wrote: »

He has that anyway, he could at least have the best interests of the public health system at heart. Utter spin and lies from him today.

Didn't watch the briefing - has he stopped trying to get rid of covid?

Dr. Bre

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

The year is 2121, Ireland finally emerges from lockdown after a successful rollout of the vaccine program but some restrictions remain incase of new variants. ;-)

George lee will still be concerned

seefin

Off the point but when they say average of 2 contacts per person, does that mean contacts outside the household or includes those living with the positive person? Never thought about it until now

caveat emptor

NeuralNetwork wrote: »

Well, it wouldn't be much of a wind up as UK citizens resident in Ireland can vote in Dáil Éireann elections.

Right you are someone told me that in a pub once and took it as gospel. Show's how dangerous pubs are.

Tpcl20

Ficheall wrote: »

Didn't watch the briefing - has he stopped trying to get rid of covid?

He wants to get the numbers down alright but he wants there to still be a good bit of it there.

NeuralNetwork

NeuralNetwork wrote: »

Well, it wouldn't be much of a wind up as UK citizens resident in Ireland can vote in Dáil Éireann elections.

Maybe that Irish citizens resident in the uk could vote in the brexit referendum, however British citizens here can’t vote in one of our referendums

Gruffalux

Dr. Bre wrote: »

George lee will still be concerned

Mostly because he is now 158 years old..

KrustyUCC

seefin wrote: »

Off the point but when they say average of 2 contacts per person, does that mean contacts outside the household or includes those living with the positive person? Never thought about it until now

It includes those living with the person afaik

Loafing Oaf

Gruffalux wrote: »

Mostly because he is now 158 years old..

and will be resorting to ever more desperate measures to put the fear of god in us

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe that Irish citizens resident in the uk could vote in the brexit referendum, however British citizens here can’t vote in one of our referendums

Yeah good point. I think they can't vote in presidential elections either.

NeuralNetwork

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe that Irish citizens resident in the uk could vote in the brexit referendum, however British citizens here can’t vote in one of our referendums

Not to throw this thread way off topic but that is purely about equivalency.
The Brexit referendum was more of a preferendum. It carried no legal weight other than to advise the government of a policy issue. It was just an opinion poll in effect.

In contrast, Irish referenda are exclusively to approve constitutional amendments. There is no equivalent in the British system. Presidential election votes are also open only to Irish citizens as there's no equivalent in the UK as the ceremonial head of state is unelected.

UK citizens, resident here, can vote in all Irish general and local elections.

The main issue is that Ireland is sharing a single travel zone - the Common Travel Area, with the UK (and the Channel Islands etc) so we need to all be coordinated on this much better than we have been to date when it comes to COVID or it's just not going to work.

Much as being in the EU doesn't impinge on our sovereignty nor does being in a bilateral arrangement with the UK on a range of issues like this - it's just the inevitability of needing to work closely with immediate neighbours.

Ficheall

Have they started testing asymptomatic contacts again yet?

seefin

KrustyUCC wrote: »

It includes those living with the person afaik

Thats what i always thought too. But must be alot of people living on their own getting covid to balance out those in houseshares, with kids etc. Seems unfeasibly small

jr1942

I am wondering how would people who are supporting all the measures and restrictions to prevent a health crisis behave and which way would they turn their head if they themselves were banned from work and put on covid subsidy etc.

I am all up for measures, but under 1 condition, whoever was forced out of job, lets have a look how much money did they earn in 2019, pay them that for 2020.

Until a system which can do that isn't figured out, no measures should be there apart from wash your hands and wear a mask on private premises if the owner dictates so ie. store entrance and similar.

caveat emptor

NeuralNetwork wrote: »

Not to throw this thread way off topic but that is purely about equivalency.
The Brexit referendum was more of a preferendum. It carried no legal weight other than to advise the government of a policy issue. It was just an opinion poll in effect.

In contrast, Irish referenda are exclusively to approve constitutional amendments. There is no equivalent in the British system. Presidential election votes are also open only to Irish citizens as there's no equivalent in the UK as the ceremonial head of state is unelected.

UK citizens, resident here, can vote in all Irish general and local elections.

The main issue is that Ireland is sharing a single travel zone - the Common Travel Area, with the UK (and the Channel Islands etc) so we need to all be coordinated on this much better than we have been to date when it comes to COVID or it's just not going to work.

Much as being in the EU doesn't impinge on our sovereignty nor does being in a bilateral arrangement with the UK on a range of issues like this - it's just the inevitability of needing to work closely with immediate neighbours.

That all makes sense. Two questions though.

• Why did we stop flights from UK then?
• Why does the UK not have a constitution? It only seems fair we prevent them from participating in amending ou

rs they should have one that we are prevented from participating in amending?

If only it were an opinion poll unfortunately. :pac:

PatrickSmithUS

Has there been much of an impact on the delivery of standard surgical procedures to the extent that anyone has taken a legal action yet?

I'd imagine that this is a huge storm coming down the line that gthe HSE is in no way prepared to fight.

PatrickSmithUS

PatrickSmithUS wrote: »

Has there been much of an impact on the delivery of standard surgical procedures to the extent that anyone has taken a legal action yet?

I'd imagine that this is a huge storm coming down the line that gthe HSE is in no way prepared to fight.

That will probably be in a year or so when poor outcomes become manifest and some people then consider taking cases. However they would be very complicated considering the more limited available resources during the pandemic.

caveat emptor

Why does the concept of 5km not extend to non essential international travel. How is it that you can't go 6 km to a beach in a different county in Ireland but it's ok to go 600km to a beach in Europe?

That has not been very well explained since march really.

gmisk

Ficheall wrote: »

Have they started testing asymptomatic contacts again yet?

https://www.thejournal.ie/testing-close-contact-confirmed-covid-cases-5338317-Jan2021/
They are starting to test close contacts again from tomorrow

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

Why does the concept of 5km not extend to non essential international travel. How is it that you can't go 6 km to a beach in a different county in Ireland but it's ok to go 600km to a beach in Europe?

That has not been very well explained since march really.

They are only beginning to put resources into dealing with the unnecessary overseas travel. It was a matter of hand-wringing before that. The government just wasn't prepared to touch it up to this.

Wolf359f

caveat emptor wrote: »

Why does the concept of 5km not extend to non essential international travel. How is it that you can't go 6 km to a beach in a different county in Ireland but it's ok to go 600km to a beach in Europe?

That has not been very well explained since march really.

I think the right to leave a country, even your own country is covered under human rights. Could be a mess if the government try to physically restrict people leaving.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

Yeah UK is banning lots of places now but allowing citizens through including Irish citizens. In fairness we should be banned too. They still think we are part of the same country. (joke)

We kind of are, given that we each have undocumented residency rights in both countries. I am surprised though how they seem ve reluctant to suspend the CTA

caveat emptor

Wolf359f wrote: »

I think the right to leave a country, even your own country is covered under human rights. Could be a mess if the government try to physically restrict people leaving.

Yeah good point. Mandatory quarantine would easily dissuade non essential people from leaving. Human rights are important but so is public health.

"People in Northern Ireland work in nursing homes and hospitals in the republic in particular in Donegal"

Might explain why when we were told to stay home cases kept rising all along the border when it was a free for all there. It's endless this sh!te.

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1354865857760022528?s=20