Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

is_that_so

Deleted User wrote: »

utterly utterly depressing listening to Prof Philip Nolan on Newstalk right now. He's basically saying we will be severely restricted for months to come, going to almost Zero Covid (or Zero tolerance Covid) and we only open up REAL priorities over the next 6 months... i.e. education and healthcare.........right up to September. Looks like there will be no holidays in Ireland this Summer as well as none abroad (according to him). How on earth can people tolerate this ?:(:( No crowded events until over 70% of the population is vaccinated either.

(he has also said most of the infection is in the over 65's and this is not reducing as fast as the reduction in ALL other age groups. The rest of the population is doing really well. So we are all stopping our lives for this older age group...........indefinitely)

I feel utterly depressed.

He's talking about current data and we are expecting Level 5 until March anyway then Level 4 maybe 3 till May. The holidays abroad is less about us than the likely situation in many other countries. Oh and just remind yourself that even he does not know. It's all educated guesswork.

DraftDodger

Deleted User wrote: »

utterly utterly depressing listening to Prof Philip Nolan on Newstalk right now. He's basically saying we will be severely restricted for months to come, going to almost Zero Covid (or Zero tolerance Covid) and we only open up REAL priorities over the next 6 months... i.e. education and healthcare.........right up to September. Looks like there will be no holidays in Ireland this Summer as well as none abroad (according to him). How on earth can people tolerate this ?:(:( No crowded events until over 70% of the population is vaccinated either.

(he has also said most of the infection is in the over 65's and this is not reducing as fast as the reduction in ALL other age groups. The rest of the population is doing really well. So we are all stopping our lives for this older age group...........indefinitely)

I feel utterly depressed.

Yeah how dare we look after prioritise health and education. The horror.

Ger Roe

Miccoli wrote: »

Hopefully I am wrong but all I’ve seen during this pandemic is the goalposts being moved time and time again with regards to the lifting of restrictions. I remarked only a few weeks ago on a thread here about how I thought once we reached 70% vaccinations we would be told to hold tight and try to get to a higher number. Now we have an official telling us just that.

The goalposts move, because the virus moves, and changes. Nothing can be taken for granted when the circumstances you are trying to address, are in a state of constant flux. Deadlines and dates are futile in these circumstances.

We will only know how to totally effectively deal with this situation and guarantee specific outcomes, within projected timeframes, when it is over.

We are still in the muddle through stage.... whatever guarantees government or anyone else tries to give you.

patnor1011

accensi0n wrote: »

And who are 'they' exactly.

And why will they still want restrictions even after covid is no longer major health concern?

Why do you think that covid is major health concern? While it may be for elderly and people with other serious health issues it clearly is non issue for majority of the population.
I think that health system collapse which we are trying to "prevent" because of covid is coming inevitably when we get to "after covid" due to everything else being put on hold.

caveat emptor

Eod100 wrote: »

Interesting thread here. Article itself behind a paywall. https://twitter.com/oconnellhugh/status/1355815515260858370?s=19

Very interesting. Absolute **** show.

https://twitter.com/oconnellhugh/status/1355815523678875648?s=20

DraftDodger

DraftDodger wrote: »

Yeah how dare we look after prioritise health and education. The horror.

there is also such a thing as mental health. Our mental health affects our physical health. I haven't seen most of my siblings for almost a year now and I feel terribly sad that this is set to continue for God know how long. There is no need for the smartass reply, I am saying how I feel.

Coybig_

If the goalposts on vaccinations, herd immunity and return to normality are going to continue to shift, a real conversation will have to be had about the benefits of lockdown in comparison to what it provides.

Unfortunately at the moment, social media (which essentially governs the government through outrage) has decided that lockdowns are required, and not only that, but we need to stop anything and everything. One death from covid is too many deaths for many of this cohort currently.

Some people are hanging on by a thread at the moment and there is relentless negativity pumped into the media on a daily basis, for what, I have no idea. A continual shifting of when we can return to normal and what that will entail.

Important to remember that we have 460,000 people in receipt of Pandemic Unemployment Payment and these people being of an age where they are typically employed which means they are (for the overwhelming majority) affected little by Covid.

We have almost 1.3 million people in the education system, the vast majority of these people under the age of 21. This covers playschool, primary school, secondary school and college. None of these people can attend at the moment. They are not getting a proper education at the moment. They are being starved of the experience that everybody else took for granted. What affect will this have on them down the line? A person who started college last September has never been to a class. It's crazy. Again, these people are not in danger from Covid.

You are approaching close to 2 million alone with those two groups.

How about the rise in other issues, during this pandemic?
Cuan Mhuire spoke just 2 weeks ago of a "frightening rise" in gambling and alcohol addictions.

There was a 16 percent increase in domestic abuse calls to Garda in 2020 from 2019.

This is just what we know right now, although we know that there are going to be further consequences. Many of these wont be felt for years.

Politicians were out this week telling people about Christmas restrictions. Once the vulnerable are vaccinated we need to open up and open up fully. Anything else is a betrayal of the majority of the population in this country, who are bearing the brunt of this sacrifice for something which does not affect them.

alentejo

People seem to be advocating lock down until the majority of the population has a vaccinated. Long boring summer becons

is_that_so

caveat emptor wrote: »

Very interesting. Absolute **** show.

https://twitter.com/oconnellhugh/status/1355815523678875648?s=20

As some unnamed NPHET members have commented they didn't always get their own communications right. October and the sweeping return of the CMO was what soured things. The events up to the so-called leaked letter was where they pitted themselves against government.

coastwatch

alentejo wrote: »

People seem to be advocating lock down until the majority of the population has a vaccinated. Long boring summer becons

Only one summer?

polesheep

caveat emptor wrote: »

Do you prefer him to give false hope? If the new variant is more transmissible (and there's quite a bit of evidence at this stage both at the molecular level and the epidemiological level) then the R number is higher.

Higher R number means a higher percentage of population will be required to vaccinated (or infected) to get to herd immunity.

There are other variables such as the efficacy of the vaccine and the revaccination period required if other variants emerge that reduce immunity.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.16.21249946v1

Countries pulling out the stops to secure the Pfizer now.



Here's the chart showing the effect on R number as proportion of population get's vaccinated. With Oxford astra it never get's below 1 even with 100% of population immunised. This paper coincided with the uptake in vaccine nationalism. Specifically the EU trying to prevent export of Pfizer vaccine to UK / NI. I don't think it's a coincidence.

I prefer, 'if you've nothing to say, say nothing'.

Zebra62

Hi All,

I'm trying to help out a friend who's looking to pass the quiz test for a GDP card....some of the questions are multiple answers and if you try any section 3 times and fail you have lost your 100 euros. He has already tried and lost 100e already. Does anyone know where you would get the correct answers for this quiz so that he can get his GDP card. As far as I can see this is a money making racket.

Please help any truckers that transport Pharmaceuticals and thank you.

jackboy

Coybig_ wrote: »

Once the vulnerable are vaccinated we need to open up and open up fully. Anything else is a betrayal of the majority of the population in this country, who are bearing the brunt of this sacrifice for something which does not affect them.

Can’t happen. The virus would rage through the population, the hospitals would get overrun due to the massive amounts of positive cases. The only difference is that the dead and those in ICU would be younger than now.

A year later and many still don’t understand the damage this virus can do without restrictions.

Ficheall

Coybig_ wrote: »

[...] Anything else is a betrayal of the majority of the population in this country, who are bearing the brunt of this sacrifice for something which does not affect them.

TLDR: It's the people who don't get sick or die that are suffering the most......................

polesheep

Deleted User wrote: »

utterly utterly depressing listening to Prof Philip Nolan on Newstalk right now. He's basically saying we will be severely restricted for months to come, going to almost Zero Covid (or Zero tolerance Covid) and we only open up REAL priorities over the next 6 months... i.e. education and healthcare.........right up to September. Looks like there will be no holidays in Ireland this Summer as well as none abroad (according to him). How on earth can people tolerate this ?:(:( No crowded events until over 70% of the population is vaccinated either.

(he has also said most of the infection is in the over 65's and this is not reducing as fast as the reduction in ALL other age groups. The rest of the population is doing really well. So we are all stopping our lives for this older age group...........indefinitely)

I feel utterly depressed.

I wonder could this be because we have only been testing those with symptoms?

polesheep

jackboy wrote: »

Can’t happen. The virus would rage through the population, the hospitals would get overrun due to the massive amounts of positive cases. The only difference is that the dead and those in ICU would be younger than now.

A year later and many still don’t understand the damage this virus can do without restrictions.

Absolute nonsense not borne out by the facts.

Ficheall

polesheep wrote: »

I wonder could this be because we have only been testing those with symptoms?

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see what happens with the cases over the next few days now. Positivity down, cases up, I suppose.



And what happened with the WHO's recommendation last week re what to count as a case - did anything come of that?

Plumbthedepths

jackboy wrote: »

Can’t happen. The virus would rage through the population, the hospitals would get overrun due to the massive amounts of positive cases. The only difference is that the dead and those in ICU would be younger than now.

A year later and many still don’t understand the damage this virus can do without restrictions.

A year later and the facts and your claims are polar opposite.

is_that_so

Ficheall wrote: »

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see what happens with the cases over the next few days now. Positivity down, cases up, I suppose.



And what happened with the WHO's recommendation last week re what to count as a case - did anything come of that?

NPHET tend to follow the ECDC guidelines so as things change there they will here.

jackboy

polesheep wrote: »

Absolute nonsense not borne out by the facts.

What facts?

If we have no restrictions thousands under 65 could die and tens of thousands may need months to recover from the effects of covid. What doctors or scientists disagree with that outlook?

polesheep

jackboy wrote: »

What facts?

If we have no restrictions thousands under 65 could die and tens of thousands may need months to recover from the effects of covid. What doctors or scientists disagree with that outlook.

There is no evidence whatsoever to support your position. All of the evidence points to the younger cohorts not being significantly affected by Covid.

Coybig_

Ficheall wrote: »

TLDR: It's the people who don't get sick or die that are suffering the most......................

TLDR: Completely wrong, and an ungenuine, misleading, cowardly representation of what I have said.

The people who dont get sick and die are suffering most from lockdown, 100 percent. Unquestionably so.

Not from the disease itself, clearly. The disease barely affects them at all.

The point is that the majority who are not affected are taking the brunt of the sacrifice to protect the few. At quite enormous cost.

Once the few are protected this needs to end, and end fast.

Malcomex

How can so many people be right

And so many people be wrong

Here at the same time

jackboy

polesheep wrote: »

There is no evidence whatsoever to support your position. All of the evidence points to the younger cohorts not being significantly affected by Covid.

Wrong. Far less of the younger population are significantly affected by the virus. But if the number of young people being infected massively increases then the results are predictable.

Coybig_

jackboy wrote: »

What facts?

If we have no restrictions thousands under 65 could die and tens of thousands may need months to recover from the effects of covid. What doctors or scientists disagree with that outlook?

How many thousands under 65 died in Sweden, just out of curiosity. Specifically looking for under 65s who would not be classed as vulnerable.

In your own time, thanks.

Also, post viral fatigue. It's been around long before Covid ffs.

jackboy

Coybig_ wrote: »

How many thousands under 65 died in Sweden, just out of curiosity. Specifically looking for under 65s who would not be classed as vulnerable.

In your own time, thanks.

Also, post viral fatigue. It's been around long before Covid ffs.

Sweden does have significant restrictions.

patnor1011

jackboy wrote: »

Sweden do have significant restrictions.

Since when? Only very recently and they did without them for most of the time last year. That, with third world countries like most of the Africa without restrictions and even functioning health system clearly contradict your doom prediction.

snotboogie

patnor1011 wrote: »

Since when? Only very recently and they did without them for most of the time last year. That, with third world countries like most of the Africa without restrictions and even functioning health system clearly contradict your doom prediction.

Sweden have had restrictions since April, which countries in Africa have no restrictions?

jackboy

patnor1011 wrote: »

Since when? Only very recently and they did without them for most of the time last year. That, with third world countries like most of the Africa without restrictions and even functioning health system clearly contradict your doom prediction.

They are not doom predictions. They are mainstream opinions which the vast majority of doctors and scientists agree with.

polesheep

jackboy wrote: »

Wrong. Far less of the younger population are significantly affected by the virus. But if the number of young people being infected massively increases then the results are predictable.

Yes, they are, but they aren't what you are predicting. Our hospitals won't be under threat from younger people with Covid.