The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 3) Mod Notes and Threadbanned List in OP

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's good old fashioned exceptionalism. Something is fine when FG do or say it, but if the Shinner bogeymen/women do it...man the keyboards.

Did FG make an issue of it? No.
Garry Gannon from the SD's did.

Not sure why people bring FG into the mix.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Did FG make an issue of it? No.
Garry Gannon from the SD's did.

Not sure why people bring FG into the mix.

Did Gary tweet when Leo said it at the election? No, he didn't because as pointed out. locally the SF vote is his 'bogeyman/woman'.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Did Gary tweet when Leo said it at the election? No, he didn't because as pointed out. locally the SF vote is his 'bogeyman/woman'.

I don't think so but again, better ask the SD's or Garry why he didn't.
There seem's to be many SD supporters around so it wouldn't be too hard to find an answer.

Again, nothing to do with FG.

Finty Lemon

It has been a poor week for MLM all the same.

Apparent hypocrisy on womens rights, no traction on the ' we are confused' line, resolution coming on vaccine supply, 94% of students opting for CA and schools calmly reopening, 93% of vaccines administered within a week of arrival, Michael Martin doing well on St Patricks Day, no major trouble on the streets, her insistence on telling us how many letters she writes making her sound like the neighbourhood crank, her demands to be heared swatted away by the grown ups.
I think she looks and sounds tired. The record is stuck Mary. Time for a change

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Did FG make an issue of it? No.
Garry Gannon from the SD's did.

Not sure why people bring FG into the mix.

You know well of course.

Bubbaclaus raised it here first. Claimed leader of the opposition wasn't a thing. Claimed MLMD said she had a right. Some of us called it out as a non issue. Bubbaclaus brought in Gannon to show someone had issue. This was explained to you already.
It was shown that it was a thing, enter FG, because Varadkar referred to himself as such. It was also not supported or backed up that MLMD had said she had a right.
You knew all this.

If we are to believe it's a relatively knew british thing brought in by FG and SF adopted it, why did folk spend days attacking MLMD for using it? And why only after it was shown Varadkar used it was it no longer an issue? Is that the misogyny you were talking about? Was it only an issue when you thought MLMD was the only one?

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

I don't think so but again, better ask the SD's or Garry why he didn't.
There seem's to be many SD supporters around so it wouldn't be too hard to find an answer.

Again, nothing to do with FG.

It has nothing to do with FG or anyone else for that matter, it has plenty to do with cheapshots and othering of the Shinners.
Leader of the opposition has been shown to be a convention here that others see themselves as if they are the largest party in opposition.

So that's the end of that.

markodaly

James Brown wrote: »

You know well of course.

Bubbaclaus raised it here first. Claimed leader of the opposition wasn't a thing. Claimed MLMD said she had a right. Some of us called it out as a non issue. Bubbaclaus brought in Gannon to show someone had issue. This was explained to you already.
It was shown that it was a thing, enter FG, because Varadkar referred to himself as such. It was also not supported or backed up that MLMD had said she had a right.
You knew all this.

If we are to believe it's a relatively knew british thing brought in by FG and SF adopted it, why did folk spend days attacking MLMD for using it? And why only after it was shown Varadkar used it was it no longer an issue? Is that the misogyny you were talking about? W

as it only an issue when you thought MLMD was the only one?

Bubbaclaus != FG

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

It has been a poor week for MLM all the same.

Apparent hypocrisy on womens rights, no traction on the ' we are confused' line, resolution coming on vaccine supply, 94% of students opting for CA and schools calmly reopening, 93% of vaccines administered within a week of arrival, Michael Martin doing well on St Patricks Day, no major trouble on the streets, her insistence on telling us how many letters she writes making her sound like the neighbourhood crank, her demands to be heared swatted away by the grown ups.
I think she looks and sounds tired. The record is stuck Mary. Time for a change

TBF, I think the Tánaiste being under criminal investigation is a tough one to top.
I'm delighted SF aren't letting Varadkar or the government slink off. We need an opposition calling them out. Labour were vocal this week too; O'Riordan saying Varadkar should be gone. Fair play.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Bubbaclaus != FG

Nope. I'll explain again.
He said it wasn't a thing. It was shown it had been and is. Varadkar was used as an example.
You should really try read what you respond to.

The rise in figures across Europe is starting to look very serious. I wonder will SF advocate for one thing up North, and another down South if we are forced to close the schools again? One of the major shortcomings of SF as the main party in opposition so far has been their flip-flopping on issues. Labour on the other hand have been pragmatic and supportive when they need to be, and critical when they feel the Government is slipping up. I'm no great fan of Alan Kelly, but he has played a blinder so far.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It has nothing to do with FG or anyone else for that matter, it has plenty to do with cheapshots and othering of the Shinners.
Leader of the opposition has been shown to be a convention here that others see themselves as if they are the largest party in opposition.

So that's the end of that.

At the end of the day it is about earning respect. Sinn Fein and Mary-Lou have done nothing to earn the respect of other political parties. They couldn't find a single one to agree a Programme for Government to support her as Taoiseach at the end of the day. They still have other much smaller opposition parties like the SDs poking fun at them for claiming the Leader of the Opposition position.

Big changes are needed for Sinn Fein if they are to avoid becoming the permanent opposition. Soundbites and photo opportunities won't be enough.

blanch152

markodaly wrote: »

Bubbaclaus != FG

No point responding to gobbledy gook. Don't waste your time on incoherent ramblings.

blanch152

blanch152 wrote: »

At the end of the day it is about earning respect. Sinn Fein and Mary-Lou have done nothing to earn the respect of other political parties. They couldn't find a single one to agree a Programme for Government to support her as Taoiseach at the end of the day. They still have other much smaller opposition parties like the SDs poking fun at them for claiming the Leader of the Opposition position.

Big changes are needed for Sinn Fein if they are to avoid becoming the permanent opposition. Soundbites and photo opportunities won't be enough.

I'm not sure the SDs offer much more than 'we haven't been in Government' either tbh. It's all hot air and hopium.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

At the end of the day it is about earning respect. Sinn Fein and Mary-Lou have done nothing to earn the respect of other political parties. They couldn't find a single one to agree a Programme for Government to support her as Taoiseach at the end of the day. They still have other much smaller opposition parties like the SDs poking fun at them for claiming the Leader of the Opposition position.

Big changes are needed for Sinn Fein if they are to avoid becoming the permanent opposition. Soundbites and photo opportunities won't be enough.

Well your record on predicting the future for SF isn't great in fairness blanch. I'd say they'll do their own thing.

Their record so far on holding FG FF (oops, nearly forgot the Greens) to account speaks for itself. How many resignations now and one senior Minister under a criminal investigation...unprecedented I would say for a government term.

blanch152

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm not sure the SDs offer much more than 'we haven't been in Government' either tbh. It's all hot air and hopium.

To be fair, there is some experience of government among their members, unlike Sinn Fein who couldn't run a parish council.

blanch152

blanch152 wrote: »

To be fair, there is some experience of government among their members, unlike Sinn Fein who couldn't run a parish council.

I don't doubt that. I do think they've gathered up a percentage of the voting base who think there is easy answers to complex problems, and that there is infinite money available. I don't doubt their integrity though. You can't say that about SF though.

NovemberWren

Deleted User wrote: »

One of the major shortcomings of SF as the main party in opposition so far has been their flip-flopping on issues.

They just want power. For themselves and for their own.

markodaly

James Brown wrote: »

Nope. I'll explain again.
He said it wasn't a thing. It was shown it had been and is. Varadkar was used as an example.
You should really try read what you respond to.

Again, nothing to do with FG.

Have a chat to the SD's about it.

a very cool kid

McMurphy wrote: »

The Oireachtas recognises opposition leaders too....







Seems a very strange thing to try and claim is not a thing here tbh.

Does this not refer to the leader of each separate speaking group? There is no single "leader of the opposition".

Technically there is no official "opposition". For practical purposes to ensure that every voice is heard and to increase accountability, the leader of government will answer questions in the house from the elected representatives but no one group has more right/purpose to hold the government to account than any other.

a very cool kid

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well your record on predicting the future for SF isn't great in fairness blanch. I'd say they'll do their own thing.

Their record so far on holding FG FF (oops, nearly forgot the Greens) to account speaks for itself. How many resignations now and one senior Minister under a criminal investigation...unprecedented I would say for a government term.

Sinn Féin had nothing to do with the resignations? The Taoiseach sacked Cowen because he wouldn't tell the truth, not Sinn Féin, Calleary screwed up, realised he was caught and resigned before the Taoiseach swing the axe and per your own prior assessment Leo hasn't been found guilty so he's innocent of a crime?

It's actually a massive failing of SF that Leo is still there, Pearse's wannabe A Time to Kill impression was a huge failure. The substance completely lost in his pathetic performance.

a very cool kid

Finty Lemon wrote: »

It has been a poor week for MLM all the same.

Apparent hypocrisy on womens rights, no traction on the ' we are confused' line, resolution coming on vaccine supply, 94% of students opting for CA and schools calmly reopening, 93% of vaccines administered within a week of arrival, Michael Martin doing well on St Patricks Day, no major trouble on the streets, her insistence on telling us how many letters she writes making her sound like the neighbourhood crank, her demands to be heared swatted away by the grown ups.
I think she looks and sounds tired. The record is stuck Mary. Time for a change

I mentioned earlier in the thread that it's very hard to imagine any of the SF front bench doing as well as Micheál did yesterday. Now things are settling down a bit and we're not all looking to be outraged every ten seconds, he's actually appearing to do a not perfect but pretty good job.

FrancieBrady

a very cool kid wrote: »

Sinn Féin had nothing to do with the resignations? The Taoiseach sacked Cowen because he wouldn't tell the truth, not Sinn Féin, Calleary screwed up, realised he was caught and resigned before the Taoiseach swing the axe and per your own prior assessment Leo hasn't been found guilty so he's innocent of a crime?

It's actually a massive failing of SF that Leo is still there, Pearse's wannabe A Time to Kill impression was a huge failure. The substance completely lost in his pathetic performance.

It can also be said these things only happened because of the pressure the opposition apply. It's regularly referred to in media.
Your position is just more of the same...'SF can't do what every opposition has done since the foundation of the state'. It's boring now lads, really is. The game changed, FF and FG were forced to merge in all but name...why? Because an opposition with teeth, which is not signed up to the power swap way of doing politics has arrived.

a very cool kid

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It can also be said these things only happened because of the pressure the opposition apply. It's regularly referred to in media.
Your position is just more of the same...'SF can't do what every opposition has done since the foundation of the state'. It's boring now lads, really is. The game changed, FF and FG were forced to merge in all but name...why? Because an opposition with teeth, which is not signed up to the power swap way of doing politics has arrived.

If the Taoiseach didn't want Cowen gone he`d still be there, nothing to do with SF.

SF got the most first preference votes but did nothing with them. There is no consolation prixe.

FrancieBrady

a very cool kid wrote: »

If the Taoiseach didn't want Cowen gone he`d still be there, nothing to do with SF.

SF got the most first preference votes but did nothing with them. There is no consolation prixe.

Had it been the old days Cowen would laughed and it would have been swept under the carpet.

New times, they can't get away with that anymore. That's good for politics here imo. All I require of SF is to finally break up the power swap and the job is complete.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

All I require of SF is to finally break up the power swap and the job is complete.

That is an odd way of looking at it, get into power and job done?
That is only the start of it, its all about what they do in power.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

That is an odd way of looking at it, get into power and job done?
That is only the start of it, its all about what they do in power.

Yes, and if they don't perform my vote, which nobody has ever owned, will go elsewhere.

a very cool kid

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Had it been the old days Cowen would laughed and it would have been swept under the carpet.

New times, they can't get away with that anymore. That's good for politics here imo. All I require of SF is to finally break up the power swap and the job is complete.

Times have changed but Cowen's resignation wasn't forced by SF. much as you kid yourself.

They're impotently crowing on the sidelines having let their voters down.

Do southern SF have any policies though? I'm not really seeing why someone who is disillusioned with the realities of modern Capitalism would think that SF is worthy of a vote. Advocate for a pension age of 65 down here, but vote in for 67 up North. Rates up North, but against water and property taxes down South. Pro-choice here, but siding with the DUP up North. Eoin O'B writing books about social housing, but leading a campaign to not have them built in his constituency. Is it really just about a UI? Is that all there is to it?

Brendan Bendar

Deleted User wrote: »

Do southern SF have any policies though? I'm not really seeing why someone who is disillusioned with the realities of modern Capitalism would think that SF is worthy of a vote. Advocate for a pension age of 65 down here, but vote in for 67 up North. Rates up North, but against water and property taxes down South. Pro-choice here, but siding with the DUP up North. Eoin O'B writing books about social housing, but leading a campaign to not have them built in his constituency. Is it really just about a UI? Is that all there is to it?

Bet your last cent, Dr.

Finty Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

Do southern SF have any policies though? I'm not really seeing why someone who is disillusioned with the realities of modern Capitalism would think that SF is worthy of a vote. Advocate for a pension age of 65 down here, but vote in for 67 up North. Rates up North, but against water and property taxes down South. Pro-choice here, but siding with the DUP up North. Eoin O'B writing books about social housing, but leading a campaign to not have them built in his constituency. Is it really just about a UI? Is that all there is to it?

That is the only policy that counts. Youth sinn fein members are instructed by senior IRA members to infiltrate sports clubs, community groups, school boards etc, all with the express purpose of campaigning in this regard.

Do not believe that these 'activists' give a crap about housing, your kids school or your local GAA club. Trojan horse approach all the way.