COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

charlie14

Polar101 wrote: »

That's a pretty common sight at business parks during the weekend. Did someone ask them if they were there for the vaccine, or are we assuming it just because of the Pfizer sign?

I was not assuming it was the Pfizer carpark, or if it is, that they are there demanding vaccination. I just found it comical with the behaviour of many of that particular cohort during this pandemic should it be the case. Also that it would be the wrong company car park.

funnydoggy

Mammy got her call, being jabbed tomorrow in Parc Uí Chaoimh

Strazdas

eoinbn wrote: »

Once there is a restriction then that doubt could cascade to other groups. I can see a lot of people in the 50's/60's age groups turning AZ down. Hopefully I am wrong.

I think vaccine hesitancy is hugely overstated. From what we are hearing, take up is very high and large numbers of people received AZ last week, even with the vaccine in the headlines.

Problem with turning AZ down would be that you could be left waiting months to be vaccinated and I think most people are well aware of this - you don't get to turn down your AZ dose and get offered another vaccine two days later.

sd1999

Strazdas wrote: »

I think vaccine hesitancy is hugely overstated. From what we are hearing, take up is very high and large numbers of people received AZ last week, even with the vaccine in the headlines.

Problem with turning AZ down would be that you could be left waiting months to be vaccinated and I think most people are well aware of this - you don't get to turn down your AZ dose and get offered another vaccine two days later.

That's certainly the case with older cohorts wAhere they would have to wait until most of the country is done to get offered another vaccine but younger cohorts are already at the back of the queue and wouldn't have to wait as long for a new offer of they turn down their first one. For example a 65 year old is offered AZ at the start of May. If they turn it down, they would have to wait until maybe the end of July to get a new offer. A 23 year old is offered AZ at the end of June and would have to wait until the end of July to get a new offer. The cost for older cohorts of refusing a vaccine is higher than it is for younger cohorts.

nibtrix

titan18 wrote: »

It might not even be an issue. If you go over 50s atm lets say, all you do until probably end of May is disrupt AZ to people under 50 in groups 4 and 7. By the end of May, there might be more information on who exactly is prone to the clotting issue.

I think even if they generally restrict AZ for younger age groups they will still recommend that cohort 4 & 7 go ahead, as their risk from Covid is higher than the risk of the side effects? That's been my understanding so far anyway.

Russman

Strazdas wrote: »

I think vaccine hesitancy is hugely overstated. From what we are hearing, take up is very high and large numbers of people received AZ last week, even with the vaccine in the headlines.

Problem with turning AZ down would be that you could be left waiting months to be vaccinated and I think most people are well aware of this - you don't get to turn down your AZ dose and get offered another vaccine two days later.

I tend to agree with this tbh.

I wonder how it would work though if someone in one of the older cohorts simply doesn't register on the portal when that group is invited to, and leaves it 2/3 weeks to register ? They'd hardly be told "sorry you had your chance" would they ? You would imagine there would be an almost ongoing "mopping up" operation for people that were missed for whatever reason.

hmmm

Strazdas wrote: »

I think vaccine hesitancy is hugely overstated. From what we are hearing, take up is very high and large numbers of people received AZ last week, even with the vaccine in the headlines.

It's hard to say "no" when you get a call from your GP with an appointment date and time.

I think vaccine laziness might be a bigger issue when they issue a general call-up for age cohorts. "Ah sure I'll get to it at some stage, no rush".

stephenjmcd

sd1999 wrote: »

That's certainly the case with older cohorts wAhere they would have to wait until most of the country is done to get offered another vaccine but younger cohorts are already at the back of the queue and wouldn't have to wait as long for a new offer of they turn down their first one. For example a 65 year old is offered AZ at the start of May. If they turn it down, they would have to wait until maybe the end of July to get a new offer. A 23 year old is offered AZ at the end of June and would have to wait until the end of July to get a new offer. The cost for older cohorts of refusing a vaccine is higher than it is for younger cohorts.

On this, there will be no "offer" per say

Speaking to my GP this morning she say's you'll register online, validation of details, appointment to issue then. So whenever you register when your cohort is allowed, appointment follows. If the over 65 opened tomorrow for example they can register tomorrow or register in say 3 weeks time, doesn't matter when they register, it'll be open for them as long as vaccination is on going but she would expect most to jump at the chance straight away. That's her understanding of the process that's been explained to them.

After that the only choice you have is when the appointment is issued, Yes I want the vaccine appointment or No I don't want the appointment. After that it's pure luck as to whatever vaccine you get, she say's it'll be whatever is in use in the vaccination centre you go to & in line with NIAC adivse. So say if NIAC give for example AZ cut off at 40. Someone who's 41 will turn up and it could be any of the vaccines, someone who's 39 turns up and it's one of Pfizer, Moderna or J&J for example. Which one you get is whatever one is assigned to the MVC.

There'll be no choice, someone might have a preference but they won't be able to express said preference either.


Just aside from this, she's finished the over 70s dose 1 and is planning on doing a small number of cohort 4 next week, in particular she said in practice she is focusing on patients in cohort 4 that would need more personal attention and be familiar with her & might not be comfortable with a change of setting or change of doctor etc for which it might be upsetting.

She's got an excellent set up over there

funnydoggy

stephenjmcd you have a fantasic GP it sounds like. Always a good thing

stephenjmcd

funnydoggy wrote: »

stephenjmcd you have a fantasic GP it sounds like. Always a good thing

She's fantastic.

Having read some stories on here of GPs being very short with people and not that welcoming I do feel lucky to have a GP that's very approachable. You don't feel like a thick going down for something that you think is minor and might be a waste of her time.

Strazdas

Russman wrote: »

I tend to agree with this tbh.

I wonder how it would work though if someone in one of the older cohorts simply doesn't register on the portal when that group is invited to, and leaves it 2/3 weeks to register ? They'd hardly be told "sorry you had your chance" would they ? You would imagine there would be an almost ongoing "mopping up" operation for people that were missed for whatever reason.

I assume people are being contacted by their GPs anyway with an appointment? Some older people wouldn't even be online or have access to the internet. The portal is probably just an added way of making sure you get an appointment.

titan18

stephenjmcd wrote: »

On this, there will be no "offer" per say

Speaking to my GP this morning she say's you'll register online, validation of details, appointment to issue then. So whenever you register when your cohort is allowed, appointment follows. If the over 65 opened tomorrow for example they can register tomorrow or register in say 3 weeks time, doesn't matter when they register, it'll be open for them as long as vaccination is on going but she would expect most to jump at the chance straight away. That's her understanding of the process that's been explained to them.

After that the only choice you have is when the appointment is issued, Yes I want the vaccine appointment or No I don't want the appointment. After that it's pure luck as to whatever vaccine you get, she say's it'll be whatever is in use in the vaccination centre you go to & in line with NIAC adivse. So say if NIAC give for example AZ cut off at 40. Someone who's 41 will turn up and it could be any of the vaccines, someone who's 39 turns up and it's one of Pfizer, Moderna or J&J for example. Which one you get is whatever one is assigned to the MVC.

There'll be no choice, someone might have a preference but they won't be able to express said preference either.


Just aside from this, she's finished the over 70s dose 1 and is planning on doing a small number of cohort 4 next week, in particular she said in practice she is focusing on patients in cohort 4 that would need more personal attention and be familiar with her & might not be comfortable with a change of setting or change of doctor etc for which it might be upsetting.

She's got an excellent set up over there

Course there's still a choice, if you turn up at the centre and they go AZ, you can turn around and walk back out. Not like they'll physically drag you into the chair to take it. You'll still need the vaccination so if there's an amount of people who wont take AZ but will take another, you just have to refuse it and wait til they allow a choice. That's obviously far easier for the younger group too as it won't be very long after most likely.

Strazdas

titan18 wrote: »

Course there's still a choice, if you turn up at the centre and they go AZ, you can turn around and walk back out. Not like they'll physically drag you into the chair to take it. You'll still need the vaccination so if there's an amount of people who wont take AZ but will take another, you just have to refuse it and wait til they allow a choice. That's obviously far easier for the younger group too as it won't be very long after most likely.

Well, you are informed in advance what vaccine you are receiving : if it's AZ for example, your notification text will tell you this.

snotboogie

12k vaccines administered on the 10th.

titan18

Strazdas wrote: »

Well, you are informed in advance what vaccine you are receiving : if it's AZ for example, your notification text will tell you this.

Ah ok, even easier to not turn up then. It's obviously difficult to do it now as going to the back of the queue is a 3-4 month wait most likely. It'll be very easy for anyone in the sub 30 group to do it though if AZ isn't ruled out for them.

Sanjuro

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Having read some stories on here of GPs being very short with people and not that welcoming I do feel lucky to have a GP that's very approachable. You don't feel like a thick going down for something that you think is minor and might be a waste of her time.

My mam's friend has a GP who has never computerised. Does everything with paper and pencil. Real old school type. Unsurprisingly, it's been absolute chaos trying to get his patients vaccinated. Said friend is 75. Not a sign of getting even the first dose so far.

stephenjmcd

Sanjuro wrote: »

My mam's friend has a GP who has never computerised. Does everything with paper and pencil. Real old school type. Unsurprisingly, it's been absolute chaos trying to get his patients vaccinated. Said friend is 75. Not a sign of getting even the first dose so far.

No idea how anyone could work like that especially a GP

Sanjuro

stephenjmcd wrote: »

No idea how anyone could work like that especially a GP

It's baffling.

iamwhoiam

stephenjmcd wrote: »

No idea how anyone could work like that especially a GP

We were 40 years with such a GP . We changed over a year ago and so glad we did . The new lady is so efficient and everything computerised . I can’t get over it !

iamwhoiam

Strazdas wrote: »

I assume people are being contacted by their GPs anyway with an appointment? Some older people wouldn't even be online or have access to the internet. The portal is probably just an added way of making sure you get an appointment.

Paul Reid said there would be two ways to register . Online on the portal or we will be given a helpline phone number who will talk you through registration
The appointment will be via the portal or hepline and with a text , not via GPs

CrabRevolution

stephenjmcd wrote: »

No idea how anyone could work like that especially a GP

I found it a bit strange how supremely confident the GPs' body was in stating that certain parts of the vaccine rollout can be handled 100% by GPs. Surely they themselves are aware of colleagues whose "database" consists of a mountain of paper folders, many of which cover patients who may not have darkened their door in years, which would have to be sorted and read through manually in order to dig out the relevant data.

I suppose they're safe in the knowledge that even if it's a failure at the GP level, the HSE will be blamed.

josip

Sanjuro wrote: »

My mam's friend has a GP who has never computerised. Does everything with paper and pencil. Real old school type. Unsurprisingly, it's been absolute chaos trying to get his patients vaccinated. Said friend is 75. Not a sign of getting even the first dose so far.

You'd have to wonder if GPs who are still working with paper and pencil are also overly relying on what they learned in their early days.

iamwhoiam

CrabRevolution wrote: »

I found it a bit strange how supremely confident the GPs' body was in stating that certain parts of the vaccine rollout can be handled 100% by GPs. Surely they themselves are aware of colleagues whose "database" consists of a mountain of paper folders, many of which cover patients who may not have darkened their door in years, which would have to be sorted and read through manually in order to dig out the relevant data.

I suppose they're safe in the knowledge that even if it's a failure at the GP level, the HSE will be blamed.

Over 70 should be ok . The HSE have a data base of over 70 because they have a Free GP card . They are assigned to a GP and the HSE were sending that list to GP of all over 70 registered in that practice

crossman47

Sanjuro wrote: »

My mam's friend has a GP who has never computerised. Does everything with paper and pencil. Real old school type. Unsurprisingly, it's been absolute chaos trying to get his patients vaccinated. Said friend is 75. Not a sign of getting even the first dose so far.

I did think from the start that a number of so called problems stemmed from GPs like this.

Rebelbrowser

Sorry if asked already, but with everything being a bit of a moveable feast, how do they decide on cut off dates for each age cohort does anyone know? Say, to pick an example, the next cohort is 65-69 and you turn 65 on 5 May. Is it only people aged 65-69 on a given day (and, if so, what day?) or would a GP include, say, everyone turning 65 this year as its very hard to pick a date otherwise?

CrabRevolution

CrabRevolution wrote: »

I found it a bit strange how supremely confident the GPs' body was in stating that certain parts of the vaccine rollout can be handled 100% by GPs. Surely they themselves are aware of colleagues whose "database" consists of a mountain of paper folders, many of which cover patients who may not have darkened their door in years, which would have to be sorted and read through manually in order to dig out the relevant data.

I suppose they're safe in the knowledge that even if it's a failure at the GP level, the HSE will be blamed.

Sure I had experts on here telling me everything is digitised and could be accessed to figure out the at-risk categories. :rolleyes:

Turtwig

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Sure I had experts on here telling me everything is digitised and could be accessed to figure out the at-risk categories. :rolleyes:

That was in relation to coding within a patients hospital files. I don't recall any poster saying to you that gps would use those.

vienne86

Rebelbrowser wrote: »

Sorry if asked already, but with everything being a bit of a moveable feast, how do they decide on cut off dates for each age cohort does anyone know? Say, to pick an example, the next cohort is 65-69 and you turn 65 on 5 May. Is it only people aged 65-69 on a given day (and, if so, what day?) or would a GP include, say, everyone turning 65 this year as its very hard to pick a date otherwise?

I was wondering that, not in relation to myself though. I have a friend turning 70 in the last week of April, but an article in the Irish Times on Saturday says IMO says anyone turning 70 in April should be included in Cohort 3.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/gps-advised-not-to-administer-astrazeneca-jab-until-committee-reports-back-1.4534281

Where would it end though......how about someone now 69, but 70 by the time they get vaccinated?

Rebelbrowser

vienne86 wrote: »

I was wondering that, not in relation to myself though. I have a friend turning 70 in the last week of April, but an article in the Irish Times on Saturday says IMO says anyone turning 70 in April should be included in Cohort 3.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/gps-advised-not-to-administer-astrazeneca-jab-until-committee-reports-back-1.4534281

Where would it end though......how about someone now 69, but 70 by the time they get vaccinated?

Exactly. I have self interest I should say as turning 45 in late summer!

ACitizenErased

NIAC to recommend restriction of AstraZeneca vaccine for over-60s
https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0412/1209247-coronavirus-vaccine-ireland/

stephenjmcd

ACitizenErased wrote: »

NIAC to recommend restriction of AstraZeneca vaccine for over-60s
https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0412/1209247-coronavirus-vaccine-ireland/

Wow, didn't think they would go with 60's.

Well that's going to set us back a little seeing as the 60s are to be the ones called forward shortly

Christ, have they a figure on how many under 60's have been given their first dose of it?

Cork2021

ACitizenErased wrote: »

NIAC to recommend restriction of AstraZeneca vaccine for over-60s
https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0412/1209247-coronavirus-vaccine-ireland/

Not being funny or anything, but are they having a fûcking laugh?? This is a serious **** up! How many over 60’s have been given 1’shot of either Pfizer/Moderna and how many have 2? This is just seriously slowing things down!

Miike

I dread to imagine what their plan is for people waiting on their second dose (myself included). If they take the route of offering a single Pfizer dose as the prime booster (as opposed to full schedule of 2 doses) or J&J I'm going to be fairly miffed.

vienne86

So having already decided it wouldn't be given to 70+, that just leaves the 60-69s to get it.

stephenjmcd

Deleted User wrote: »

Christ, have they a figure on how many under 60's have been given their first dose of it?

Plenty, most countries though are going ahead with the dose 2 if they've already got dose 1.

The mix and match isn't approved, would be shocked if it was implemented here. Can't see an issue with going ahead with dose 2 for those that have had 1

Cork2021

Cork2021 wrote: »

Not being funny or anything, but are they having a fûcking laugh?? This is a serious **** up! How many over 60’s have been given 1’shot of either Pfizer/Moderna and how many have 2? This is just seriously slowing things down!

It basically limits it to people from 60 - 69. A lot of whom may now turn it down.

ACitizenErased

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

Strazdas

Miike wrote: »

I dread to imagine what their plan is for people waiting on their second dose (myself included). If they take the route of offering a single Pfizer dose as the prime booster (as opposed to full schedule of 2 doses) or J&J I'm going to be fairly miffed.

As far as I know, no person who has received an AZ vaccine has developed blood clots after the second dose - therefore getting the follow up AZ dose 12 weeks later should not be an issue, no matter what their age.

stephenjmcd

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Plenty, most countries though are going ahead with the dose 2 if they've already got dose 1.

The mix and match isn't approved, would be shocked if it was implemented here

I wonder will many refuse the second dose if we go ahead with them.

Van.Bosch

ACitizenErased wrote: »

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

Time for a new roadmap!

Klonker

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Wow, didn't think they would go with 60's.

Well that's going to set us back a little seeing as the 60s are to be the ones called forward shortly

They are in a difficult situation here now. Do they avoid giving any over 60s any the other vaccines and give them only Astra Zenica? This would mean 55-59 will probably be vaccinated before 60-69. Feels like Ireland are being overly cautious as usual.

MerlinSouthDub

ACitizenErased wrote: »

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

If they'd gone 55+ (like France), that would bring in another 300,000 people for AZ. Surprised they've gone to 60

Cork2021

ACitizenErased wrote: »

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

It’s a ****ing joke!!! I haven’t been this angry in long long time! So we’ll just wait and twiddle our thumbs so! AZ were the saviours now the clowns!

Strazdas

ACitizenErased wrote: »

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

Perfectly doable - I imagine they will be able to use up their entire AZ supply in coming months no matter what.

ACitizenErased

ACitizenErased wrote: »

they'll have to divert all remaining over 70s and the 60-69 to get AZ. We'll end up with AZ sitting around otherwise.

We're only a few days short of the target to have all over 70's offered a first dose, there may not be enough over 70's to avoid a stockpile building.

Strazdas

Klonker wrote: »

They are in a difficult situation here now. Do they avoid giving any over 60s of the other vaccines and give them only Astra Zenica? This would mean 55-59 will probably be vaccinated before 60-69. Feels like Ireland are being overly cautious as usual.

Not necessarily - their attitude is that the vaccines are all in and around the same standard in terms of effectiveness, so they can give the over 60s any vaccine and whatever is available (as the first dose).

Miike

Strazdas wrote: »

As far as I know, no person who has received an AZ vaccine has developed blood clots after the second dose - therefore getting the follow up AZ dose 12 weeks later should not be an issue, no matter what their age.

The official line is because of the limited experience in second dose candidates it cannot be ruled out :rolleyes: I'll take my chances with the second dose if that's an option.

Sky King

They'd hardly make it available privately to anyone who wants to roll the one in a hundred thousand dice?!?

stephenjmcd

Strazdas wrote: »

Perfectly doable - I imagine they will be able to use up their entire AZ supply in coming months no matter what.

Highly unlikely to be honest.

We're down to the age 70 bracket now so there's only 60-69 to be called forward that could now get AZ. It's not going to take months to get them done