COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

TomOnBoard

Apologies if it's already been asked and answered:

Can someone please explain this, using established science that has peer-reviewed bona-fides:

If I previously contracted Covid, and my antibody levels are good and high, as measured by a reliable test, should I still be vaccinated?

ACitizenErased

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Apologies if it's already been asked and answered:

Can someone please explain this, using established science that has peer-reviewed bona-fides:

If I previously contracted Covid, and my antibody levels are good and high, as measured by a reliable test, should I still be vaccinated?

Why exactly do you want a 'peer reviewed bona-fides' answer? The answer is simple, yes.

eagle eye

GT89 wrote:

I'm guessing the reason why they're trying to coercise people into taking the shot is because a sizeable amount of people like myself don't want to take it so they need to try and force people to take it by only allowing the vaccinated partake in most everyday activities. In my opinion any business that enforces masks or vaccines should be boycotted. Regardless if you agree with vaccines or not.

How many people do you reckon don't want a vaccine? I'd imagine it's a very small number. I want a vaccine myself.
I do agree though that it's unfair for anybody whose got a vaccine to be given preferential treatment.

TomOnBoard

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Why exactly do you want a 'peer reviewed bona-fides' answer? The answer is simple, yes.

Why do you need to know why I asked what I asked? Does one need to preface all questions on here with a statement of the reason for asking them?

I think not!

To avoid further snarky responses, let me re-iterate that I'm looking for answers that are meaningful, i.e. with a sound scientific basis, and not just yes/no opinions plucked out of wherever.. if such science-based answers are not possible here, maybe a Mod could do me a favour and point to some forum on Boards where serious Covid-related questions can be met with serious answers. Thank you!

JPup

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Apologies if it's already been asked and answered:

Can someone please explain this, using established science that has peer-reviewed bona-fides:

If I previously contracted Covid, and my antibody levels are good and high, as measured by a reliable test, should I still be vaccinated?

How do you intend to test whether your antibodies are good and high? Much simpler to just take the vaccine and then you will know for sure that they are.

eagle eye

JPup wrote:

How do you intend to test whether your antibodies are good and high? Much simpler to just take the vaccine and then you will know for sure that they are.

It's easily done, I know a few people who have got it done.

astrofool

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Why do you need to know why I asked what I asked? Does one need to preface all questions on here with a statement of the reason for asking them?

I think not!

To avoid further snarky responses, let me re-iterate that I'm looking for answers that are meaningful, i.e. with a sound scientific basis, and not just yes/no opinions plucked out of wherever.. if such science-based answers are not possible here, maybe a Mod could do me a favour and point to some forum on Boards where serious Covid-related questions can be met with serious answers. Thank you!

The current data (on the scientific side) points to the antibody levels in those who've previously been infected by SARS-COV2 to be lower compared to those who've taken a vaccine, and also that the antibodies are specific to the strain they were infected with, so less protection against mutations.

Some countries were looking at single doses for those previously infected, but health officials recommend that people still get vaccinated for strong lasting immunity, there has certainly been no adverse effects by those who were previously infected getting a vaccine.

Your questions are also quite broad and more detail of the specific situation is needed to give a fuller answer.

marno21

Not sure if it's been reported here amongst the last 80 posts or so which I scrolled through rather swiftly

https://www.ft.com/content/df5020f4-461e-443e-8d55-f3234690d049

AstraZeneca are cutting next weeks delivery by 49%. Roughly 14k coming now instead of 28k. They still say they aim to deliver 70m "as promised" (the original promise was 180m) in Q2.

stephenjmcd

marno21 wrote: »

Not sure if it's been reported here amongst the last 80 posts or so which I scrolled through rather swiftly

https://www.ft.com/content/df5020f4-461e-443e-8d55-f3234690d049

AstraZeneca are cutting next weeks delivery by 49%. Roughly 14k coming now instead of 28k. They still say they aim to deliver 70m "as promised" (the original promise was 180m) in Q2.

1 batch won't have progressed through QA in time for the delivery date next week so can't be released for delivery. Expected to be included in the next delivery.

It's not a yield issue etc so it's different to their previous reasoning but it's another example of their unreliability to stick to schedules

hmmm

marno21 wrote: »

AstraZeneca are cutting next weeks delivery by 49%. Roughly 14k coming now instead of 28k. They still say they aim to deliver 70m "as promised" (the original promise was 180m) in Q2.

They should never have done this on a no-profit basis, and it shows the folly of celebrating that approach.

If I was Astra Zeneca I'd walk away and cut their losses. Let one of the big EU manufacturers who have done little to nothing pick up the vaccine.

marno21

stephenjmcd wrote: »

1 batch won't have progressed through QA in time for the delivery date next week so can't be released for delivery. Expected to be included in the next delivery.

It's not a yield issue etc so it's different to their previous reasoning but it's another example of their unreliability to stick to schedules

Clear example of why it's prudent to withhold some doses for second doses if this is the level of reliability we are operating at.

Wolf359f

hmmm wrote: »

They should never have done this on a no-profit basis, and it shows the folly of celebrating that approach.

If I was Astra Zeneca I'd walk away and cut their losses. Let one of the big EU manufacturers who have done little to nothing pick up the vaccine.

The non profit is debatable, every country is paying a different price.
I'd say AZ is under contract so walking, god know what kinda contract breach that would cause. Not just between AZ and Oxford, but AZ and all their customers.
Best Effort clause could hardly absolve AZ relinquishing the patent to produce it.

patnor1011

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Sure. Put it this way. Ireland should thank its lucky stars that Tegnell wasn't in charge here during the pandemic.

What are you talking about? We did the same they did - we emptied hospitals and shipped most vulnerable to nursing houses when they promptly died. Majority of the population have no problem when they get covid mask or restriction or none of them does not matter.

Vaccines are no silver bullet as they do not guarantee reinfection but may reduce severity. It does not matter how many people get vaccinated as our health system is poised to collapse as soon as they attempt to fully open it again due to all missed appointments.

gmisk

I was onto my sister yesterday she is in northern ireland. She would be in the 40-45 range, asked to book an appointment for first dose via portal....they really are flying through people....meanwhile down here what ages are we now at, is it still over 70s?

I am guessing if I could get booked in up north it would be an essential journey?....I am just under 40.

noserider

gmisk wrote: »

I was onto my sister yesterday she is in northern ireland. She would be in the 40-45 range, asked to book an appointment for first dose via portal....they really are flying through people....meanwhile down here what ages are we now at, is it still over 70s?

I am guessing if I could get booked in up north it would be an essential journey?....I am just under 40.

Go for it

is_that_so

marno21 wrote: »

Clear example of why it's prudent to withhold some doses for second doses if this is the level of reliability we are operating at.

It's also a reminder of the house of cards that is delivery projections for Q2 vaccinations.

maviesk

gmisk wrote: »

I was onto my sister yesterday she is in northern ireland. She would be in the 40-45 range, asked to book an appointment for first dose via portal....they really are flying through people....meanwhile down here what ages are we now at, is it still over 70s?

I am guessing if I could get booked in up north it would be an essential journey?....I am just under 40.

Definitely an essential journey.

You can get the jab in Northern Ireland if you're registered with a GP there. If you're registered with a GP elsewhere in the UK, you're still eligible but you need to get in touch with the Trust directly and provide proof of NHS number and GP registration.

gmisk

maviesk wrote: »

Definitely an essential journey.

You can get the jab in Northern Ireland if you're registered with a GP there. If you're registered with a GP elsewhere in the UK, you're still eligible but you need to get in touch with the Trust directly and provide proof of NHS number and GP registration.

Thanks for that I am registered with a GP beside my folks. So yeah I think will probably head up when I can get booked in.

My other half is in healthcare and due his second dose pretty soon, so I wouldn't mind being vaccinated as well.

maviesk

gmisk wrote: »

Thanks for that I am registered with a GP beside my folks. So yeah I think will probably head up when I can get booked in.

My other half is in healthcare and due his second dose pretty soon, so I wouldn't mind being vaccinated as well.

Not sure where in the North your folks are, but in Belfast you've two choices: SSE Arena is only administering AZ but the Royal Vic is doing mostly Pfizer so while it's never a guarantee, something to keep in mind if you've a particular preference.

Micky 32

patnor1011 wrote: »

Vaccines are no silver bullet as they do not guarantee reinfection but may reduce severity.

There’s no may about it. Vaccines are practically 100% protection against severe illness hospitalisation and death. Take a look at Israel’s stats.

Some people love trying to downplay vaccines.

TomOnBoard

astrofool wrote: »

The current data (on the scientific side) points to the antibody levels in those who've previously been infected by SARS-COV2 to be lower compared to those who've taken a vaccine, and also that the antibodies are specific to the strain they were infected with, so less protection against mutations.

Have you references to some of the studies that established these findings? Thanks.

TomOnBoard

JPup wrote: »

How do you intend to test whether your antibodies are good and high? Much simpler to just take the vaccine and then you will know for sure that they are.

Antibody tests will tell you if you have antibodies and the levels you have. Such tests are also fundamental to establishing longevity of protection from vaccines. In Ireland, an ongoing project that measures antibody levels has been ongoing since last year. See SCOPI study here:
https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/scopi/

Micky 32

https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1380665520366579714?s=21

stephenjmcd

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Antibody tests will tell you if you have antibodies and the levels you have. Such tests are also fundamental to establishing longevity of protection from vaccines. In Ireland, an ongoing project that measures antibody levels has been ongoing since last year. See SCOPI study here:
https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/scopi/

While anti body tests like this can play a roll they actually aren't all that accurate.

T Cell response is where the long term protection looks to be and that won't come up in an anti body test which is only looking at anti bodies in the blood which will fade over time, while T cell is the long term memory.

Micky 32

Micky 32 wrote: »

There’s no may about it. Vaccines are practically 100% protection against severe illness hospitalisation and death. Take a look at Israel’s stats.

Some people love trying to downplay vaccines.

I agree with you that they are very effective. But it's not so much the public that are downplaying them, it seems to me, as doctors and scientists (particularly in the West). Dr Mary Ramsay of Public Health England predicts and social distancing will last for years in the UK despite the success of the vaccine rollout there: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56475807

SAGE is saying something similar: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9437441/Life-WONT-return-normal-June-21-Covid-vaccines-arent-good-SAGE-warns.html

If I recall correctly Tony Holohan said they would compliment the current measures a few months ago.

Micky 32

Deleted User wrote: »

I agree with you that they are very effective. But it's not so much the public that are downplaying them, it seems to me, as doctors and scientists (particularly in the West). Dr Mary Ramsay of Public Health England predicts and social distancing will last for years in the UK despite the success of the vaccine rollout there: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56475807

SAGE is saying something similar: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9437441/Life-WONT-return-normal-June-21-Covid-vaccines-arent-good-SAGE-warns.html

If I recall correctly Tony Holohan said they would compliment the current measures a few months ago.

Lol, I can’t see SD lasting for years but feel free to hide under your bed. To qoute:

“”Already, it means that people who are fully vaccinated can meet up after 14 days of the second dose, indoors or outdoors, without masks, or the need to social distance.””

Micky 32

Micky 32 wrote: »

Lol, I can’t see SD lasting for years but feel free to hide under your bed. To qoute:

“”Already, it means that people who are fully vaccinated can meet up after 14 days of the second dose, indoors or outdoors, without masks, or the need to social distance.””

I agree with you. And I want what you want, i.e. life to go back to normal asap. I'm just pointing out that it's not so much the public as many scientists and doctors who appear to be downplaying the vaccines. There was an article in the Financial Times the other day about the UK Government sounding out companies about social distancing being a requirement for 6 months every year in workplaces. But I hope as much as anyone that normal life will resume asap.

Micky 32

Deleted User wrote: »

I agree with you. And I want what you want, i.e. life to go back to normal asap. I'm just pointing out that it's not so much the public as many scientists and doctors who appear to be downplaying the vaccines. There was an article in the Financial Times the other day about the UK Government sounding out companies about social distancing being a requirement for 6 months every year in workplaces. But I hope as much as anyone that normal life will resume asap.

Doctors differ patients die and all that. If you were to listen to SAGE they wouldn’t want normality to return until there’s zero cases left in the world. We all know that will never happen, there will always be cases somewhere.

I posted a link earlier in the thread where people from Israel were all out socialising post vaccinated. There wasn’t much social distancing going on. Added to that social distancing rules relaxed for irish people who are vaccinated. It’s all good. It’s just the begining.

Micky 32

Micky 32 wrote: »

Doctors differ patients die and all that. If you were to listen to SAGE they wouldn’t want normality to return until there’s zero cases left in the world. We all know that will never happen, there will always be cases somewhere.

I posted a link earlier in the thread where people from Israel were all out socialising post vaccinated. There wasn’t much social distancing going on. Added to that social distancing rules relaxed for irish people who are vaccinated. It’s all good. It’s just the begining.

I hope you're right.

vienne86

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/newsfeatures/covid19-updates/vaccination-programme-dashboard-as-of-08-april-2021.pdf

Decent day!