Ireland v France 2021 6n

Ruggabugga101

StevenToast wrote: »

Andy Farrell is an excellent defence coach...

He is not a head coach.

Sadly I think I think this might be the case.

mfceiling

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Lowe had as many bad kicks as good kicks.
His almost try was only an almost try.
His missed tackles were criminal.


The only reason we lost by two wasn’t down to our ability, it was French mistakes that stopped them scoring more and allowed us a soft try.

The French mistakes flattered the score line but the were never in trouble.

The reason we lost by 2 was our ability.

Missed penalty by Burns.

Missed try by Lowe.

Missed tackle by Lowe.

These were all controlled by ourselves.

French mistakes were their doing, not ours.

We can only control our own performance.

TomsOnTheRoof

almostover wrote: »

We replaced Ryan and POM with Henderson and Ruddock. Little to no drop off in quality. Replaced Murray and Sexton with JGP and BB. Huge drop off in quality. Therein lies the issue.

Whatever about Henderson, he played well, but Ruddock didn't perform. He made 10 carries for 10 metres and made 7 tackles. Now stats aren't everything but given that he's not a set piece specialist or a jackal those are some pretty poor numbers. By contrast Stander made 44 metres and double the carries. Ruddock also only made 1 pass. I'm not trying to **** on him, he deserved to be given a go after on provincial form but that was a poor outing.

chancer12

Blanco100 wrote: »

How is Jack Carry not considered for this panel, he surely adds something different at 10.

Ciaran Frawley at Leinster is also an excellent option. However, he's being pushed to play 12 to accommodate the Byrnes. Harry has the potential to be excellent, Ross has reached his 'potential'.

dh1985

mun1 wrote: »

French were very poor today, we could have sneaked it in the end . A bit more composure and it could have worked out for us .
I’d pick the following team for Italy match , who will be a lot better than France were today

1. Healy/kilcoyne
2. Kelleher
3. Porter/furlong.
4. Henderson
5. Ryan
6. Beirne
7. VDF
8. Stander
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Earls
12. Henshaw
13. Ringrose
14. Larmour/Conway
15. Keenan.

Thought ruddock was very good today. What we have been missing at 6 for a long time. Dont think vdf is international standard also. Would like to see Connors start and see how he ruddock and stander gel.

Blanco100

Augme wrote: »

Reddan with a very rosey view of things I have to say.

We are on the road to learning this system or else closer to getting rid of players who won't fit in. Great stuff from Reddan.

Clareman

What controversary was there this week?

razorblunt

shootermacg wrote: »

Missed tackles and a few handling errors. Can't blame a coach for that really, that's down to the individual.

And the backline going nowhere? Allowing a 10 to stand deep and just lob the ball on?
All on the Coaches, buck stops with the Head Coach.

UAEguy2020

I don’t even know where we go about fixing things, the players who for any other team look confident and have the right idea look like a bunch of headless chickens for when they put on the green shirt, it’s not even the attack it’s just the attacking instinct, it just vanishes.


Really frustrating today as it wouldn’t have taken much for it to swing in our direction.

shootermacg

Earls was super today.

walshb

Augme wrote: »

So we just give up and accept we will never compete with France? Interesting attitude.

We have won 5 of last 8 matches now...

We do compete. Sometimes we lose..

It’s sport. It’s life..

Jump_In_Jack

prawnsambo wrote: »

Muddy Williams is an awful spoofer. Always has been. He's sometimes right, like a stopped clock. An example him saying that France have moved forward more than we have while omitting the fact that they have 28 pro teams to our 4.

Top 14 and Pro D2 has 16 teams so that’s 30 professional clubs.

prawnsambo

Augme wrote: »

So we just give up and accept we will never compete with France? Interesting attitude.

Well there's a leap. Have another think. You might get somewhere.

ujjjjjjjjj

Henshaw, Henderson, Keenan, Connors, Porter, Ruddock, Healy, Kelleher, Furlong Ringrose and Ross Byrne all did well for me.

Mixed games from JGP, Lowe, Earls, VDF and Beirne.

Stander and Herring offered little bar effort and we have to look at these two slots going forward and Burns clearly showed he is not for this level. Ed Byrne I think is unlikely to make an impact at this level. Dillane in this area too.

Pudsy33

Clareman wrote: »

What controversary was there this week?

The Sexton and French doctor stuff

breezy1985

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Lowe had as many bad kicks as good kicks.
His almost try was only an almost try.
His missed tackles were criminal.


The only reason we lost by two wasn’t down to our ability, it was French mistakes that stopped them scoring more and allowed us a soft try.

The French mistakes flattered the score line but the were never in trouble.

I do think Lowe has talent but he seems to want to be in the limelight a bit too much. Reminds me of Murray the way he wants to do everything himself

Scratchly

shootermacg wrote: »

Earls was super today.

Not sure in what world Earls was super. Missed a few tackles, poor kick chasing and minimal contribution going forward.

cantwbr1

There’s a certain amount of hysteria here (as was last week).
We were 1 shanked penalty from a win.
During the week people were forecasting a hammering. The same people are saying that the only reason that didn’t happen was France were crap.

Clareman

Pudsy33 wrote: »

The Sexton and French doctor stuff

Forgot about that, thanks

Utopia Parkway

Think the forwards have done really well over the two games. Plenty of territory and possession. Solid set piece.

The back play though has been absolutely septic. Very little threat with ball in hand. Ball being shoveled on laterally. Nobody straightening a line apart from Henshaw. And they've defended the wings very poorly.

Not seeing what Mike Catt is bringing to the party so far?

UAEguy2020

prawnsambo wrote: »

Muddy Williams is an awful spoofer. Always has been. He's sometimes right, like a stopped clock. An example him saying that France have moved forward more than we have while omitting the fact that they have 28 pro teams to our 4.

More excuses to accept mediocrity. I’m sick of these cop outs of blaming size and population and number of professional clubs and using it as an excuse to accept mediocrity. The French have a game plan, and a clear understanding of what’s expected of them whereas we don’t and you don’t have a clue what we will do next, that’s coaching, nothing to do with the number of professional clubs.

breezy1985

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Henshaw, Henderson, Keenan, Connors, Porter, Ruddock, Healy, Kelleher, Furlong Ringrose and Ross Byrne all did well for me.

Mixed games from JGP, Lowe, Earls, VDF and Beirne.

Stander and Herring offered little bar effort and we have to look at these two slots going forward and Burns clearly showed he is not for this level. Ed Byrne I think is unlikely to make an impact at this level. Dillane in this area too.

Every week we seem to get this Earls done meh narrative but what exactly does he do wrong. Ya he isnt scoring tries but he isn't getting much ball to either

prawnsambo

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

More excuses to accept mediocrity. I’m sick of these cop outs of blaming size and population and number of professional clubs and using it as an excuse to accept mediocrity. The French have a game plan, and a clear understanding of what’s expected of them whereas we don’t and you don’t have a clue what we will do next, that’s coaching, nothing to do with the number of professional clubs.

Do you think that having 28 pro teams isn't an advantage? Yes or no.

IngazZagni

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Top 14 and Pro D2 has 16 teams so that’s 30 professional clubs.

Indeed and most of our players come through via schools and amateur rugby in which there'll be the guts of 2 years with no action. This will have a much bigger negative effect for Ireland than France.

Overall I think people are being overly harsh on Ireland today. We aren't massively behind the best teams. Small margins just aren't going our way......yet.

cantwbr1

cantwbr1 wrote: »

There’s a certain amount of hysteria here (as was last week).
We were 1 shanked penalty from a win.
During the week people were forecasting a hammering. The same people are saying that the only reason that didn’t happen was France were crap.

In fairness France threw away 12 points with the try line a-begging through pure butchery on their part.

Ireland got a lucky bounce for 7 points.

That's a possible 19 point swing

Well done to Ireland for being gritty but the scoreline was a bit flattering really imo and Ireland didn't show much in attack to threaten the French whereas the French looked dynamic and dangerous when they had the ball

TomsOnTheRoof

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Henshaw, Henderson, Keenan, Connors, Porter, Ruddock, Healy, Kelleher, Furlong Ringrose and Ross Byrne all did well for me.

Mixed games from JGP, Lowe, Earls, VDF and Beirne.

Stander and Herring offered little bar effort and we have to look at these two slots going forward and Burns clearly showed he is not for this level. Ed Byrne I think is unlikely to make an impact at this level. Dillane in this area too.

I'm sorry but you are talking rot. Ruddock made 1 pass, made 10 metres for 10 carries and made 7 tackles. He did not have a good game. You say Stander is not up to it but he made 4 and a half times the number of metres Ruddock did. He also made 6 times the number of passes. Stander had the second highest number of metres for us today and he made the same number of passes and offloads as Ringrose.

Lowe did not have a mixed game. He was awful. He made 3 tackles, missed 4 and conceded 3 turnovers.

UAEguy2020

cantwbr1 wrote: »

There’s a certain amount of hysteria here (as was last week).
We were 1 shanked penalty from a win.
During the week people were forecasting a hammering. The same people are saying that the only reason that didn’t happen was France were crap.

To be fair most of those people have never actually analyzed how France play and just bought into the hype and thought just because they smashed Italy that they would smash Ireland. The reality is France have improved a lot and are looking good but this idea that they are the best thing since slimmed bread is a complete false narrative and nothing more.

its_phil

By the end of the 6N, Andy Farrell has a big decision to make about his back room staff. Wipe the slate, bar POC, or back the current staff going into games with New Zealand and Argentina.

Going to be interesting.

basill

The scoreline flatters Ireland. They were a distant second to a French team that didn't play to their ability or form.

walshb

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

More excuses to accept mediocrity. I’m sick of these cop outs of blaming size and population and number of professional clubs and using it as an excuse to accept mediocrity. The French have a game plan, and a clear understanding of what’s expected of them whereas we don’t and you don’t have a clue what we will do next, that’s coaching, nothing to do with the number of professional clubs.

Are you for real?

A country the size of France with its history of Rugby, finances, professionalism and clubs and pools..

You think an island of 5 million where GAA is completely dominant, followed by soccer is on the same playing field as France?

thomas 123

Zebo back for 15?

UAEguy2020

prawnsambo wrote: »

Do you think that having 28 pro teams isn't an advantage? Yes or no.

Simple question, is Farrell get the best out of the resources available to him, Yes or no? If the answer is no than that’s the end of the conversation.

France came to Dublin with a game plan, we had none...that’s nothing to do with the number of professional clubs available to them, that’s just mediocrity when it comes to coaching.

johnnyskeleton

StevenToast wrote: »

Andy Farrell is an excellent defence coach...

He is not a head coach.

Which is ironic, considering that the forward pack isn't really the problem for Ireland.

Overall I thought Ireland performed better than expectations but simply not good enough. They are too slow passing down the line, seem to lack communication and have a big problem replacing any tacklers who get out of position.

Dissappointed in Billy Burns today, but Ross Byrne has showed himself to be ideal for the Irish game plan - solid and reliable rather than unpredictable.

There were probably too many handling errors on both sides, which is due in part no doubt to the weather, but I felt that while France adapted and shortened their passing, Ireland didn't adapt well making their passing too slow and too far back into their own half during the second half.

If they had played less cautiously, France might have beat them by more. But, because they played so cautiously, they lacked the edge needed to win

thomas 123

walshb wrote: »

Are you for real?

A country the size of France with its history of Rugby, finances, professionalism and clubs and pools..

You think an island of 5 million where GAA is completely dominant, followed by soccer is on the same playing field as France?

Can you stop with the negativity.

UAEguy2020

walshb wrote: »

Are you for real?

A country the size of France with its history of Rugby, finances, professionalism and clubs and pools..

You think an island of 5 million where GAA is completely dominant, followed by soccer is on the same playing field as France?

So you are saying Andy Farrell is doing as great a job as Galthie right? Simple question.

The Inbetween is mine

its_phil wrote: »

By the end of the 6N, Andy Farrell has a big decision to make about his back room staff. Wipe the slate, bar POC, or back the current staff going into games with New Zealand and Argentina.

Going to be interesting.

Do you think that decision will be Farrell's to make?

Scratchly

thomas 123 wrote: »

Zebo back for 15?

I'm not sure laziness is the missing piece of the puzzle.

Movementarian

For me by far and away the biggest concern is our lack of ability to convert possession into points. Especially in opposition 22.

Too often seeing games where all stats are for us but we still lose or barely win. This has to be down to either poor attack coaching and/or a lack of player ability.

Very frustrating watching at the moment

its_phil

its_phil wrote: »

By the end of the 6N, Andy Farrell has a big decision to make about his back room staff. Wipe the slate, bar POC, or back the current staff going into games with New Zealand and Argentina.

Going to be interesting.

POC deserves huge credit for fixing the line out

prawnsambo

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

Simple question, is Farrell get the best out of the resources available to him, Yes or no? If the answer is no than that’s the end of the conversation.

France came to Dublin with a game plan, we had none...that’s nothing to do with the number of professional clubs available to them, that’s just mediocrity when it comes to coaching.

Ah yeah, I'm going to answer your strawman question while you refuse to answer mine. Good luck with that.

walshb

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

So you are saying Andy Farrell is doing as great a job as Galthie right? Simple question.

What has this to do with the comparisons in my post?

walshb

thomas 123 wrote: »

Can you stop with the negativity.

I’m not the one slagging our team for losing a rugby match by a score to France..

Clegg

its_phil wrote: »

By the end of the 6N, Andy Farrell has a big decision to make about his back room staff. Wipe the slate, bar POC, or back the current staff going into games with New Zealand and Argentina.

Going to be interesting.

Our scrum is a bigger positive than lineout I think. Held its own with just 7 men last week and was ultra solid against a mammoth France pack.

UAEguy2020

Farrell could do with someone from the outside looking at our back play, one big positive from these two games is our pack looks to be back and firing and surprisingly beat the French upfront today, I’m actually not dreading the game with England now. Our attack could use a similar fix, either get a backs coach in (Catt is an attack coach, not the backs coach technically) or maybe get someone like Graham Henry in like Leinster did for afew weeks just to give some tips, the players we have in that backline shouldn’t be as one dimensional as they are.

Tommybojangles

Unfortunate not to snatch it, could have gone either way but the lack of ideas in attack is what's costing us. No need to fly off the handle, lots of turnover at the moment and we're working towards our best team which isn't a disaster 18 months after the World Cup.

Kelleher did OK in his time on the pitch and I reckon he'll get the start next time? I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see Burns again, Ross is more deserving of more chances but its hard to see us having a top quality 10 going into 2023

thomas 123

walshb wrote: »

I’m not the one slagging our team for losing a rugby match by a score to France..

Your saying we shouldn’t have a chance at all though - nothing constructive about that. We should have a chance we were better than France for much of the last decade.

Also wins against Scotland and Georgia aren’t exactly metrics to say we don’t have a problem.

UAEguy2020

prawnsambo wrote: »

Ah yeah, I'm going to answer your strawman question while you refuse to answer mine. Good luck with that.

I’m guessing your answer is no.

Your question is irrelevant because our coaching staff has got them best out of the resources at their disposal and if that’s the case it’s a mute point. It’s excuses like this that leads to 0 improvement in the team and inevitably getting knocked out in the RWC QF.

bilston

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Ferris...! Be still my beating heart.

I'd have to ask, what has Catt done with this team? No power plays or tricky back moves.

Beginning to think this myself, but they have to generate quick ball for the backs to be able to do anything. Either we produce a brutal ball carrier or we improve our rucking

Utopia Parkway

Clegg wrote: »

Our scrum is a bigger positive than lineout I think. Held its own with just 7 men last week and was ultra solid against a mammoth France pack.

The pack and set-piece in general has been very good.

The good news stops at number 8 though. Apart from Henshaw at 12 who's been good.

prawnsambo

walshb wrote: »

What has this to do with the comparisons in my post?

I'm seeing a pattern here.
Gets annoying
Not really worth wasting time with
Obvious solution
Really works
Every time.