Ireland v France 2021 6n

Hands Like Flippers

almostover wrote: »

We replaced Ryan and POM with Henderson and Ruddock. Little to no drop off in quality. Replaced Murray and Sexton with JGP and BB. Huge drop off in quality. Therein lies the issue.

Nope. Don't agree.

Are you saying we would have won with CM and JS playing? Sure we lost in the autumn.

Hands Like Flippers

IngazZagni wrote: »

Indeed and most of our players come through via schools and amateur rugby in which there'll be the guts of 2 years with no action. This will have a much bigger negative effect for Ireland than France.

Overall I think people are being overly harsh on Ireland today. We aren't massively behind the best teams. Small margins just aren't going our way......yet.

Huge.

I personally know players and coaches packing it in. No underage internationals, right down to u10's. Devastating for the game.

ElisaAtWar

Hands Like Flippers wrote: »

Huge.

I personally know players and coaches packing it in. No underage internationals, right down to u10's. Devastating for the game.

There are very fine players at underage level. Is your issue that they are not being acknowledged. I would tend to agree if that's your point.

As per my previous post I would suggest there is just a simple flat game that Ireland plays and if you don't fit that game then you don't fit that game.

Let's take Jack Carty and ignore his penalty kicking percentages. Jack, by nature, plays positional rugby. And an outhalf who plays positional rugby does not equate to Irish rugby. It is totally different to Ireland.

So people can have their opinions but the reality is the direction of the team is set in stone. And while we can crib about it, it doesn't change the fact

cantwbr1

PokeHerKing wrote: »

I disagree. They're not professional so that automatically means that they compete in a diluted pool of talent, to think that don't is parochial blinkered nonsense.

To a certain extent what you say is true. However the playing population of inter county GAA is probably greater than the population playing AIL and professional rugby. And while most rugby players are not capable of playing professionally a percentage are. If every county GAA player had committed to rugby as a child and gave the same effort as they put into GAA the playing population capable of playing AIL or higher is automatically going to increase. It’s purely a numbers thing.

All sports are a pyramid with most players at the base (fairly crap) and the best few percent at the apex. The broader the base the more you get at the apex.

Former Former Former

A few thoughts now that things have settled down a bit.

Our main problem is our total lack of cutting edge in attack. We just never look like opening teams up when we have the ball. Defensively, set piece, at the breakdown - we're just as good as anyone else. However, we need phase after phase after phase to make any sort of inroads and frequently end up going backwards. I don't know if that's coaching or just lack of players who can break the line - but I was surprised that we didn't see Larmour earlier yesterday.

So, pretty deflating to be sitting on 2 LBPs after two rounds when we could have won both. I think we deserved to win in Wales but were second best yesterday.

Is it coaching that is holding us back? I don't know. Could just be a collective lack of confidence. We were definitely lacking on-field leadership yesterday; no offence to Henderson and Ringrose but they don't strike me as the 'leaders of men' type.

Anyhoo, some comments on the XV;

Keenan - continues to impress me, a few poor judgements aside. Has earned the jersey now.
Earls - battled manfully but totally underused. Can we get him to come infield more?
Ringrose - some lovely steps with little end product. Looks like the only guy who'll break the line but needs support
Henshaw - continued his great form but again, no real penetration
Lowe - overall a negative day IMO. Almost got a great try but the missed tackle for the second try and that kick on the full were horrendous.
Burns - not terrible but not much to shout about either. Not the successor to Sexton but still (probably) the best alternative right now
JGP - awful mistake for the first try but overall a decent showing.
Healy - solid in defence and set piece, anonymous in attack
Herring - just anonymous. The lineout is hugely improved so credit there.
Porter - another strong performance
Henderson - went well until the injury, no real carries but worked hard
Beirne - pretty quiet I thought
Ruddock - always willing to truck it up but outshone by the French backrow
VDF - as for Ruddock
Stander - as for VDF

Bench - Kelleher looked sharp enough, Ross Byrne did nothing wrong, Connors brought a bit of fight, but ultimately little or no impact off the bench.

Burkie1203

Former Former Former wrote: »

Henderson - went well until the injury, no real carries but worked hard
Beirne - pretty quiet I thought
Ruddock - always willing to truck it up but outshone by the French backrow
VDF - as for Ruddock
Stander - as for VDF

Beirne was poor I thought. Gave away the same penalty twice at lineouts and generally was poor around the park.

Ruddock I thought did very well. Offers more around then park then POM and was a nuisance at the lineout too.

I thought VDF was a bit like Beirne. Great last week, not so this week.


Our real issue is we go through phase play far too much. There is no challenge to defences to have to worry about another option. It will be constant phase play.


Standers charge at Faletau last week I thought summed us up. There was loads of space and more yardage to gain by avoiding Faletau but Stander ran straight at him. Was stopped dead before he went around to the side but by that stage the Welsh had got some sort of line in place. The first thought was to run straight into the nearest Welsh player.

GreeBo

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Standers charge at Faletau last week I thought summed us up. There was loads of space and more yardage to gain by avoiding Faletau but Stander ran straight at him. Was stopped dead before he went around to the side but by that stage the Welsh had got some sort of line in place. The first thought was to run straight into the nearest Welsh player.

That must be coming from the coaches, the emphasis is on setting up the next ruck, and then the next one 2m down the pitch...etc, etc.
It feels a bit like Arsenal trying to pass it into the net back in the day

Tbf the pack are the ones keeping us in these last 2 games, at least they are making the 2m!
Numerous times yesterday we either opted for the high ball or just shipped it out the line without drawing a tackle or even the defender.
This has to fall on the coaching staff as we have seen what teams like Japan can do with some quality coaching, nice dynamic back moves and line breaks. Even looking at Scotland yesterday you can see line breaks (other than a slip and a trip they had that won)

I don't understand the attitude of "lost by a score against France"...France weren't good! They butchered a couple of their chances and then handed us 5 points at that lineout. We shouldnt be looking at the scoreline after a match like that, we need to look at the performance...it wasnt good enough in a number of areas.

errlloyd

The wide behind angle for their first try showed why JGP shot. He was shooting for the bouncing ball that was going past Fikou. He was unlucky Fikou did well to grab it, get control of it, and pass it - when it looked like it'd spill past him into that space JGP was running into.

GreeBo

errlloyd wrote: »

The wide behind angle for their first try showed why JGP shot. He was shooting for the bouncing ball that was going past Fikou. He was unlucky Fikou did well to grab it, get control of it, and pass it - when it looked like it'd spill past him into that space JGP was running into.

Nah, it was a bad call, you dont shoot out like that in the hope of gathering if it leaves your man unmarked outside you, there was already a defender on Fikou, JGP had no business leaving his man imo.

Buer

I thought Beirne was solid yesterday after a great showing in Wales. Overall, he's up there as one of our best performers thus far in the tournament.

He needs to tidy up his discipline though. Yes, he was whistled harshly at one point in Cardiff but he now has 6 penalties against him in 2 games including a couple of dopey line out offences for pulling the opponent down. If Farrell is looking for a reason to exclude him and go back to Henderson and Ryan (which was always likely), that will be a very obvious excuse for him to do so.

There's a solid clear case for him moving to 6 against Italy but that fixture should really be an opportunity to look at a back row for the long term. Do we see him as along term option at blindside? I'm not so sure on that which is the only reason I'd be reluctant to start him there. It would not be making the most of that opportunity.

Our back row needs more dynamism not another big unit. As good as the likes of Ruddock and Stander were, we were one dimensional in attack up front and incredibly easy to defend against. We sorely lack Doris at the moment i.e. someone who can attack soft shoulders and space. I don't think moving Beirne to the back row is really going to help with that.

prawnsambo

Buer wrote: »

I thought Beirne was solid yesterday after a great showing in Wales. Overall, he's up there as one of our best performers thus far in the tournament.

He needs to tidy up his discipline though. Yes, he was whistled harshly at one point in Cardiff but he now has 6 penalties against him in 2 games including a couple of dopey line out offences for pulling the opponent down. If Farrell is looking for a reason to exclude him and go back to Henderson and Ryan (which was always likely), that will be a very obvious excuse for him to do so.

There's a solid clear case for him moving to 6 against Italy but that fixture should really be an opportunity to look at a back row for the long term. Do we see him as along term option at blindside? I'm not so sure on that which is the only reason I'd be reluctant to start him there. It would not be making the most of that opportunity.

Our back row needs more dynamism not another big unit. As good as the likes of Ruddock and Stander were, we were one dimensional in attack up front and incredibly easy to defend against. We sorely lack Doris at the moment i.e. someone who can attack soft shoulders and space. I don't think moving Beirne to the back row is really going to help with that.

I'm not sure, but I think at least one of those dopey lineout penalties was caused by his lifter letting him fall sideways and he instinctively grabbed out for support. I thought I heard Pearce say that it was a penalty against the lifter.

dub_skav

prawnsambo wrote: »

I'm not sure, but I think at least one of those dopey lineout penalties was caused by his lifter letting him fall sideways and he instinctively grabbed out for support. I thought I heard Pearce say that it was a penalty against the lifter.

They seemed to be trying a single lift at the front on Beirne quite a bit. He jumped a bit early and the lifter tried to hold him up, which will never work with a single lifter, so he lost balance.

Seems like a system weakness that they will need to get used to.

phog

I bit disappointed with us yesterday, more so than v Wales even though I thought that this was France's to lose.

We're still making too many errors in both attack which is blunt to say the least and in defence. Four tries scored against on the wing and you could claim by us targeting the wrong man we gave them space on the wing for those four tries.

Positives for me so far is JvDF, Keenan & Connors too, though I thought Keenan had to make the defender target him before passing that ball to Lowe.

Negatives for me is our attack, lack of use of our very good centres & wingers and Lowe's defence, caught again in no mans land yesterday.

I can understand why but still disappointed that Casey didn't get a few minutes yesterday and I wonder would we have made ground with him in those last few minutes rather than being driven backwards.

aloooof

phog wrote: »

Positives for me so far is JvDF,

I actually thought VDF was fairly average yesterday along with some uncharacteristic errors. Of our backrow, I thought Ruddock and Stander comfortably had better games than him, with Stander being the standout.

prawnsambo

dub_skav wrote: »

They seemed to be trying a single lift at the front on Beirne quite a bit. He jumped a bit early and the lifter tried to hold him up, which will never work with a single lifter, so he lost balance.

Seems like a system weakness that they will need to get used to.

I presume it's to give as many options to attack an opposition lineout as possible. In a six man lineout, you could conceivably have three different attacking options.

cantwbr1

One thing that was disappointing yesterday was that we were stripped of the ball 3 or 4 times after carrying into contact. This happened to backs and forwards.
It seems like we aren’t focusing on getting the absolute basics right

aloooof

Hoping things have calmed down a bit in here, but some thoughts:

1. Some of the camera work has been absolutely dreadful in a lot of matches this 6 Nations.  

2. Tighter scoreline than I expected, and considering we were missing Ryan, Doris, Sexton, Murray, POM, Stockdale before the game, and Henderson, Healy and Burns during it, I think we did ok, particularly in the forwards. 

3. However, from pretty early on, it did have the feel that France were capable of conjuring a try out of nothing, while we looked far more laboured in attack, before eventually resorting to kicking. I think our setup to the Lowe non-try was a decent bit of back play, but I don't think it's a surprise that came off first phase off a strong lineout maul. In general phase play, it all seems very static. 

4. Thought JGP did reasonably well. His box kicks aren't as accurate as Murray's, and he does seem to throw the occasional loose (and sometimes completely wayward) pass, but overall he was good. Mistake for the try, but France's quick transition seemed to result in us completely losing our shape, with JGP ending up on the wing so I'd wager there was more going wrong there than just him biting in

5. Lowe had an even more mixed day than the last day out; some really excellent things and some real awful things, especially defensively. Great to see us using his boot a lot more tho. 
He was unlucky with the disallowed try, but in real-time, it really looked to me like he led with his forearm. Would need to see it again (the replays focused on his foot to touch, naturally) but he may have been lucky there. Keenan really needs to fix Dulin before the pass as well, imo. 

6. Of our backrow, I thought VdF was poor, with some uncharacteristic errors. Ruddock was very solid, delivered exactly what you expect from him, but Stander was comfortably our best backrow, imo. 

7. Pretty stark turnaround in our lineout, especially defensively, it's been excellent. It's too soon to say it's solved, but some credit has to go to POC so far anyways. Scrum was excellent as well, so we at least have good platforms to work off.

8. Ringrose is class. It felt like anything good we were going to produce thru the backs was going to come thru him. Delighted for him to get the armband as well when Henderson went off.

9. Of the 10's I thought Ross Byrne had the better outing overall (not just the obvious from the tee). Interesting to see what happens in the half-backs the next day against Italy tho. ROG with the suggestion we should start Casey and Harry Byrne, given how strong we look in the pack.

phog

aloooof wrote: »

I actually thought VDF was fairly average yesterday along with some uncharacteristic errors. Of our backrow, I thought Ruddock and Stander comfortably had better games than him, with Stander being the standout.

I agree about Stander but I think we use him too much and on his own as a ball carrier so he's easy to target.

I also agree VdF had a few errors yesterday, who hadn't but I think over the two games he's one of the positives for me from the Irish camp

phog

aloooof wrote: »

9. Of the 10's I thought Ross Byrne had the better outing overall (not just the obvious from the tee). Interesting to see what happens in the half-backs the next day against Italy tho. ROG with the suggestion we should start Casey and Harry Byrne, given how strong we look in the pack.

Aside from taking his kicks at goal I wouldn't agree on Byrne.

Henry Ford III

Lacklustre and uninspiring.

I'm not sure is the issue a coaching one, or a player one but it's clear that we'll win few enough games playing like this. The pack are pretty decent and have been at least a match for Wales and France. The backs however have no cutting edge at all even with decent ball.

Some of the defensive errors are unacceptable at this level.

Had JGP and Lowe defended properly we'd have won both those games.

Burkie1203

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Lacklustre and uninspiring.

I'm not sure is the issue a coaching one, or a player one but it's clear that we'll win few enough games playing like this. The pack are pretty decent and have been at least a match for Wales and France. The backs however have no cutting edge at all even with decent ball.

Some of the defensive errors are unacceptable at this level.

Had JGP and Lowe defended properly we'd have won both those games.

There is a personnel issue very much at the heart of it but coaching is the main issue for me. We just don't look like we have a plan outside of running Into a wall of defenders

TheCitizen

phog wrote: »

Aside from taking his kicks at goal I wouldn't agree on Byrne.

You surely can’t be suggesting Burns should play. He’s very limited offers nothing in terms of kicking and little in terms of open play.

TheCitizen

clsmooth wrote: »

Jaysus, it’s toxic in here. No shame getting beaten by that French team. Enjoy your negativity lads.

France didn’t turn up. They were there for the taking. We have ability and talent but this manager/head coach whatever isn’t capable of getting the best out of our players. That was obvious last season and yet he’s still there.

awec

TheCitizen wrote: »

You surely can’t be suggesting Burns should play. He’s very limited offers nothing in terms of kicking and little in terms of open play.

Byrne offers even less through open play, it's his biggest weakness.

Came off the bench yesterday and did ok, landed an excellent kick at goal. But doesn't attack the line whatsoever and just shovels the ball on outside him when he gets it.

wittycynic

Burkie1203 wrote: »

There is a personnel issue very much at the heart of it but coaching is the main issue for me. We just don't look like we have a plan outside of running Into a wall of defenders

People will make excuses, but the reality is that this coaching team has had plenty of opportunity to evolve our game, or at least stop the decline that started in Joe's final days. Neither has happened.

We've seen no progress whatsoever and we need to change coaches at the end of this Six Nations, or risk wasting more of these players' potential.

phog

TheCitizen wrote: »

You surely can’t be suggesting Burns should play. He’s very limited offers nothing in terms of kicking and little in terms of open play.

We then we're in trouble because we went backwards with Byrnes playing, we owned the ball for the last few minutes and went backwards, passed more, backwards, passed more, backwards until France turned us over and took us out of our misery.

TheCitizen

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Lacklustre and uninspiring.

I'm not sure is the issue a coaching one, or a player one but it's clear that we'll win few enough games playing like this. The pack are pretty decent and have been at least a match for Wales and France. The backs however have no cutting edge at all even with decent ball.

Some of the defensive errors are unacceptable at this level.

Had JGP and Lowe defended properly we'd have won both those games.

I think it’s a coaching issue more than anything. The tournament this year was there for the taking if we were properly organised. There is ability and talent available, it’s disgraceful if the IRFU continue with a coaching set up that fails to make the most of them.

prawnsambo

TheCitizen wrote: »

France didn’t turn up. They were there for the taking. We have ability and talent but this manager/head coach whatever isn’t capable of getting the best out of our players. That was obvious last season and yet he’s still there.

What? What exactly about France's play was indicative of this?

TheCitizen

phog wrote: »

We then we're in trouble because we went backwards with Byrnes playing, we owned the ball for the last few minutes and went backwards, passed more, backwards, passed more, backwards until France turned us over and took us out of our misery.

Is Jack Carty a better option. Burns is not the answer that much is certain. O’Gara suggested Harry Byrne IIRC. The tournament is over for Ireland, use the rest of it to give opportunities to new half back pairings to replace Sexton and Murray. That’s what should happen but this coach is a totally uninspiring figure with no vision.

TheCitizen

prawnsambo wrote: »

What? What exactly about France's play was indicative of this?

They didn’t get out of second gear. Ireland inexplicably were within reach of France towards the end of the game. If they had turned up with form nearer what they’re capable of the match would have been done and dusted much earlier.

Pudsy33

France absolutely turned up, they were out on their feet at the end and were celebrating in the changing room like like won a world cup. This was massive for them.

dub_skav

prawnsambo wrote: »

I presume it's to give as many options to attack an opposition lineout as possible. In a six man lineout, you could conceivably have three different attacking options.

Looked like that alright.
Beirne is a very good and reasonably light jumper, so only commit 1 lifter to him to contest at the front. If they still win at the front you're happy enough to concede there.
Then you do a read and react with all the other players to get either Ruddock or Henderson in the air with 2 lifters.
It worked pretty well with the full pod putting a lot of pressure on, but Beirne and his lifter need to accept when they've timed it wrong and let them have it.

Not a travesty by any means, but they haven't had much time with POC to practice any new setup and even less time with Ruddock, surprisingly, in the middle of it.

FrannoFan

TheCitizen wrote: »

They didn’t get out of second gear. Ireland inexplicably were within reach of France towards the end of the game. If they had turned up with form nearer what they’re capable of the match would have been done and dusted much earlier.

we stopped them playing by starving them of the ball. we attacked them all day at the breakdown and set piece. (bar the first try where we inexplicably didn't compete despite disrupting 3 lineouts already at that point) We played territory forcing them to kick back. We were clever and combative. france weren't allowed to get out of second gear.

Scratchly

aloooof wrote: »

He was unlucky with the disallowed try, but in real-time, it really looked to me like he led with his forearm. Would need to see it again (the replays focused on his foot to touch, naturally) but he may been lucky .

Nah there was no leading with the forearm. He just leaned into the hit.

theVersatile

https://streamable.com/i00ssu

Byrne (Ed) doesn't come out of this well in hindsight. Won't look great in the review

crossman47

Just one thought on reflection. The criticism of Joe towards the end was of a limited game plan. We had such great players they should be given more scope. How stupid that looks now. If he were in charge yesterday we would have won. It might have been boring but who would care.

We are always set on blaming the coach. How many have we let go too early? Certainly Gatland and maybe O'Sullivan. Also Kidney gets referenced usually as a failure when he brought us to our grand slam and had a magnificent record with Munster. The calls for Cullen to get the job are misplaced unless he were to bring Lancaster with him.

hahashake

Pudsy33 wrote: »

France absolutely turned up, they were out on their feet at the end and were celebrating in the changing room like like won a world cup. This was massive for them.

There is a segment of fans (both Irish and non-Irish) who predicted and were hoping for a complete domination by France. The same people who will chalk up any French mistake as unlucky/sloppy but any Irish mistake as indicative of the inherent flaws of the players/coaching ticket.

Now, I believe this French team is better than the current Irish team but I don't think the gap is massive. Whether that means France aren't as good as many are saying or Ireland are better than many are saying remains to be seen.

Podge_irl

crossman47 wrote: »

Just one thought on reflection. The criticism of Joe towards the end was of a limited game plan. We had such great players they should be given more scope. How stupid that looks now. If he were in charge yesterday we would have won. It might have been boring but who would care.

We are always set on blaming the coach. How many have we let go too early? Certainly Gatland and maybe O'Sullivan. Also Kidney gets referenced usually as a failure when he brought us to our grand slam and had a magnificent record with Munster. The calls for Cullen to get the job are misplaced unless he were to bring Lancaster with him.

Calls for Farrell to go are way overblown, but EOS most definitely was not let go too early and Kidney was there far too long.

TheCitizen

FrannoFan wrote: »

we stopped them playing by starving them of the ball. we attacked them all day at the breakdown and set piece. (bar the first try where we inexplicably didn't compete despite disrupting 3 lineouts already at that point) We played territory forcing them to kick back. We were clever and combative. france weren't allowed to get out of second gear.

We have ability and talent especially with the forwards. We have the platform there for a decent team. We need a coaching set up with the vision and ability required to build on that and make the most of it. The coach we have picked Burns at out half, says it all.

France btw can play much better, they coughed up opportunities for Ireland that kept us in the game that had nothing to do with the pressure and good play from the Irish pack.

UAEguy2020

crossman47 wrote: »

Just one thought on reflection. The criticism of Joe towards the end was of a limited game plan. We had such great players they should be given more scope. How stupid that looks now. If he were in charge yesterday we would have won. It might have been boring but who would care.

We are always set on blaming the coach. How many have we let go too early? Certainly Gatland and maybe O'Sullivan. Also Kidney gets referenced usually as a failure when he brought us to our grand slam and had a magnificent record with Munster. The calls for Cullen to get the job are misplaced unless he were to bring Lancaster with him.

Okay, now you know I’m going to ask you how we would have won if Schmidt was in charge. What would we have done any differently if he was in charge?

Podge_irl

TheCitizen wrote: »

We have ability and talent especially with the forwards. We have the platform there for a decent team. We need a coaching set up with the vision and ability required to build on that and make the most of it. The coach we have picked Burns at out half, says it all.

France btw can play much better, they coughed up opportunities for Ireland that kept us in the game that had nothing to do with the pressure and good play from the Irish pack.

As opposed to...?

Buer

phog wrote: »

Aside from taking his kicks at goal I wouldn't agree on Byrne.

I agree with a caveat that we couldn't kick the ball away when Ross Byrne was on the field as we were chasing the game.

In many ways, the first half game plan was much more suited to Ross Byrne (territorial, lots of kicking, forward dominance) and the second half (at least the latter stages) was more suited to Burns (chasing the game, needed to create something with ball in hand and retaining possession was key).

But we were going nowhere with ball in hand whilst Byrne was on the field. He nailed two difficult kicks and really does deserve credit for that but we looked so easy to defend against in those closing stages. All France needed to do was keep their discipline and they were never in any difficulty.

That's not all on Byrne. I thought are midfield distribution was mediocre/poor and, on the couple of occasions we got the ball wide, the logical move was to kick down the line over the defender with a chase but we just checked back inside, set up the ruck and went again with the same pattern, losing yards each time.

TheCitizen

Podge_irl wrote: »

Calls for Farrell to go are way overblown, but EOS most definitely was not let go too early and Kidney was there far too long.

Nonsense Farrell isn’t up to the task at all. He does half a job. Not good enough. Even when we get into positions where we have opportunities to win we just shoot ourselves in the foot with amateur unforced errors. Get rid of him and then we might have a hope of building a decent properly organised side.

crossman47

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

Okay, now you know I’m going to ask you how we would have won if Schmidt was in charge. What would we have done any differently if he was in charge?

The basics would have been better. No stupid mistakes. He wouldn't have picked Lowe for one.

TheCitizen

Podge_irl wrote: »

As opposed to...?

If you’re suggesting we have no better options than Burns at out half then we may as well pack it in. If Byrne started yesterday we would have been ahead towards the end instead of chasing the game. Carty and Harry Byrne are others to consider. Burns is not an option. Hopeless management to select him after what he did when he came on v Wales.

prawnsambo

TheCitizen wrote: »

They didn’t get out of second gear. Ireland inexplicably were within reach of France towards the end of the game. If they had turned up with form nearer what they’re capable of the match would have been done and dusted much earlier.

Sorry, I couldn't see their gear shifter from where I was sitting.

You don't think our defence had something to do with this? That we had Dupont closed down for most of the game?

UAEguy2020

hahashake wrote: »

There is a segment of fans (both Irish and non-Irish) who predicted and were hoping for a complete domination by France. The same people who will chalk up any French mistake as unlucky/sloppy but any Irish mistake as indicative of the inherent flaws of the players/coaching ticket.

Now, I believe this French team is better than the current Irish team but I don't think the gap is massive. Whether that means France aren't as good as many are saying or Ireland are better than many are saying remains to be seen.

The fans that thought France were going to destroy us were the fans that don’t properly watch or analyze France and are just buying into the media narrative, you can tell just from the commentary jamming the same sentences every time France play a match.

The reality is the French team is better than it was but it’s not within an asses roar of winning a RWC, people will say they have an advantage of being at home but then again based on history is that really an advantage? Because even when France hosted the last RWC they lost 3 home games to not exactly the best opposition in the tournament and that’s just one example. France appear to be further down the line at the minute than the others which is why they are having success. Yesterday confirmed more of what I already knew that the media are full of **** when they talk about France and are just following the narrative rather than talking about facts.

UAEguy2020

crossman47 wrote: »

The basics would have been better. No stupid mistakes. He wouldn't have picked Lowe for one.

We made stupid mistakes even when Schmidt was coach. He picked Stockdale so would have picked Lowe also.

aloooof

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

The reality is the French team is better than it was but it’s not within an asses roar of winning a RWC

Way too premature to be claiming this, imo. We're over 2 years out. People would've been saying the exact same thing about SA at this time 4 years ago. A lot can change in 2 years and France seem to be going in the right direction, and have some exceptional players in their squad.

TheCitizen

prawnsambo wrote: »

Sorry, I couldn't see their gear shifter from where I was sitting.

You don't think our defence had something to do with this? That we had Dupont closed down for most of the game?

I think and have said we have ability and talent in certain areas. We won’t make the most of it with this current head coach though.