Covid 19 Part XXXIII-231,484 ROI(4,610 deaths)116,197 NI (2,107 deaths)(23/03)Read OP

caveat emptor

is_that_so wrote: »

AZ not hitting targets in Q1, regularly changing those supply delivers and unlikely to do so in Q2 doesn't win them any friends at all in the EU. They are well within their rights to do this.

Really. When Germany blocked export of PPE while our nurses and doctors wore bin bags it wasn't proclaimed that they were doing the right thing.

In fact it was acknowledged that it was a mistake and led to the common approach to vaccine procurement at an EU level.

CIARAN_BOYLE

There's a few views on hospital transmissions

1. Hospital transmission is due to hospital **** ups. Jail the doctors and nurses. They are murders.

2. Hospital transmissions happen if there is covid in the community. It sucks but we can't fix this. People are doing their best to limit it but it still happens at an unfortunately high level.

3. Hospital transmissions don't happen. Cases detected in hospital aren't hospital transmissions. Health care workers are angels. Hospitals have a magical shield and you can't get covid there.

Personally I'm a believer in version 2.

is_that_so

caveat emptor wrote: »

Really. When Germany blocked export of PPE while our nurses and doctors wore bin bags it wasn't proclaimed that they were doing the right thing.

In fact it was acknowledged that it was a mistake and led to the common approach to vaccine procurement at an EU level.

Not sure what PPE has to do with AZ, that was the Wild West back everywhere then.

Shelby Foote

is_that_so wrote: »

Yep, that's what we do here, explain to the bewildered what's going on but you're clearly too smart to need it!

I think even the bewildered realise that lowering deaths, cases and ICU numbers inform government decisions. Patronising.

normanoffside

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

There's a few views on hospital transmissions

1. Hospital transmission is due to hospital **** ups. Jail the doctors and nurses. They are murders.

Honestly I don't think anyone blames the Doctors and Nurses, rather the poor equipment, procedures and conditions provided to them by the HSE

timsey tiger

caveat emptor wrote: »

Really. When Germany blocked export of PPE while our nurses and doctors wore bin bags it wasn't proclaimed that they were doing the right thing.

In fact it was acknowledged that it was a mistake and led to the common approach to vaccine procurement at an EU level.

Bit of a difference between sharing with fellow member states and third countries. Not quiet sure why you can't/won't see this.

Ficheall

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

There's a few views on hospital transmissions

1. Hospital transmission is due to hospital **** ups. Jail the doctors and nurses. They are murders.

2. Hospital transmissions happen if there is covid in the community. It sucks but we can't fix this. People are doing their best to limit it but it still happens at an unfortunately high level.

3. Hospital transmissions don't happen. Cases detected in hospital aren't hospital transmissions. Health care workers are angels. Hospitals have a magical shield and you can't get covid there.

Personally I'm a believer in version 2.

Version 2 with the suggestion that we therefore keep trying to reduce the covid in the community, of course. It should, of course, go without saying, but............

caveat emptor

is_that_so wrote: »

Not sure what PPE has to do with AZ, that was the Wild West back everywhere then.

Both PPE and vaccines are in demand commodities.

Back in the early days Germany blocked export of any and all PPE.
We didn't have enough PPE for health care workers and doctors had to beg on social media for donations.

Italy blocking export of the vaccine isn't a million miles away from that.
Not issuing export permits is a tried and tested method of vaccine nationalism.

That way they don't have to result in pulling the stuff off the back of a truck.

Germany and France both have massive surplus in AZ vaccine after they rubbished it in the midjia. Surely they could donate some unwanted stock?

Gael23

462 cases 39 deaths

jhegarty

We have a real shot at a < 500 average for the week.

caveat emptor

timsey tiger wrote: »

Bit of a difference between sharing with fellow member states and third countries. Not quiet sure why you can't/won't see this.

International trade is complex and any measures are usually reciprocated. God knows what random products they could block in retaliation that people depend on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia–Ireland_relations#Trade

n 2016, trade between Australia and Ireland totalled $2.4 billion Australian dollars.[19] Australia exported approximately $71 million Australian dollars to Ireland with main exports including: medicaments, alcoholic beverages, sugar, molasses and honey and medical instruments. Ireland exported $2.384 billion Australian dollars worth of goods to Australia with the main exports including: medicaments, manufactured articles, pharmaceutical products and computers.[19] Australia is Ireland's 15th biggest export trading partner globally, while at the same time, Australia is Ireland's 44th largest import source.

Marty Bird

Goldengirl wrote: »

As you are joining in here..... When did he get it, was he swabbed, did he pick it up within the first week or was it after that? Did any of his family get swabbed and were they negative?
Of course you may not have access to that detail nor are you going to interrogate your grieving friend.
That is the job of the tracing teams and HSE.
Yes outbreaks occurred but a good percentage were not from "in hospital" transmission.
When you or anyone else here has all that information it is perfectly reasonable to discuss.
But please spare us unvetifiable anecdotal stories, just to stir it up.

All I know his dad was due to go into hospital for hip procedure was tested prior to going in negative went in a got in it hospital was what he told me.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

International trade is complex and any measures are usually reciprocated. God knows what random products they could block in retaliation that people depend on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia–Ireland_relations#Trade

If there were to be a trade war between the Europeans and Australia, the type of products Ireland exports would be last on the list for tariffs. There is nowhere else they could realistically go for stents for example. I think we would manage without jacobs creek however

mollser

I see RTE have stopped reporting the NI numbers altogether now, now that they're going well. Not wholly surprising, but hey!

Tyrone212

caveat emptor wrote: »

International trade is complex and any measures are usually reciprocated. God knows what random products they could block in retaliation that people depend on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia–Ireland_relations#Trade

Australia is in the sh.t with China presently. Doubt they'll want a second front. A country of just over 20m. What clout they have...

is_that_so

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Australia is in the sh.t with China presently. Doubt they'll want a second front. A country of just over 20m. What clout they have...

They might make a few loud noises but it does give them a ready made excuse if there are issues with their vaccination programme.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Marty Bird wrote: »

All I know his dad was due to go into hospital for hip procedure was tested prior to going in negative went in a got in it hospital was what he told me.

He wouldn't be told where he got it. Even the contact tracing people wouldn't know for certain. They are just making educated guesses.

The virus has a presymtomatic phase where it can't be detected. Tests only show if virus is detectable at a point in time.

A lot of people blame hospitals because they had a negative test going in but that negative test probably reflects being negative 5 days before going in. You aren't certain you actually were negative when you went in. If you have a positive test on your third day in hospital it's more likely to be hospital detection of transmission prior to being in hospital than hospital transmission. People blame hospital transmission though.

Some posters are health care workers and are oversensitive because they are used to a negative refrain from posters here. We have restrictions because hospitals and health care workers infect people with this virus.

There is a much higher rate of hospital detection than in comparable settings. This is because there are huge amounts of testing going on in hospitals. Yes there is some hospital transmission but a lot more people blame hospital transmission than hospitals are actually responsible for.

Plumbthedepths

mollser wrote: »

I see RTE have stopped reporting the NI numbers altogether now, now that they're going well. Not wholly surprising, but hey!

I'm surprised they reported on RyanAir announcing a Summer schedule from Belfast airport. 8 routes to choose from. RA last flew from Belfast 11 years ago.

AdamD

caveat emptor wrote: »

International trade is complex and any measures are usually reciprocated. God knows what random products they could block in retaliation that people depend on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australia–Ireland_relations#Trade

Based on that, Australia are far more reliant on importing items from Ireland than vice versa. Though obviously our businesses would be reliant on that income.

Ultimately, I think the EU have to take this position. They can't allow Astrazenica to consistently miss deadlines and supply totals to the EU whilst also exporting to other countries from EU based factories.

BorneTobyWilde

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

BBC reporting that Italy has blocked the export of 250,000 AZ vaccine doses to Australia.
Considering what Italy went through whilst I don't agree I understand the motivation.

Australia, with 4 cases a day! Dam right to block that shipment



AZ are just taking the piss now. And its at the request of UK to screw EU over.

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

If there were to be a trade war between the Europeans and Australia, the type of products Ireland exports would be last on the list for tariffs. There is nowhere else they could realistically go for stents for example. I think we would manage without jacobs creek however

So **** them yeah? I seem to remember we have quite a large number of Irish citizens living there.

It's all cover for our (EU) fvck up of a roll out. DE and FR actively undermined it. Can't shift their AZ vaccine.

Denmark and Austria told not to engage with Israel about collaborating on establishing their own manufacturing capability of the pfizer vaccine. Austria immediately got 100 K delivery of Pfizer to make sure.

0lddog

Gael23 wrote: »

462 cases 39 deaths

Do you know where we can find out how many of those 39 were in March, Feb, Jan and earlier ?

Renault 5

The EU and Italy have come to the correct decision in regards to stopping AZ shipments

CIARAN_BOYLE

0lddog wrote: »

Do you know where we can find out how many of those 39 were in March, Feb, Jan and earlier ?

Try rte

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0304/1200855-coronavirus-ireland/

KrustyUCC

0lddog wrote: »

Do you know where we can find out how many of those 39 were in March, Feb, Jan and earlier ?

the National Public Health Emergency Team said that ten of the deaths occurred this month, 12 in February, 13 in January and three earlier than this.

mollser

mollser wrote: »

I see RTE have stopped reporting the NI numbers altogether now, now that they're going well. Not wholly surprising, but hey!

Can't have the Government & HSE reflected in a poor light, now can we? UK putting us in the shade with respect to speed of re-opening won't breed compliance forever, hence RTÉ are burying NI success story. Cynical as it gets.

caveat emptor

AdamD wrote: »

Based on that, Australia are far more reliant on importing items from Ireland than vice versa. Though obviously our businesses would be reliant on that income.

Ultimately, I think the EU have to take this position. They can't allow Astrazenica to consistently miss deadlines and supply totals to the EU whilst also exporting to other countries from EU based factories.

Yeah there is an imbalance in our favour but it's just not a good route to go down.

I think it's important that they control it so I'm not disagreeing with it rather I think it's a disgrace that Germany and France have a stockpile of astra-zenica because they undermined it during the Brexit sh!te.

They should be giving those to Italy instead of blocking Australia. Considering how well Australia have done it's not surprising they'll be punished.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

So **** them yeah? I seem to remember we have quite a large number of Irish citizens living there.

It's all cover for our (EU) fvck up of a roll out. DE and FR actively undermined it. Can't shift their AZ vaccine.

Denmark and Austria told not to engage with Israel about collaborating on establishing their own manufacturing capability of the pfizer vaccine. Austria immediately got 100 K delivery of Pfizer to make sure.

The eu roll out is a poor relative to uk, us and Israel, and in Israel’s case they are doing nothing for their Palestinian subjects. Relative to the rest of the world the eu is doing quite well outside of a few oil oligarchies and luxury holiday destinations. And the more is equity of supply across the eu. How do you think it would have worked out for most members in a free for all, given the same overall number of doses would have been available

Jim_Hodge

0lddog wrote: »

Do you know where we can find out how many of those 39 were in March, Feb, Jan and earlier ?

RTE News

ten of the deaths occurred this month, 12 in February, 13 in January and three earlier than this.

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

The eu roll out is a poor relative to uk, us and Israel, and in Israel’s case they are doing nothing for their Palestinian subjects. Relative to the rest of the world the eu is doing quite well outside of a few oil oligarchies and luxury holiday destinations. And the more is equity of supply across the eu. How do you think it would have worked out for most members in a free for all, given the same overall number of doses would have been available

We would have come off worse although we could have blocked export of stents as you suggested in the Australian situation so maybe it could have gone well?

I think the UK were right on the one dose vs two doses and used what they had to maximal effect. What's your thoughts?

Goldengirl

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

He wouldn't be told where he got it. Even the contact tracing people wouldn't know for certain. They are just making educated guesses.

The virus has a presymtomatic phase where it can't be detected. Tests only show if virus is detectable at a point in time.

A lot of people blame hospitals because they had a negative test going in but that negative test probably reflects being negative 5 days before going in. You aren't certain you actually were negative when you went in. If you have a positive test on your third day in hospital it's more likely to be hospital detection of transmission prior to being in hospital than hospital transmission. People blame hospital transmission though.

Some posters are health care workers and are oversensitive because they are used to a negative refrain from posters here. We have restrictions because hospitals and health care workers infect people with this virus.

There is a much higher rate of hospital detection than in comparable settings. This is because there are huge amounts of testing going on in hospitals. Yes there is some hospital transmission but a lot more people blame hospital transmission than hospitals are actually responsible for.

Thanks for that more objective post
Yes sensitive but wouldn't say over sensitive !
Some posters here are known to tell fibs when it suits them and then stories to suit their narrative .
Why would it be ok not to blame partying students for infections but somehow blame HCWs for example ?
Some others are straight up what you see is what you get .

I have never denied hospital transmission or infection.
It is what happens whenever rates in the community go up and is virtually impossible to prevent with Covid when case numbers are high without resorting to banning patients from coming in !
We also have patients coming to hospital for something else, unaware that infection is brewing in their families and despite a negative test on admission they end up getting sicker and then test positive.
If this is traced back to family infections and is within the first 5 days it is, generally, but not always , deemed to be community transmission and not hospital, or nosocomal .
It depends on contacts and swab tests on staff and relatives.
We have had families denying they were infected because they did not want to be seen as the source of infection,even to the point of refusing to get tested, until another family member then falls ill !
Most people are sensible and see it for what it is , one of the most difficult areas to keep this virus under control.
It is definitely more transmissible than it was first wave .

Imo the reason numbers are coming down in hospital is through everyone locking down the last FIFTEEN WEEKS . That is what is reducing the numbers of very sick people in hospital .
The effect on vaccination of the over 85s would be beginning to reduce numbers hospitalised, but not so much in ICU .

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

We would have come off worse although we could have blocked export of stents as you suggested in the Australian situation so maybe it could have gone well?

I think the UK were right on the one dose vs two doses and used what they had to maximal effect. What's your thoughts?

I never suggested blocking exports. I suggested Australia had more to lose in a trade war and would not include the type of goods we produce in any tariff regime

PTH2009

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

RTE News

Are the Coroner reports the reason for the delay of the Death announcements ?

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

We would have come off worse although we could have blocked export of stents as you suggested in the Australian situation so maybe it could have gone well?

I think the UK were right on the one dose vs two doses and used what they had to maximal effect. What's your thoughts?

The tail in that Pfizer chart suggests maintaining 2 dose no more than 6 weeks apart may be appropriate for that vaccine at least. 2 dose regimes are generally around promoting the response then fixing the response. The greater side effects after taking the second dose suggests this is true. I hope there isn’t a sting in the Pfizer vaccine regimen in the uk once people get closer to 3 months, however for the moment it looks like they have lucked out on this one

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

I never suggested blocking exports. I suggest Australia had more to lose in a trade war and would not include to type of goods we produce in any tariff regime

Cool cool, you said EU roll out has been poor relative to UK / Israel. What are your thoughts on the one dose, two dose now that there's some data?

edit: thanks see above. In a pandemic you make your own luck.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

Cool cool, you said EU roll out has been poor relative to UK / Israel. What are your thoughts on the one dose, two dose now that there's some data?

See separate reply

Goldengirl

PTH2009 wrote: »

Are the Coroner reports the reason for the delay of the Death announcements ?

No .
Families have 3 months to register deaths .

niallo27

Ah lads new low for rte, 4 reports of stillborn babies linked to virus, further down the article, they could be linked to virus but we will need to investigate further. Honestly what a shower of ****en *****. Imagine being a pregnant women reading this crap. **** them.

Stateofyou

niallo27 wrote: »

Ah lads new low for rte, 4 reports of stillborn babies linked to virus, further down the article, they could be linked to virus but we will need to investigate further. Honestly what a shower of ****en *****. Imagine being a pregnant women reading this crap. **** them.

Ok but... isn't there a reason why pregnant teachers now have an exemption to go back?

nc6000

Ah here, that's total scaremongering now from Glynn and RTE. It's terrible for the families but as it's still being investigated maybe it shouldn't be brought up at the daily press conference and mentioned on the news!

fits

niallo27 wrote: »

Ah lads new low for rte, 4 reports of stillborn babies linked to virus, further down the article, they could be linked to virus but we will need to investigate further. Honestly what a shower of ****en *****. Imagine being a pregnant women reading this crap. **** them.

So you don’t think they should report four cases of stillbirth caused by inflamed placentas among covid positive women in recent weeks?

blade1

niallo27 wrote: »

Ah lads new low for rte, 4 reports of stillborn babies linked to virus, further down the article, they could be linked to virus but we will need to investigate further. Honestly what a shower of ****en *****. Imagine being a pregnant women reading this crap. **** them.

I don't watch rte but thank you for scaremongering me.

TheDoctor

Fair play to the writers for still coming up with new story lines to scare people with.

Cant be easy this many seasons in.

normanoffside

niallo27 wrote: »

Ah lads new low for rte, 4 reports of stillborn babies linked to virus, further down the article, they could be linked to virus but we will need to investigate further. Honestly what a shower of ****en *****. Imagine being a pregnant women reading this crap. **** them.

That was brought up voluntarily by Glynn with a new name 'Covid Placentis' even though it hasn't been proved true or false.
Then we were treated to a 15 minute study of spread of a student party in Galway which produced hundreds of cases.
A journalist later asked if any deaths had been linked to the outbreak- the answer was of course no and only 1 hospitalisation.

You'd nearly think the NPHET presentations are designed to deflect attention from important issues. Unfortunately the journalists are all extremely compliant and just ask questions on what they were presented

niallo27

fits wrote: »

So you don’t think they should report four cases of stillbirth caused by inflamed placentas among covid positive women in recent weeks?

Not until confirmed no.

Deeper Blue

If covid was causing stillbirth wouldn't we have heard about a load of cases worldwide?

Plumbthedepths

normanoffside wrote: »

A journalist later asked if any deaths had been linked to the outbreak- the answer was of course no and only 1 hospitalisation.

Was there an air of disappointment at the response?

caveat emptor

George lee asked the question. Glynn confirmed that the coroner was investigating. By all means blame RTE for the dead babies while simultaneously denying that there is a deadly virus spreading.

Amirani

normanoffside wrote: »

Honestly I don't think anyone blames the Doctors and Nurses, rather the poor equipment, procedures and conditions provided to them by the HSE

People really seem to think the HSE have more involvement in the running of medical treatment within Acute hospitals than they actually do.

"Procedures and conditions" are largely designed and dictated by consultants (sometimes registrars), that determine rosters and ways of working within their specialities. They're largely autonomous from the HSE in these matters.

normanoffside

Deeper Blue wrote: »

If covid was causing stillbirth wouldn't we have heard about a load of cases worldwide?

NPHET basically write the RTE news and these are the stories they want to be published.

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1367551657840685063

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1367541421750841350