Govt to replace Direct Provision with protection system

Feadog999

I finally got my FOI request back from the department of public expenditure and reform and their concerns back up some of the reservations we all have here. Costings are wrong, need a more efficient system, current large backlog, 4 years is a very ambitious time frame etc

If you know any journalists (long shot) that would run with something like this please DM me their names.

Cal4567

Own door accomodation means buying one off properties which other parts of the state apparatus are currently being called out on.

Even if that wasn't the case, the likelihood of someone coming into the country and getting their own house is not going to happen in the guts of 12 weeks.

This has dipped down the pecking order. I wouldn't be at all surprised if one of the more vocal rural TDs brings this up, to curry local favour. If the government crashes over the next year, I can see it being discussed across the media. It's going to be hard for even the various left parties to be seen to be too strongly supporting it.

The problem won't go away. I reckon we will see more state run schemes. The 12 week thing is just laughable. Not going to happen.

_Kaiser_

Cal4567 wrote: »

Own door accomodation means buying one off properties which other parts of the state apparatus are currently being called out on.

Even if that wasn't the case, the likelihood of someone coming into the country and getting their own house is not going to happen in the guts of 12 weeks.

This has dipped down the pecking order. I wouldn't be at all surprised if one of the more vocal rural TDs brings this up, to curry local favour. If the government crashes over the next year, I can see it being discussed across the media. It's going to be hard for even the various left parties to be seen to be too strongly supporting it.

The problem won't go away. I reckon we will see more state run schemes. The 12 week thing is just laughable. Not going to happen.

It depends on what stock the councils already have (whether directly or rented from others).

Take the George Nkencho situation (as a high profile example). In the space of weeks it seems the family were relocated to a new house. There's situations I'd know of too where Irish people on the list were found places quickly enough too once a TD got involved.

They can move very quickly when they want to.

Cal4567

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

It depends on what stock the councils already have (whether directly or rented from others).

Take the George Nkencho situation (as a high profile example). In the space of weeks it seems the family were relocated to a new house. There's situations I'd know of too where Irish people on the list were found places quickly enough too once a TD got involved.

They can move very quickly when they want to.

Agreed but they are one off situations. Doing it at scale will be more of a challenge, never mind continuing to do so.

punisher5112

Feadog999 wrote: »

I finally got my FOI request back from the department of public expenditure and reform and their concerns back up some of the reservations we all have here. Costings are wrong, need a more efficient system, current large backlog, 4 years is a very ambitious time frame etc

If you know any journalists (long shot) that would run with something like this please DM me their names.

Try Niall boylan, he may well like to have someone on with the facts.
I'm surprised there isn't more noise on this.

_Kaiser_

punisher5112 wrote: »

Try Niall boylan, he may well like to have someone on with the facts.
I'm surprised there isn't more noise on this.

There isn't because most of the media is complicit. Take Newstalk breakfast. Phillipino carer this morning who is here 10 years "undocumented" and yet the narrative is how this woman is afraid to get her Covid vaccine in case she's deported.

Most of their stories/editorial have the same "victim" perspective, rather than calling it out as it is - she shouldn't even be here to worry about her vaccine (that we'll pay for) in the first place.

Better questions to ask would be why she didn't (re)apply legitimately when her visa ran out? Why does she feel entitled to break our immigration laws (such as they are), and worse again, secure enough to go on national radio with her "poor me" story.

TomTomTim

It's beyond insane that they are all coming out now saying that they'll fix the housing problem, when this policy has only passed recently. It's like a doctor dealing with someone with a broken leg, who decides to break the other leg and both arms, and then says they'll fix the issue.

Jane98

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

There isn't because most of the media is complicit. Take Newstalk breakfast. Phillipino carer this morning who is here 10 years "undocumented" and yet the narrative is how this woman is afraid to get her Covid vaccine in case she's deported.

Most of their stories/editorial have the same "victim" perspective, rather than calling it out as it is - she shouldn't even be here to worry about her vaccine (that we'll pay for) in the first place.

Better questions to ask would be why she didn't (re)apply legitimately when her visa ran out? Why does she feel entitled to break our immigration laws (such as they are), and worse again, secure enough to go on national radio with her "poor me" story.

I heard this today and was livid listening to it. She said she was so grateful to Helen McEntee for trying to fix this.

Jane98

Jane98 wrote: »

I heard this today and was livid listening to it. She said she was so grateful to Helen McEntee for trying to fix this.

It's deeply frustrating what's going on

clytemnestra

I wonder if it's our own post-colonial hangover of mistrust and dislike of authority. So when we hear this woman we're supposed to think aw, shure she was just bending the rules a bit, we've all done that. Not realising that the rules in this case are for our benefit and that it's not in our interest having our resources consumed by anyone who shows up.

Stovepipe

Because,like all undocumenteds, there's always a back story.She's probably working cash in hand and is afraid of her life that she'll be sent home and she is probably a major breadwinner for her family back home. If she comes to public notice, her employer might decide to jettison her,in case he or she brings on the Revenue. On the other hand,she could be cynically taking the piss and be quite happy to be cash in hand and not be known to the Revenue via PPSN number. The Revenue could simply say,you owe us ten years worth" and there's no prospect of getting that back, so back to Manila you go. They'll fine the owner of the hotel or hospital she works for and next week, it'll be old news and forgotten.

suicide_circus

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

There isn't because most of the media is complicit. Take Newstalk breakfast. Phillipino carer this morning who is here 10 years "undocumented" and yet the narrative is how this woman is afraid to get her Covid vaccine in case she's deported.

Most of their stories/editorial have the same "victim" perspective, rather than calling it out as it is - she shouldn't even be here to worry about her vaccine (that we'll pay for) in the first place.

Better questions to ask would be why she didn't (re)apply legitimately when her visa ran out? Why does she feel entitled to break our immigration laws (such as they are), and worse again, secure enough to go on national radio with her "poor me" story.

"Afraid" to get vaccine but not afraid to go on national radio. Horsesh1te.

Feadog999

A bit of sense from Europe with Michel Barnier calling for a halt on immigration to Europe. Citing it isn't working. He excludes refugees and students from that though.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/michel-barnier-calls-for-halt-to-immigration-across-europe/ar-BB1gBc9y

Feadog999

Feadog999 wrote: »

A bit of sense from Europe with Michel Barnier calling for a halt on immigration to Europe. Citing it isn't working. He excludes refugees and students from that though.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/michel-barnier-calls-for-halt-to-immigration-across-europe/ar-BB1gBc9y

Wow, that's genuinely surprising coming from such a mainstream politician as him.

_Kaiser_

Jane98 wrote: »

I heard this today and was livid listening to it. She said she was so grateful to Helen McEntee for trying to fix this.

Yep and McEntee herself was interviewed and assured her (and the 20000 other illegals) that she wouldn't have her details passed on by getting her vaccine.

Absolutely ridiculous, but I'd expect no different from McEntee. No real world experience, "inherited" her seat, and certainly won't be impacted either way.

Dyr

Feadog999 wrote: »

A bit of sense from Europe with Michel Barnier calling for a halt on immigration to Europe. Citing it isn't working. He excludes refugees and students from that though.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/michel-barnier-calls-for-halt-to-immigration-across-europe/ar-BB1gBc9y

Repeat the chant

Small. Open. Economy
Small. Open. Economy
Small. Open. Economy
Small. Open. Economy

Cal4567

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow, that's genuinely surprising coming from such a mainstream politician as him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_French_presidential_election

I'd hazard a guess that this is why. Centrist politicians trying to take on some element of right wing discourse. The Dutch did it well a couple of years back. Trying to halt Le Pen in her tracks.

Dyr

Cal4567 wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_French_presidential_election

I'd hazard a guess that this is why. Centrist politicians trying to take on some element of right wing discourse. The Dutch did it well a couple of years back. Trying to halt Le Pen in her tracks.

Barney fancies a tilt at the Presidency, he'll make some noises in the hope of attracting votes but then will do f***k all if he gets in.

Cal4567

Cal4567 wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_French_presidential_election

I'd hazard a guess that this is why. Centrist politicians trying to take on some element of right wing discourse. The Dutch did it well a couple of years back. Trying to halt Le Pen in her tracks.

Oh ya, I've no doubt that's what he is at. It's still a massive declaration from someone like him, especially a man that is loved by the FBPE crowd in the UK.

https://www.rte.ie/news/connacht/2021/0511/1220864-asylum-seekers-hse-accommodation/

Never knew this was a thing.
Anyway... Ó Gorman making comments here too, he's pretty front line and centre when suits.
Still hasn't replied to my email..

DelaneyIn

If they’re working, can they not rent a place out of their own pockets? Why do they need the state to find accommodation for them?

suicide_circus

DelaneyIn wrote: »

If they’re working, can they not rent a place out of their own pockets? Why do they need the state to find accommodation for them?

lol

zom

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow, that's genuinely surprising coming from such a mainstream politician as him.

Not at all. He "excludes refugees and students" which means ban mostly of cheap workers from India, Malaysia or Turkey. Millions of refugees on boats from Africa are still welcomed.

mgn

DelaneyIn wrote: »

If they’re working, can they not rent a place out of their own pockets? Why do they need the state to find accommodation for them?

Because the money is sent home to fund the next batch of chancers.

Don't forget these are the people that will be paying our pensions in the future, according to the great and good in this country.

https://www.flac.ie/blog/new-social-housing-assessment-regulations-raise-the-income-l/

'' FLAC is aware of at least one case, arising from its Roma Legal Clinic, where a family with over ten children, who were dependent on social welfare and who were experiencing homelessness, were unable to access social housing supports because their income was above the threshold.''

Jesus H christ. Funny enough I'm under the threshold at the moment for social housing should I take a notion to join the list.
How the holy sh1tting name is a roma family with 10 kids on social welfare earning more than me as a public servant with a bachelors degree...
Jesus lads I just don't know anymore.
Bail or give up?

DelaneyIn

DelaneyIn wrote: »

If they’re working, can they not rent a place out of their own pockets? Why do they need the state to find accommodation for them?

Say it from the back '' ENTITLEMENT''

Feadog999

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://www.flac.ie/blog/new-social-housing-assessment-regulations-raise-the-income-l/

'' FLAC is aware of at least one case, arising from its Roma Legal Clinic, where a family with over ten children, who were dependent on social welfare and who were experiencing homelessness, were unable to access social housing supports because their income was above the threshold.''

Jesus H christ. Funny enough I'm under the threshold at the moment for social housing should I take a notion to join the list.
How the holy sh1tting name is a roma family with 10 kids on social welfare earning more than me as a public servant with a bachelors degree...
Jesus lads I just don't know anymore.
Bail or give up?

Mad isn't it?


If a single person is on €45,000 gross (or less) in Dublin. They are entitled to social housing. Crazy system. You won't get a house in 4 months at all though. You'll join the list of 60,000 plus people. Mad that the system would encourage anyone from graduates up to middle management to apply for social housing rather than having affordable housing options. Of course, most working people would rather pay for their own housing and they won't get air time like the above.

punisher5112

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://www.flac.ie/blog/new-social-housing-assessment-regulations-raise-the-income-l/

'' FLAC is aware of at least one case, arising from its Roma Legal Clinic, where a family with over ten children, who were dependent on social welfare and who were experiencing homelessness, were unable to access social housing supports because their income was above the threshold.''

Jesus H christ. Funny enough I'm under the threshold at the moment for social housing should I take a notion to join the list.
How the holy sh1tting name is a roma family with 10 kids on social welfare earning more than me as a public servant with a bachelors degree...
Jesus lads I just don't know anymore.
Bail or give up?

Is it any surprise, they are laughing at us.

Feadog999

Feadog999 wrote: »

Mad isn't it?


If a single person is on €45,000 gross (or less) in Dublin. They are entitled to social housing. Crazy system. You won't get a house in 4 months at all though. You'll join the list of 60,000 plus people. Mad that the system would encourage anyone from graduates up to middle management to apply for social housing rather than having affordable housing options. Of course, most working people would rather pay for their own housing and they won't get air time like the above.

It's infuriating to say the least. Exhausting too.
I don't begrudge the whole social housing thing but it just done so wrong and the people who get up to work, even the Irish people who are awaiting social housing who work are shafted by the economic refugees/migrants. I don't even want a social house, I don't want that one bit I could be on the list 16 years already, I want to choose where I live and have a bit of input into who I live beside and who my kids will spend their childhoods with...
but chirst there is no options, I'd love if a party stepped up and realised its time to make it pay to work, a rent to buy scheme, real affordable schemes? There must be something better out there. There must be some decent party contemplating coming into the fray? One could only hope.

Feadog999

Here's a odd one. My FOI request came back from the department of housing. The Department of Housing did not contribute to the compilation of costings for home delivery in the white paper. However, nor did it raise any query in relation to the costing. Weird the department of housing wasn't involved.

Seems to me the department of housing and Darragh O'Brien are distancing themselves from this.