Right wing extremist group behind Dublin Protest say Gardai

MrStuffins

AllForIt wrote: »

This is a very odd argumentative strategy.

Agreed. Pure Whataboutery! But it doesn't stop people deflecting by bringing up any and every "What About......" they can.

Necro

Mike Murdock wrote: »

I'm not whinging at all.

I'm simply asking that someone that equates the aims of the Irish Far Right with what Trump espoused, outlines the 4/5 policies that they say highlight Trump as being Far Right. So we can debate it.

And isn't this thread about the Irish Far Right? This would mean the simple request that I have, is pertinent to the topic at hand.

Mod:

Donald Trump discussion goes in the Donald Trump thread, this incident occurred in Dublin, Ireland - do not derail the thread with this discussion again

completedit

The WHO official line on lockdowns gives ample scope for justified objections to lockdowns and thus, protests. I was actually initially falling for the illuminati type higher power pulling the strings to enact some great societal changes that would have received too much pushback in normal times, as they say only real change happens with a revolution or a war, but as time goes on it is actually becoming an increasingly localised failure of Irish govt. dogmatism and ineptness.

expectationlost

yesterday could have been a lot worse,with more then a few injuries its pity but often some totally unrelated yobs come along and use protests to attack the cops... ( imho think less inequality is the long term solution to that) people can try and keep the protest on point, but cops really need not react en-mass to people throwing aluminum cans or plastic bottles, when you have lots of peaceful people there, thats dangerous and unfair. I think gardai forming lines is a terrible thing it creates a conflict point, a static line to throw things at. What if they had let them into Stephens Green, it was closed to right-thinking people already so it wouldn't have made a difference to let them in. they would have been able to control the exits then. Obviously a firework is a different order of things, and they were right to go after that guy, but they didn't have to hit anyone else or try to grab anyone else unless, they hit them. They were some far rights nutters at the front who took advantage once chaos broke out eg kicked a gardai.

so there should be no mass gatherings at the mo,(without social distancing and masks) its stupid and self-defeating but in regular times how do you stops yob ruining protests?

completedit

The funniest thing I saw was that the government were going to prevent illegitimate protests from happening in the future. Why would a government give a green light to a legitimate" protest that doesn't fit with their consensus. That's the whole point of a protest. What world do people like this live in? Imagine being in politics, something I consider intrinsically linked with something bigger and tied to history and coming out with daft nonsense like this. Even odder you have the ordinary man on the street nodding aling. It's real end of history stuff. I love how the protestors were depicted as anti lockdown as if that was meant to tarnish the legitimacy of the protest. Eh that was the whole point- to denounce lockdowns.

MrStuffins

expectationlost wrote: »

how do you stops yob ruining protests?

Well, from the point of view of those who turned up hoping to protest peacefully, it was ruined.

But make no mistake, the organisers of this demonstration knew exactly what they were doing. They knew what they were organising and knew a chunk of who they were inviting were people who would cause trouble and instigate violence.

It suits their agenda.

expectationlost

completedit wrote: »

The funniest thing I saw was that the government was going to prevent illegitimate protests from happening. Why would a government give a green light to a protest that doesn't fit with their consensus. That's the whole point of a protest. I love how the protestors were depicted as anti lockdown as if that was meant to tarnish the legitimacy of the protest. Eh that was the whole point to denounce lockdowns.

the more mass gatherings like this there are the longer the lockdown will be, stupid stupid stupid.

ExMachina1000

expectationlost wrote: »

the more mass gatherings like this there are the longer the lockdown will be

Yeah the Blm one in June added months.

Wasn't called out though. Media supported it.
Funny

expectationlost

MrStuffins wrote: »

Well, from the point of view of those who turned up hoping to protest peacefully, it was ruined.

But make no mistake, the organisers of this demonstration knew exactly what they were doing. They knew what they were organising and knew a chunk of who they were inviting were people who would cause trouble and instigate violence.

It suits their agenda.

well i think that hippy lady who was organising the musicians etc is just in her own dreamland, she was partly responsible for it, but I don't think she was trying to start a riot / "create race war", like the other organisers were.

the fireworks guy did have some NP leanings but i don't think he was an organiser, there were far rights organisers up the front but they didn't start the conflict, I don't think the guy in all grey was a far right organisers either, he was the guy who was seen telling people to come on, lets go, and pulling the barrier aside, and a cop tried to grab him.

expectationlost

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Yeah the Blm one in June added months.

Wasn't called out though. Media supported it.
Funny

that one wasn't against lockdowns so it wasn't totally contradictory and self defeating like the the one on satruday.

MrStuffins

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Yeah the Blm one in June added months.

Wasn't called out though. Media supported it.
Funny

MrStuffins wrote: »

"But what about........."

Insert:

BLM
The Garda
Antifa
Left-Wing Extremeists
The Bankers
The Homeless
Thierry Henry's handball v Ireland

One down, six to go.

#WhatabouteryBingo

ExMachina1000

expectationlost wrote: »

that one wasn't against lockdowns so it wasn't totally contradictory and self defeating like the the one on satruday.

Its either a breach of public health guidelines and restrictions or its not. The virus is either highly contagious or it isnt.

expectationlost

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Its either a breach of public health guidelines and restrictions or its not. The virus is either highly contagious or it isnt.

I was replying to this post as below because the the guy appeared to not understand that it wasn't a normal protest because its occurrence was completely self-defeating

Originally Posted by completedit
The funniest thing I saw was that the government was going to prevent illegitimate protests from happening. Why would a government give a green light to a protest that doesn't fit with their consensus. That's the whole point of a protest. I love how the protestors were depicted as anti lockdown as if that was meant to tarnish the legitimacy of the protest. Eh that was the whole point to denounce lockdowns.

MrStuffins

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Its either a breach of public health guidelines and restrictions or its not. The virus is either highly contagious or it isnt.

The topic is the protest /demonstration Saturday. Not any other unrelated gathering.

dontmindme

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Very. But there are, certainly, some amount of (far)right whingers grasping at straws in here today!

Anyone who disagrees with you is far-right...nice move :rolleyes:

completedit

expectationlost wrote: »

I was replying to this post as below because the the guy appeared to not understand that it wasn't a normal protest, its occurrence was completely self-defeating

Your assumption is that lockdown will just end and that will be it. I think this is the last lockdown but after a year of restrictions and lockdown it's natural people either feel that there's no end in sight or that lockdowns will become a feature of our lives as various new "strains" emerge. People are fearful. Type into Covid and inequality in Europe and see what the affects of lockdowns will be. Once again the poor suffer inordinately. The protests are about saying enough. Isolate the vulnerable and stop inflicting unnecessary toll on the rest of the population. The protests are, at least in theory, about the perils of short-term thinking and the failure to take into account how damaging even more inequality will be for social cohesion in the years ahead combined with increased digitisation and automation that renders in the short term at least many people out of work. You can agree with that or not. That is the WHO's official line BTW.

*I personally think its understandable that we focus on the now. But you'd hope a quick understanding of history would give politicians some insight into how gross economic divergences play out and the damage they do on society. If you undermine these concerns and issues then you're playing with fire.

Gremlinertia

Enough dragging things off topic - look at the thread title before posting please

expectationlost

completedit wrote: »

Your assumption is that lockdown will just end and that will be it. I think this is the last lockdown but after a year of restrictions and lockdown it's natural people either feel that there's no end in sight or that lockdowns will become a feature of our lives as various new "strains" emerge. People are fearful. Type into Covid and inequality in Europe and see what the affects of lockdowns will be. Once again the poor suffer inordinately. The protests are about saying enough. Isolate the vulnerable and stop inflicting unnecessary toll on the rest of the population. The protests are about short term thinking and the failure to take into account how damaging even more inequality will be for social cohesion in the years ahead combined with increased digitisation and automation that renders in the short term at least many people out of work. You can agree with that or not. That is the WHO's official line BTW.

you can try to pull in these other social issues, to make yourself look smart, but the more mass gatherings like this there are, the longer the lockdown will be.

Mass protesting virus lockdowns is stupid.

politicians don't listen to protest, they listen to rich people, a lot of whom also want the lockdowns to end, lots of whom are on the far right.

they tell you to contact your TD if you want to express a view or impact politics (in between election time), but if you haven't and won't ever vote for the TDs in the large government parties, you can't threaten to not vote for them unless they do X because you never did and never will. They know that. So they don't care about your views.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

The aims and goals of the Irish far right (and not so far right) are almost identical to those expressed by Trump and the GOP across the pond. Almost identical, right across the board.

I'd say you'll be hard pressed to find one person in Ireland whose goals align with those of the CCP. There's a huge difference, and anyone trying to lump modern, western leftists in with the extermination of Uighurs is seriously clutching at straws. Like, seriously clutching. But they know that, and are regurgitating bulksh1t 'facts' from Shapiro et al, as if that's some sort of gotcha. Laughable really.

Seriously, lads? China?

There are plenty of Irish Marxists bouncing about. At the height of the Cold War we had communist and communist aligned parties in Ireland. There was a self proclaimed Communist party of Ireland (or perhaps two) but more importantly the workers party had large and sometimes poll topping support. They were (and are) Marxists, with then fraternal links to the Soviet Union. They also infiltrated RTE etc. Some of my family were members. There was little or no hysteria at the time and no attempt to lock up protestors.

There’s no indication that the NP, with its 0.2% support was organising this protest. As I said the demographics would suggest that the marchers are left wing voters.

Anyway most of the accusations about the far right come from you and the other pro government genius who uses quotes incorrectly and likes to talk about his poop. If you are not here you are bleating on about some Sinn Fein tweet in the interminable thread about what SF did today.

I’m no fan of SF, and believe we need lockdowns, but most of the accusations of far right blather is from a government that’s incapable of governing so it just throws temper tantrums.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

MrStuffins wrote: »

One down, six to go.

#WhatabouteryBingo

Well, you know the Antifa Gardai are just left-wing extremists who got the bankers to pay for Thierry Henry's Hhandball and push up the homless numbers.

Full house?

Eric Cartman

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Well, you know the Antifa Gardai are just left-wing extremists who got the bankers to pay for Thierry Henry's Hhandball and push up the homless numbers.

Full house?

And you missed the most obvious part of all... but ofcourse thats what a zionist lizard person would do...

CtevenSrowder

expectationlost wrote: »

that one wasn't against lockdowns so it wasn't totally contradictory and self defeating like the the one on satruday.

A virus, that if we are to believe data from the US and UK, kills black people more than white people... so ye, an unnecessary protest proclaiming to highlight how 'black lives matter' in the middle of a pandemic that kills them more than anyone else is pretty self-defeatist.

Dyr

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I see the graduates from the Institute for Reactionary Numbskulls have arrived with their 'the left killed 100 million people' shit they hear from Profs Shapiro and Peterson on YouTube.

Tom, Tom, Tom

The world knew that the extreme left had killed more people than Genghis Khan long before little Ben Shaprio showed up.

Why does that make you uncomforatble? It shouldnt only make people extreme views uncomfortable.

Very odd carry on.

circadian

Bambi wrote: »

Tom, Tom, Tom

The world knew that the extreme left had killed more people than Genghis Khan long before little Ben Shaprio showed up.

Why does that make you uncomforatble? It shouldnt only make people extreme views uncomfortable.

Very odd carry on.

Because it's whataboutery and detracts from the topic at hand. Regardless of what people say, right wing elements were at the core of Saturdays protest which got violent.

I don't see what this has to do with the Soviets or any other Communist regime.

Tokyo

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

A virus, that if we are to believe data from the US and UK, kills black people more than white people... so ye, an unnecessary protest proclaiming to highlight how 'black lives matter' in the middle of a pandemic that kills them more than anyone else is pretty self-defeatist.

Mod: Christ, wind it in with the incessant off-topic posting. Final warning.

gmisk

RTE news : Man arrested over firework attack on gardaí at protest

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2021/0302/1200353-protest-arrest/

Good news

Invidious

What is this "right-wing extremist group"? Who leads them? How many people are involved?

Acting as if only the so-called "far right" opposes lockdowns is disingenuous. Significant anti-lockdown protests have taken place in other countries (notably Italy and the Netherlands), where protesters clashed with police far more violently than anything seen in Dublin. In the Netherlands, protesters threw rocks and knives at police, attacked a hospital, looted shops, and burned down a Covid testing station, leading to hundreds of arrests. In Turin, protesters threw petrol bombs at police.

With Ireland in lockdown for most of the past year, people are naturally frustrated with the restrictions, worried about the impact on their businesses and jobs, and tired of not being able to do basic things like visit family, buy clothes in a shop, send their kids to school, or get a haircut. These frustrations boiled over into protests, as was inevitable at some point, but the effort that is going into pinning all of this on a hitherto nonexistent "far right" is remarkable.

Mod: Off topic. Quit it.

Junkyard Tom

Bambi wrote: »

Why does that make you uncomforatble? It shouldnt only make people extreme views uncomfortable.

Bad faith arguments make me uncomfortable, like you just did by being careful enough to specifically write 'extreme left'.

Extreme adherence to [any ideology] has the potential to kill millions of people. We should know here with the excuse of laissez-faire economics being, ostensibly, responsible for the death/forced migration of millions of our own people.

It's a 'guilt by association' tactic used by pseudo-intellectuals from the reactionary circuit. Oh you want universal healthcare? You're a Marxist and Marxism killed 100 million people ergo universal healthcare is bad.

And so on.

gmisk

gmisk wrote: »

RTE news : Man arrested over firework attack on gardaí at protest

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2021/0302/1200353-protest-arrest/

Good news

Great news. Hopefully he’ll get the book thrown at him.