Pizza oven placement

flogen

I know this isn't strictly a gardening query - but it is garden-related, so...

I've been toying with the idea of building a pizza oven in my back garden. I almost certainly won't be doing it until next year at the earliest, if ever, but I reckon I should at least identify where would be the best place for one now, so I can plan my current gardening work around it and not make things more difficult for myself down the line.

So would anyone have any tips for the best place to build one?

My garden is relatively small - it has a path of paving stones leading to a raised patio area at the back, with a small patch of grass in there too.

Would it be unwise to build it on the patio? My thinking there is that it could double as a heater. It would probably be the nicest-looking spot and handiest in terms of actual usage.

What about its proximity to plants/shrubs/trees? There's another spot that could work but the neighbour has a tree growing on their side of the wall - would that be a hazard in terms of the heat/smoke coming off the top of it? (alternatively there's a spot plagued by ivy - if you told me the heat radiating off an oven would discourage that from growing... without causing an actual fire... I'd be delighted!)

In general is a pizza oven in a small garden do-able or a bad idea? Is the smoke from one going to piss off my neighbours no matter where I put it?

hirondelle

I bought the metal one from Lidl, doubles as a smoker. Costs iirc €120 and I absolutely love it- the pizzas are unbelievably good- as good as any proper restaurant ones. The reason I mention it is you can obviously move it round the garden depending on the breeze (and also to follow the sun!) THis is one of those unboxing videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrE0oy_LS70

A lot less of an investment than building your own and you avoid all the issues you are raising. Once you keep it out of the weather in winter I think it will last for years. Would have preferred a slightly bigger stone, but I'm sure it is possible to get one separately.

magicbastarder

that pizza he places in the oven at 9:50!
my eyes. buying a dedicated pizza oven and putting a goodfellas deep pan in it. should be illegal.

flogen

hirondelle wrote: »

I bought the metal one from Lidl, doubles as a smoker. Costs iirc €120 and I absolutely love it- the pizzas are unbelievably good- as good as any proper restaurant ones. The reason I mention it is you can obviously move it round the garden depending on the breeze (and also to follow the sun!) THis is one of those unboxing videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrE0oy_LS70

A lot less of an investment than building your own and you avoid all the issues you are raising. Once you keep it out of the weather in winter I think it will last for years. Would have preferred a slightly bigger stone, but I'm sure it is possible to get one separately.

I do like the idea of making an oven - and think a well-made brick one can look really well.

That being said I've a fair idea of the cost, and more importantly time and effort involved - so for that price I'd be very tempted to get a Lidl one, even until I was sure I wanted to build something myself.

My main issue with it is that it has the fire lit from underneath, rather than next to the pizza itself. I'd worry that that might lead to it baking un-evenly. Also from what I remember they were like gold dust when they did a special on them last year, though. After that it looks like you're spending €300+ for a decent one.

magicbastarder wrote: »

that pizza he places in the oven at 9:50!
my eyes. buying a dedicated pizza oven and putting a goodfellas deep pan in it. should be illegal.

Couldn't believe that! It's not that hard to make a pizza from scratch, but even if you weren't bothered surely you could find somewhere that'd make them fresh. Or at worst you could get one of the chilled ones by Pizza Express etc!

Must have a look and see how anyone has gotten on using one of the Lidl ones for baking homemade pizza.

joficeduns1

Sorry but that Goodfellas pizza is a horrendous idea! OP nice thinking on the pizza oven. Would love to do it, but waiting for a bigger garden in a forever home. I couldn't build a pizza oven and then move away from it!

I'd say keep an eye on where the sun tracks in your garden over the summer,.although since you've a raised decking I'm sure that's where your set for an evening. Account for prep room (flat surface for assembly), storage for peel, brush, wood etc.

If you're going full insulated brick construction I wouldn't worry about neighboring plants, most if not all the heat will go through the chimney etc.

I'm mad to build one also.
Is your garden big ? I have a an ideal spot but its 30m from the back door so if I wanted to use it in winter I wouldnt.
So when I get around to it I'll build it near the back door and probably have a high chimney or something .

These guys in kildare sell a kit for 1000e
https://pizzaovens4u.com/product/valimbrosa-pizza-oven-kit-900mm/

if its any use I dont know.

magicbastarder

we got an ooni in the black friday sales, and it's very impressive. once it's up to heat, you can cook a pizza on a laughably small amount of fuel. wouldn't leave it outside, but it is easy enough to lift.

Wabbit Ears

A few considerations ( I have an end to end brick pizza over build in the DIY forum).

A well built pizza oven wont radiate any heat out bar directly out the door so its use as a patio heater is limited. Buy a chimenea or have a firepit for that purpose.

Due to insulation you can have it up close enough to fences etc without to much worry.

Put time into the logistics and flow of pizza making. Directly in front of the door does get HOT!! its not comfortable to be there. so there should be easy access for a person carrying a pizza peel to approach the oven and to turn the pizzas etc. without obstruction. basically no one should be sitting or have tables/chairs/obstruction for a 2-2.5m radius from the oven door.

You'll need a pizza making place ideally at the side of the Oven. I've been using use a fold away table set back from the door but it does get to hot and the table is too low. Your back starts hurting if you make more than 3/4 pizzas. I will be looking at getting a marble tabletop slab setup beside the oven which ill add onto the Built in BBQ at a more comfortable height for prolonged pizza making.

Its a huge but rewarding project if you love building stuff, otherwise, buy a steel cart and an ooni.

Would you have done anything different with yours wabbit ears?
I remember you had trouble getting the right bricks , would you consider the precast domes?

https://pizzaovens4u.com/product/pizza-oven-dome/

Wabbit Ears

BrownFinger wrote: »

Would you have done anything different with yours wabbit ears?
I remember you had trouble getting the right bricks , would you consider the precast domes?

https://pizzaovens4u.com/product/pizza-oven-dome/

TBH I had a great time building the dome myself which is one of my enjoyments of these types of projects. I also read a lot of pre cast domes aren't great, especially for the money.

bricks were hard to get due to covid related supply issues and i paid way over the odds for bauhaus bricks over the ones I was let down by murdochs provider. Cost me literally 4 times the price for bricks!!

Part of the minor regret is I didn't fully realize the difference between a pizza oven build and a pizza/bread oven build.

A bread/pizza oven needs a lot more mass to retain heat whereas a Pizza oven build just needs a dome to hold in the heat while your making pizzas. Mine makes pizzas great. It can even get to hot TBH and I have to let it cool as its turning pizzas into charcoal faster than I can blink. If I were to do it again Id have made the dome from Refractory sand/cement about 6-8 inches thick and used much thicker bricks on the base. This, however, would have added about 600 or more to the final price Id guess and Refractory sand/cement in an un-mixed form is hard to get ( pre made is easily available but you'd need a LOT).

All that to make bread the next day from retained heat. That said, Id never actually do that but FOMO is a powerful thing.

flogen

joficeduns1 wrote: »

Sorry but that Goodfellas pizza is a horrendous idea! OP nice thinking on the pizza oven. Would love to do it, but waiting for a bigger garden in a forever home. I couldn't build a pizza oven and then move away from it!

I'd say keep an eye on where the sun tracks in your garden over the summer,.although since you've a raised decking I'm sure that's where your set for an evening. Account for prep room (flat surface for assembly), storage for peel, brush, wood etc.

If you're going full insulated brick construction I wouldn't worry about neighboring plants, most if not all the heat will go through the chimney etc.

As I said it's a fairly small garden - not tiny, but not flowing in space. And it's not the forever home either, so I would have the same difficulty as you... but if I'm honest I won't be moving for a few years at least, bar a lotto win, so wondering if I should just do it rather than wait for who-knows how long until I have the dream garden.

BrownFinger wrote: »

I'm mad to build one also.
Is your garden big ? I have a an ideal spot but its 30m from the back door so if I wanted to use it in winter I wouldnt.
So when I get around to it I'll build it near the back door and probably have a high chimney or something .

These guys in kildare sell a kit for 1000e
https://pizzaovens4u.com/product/valimbrosa-pizza-oven-kit-900mm/

if its any use I dont know.

Looks lovely - very tempting prospect to have everything you need in one purchase too. I wonder how much you'd spend assembling it all yourself, though (I've not even tried to price it up yet)

magicbastarder wrote: »

we got an ooni in the black friday sales, and it's very impressive. once it's up to heat, you can cook a pizza on a laughably small amount of fuel. wouldn't leave it outside, but it is easy enough to lift.

How much did you get the Ooni for? I see the cheapest one is around €300 - but by all accounts they're great little things.

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

A few considerations ( I have an end to end brick pizza over build in the DIY forum).

A well built pizza oven wont radiate any heat out bar directly out the door so its use as a patio heater is limited. Buy a chimenea or have a firepit for that purpose.

Due to insulation you can have it up close enough to fences etc without to much worry.

Put time into the logistics and flow of pizza making. Directly in front of the door does get HOT!! its not comfortable to be there. so there should be easy access for a person carrying a pizza peel to approach the oven and to turn the pizzas etc. without obstruction. basically no one should be sitting or have tables/chairs/obstruction for a 2-2.5m radius from the oven door.

You'll need a pizza making place ideally at the side of the Oven. I've been using use a fold away table set back from the door but it does get to hot and the table is too low. Your back starts hurting if you make more than 3/4 pizzas. I will be looking at getting a marble tabletop slab setup beside the oven which ill add onto the Built in BBQ at a more comfortable height for prolonged pizza making.

Its a huge but rewarding project if you love building stuff, otherwise, buy a steel cart and an ooni.

Thanks for all of that, really appreciate it.

Given what you're saying I think there's a good spot to the side of my patio that would work best - would have space for a pizza-making spot next to it and would be relatively easy to keep clear of furniture etc.

Roughly, what's the length of your oven from the back to the entrance of the door? And how much do you reckon you spent putting it together?

flogen

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

TBH I had a great time building the dome myself which is one of my enjoyments of these types of projects. I also read a lot of pre cast domes aren't great, especially for the money.

bricks were hard to get due to covid related supply issues and i paid way over the odds for bauhaus bricks over the ones I was let down by murdochs provider. Cost me literally 4 times the price for bricks!!

Part of the minor regret is I didn't fully realize the difference between a pizza oven build and a pizza/bread oven build.

A bread/pizza oven needs a lot more mass to retain heat whereas a Pizza oven build just needs a dome to hold in the heat while your making pizzas. Mine makes pizzas great. It can even get to hot TBH and I have to let it cool as its turning pizzas into charcoal faster than I can blink. If I were to do it again Id have made the dome from Refractory sand/cement about 6-8 inches thick and used much thicker bricks on the base. This, however, would have added about 600 or more to the final price Id guess and Refractory sand/cement in an un-mixed form is hard to get ( pre made is easily available but you'd need a LOT).

All that to make bread the next day from retained heat. That said, Id never actually do that but FOMO is a powerful thing.

Oh... That's piqued my interest. I bake a lot of bread so would be all for doing it in a way that allowed me to apply that usage too.

I wonder if you could even construct it in a way that allowed it to work as a kind of tandoor too

Wabbit Ears

The oven is 4 Patio slabs in size, so ~1.2m by 1.2m. Cost would be about 1200 once all was said and done. You can do one for a lot less and a lot more, all depends on your budget and how good are you at hiding stupid costs from your wife.

This video series actually formed the basis of my build, I just made the dome same as this guy and modified everything else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftce6DbLjFA

Wabbit Ears

flogen wrote: »

Oh... That's piqued my interest. I bake a lot of bread so would be all for doing it in a way that allowed me to apply that usage too.

I wonder if you could even construct it in a way that allowed it to work as a kind of tandoor too

This guy posted on the Pizza oven thread in the food forum and im so Jealous.
I do not have space or money for this but you know.. life goals and all that

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116292641&postcount=1603

flogen

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

The oven is 4 Patio slabs in size, so ~1.2m by 1.2m. Cost would be about 1200 once all was said and done. You can do one for a lot less and a lot more, all depends on your budget and how good are you at hiding stupid costs from your wife.

This video series actually formed the basis of my build, I just made the dome same as this guy and modified everything else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftce6DbLjFA

Thanks. Would probably want to keep the cost under that if I could - though if I knew I was putting it in the 'forever' garden it'd be a different story!

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

This guy posted on the Pizza oven thread in the food forum and im so Jealous.
I do not have space or money for this but you know.. life goals and all that

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116292641&postcount=1603

Wow. Serious envy there.

hirondelle

magicbastarder wrote: »

that pizza he places in the oven at 9:50!
my eyes. buying a dedicated pizza oven and putting a goodfellas deep pan in it. should be illegal.

Yes, apologies- I really should have flagged that issue!!