What to do here?

Graces7

JustAThought wrote: »

Her parents live around the corner? With that kind of childish behaviour its no wonder she lives elsewhere from them. What age is s/he?

Sit her down and tell her her behaviour is unacceptable and list them. Include the heat and costs - not sure if the bills are split or if they are included - if her antics keep up she will be charged the full costs from her deposit. Tell her you are now deeply concerned for her mental wellbeing and are not prepared to deal with it anymore or have her acting like a child in the house.

Is money very tight with her that she complains about people drinking her booze and juices? Maybe someone is nibbling away at them? Find out from her and get her to quantify it and as a goodwill gesture replace it/ them. Tell tell the other lodger not to use her stuff or store it in their bedroom as people sometimes do - with less lunatic reactions. it might calm the waters for her to hear her claims are being heard and supported somewhat and allow you to make firm rules for behaviour for the remainder of her stay. Remind her she will need a landlords reference to get a new place and if this teenager behaviour keeps up you will not be able to give her one.

Bad idea as her behaviour has gone way beyond this now. This is also purely a business matter not a counselling session.

893bet

Under no circumstances shorten her notice and warn her.

Assuming you gave the “notice” verbally I would pretend that it never happened. She forced your hand.

Pack her stuff. Change the locks and arrange collection. Have someone with you for collection as she won’t be alone. Do not allow entry to the property to collect. Hand it over at the door.

BackforFPL

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

You'd be surprised how immature and entitled a lot of "young adults" are nowadays.

Too much social media and parents who didn't really do discipline or say no to them growing up.

To be fair, entitled gobs*tes aren't a new phenomenon. I remember 20+ years ago sharing houses with people like this.

We just notice it more now because we're the "old people" I think.

Caranica

893bet wrote: »

Pack her stuff. Change the locks and arrange collection. Have someone with you for collection as she won’t be alone. Do not allow entry to the property to collect. Hand it over at the door.

If you're going to pack her stuff then video all of it because she sounds like the type to say an expensive piece of clothing/electronics etc is missing.

fran38

Fol20 wrote: »

I’m not sure I believe this.

Solicitors usually don’t plead ignorance given it’s their job. They are usually the most careful people to speak to when I talk to them and usually don’t say something unless they can back it up.

Did they say any of this in writing?

OP here. Apologies for not updating earlier. Im just so drained from it all. One of the village solicitors got back to me this morning as he said he would. He needed time to pore over legislation etc His advice is this; He agreed that I'm in the right here in relation to asking a lodger/licencee to vacate my house in such a short time span but he wants me to be measured in my approach. I'm asked to remain calm and hope that the lodger quits her tantrums and aim for the 31st as agreed. Because if i get a solicitors letter telling her I'm legally sound in asking her to leave pronto, she or her mother may seek legal advice where the whole covid eviction ban may raise its head. And if it does, well I may be in for a long battle. He admits that legally i can ask her to leave despite whats in the covid eviction ban rules but he concedes some other solicitor retained by the lodger may not see it as such.
She has been quiet this morning and today so I'll play it by ear. I've come to the conclusion that getting another lodger in is not in my best interests. I can afford to pay my mortgage with the help of the one lodger that ill keep. Mental health, piece of mind, you cant put a price on that .

Purple Mountain

Speaking of mental health, I wouldn't be surprised if she has mental health issues, her reaction over a stupid bowl was way out of proportion.

Dav010

fran38 wrote: »

OP here. Apologies for not updating earlier. Im just so drained from it all. One of the village solicitors got back to me this morning as he said he would. He needed time to pore over legislation etc His advice is this; He agreed that I'm in the right here in relation to asking a lodger/licencee to vacate my house in such a short time span but he wants me to be measured in my approach. I'm asked to remain calm and hope that the lodger quits her tantrums and aim for the 31st as agreed. Because if i get a solicitors letter telling her I'm legally sound in asking her to leave pronto, she or her mother may seek legal advice where the whole covid eviction ban may raise its head. And if it does, well I may be in for a long battle. He admits that legally i can ask her to leave despite whats in the covid eviction ban rules but he concedes some other solicitor retained by the lodger may not see it as such.
She has been quiet this morning and today so I'll play it by ear. I've come to the conclusion that getting another lodger in is not in my best interests. I can afford to pay my mortgage with the help of the one lodger that ill keep. Mental health, piece of mind, you cant put a price on that .

I wonder what battle he is referring to, if the legislation allows you to remove her as she is there under license, what could she claim you have gone wrong?

Kick her ass to the curb.

lalababa

Ahh yeah, but who put the tinfoil on the bowl?? It could have been anyone....

ted1

Any update ?

The_Conductor

ted1 wrote: »

Any update ?

Its not a soap opera.......

ted1

The_Conductor wrote: »

Its not a soap opera.......

It’s of interest to people who may be in similar conditions.

fran38

OP here. Apologies for the absence. I've been working and then trying to remain calm under a barrage of incessant noise from the female tenant. So to bring this up to speed:

The last few days have been unnerving, she is constantly playing her ipad/phone/stereo at various times of the day at a very loud volume. With that she will sing extra loud especially when she crosses my path (I've been trying to steer clear of her even though its my house, madness). She'll laugh when shes in conversation with someone on the phone and it's obviously put on. She was never like this, or I suppose I've never noticed it before all this happened.

I've been on nights the last two nights, been to bed this morning hoping to get some sleep for tonights shift (I'm at work right now). Her behaviour is crazy, she knows I'm working and doesn't give a ****. Ye may call me stupid but I'm not giving her the satisfaction in knowing the noise is keeping me awake. I got two hours sleep between 11am and 7pm this evening.

So, with the advice from both village solicitors and the local Gardai, I have no option but to keep my head down untilk her move out date (March 31st). And even then, there is no guarantee she'll move on that date. She has a lot of stuff to move, it could take two days if she doesn't get her dad to do it. He owns a van.

Dav010

fran38 wrote: »

Ye may call me stupid

I’m not going to call you stupid, but you are acting stupidly. Why are you putting up with this behaviour? It’s past time you showed her the door.

Purple Mountain

OP, seriously, you're under duress in your own home.
She's either a devious little spoilt brat or she has a mental illness.
Do you really think she'll go on 31st or at least she'll go peacefully?
I don't.

fran38

Dav010 wrote: »

I’m not going to call you stupid, but you are acting stupidly. Why are you putting up with this behaviour? It’s past time you showed her the door.

I got advice from the two village solicitors that it best to keep the head down and pray she moves out at the end of the month. The reason being is that either she or her mam may look to get legal advice andf then the issue of the covid eviction ban may pop up. Now, even though lodgers/licencees may not come under this rule, whatever solicitor they get may read it differently and then she'll really dig her heals in and the 31st March may look fanciful.

fran38

Purple Mountain wrote: »

OP, seriously, you're under duress in your own home.
She's either a devious little spoilt brat or she has a mental illness.
Do you really think she'll go on 31st or at least she'll go peacefully?
I don't.

No, on both parts unfortunately. I am at a total loss.

Baby01032012

She is a licensee and has no rights under the residential tenancies acts or the equal status act. The covid 19 ban on evictions does not apply to her. She or a solicitor can take whatever legal view they like. Let them take that view after she is out. If she doesn’t leave remove her belongings and change the lock. End of.

o1s1n

fran38 wrote: »

I got advice from the two village solicitors that it best to keep the head down and pray she moves out at the end of the month. The reason being is that either she or her mam may look to get legal advice andf then the issue of the covid eviction ban may pop up. Now, even though lodgers/licencees may not come under this rule, whatever solicitor they get may read it differently and then she'll really dig her heals in and the 31st March may look fanciful.

That's actually ridiculous advice, you've someone with no right to be in you home causing you a huge amount of grief.

Turf her out.

fran38

Baby01032012 wrote: »

She is a licensee and has no rights under the residential tenancies acts or the equal status act. The covid 19 ban on evictions does not apply to her. She or a solicitor can take whatever legal view they like. Let them take that view after she is out. If she doesn’t leave remove her belongings and change the lock. End of.

They will take that view while shes in the house, then it'll be a slog to get her out on the 31st.

She has a ****load of stuff. You wouldn't believe it. On my own with no family around me, it'll take me at least two days flat out to pack her stuff. And in those two days, I'll have to contend with her and everyone belonging to her banging on my door.

fran38

o1s1n wrote: »

That's actually ridiculous advice, you've someone with no right to be in you home causing you a huge amount of grief.

Turf her out.

I agree with you.

It's not that easy or simple. I have to wait to change locks but that scenario has her going out for a few hours. She rarely leaves the house.

I know it seems I'm making excuses but I dont want the scenario where she gets wind of this covid rule, whether it applies to her or not, she'll scream blue murder and bang, there goes my 31st march.

Purple Mountain

OP, law isn't interpretable.
She's either covered by the Covid ban or not.
If not, go to the Garda station. Tell them you're a prisoner in your own home being subjected to mental games. Give solid examples.
Like, how do you know, she won't go full rogue coming up to 31st and leave fish in the bed for example?
Ask guards to come to the house and ask her to leave there and then with a bag to get her through for a day or two.
Simultaneously have a locksmith call then.
You can tell her that someone other than her abuse giving mother can come back to the house at a time when you and the other tenant are there to supervise them packing the rest of the stuff.
If this takes one or 2 times, that's not your issue.
Do not leave the other person unsupervised packing or let this nightmare wagon in again after Gardai have seen her out on day one.
Only after have you inspected the room and are sure all her stuff is gone, will you return her deposit to a bank account.
And do not provide her with a reference!

o1s1n

fran38 wrote: »

I agree with you.

It's not that easy or simple. I have to wait to change locks but that scenario has her going out for a few hours. She rarely leaves the house.

I know it seems I'm making excuses but I dont want the scenario where she gets wind of this covid rule, whether it applies to her or not, she'll scream blue murder and bang, there goes my 31st march.

I completely understand and conflict in these kinds of scenarios is awful, I'd something similar happen to me years back and decided to play it cool like you for fear of legal repercussions. Actually drove me to drink and in retrospect I was far to accommodating.

The problem here unfortunately is that you want to avoid a conflict. In actual reality she doesn't have any leg to stand on and you can literally tell her now, at this very moment, to get the hell out of your house.

The 31st of March is still two weeks away. There is no reason for you to be putting up with this and impacting your own mental health and wellbeing for two weeks while she prances around your house annoying you with loud music and calls as if she has any right to be there.

fran38

Purple Mountain wrote: »

OP, law isn't interpretable.
She's either covered by the Covid ban or not.
If not, go to the Garda station. Tell them you're a prisoner in your own home being subjected to mental games. Give solid examples.
Like, how do you know, she won't go full rogue coming up to 31st and leave fish in the bed for example?
Ask guards to come to the house and ask her to leave there and then with a bag to get her through for a day or two.
Simultaneously have a locksmith call then.
You can tell her that someone other than her abuse giving mother can come back to the house at a time when you and the other tenant are there to supervise them packing the rest of the stuff.
If this takes one or 2 times, that's not your issue.
Do not leave the other person unsupervised packing or let this nightmare wagon in again after Gardai have seen her out on day one.
Only after have you inspected the room and are sure all her stuff is gone, will you return her deposit to a bank account.
And do not provide her with a reference!

The local Gardai believe she is covered by the covid ban so will not lift a finger. But I could try them again if I printed off the relevant legislation.

fran38

o1s1n wrote: »

I completely understand and conflict in these kinds of scenarios is awful, I'd something similar happen to me years back and decided to play it cool like you for fear of legal repercussions. Actually drove me to drink and in retrospect I was far to accommodating.

The problem here unfortunately is that you want to avoid a conflict. In actual reality she doesn't have any leg to stand on and you can literally tell her now, at this very moment, to get the hell out of your house.

The 31st of March is still two weeks away. There is no reason for you to be putting up with this and impacting your own mental health and wellbeing for two weeks while she prances around your house annoying you with loud music and calls as if she has any right to be there.

Thank you for this. I need inspiration to get this done.

TheChizler

fran38 wrote: »

The local Gardai believe she is covered by the covid ban so will not lift a finger. But I could try them again if I printed off the relevant legislation.

You won't convince them to intervene but they might attend as observers, especially if you thought she might get violent.

PetitPois89

fran38 wrote: »

The local Gardai believe she is covered by the covid ban so will not lift a finger. But I could try them again if I printed off the relevant legislation.

She is most definitely not covered by the covid ban as a licensee. Even if she were a tenant, by acting in an antisocial/threatening/severely disruptive manner, a landlord is entitled to terminate her tenancy during this emergency period as the situation is considered an “exception”. I’d give her 48 hours notice to pack her bags and get out. Then get the locksmith around.

You could even pay a security guard for a day to sit in the property while she gets out. May be worth the money to save you some stress.

Purple Mountain

TheChizler wrote: »

You won't convince them to intervene but they might attend as observers, especially if you thought she might get violent.

Exactly, ask them to witness.
It's YOUR home OP.
She's an unwelcome guest, pull the plug.

fran38

PetitPois89 wrote: »

She is most definitely not covered by the covid ban as a licensee. Even if she were a tenant, by acting in an antisocial/threatening/severely disruptive manner, a landlord is entitled to terminate her tenancy during this emergency period as the situation is considered an “exception”. I’d give her 48 hours notice to pack her bags and get out. Then get the locksmith around.

You could even pay a security guard for a day to sit in the property while she gets out. May be worth the money to save you some stress.

Can her actions be considered anti social when it's not impacting on anyone external to the house? Will her behaviour be interpreted as merely 'extremely disruptive' (which isnt mentioned in the The Residential Tenancies Act 2020)

PetitPois89

fran38 wrote: »

Can her actions be considered anti social when it's not impacting on anyone external to the house? Will her behaviour be interpreted as merely 'extremely disruptive' (which isnt mentioned in the The Residential Tenancies Act 2020)

She’s a licensee so the Residential Tenancies Act doesn’t apply to her. Antisocial can apply to either internal or external depending on the circumstances

fran38

PetitPois89 wrote: »

She’s a licensee so the Residential Tenancies Act doesn’t apply to her. Antisocial can apply to either internal or external depending on the circumstances

The big question is, will the Gardai see it that way when I ask them to oversee the eviction? Anti Social can be interpreted a lot of ways or not at all. Being disruptive eg: Playing music excessively and at a loud volume, stomping her feet, banging doors, basically shouting down her phone, loud excessive singing along to songs that she has never done in her 1.5/2 years in my house. Will the Gardai see this as anti social or will they scoff at me?