Harry and Meghan - OP updated with Threadbanned Users 4/5/21

irishblessing

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes but if I met her not knowing anything about her, I would not have guessed that she had black ancestry. I would have described her as tanned and exotic looking. If I did something to offend her, I would have no idea it could be construed as racism. I think the vast majority of people didn't view her as a "woman of colour" until it was pointed out to them that one of her parents was non-white.

When would you ever describe a Caucasian person as "exotic?"

It's beside the point. She's publicly identified as mixed race, a woman of colour, and her mother is clearly a black woman.

There were overtly racist news headlines, comments, and increase of death threats to this couple once their relationship was announced. This cannot be discredited.

Sunny Disposition

irishblessing wrote: »

When would you ever describe a Caucasian person as "exotic?"

It's beside the point. She's publicly identified as mixed race, a woman of colour, and her mother is clearly a black woman.

There were overtly racist news headlines, comments, and increase of death threats to this couple once their relationship was announced. This cannot be discredited.

Racist people won’t like her for her heritage, that is true. But the reason most of the British people don’t like her is more prosaic, they just don’t find her likeable.
I think some people have tried to conflate the two.

walshb

Folks need to move away from this race nonsense..

She is a woman. A human being. Mother is black and father is white. End of

I never took to her right from the start.

The interview simply cemented my views. I find difficult to like.

Neyite

I liked her a lot in the beginning. I knew it would be bloody hard for her to fit in and that she would get criticism from certain quarters due to her race, her previous divorce and the cultural difference of an American fitting in to an archaic British institution. Even when they quit, I thought 'good for them' they are carving out their own path, regaining agency over their lives, fair play.

But it was when reports started coming out that they thought they could maintain the income for being a working royal without actually doing any work, when they moved immediately after using public funds to renovate Frogmore and it was only when there was public criticism that they reluctantly announced that they were repaying it. When they wanted to keep the Sussex Royal branding and were clearly pissed off when the Queen quashed that money spinner for them. I read Finding Freedom with an open mind but came away feeling like they were two very entitled brats who felt they could pick and choose at royal life, capitalise on it and do very little in return. That's not how it works.

Sunny Disposition

Neyite wrote: »

I liked her a lot in the beginning. I knew it would be bloody hard for her to fit in and that she would get criticism from certain quarters due to her race, her previous divorce and the cultural difference of an American fitting in to an archaic British institution. Even when they quit, I thought 'good for them' they are carving out their own path, regaining agency over their lives, fair play.

But it was when reports started coming out that they thought they could maintain the income for being a working royal without actually doing any work, when they moved immediately after using public funds to renovate Frogmore and it was only when there was public criticism that they reluctantly announced that they were repaying it. When they wanted to keep the Sussex Royal branding and were clearly pissed off when the Queen quashed that money spinner for them. I read Finding Freedom with an open mind but came away feeling like they were two very entitled brats who felt they could pick and choose at royal life, capitalise on it and do very little in return. That's not how it works.

I saw Harry complaining that he had to get his own security and I thought he was so entitled. He is an extremely wealthy man who can easily pay for it, surely if he is not even working for the royal family he should take care of it not the lowly British taxpayer.

Be right back

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

I saw Harry complaining that he had to get his own security and I thought he was so entitled. He is an extremely wealthy man who can easily pay for it, surely if he is not even working for the royal family he should take care of it not the lowly British taxpayer.

And he was cut off financially. Diddums. Doesn't he realise anyone who leaves a job will no longer be paid by said employer??

retro:electro

irishblessing wrote: »

When would you ever describe a Caucasian person as "exotic?"

It's beside the point. She's publicly identified as mixed race, a woman of colour, and her mother is clearly a black woman.

There were overtly racist news headlines, comments, and increase of death threats to this couple once their relationship was announced. This cannot be discredited.

Where?

superflyninja

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Racist people won’t like her for her heritage, that is true. But the reason most of the British people don’t like her is more prosaic, they just don’t find her likeable.
I think some people have tried to conflate the two.

Some people including Markle herself.

irishblessing

irishblessing wrote: »

When would you ever describe a Caucasian person as "exotic?"

When they look exotic by Irish standards.

irishblessing

irishblessing wrote: »

There were overtly racist news headlines, comments, and increase of death threats to this couple once their relationship was announced. This cannot be discredited.

That's just not true. There were no racist news headlines when their relationship was announced.

retro:electro

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes but if I met her not knowing anything about her, I would not have guessed that she had black ancestry. I would have described her as tanned and exotic looking. If I did something to offend her, I would have no idea it could be construed as racism. I think the vast majority of people didn't view her as a "woman of colour" until it was pointed out to them that one of her parents was non-white.

Meghan has had some work done to her face, most notably a nose job. So her natural features have changed

beakerjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

When they look exotic by Irish standards.

Depends....are they wearing an Hawaiian shirt? :pac:

Make no bones about it, she's a woman of colour. Its obvious from looking at her.

Ive no doubt that she has probably suffered some form of racial abuse in her life from her skin colour.

Still believe her interview was a publicity opportunity. She positioning herself as the next top reality star ala Kim K. The interview and the content are all a means to that end.

Smart girl. Whetehr it works or not is another thing, but if her goal is fame and money, shes going the right way about it.

beakerjoe

beakerjoe wrote: »

Depends....are they wearing an Hawaiian shirt? :pac:

Make no bones about it, she's a woman of colour. Its obvious from looking at her.

Ive no doubt that she has probably suffered some form of racial abuse in her life from her skin colour.

Still believe her interview was a publicity opportunity. She positioning herself as the next top reality star ala Kim K. The interview and the content are all a means to that end.

Smart girl. Whetehr it works or not is another thing, but if her goal is fame and money, shes going the right way about it.

I don't think it is obvious from looking at her. Once you know her mother was black, then it is obvious, but I think most people did not realise she was mixed race until it was pointed out to them.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't think it is obvious from looking at her. Once you know her mother was black, then it is obvious, but I think most people did not realise she was mixed race until it was pointed out to them.

I know a woman, Irish as, she is 6'2'', long black glossy hair, goes brown as soon as she looks at the sun.
So I think, that if people were not aware of Meghan background you wouldn't automatically assume she was mixed race, or what race she is!
Anyway, her race is really not important, as far as I can see her personality appears to be the issue!

beakerjoe

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think it is obvious from looking at her. Once you know her mother was black, then it is obvious, but I think most people did not realise she was mixed race until it was pointed out to them.

I disagree, she looks obviously mixed race.



She does not look Caucasian in any pic I've seen.

jm08

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

I saw Harry complaining that he had to get his own security and I thought he was so entitled. He is an extremely wealthy man who can easily pay for it, surely if he is not even working for the royal family he should take care of it not the lowly British taxpayer.

Security for them costs £2.5 million per year. His 10/15 million inheritance wasn't going to last long with those costs. Fair play to them both, they got jobs. At least they are not workshy.


The Royal Family have plenty of money. Its not his fault that he was born into it and is a target because of that.

jm08

bubblypop wrote: »

I know a woman, Irish as, she is 6'2'', long black glossy hair, goes brown as soon as she looks at the sun.
So I think, that if people were not aware of Meghan background you wouldn't automatically assume she was mixed race, or what race she is!
Anyway, her race is really not important, as far as I can see her personality appears to be the issue!

Isn't that the thing about racism - why should she have to pass as white as white is better than black?

jm08

jm08 wrote: »

Isn't that the thing about racism - why should she have to pass as white as white is better than black?

But she doesn't?
She is whatever she is, wgy would you think white is better than black?

retro:electro

Most people don’t care that they have had to sign with Netflix and Spotify in order to make money. They were always going to try and make a name for themselves in Hollywood and so signing those deals is a part of that. What most people find a bit pathetic is the fact that the two of them, both pushing 40, complained about being forced to sign these deals in order to have to provide for their own security; despite The Queen making it clear in her Megsit terms that they don’t want to be reliant on public funds in their new lives. They seemed to be kind of resentful and spiteful in the interview over the fact that they have to fund their own lifestyle now after their own decision to leave the institution to live a more independent life.

superflyninja

superflyninja wrote: »

Im in the retro:electro camp on this one its getting tiresome replying to you and you cherry-picking the points you argue.

Where did she lie????
Cutting down to two things. Ignoring all else.
Firstly about her private wedding 3 days before. Yes, we all know it wasn't official, it was a private ceremony for H&M. I've no problem with that. But she categorically stated in the interview that it was a marriage ceremony. That's when she got married. This has been proven false.
Keep that in mind for this next bit.
She claimed prince/princess titles for her kids and security for the family was being withheld. She made it sound that someone CHOSE to withhold those things, most likely with a racist motive.
We know that is untrue. Its public knowledge. And was so before she married.

The first point proves that she is an unreliable narrator.
The facts surrounding the second point show that at very best she is massively stupid. Yet she has shown that she is quite intelligent in her interview, so that leads a great many people to think that she is not stupid, she is lying, that she knew these things but wanted them anyway, she didnt get them and is throwing her toys out of the pram as a result.

Can you answer us on those points?

Nothing to say about this then?

Sunny Disposition

retro:electro wrote: »

Most people don’t care that they have had to sign with Netflix and Spotify in order to make money. They were always going to try and make a name for themselves in Hollywood and so signing those deals is a part of that. What most people find a bit pathetic is the fact that the two of them, both pushing 40, complained about being forced to sign these deals in order to have to provide for their own security; despite The Queen making it clear in her Megsit terms that they don’t want to be reliant on public funds in their new lives. They seemed to be kind of resentful and spiteful in the interview over the fact that they have to fund their own lifestyle now after their own decision to leave the institution to live a more independent life.

This is what makes their position ridiculous, some of the richest people in the world complaining that the taxpayer isn’t helping them enough. The entitlement is obscene.
If the interview hadn’t been so soft it was a really obvious question to ask, why do you feel the UK taxpayer should support you when you don’t work for it anymore and you are vastly wealthy?

jm08

retro:electro wrote: »

Most people don’t care that they have had to sign with Netflix and Spotify in order to make money. They were always going to try and make a name for themselves in Hollywood and so signing those deals is a part of that. What most people find a bit pathetic is the fact that the two of them, both pushing 40, complained about being forced to sign these deals in order to have to provide for their own security; despite The Queen making it clear in her Megsit terms that they don’t want to be reliant on public funds in their new lives. They seemed to be kind of resentful and spiteful in the interview over the fact that they have to fund their own lifestyle now after their own decision to leave the institution to live a more independent life.

Wasn't the issue that the security was withdrawn at short notice, the tabloids had published where they were living in Canada so they had to leave at short notice and rely on a friend to provide them with accommodation and security in LA.


I also seem to remember hearing that Prince Charles was going to help out from his personal funds. Has he? £2.5m a year is a lot of money to come up with for protection because of being a member of the Royal Family.


A lot of the non-working royals who don't get any money get into all sorts of trouble. For example, Princess Ann's son, ? Phillips got into fierce trouble with the RF because he sold his wedding photos to Hello. Fergie also had problems with money as had Edward.

jm08

jm08 wrote: »

Wasn't the issue that the security was withdrawn at short notice, the tabloids had published where they were living in Canada so they had to leave at short notice and rely on a friend to provide them with accommodation and security in LA.

.

Well flagged before they left, and tbh if prince Harry thought that the British police would just keep on supplying security to him for free that shows an amazing unawareness and sense of entitlement!!

JoChervil

Neyite wrote: »

I liked her a lot in the beginning. I knew it would be bloody hard for her to fit in and that she would get criticism from certain quarters due to her race, her previous divorce and the cultural difference of an American fitting in to an archaic British institution. Even when they quit, I thought 'good for them' they are carving out their own path, regaining agency over their lives, fair play.

But it was when reports started coming out that they thought they could maintain the income for being a working royal without actually doing any work, when they moved immediately after using public funds to renovate Frogmore and it was only when there was public criticism that they reluctantly announced that they were repaying it. When they wanted to keep the Sussex Royal branding and were clearly pissed off when the Queen quashed that money spinner for them. I read Finding Freedom with an open mind but came away feeling like they were two very entitled brats who felt they could pick and choose at royal life, capitalise on it and do very little in return. That's not how it works.

I’ve seen one or two episodes of Suits and must admit, she drew my attention. I thought she was more Spanish or Mexican. But I found her looks attractive, nothing negative. Also I liked Harry very much.

And I wished them both well till that interview. Even on this thread people are criticising her for her behaviour. As far as I know, none here had any problem with the colour of her skin.

But watching part of the interview with this Lady C, I must admit I would dread to get into this crowd as an outsider. Her pose, her feeling of superiority. Honestly I wouldn’t be able to stand it.

In my opinion Meghan will be criticised in US as well. Anyone, who wants to stand out from the crowd will suffer this. The more she would like undeserved privileges, the bigger opposition she will meet. But the problem is she seems unable to accept any criticism. And this one her trait will drown her in the end. Or she will undergo therapy and be able to control it.

On the other hand I didn’t like Kate at the beginning, but she grew on me and now I at least respect her. So Meghan started from much higher position in my mind. And she lost it. She just didn’t want to pay that “entrance fee”. There is always a resistance in an established group of people against the new person entering it. It’s a natural thing and it has nothing to do with the colour of someone’s skin. It is just a natural reaction to protect established rules. I am sure we all had to pay it in certain moments is our lives. So why shouldn’t she?

If she first ate a humble pie, so then she could have introduced her changes. But she didn’t want to “pay for one’s inexperience”.

retro:electro

jm08 wrote: »

Wasn't the issue that the security was withdrawn at short notice, the tabloids had published where they were living in Canada so they had to leave at short notice and rely on a friend to provide them with accommodation and security in LA.


I also seem to remember hearing that Prince Charles was going to help out from his personal funds. Has he? £2.5m a year is a lot of money to come up with for protection because of being a member of the Royal Family.


A lot of the non-working royals who don't get any money get into all sorts of trouble. For example, Princess Ann's son, ? Phillips got into fierce trouble with the RF because he sold his wedding photos to Hello. Fergie also had problems with money as had Edward.

Well that’s the thing with periods of transition isn’t it, the arrangement isn’t going to go on indefinitely and whatever agreement they had was always going to come to an end at some point. And they seem quite bitter about that. “A friend” of theirs just happened to suggest to them the idea of signing deals with Netflix and Spotify (it’s always someone else’s idea isn’t it :pac: ) and thus they just had to, poor souls. I believe Charles had also been funding them privately for some time also and is reportedly quite upset at accusations he cut them off. Ultimately I think their attitude stinks. They left of their own accord, they weren’t thrown out. If they didn’t weigh up the risks before doing that then it’s no ones fault but their own.

I believe superflyninja has a few questions for you there, while we have you!

JoChervil

jm08 wrote: »

Wasn't the issue that the security was withdrawn at short notice, the tabloids had published where they were living in Canada so they had to leave at short notice and rely on a friend to provide them with accommodation and security in LA.


I also seem to remember hearing that Prince Charles was going to help out from his personal funds. Has he? £2.5m a year is a lot of money to come up with for protection because of being a member of the Royal Family.


A lot of the non-working royals who don't get any money get into all sorts of trouble. For example, Princess Ann's son, ? Phillips got into fierce trouble with the RF because he sold his wedding photos to Hello. Fergie also had problems with money as had Edward.

All you questions were really answered earlier in the thread, but you don't bother reading.

beakerjoe

bubblypop wrote: »

Well flagged before they left, and tbh if prince Harry thought that the British police would just keep on supplying security to him for free that shows an amazing unawareness and sense of entitlement!!

Like you cant have it both ways.

Im sure they have less privacy now than they did when they were part of the Royal Family.

They have been more present in the media than ever since they left.

She wants the fame IMO and she wants everything that comes with it.

retro:electro

They don’t want to have to pay for their own security. That’s what it all comes down to. They believe that because Harry inherited the risk then the taxpayer should inherit the cost of paying for that risk forever more, despite the fact it was they who stepped away from their roles and requested a life of independence, without relying on the public. I don’t think they know what they want tbh. They don’t want the title for Archie but oh wait they do now. They don’t want to be reliant on public funds but please still pay for our security. Want privacy but hello Netflix and Oprah. Want away from an oppressive institution but were happy to still be tied enough to it to be able to be “part time royals”. Why would you want to be part time belonging to an institution that you see as racist? And institution that didn’t help you when you were suicidal? Maybe because being “part time” would mean they still get security paid for? It all comes down to money tbh. They want the best of both worlds. To be able to sign multi million dollar deals with Netflix but have the UK foot their security due to an “inherited risk”.
I’d wager among the actual celebrities living and walking around in Montecito, nobody could actually give a crap about them.

banie01

bubblypop wrote: »

I know a woman, Irish as, she is 6'2'', long black glossy hair, goes brown as soon as she looks at the sun.
So I think, that if people were not aware of Meghan background you wouldn't automatically assume she was mixed race, or what race she is!
Anyway, her race is really not important, as far as I can see her personality appears to be the issue!

My 1st wife was Irish, the family are Irish as far back as we could trace.
There may have been a taint of Spanish blood in their pool around the time of the Armada

But similar to your friend, as soon as the sun appeared she would became dark skinned and Latina looking. When we lived abroad she was commonly mistaken for one of the locals.

Meghan's appearance does not make her race immediately apparent, it's a red herring in the effort to portray her as a victim of racism.
Yes there has certainlyly been racist behaviour towards Meghan, particularly from some parts of the press and online in particular.
But, I have yet to see any actual evidence other than "Meghan's truth" that she has been a victim of institutional racism.

Larbre34

beakerjoe wrote: »

She wants the fame IMO and she wants everything that comes with it.

Except the duty. Except the work.