Anyone got any experience of using BidX1 Ireland?

NIMAN

Any tales to tell, good or bad?

Was looking at a property recently, and know I would have to register for 4.5k just to place a bid.

This is refundable if you don't win, but I did see some mention of a non-refundable €123 fee somewhere in their literature, can't seem to find it now.

Claw Hammer

NIMAN wrote: »

Any tales to tell, good or bad?

Was looking at a property recently, and know I would have to register for 4.5k just to place a bid.

This is refundable if you don't win, but I did see some mention of a non-refundable €123 fee somewhere in their literature, can't seem to find it now.

I can't understand how there can be any non-refundable fee. An estate agent is only entitled to charge 1 party in any transaction.

NIMAN

I found the link.

On their website, one of the FAQs has a title, "Is there an admin fee".

It reads

For auctions in the Republic of Ireland, there is a non-refundable registration fee of €125 (€103.31 plus VAT) for each auction. This fee is payable during the registration process. Please note that this fee will be processed as a separate transaction to any deposit requirement.

wonski

It's a fee for auction, same like with car auction.

Call it an entry fee.

Ubbquittious

wonski wrote: »

It's a fee for auction, same like with car auction.

Call it an entry fee.

Fcuking load of sh1te that is. I attended a real life property auction and paid nothing since my bid didnt win. Cute hoors charging people to attend

NIMAN

Just got it clarified by BidX1 themselves.

So if they had an average of 10 people bidding on every property they list, they are getting >1k per property in admin fees.

wonski

NIMAN wrote: »

Just got it clarified by BidX1 themselves.

So if they had an average of 10 people bidding on every property they list, they are getting >1k per property in admin fees.

Is that fee per property or per auction?

Either way they are there to make money, handy little income.

NIMAN

wonski wrote: »

Is that fee per property or per auction?

Either way they are there to make money, handy little income.

True, but there will be plenty of people registering just to bid on a certain property.

So, I just looked at their March online auction, and there seems to be 222 lots up for auction.

Say on average there is 3 people interested in each property up for auction.
Thats 666, lets call it 600 in case some have no great interest (of course some properties could have 30 interested if in a great location).

So 600 people have to pay €125 just to register to bid.
So thats €75,000 admin fees for that days auction?

And that's even before counting their % cut of every sale price off the sellers.

Nice business.

Its per auction. You pay the entry fee and you can bid on whatever you want in that auction.

mel123

NIMAN wrote: »

Any tales to tell, good or bad?

Was looking at a property recently, and know I would have to register for 4.5k just to place a bid.

This is refundable if you don't win, but I did see some mention of a non-refundable €123 fee somewhere in their literature, can't seem to find it now.

Yes i have used them and was the winning bidder. Sale went through no problems. Cant complain about them to be honest.

Claw Hammer

NIMAN wrote: »

I found the link.

On their website, one of the FAQs has a title, "Is there an admin fee".

It reads

For auctions in the Republic of Ireland, there is a non-refundable registration fee of €125 (€103.31 plus VAT) for each auction. This fee is payable during the registration process. Please note that this fee will be processed as a separate transaction to any deposit requirement.

PROPERTY SERVICES (REGULATION) ACT 2011
90.— (1) Subject to subsection (2), any provision (whether express or implied) in an agreement in respect of the sale or letting of land whereby the purchaser or tenant, as the case may be, is required to pay or otherwise bear the cost of the licensee’s fees or expenses in respect of the sale or letting, as the case may be, shall be void, and any moneys paid pursuant to such a provision shall be recoverable as a simple contract debt in a court of competent jurisdiction.

(2) Nothing in subsection (1) shall affect the liability of a person to pay fees or expenses to a licensee in respect of the acquisition of any land where the licensee has been retained by the person to acquire such land and does not also act, in respect of such acquisition, on behalf of the person from whom the land is acquired.



I would be complaining to the Property Services regulatory Authority and looking for my money back.

Dav010

Claw Hammer wrote: »

I can't understand how there can be any non-refundable fee. An estate agent is only entitled to charge 1 party in any transaction.

Is BidX an estate agent? I thought it was just an auction service.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

Is BidX an estate agent? I thought it was just an auction service.

They can't conduct an auction of property without a licence.

Galwayhurl

Can you imagine the amount of timewasters they'd have if they didn't charge a registration fee?

Claw Hammer

Galwayhurl wrote: »

Can you imagine the amount of timewasters they'd have if they didn't charge a registration fee?

So what? The law is the law.

Galwayhurl

Claw Hammer wrote: »

So what? The law is the law.

I imagine that BidX1 would say that the registration fee is just that and not "... the cost of the licensee’s fees or expenses in respect of the sale or letting" which would include commission, photography, advertisements etc.

JimmyVik

A few years ago we bought a house that needed underpinning and a chimney that needed from someone.
All easy enough to sort out and then sell on for us. tbh if you knew what you were doing you could easily have figured out this stuff before bidding.
The vendor had bought it from Bidx1 previously and didnt know there was anything wrong with it, so they sold it.

Dav010

Maybe CH has a point that the auction house cannot charge both buyer and seller, but I don’t see the issue with charging everyone else who isn’t the successful bidder. Also, the registration fee may be for the use of the bidding platform, that is not to say the registrant is required to bid/buy.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

Maybe CH has a point that the auction house cannot charge both buyer and seller, but I don’t see the issue with charging everyone else who isn’t the successful bidder. Also, the registration fee may be for the use of the bidding platform, that is not to say the registrant is required to bid/buy.

Someone has to be the buyer eventually and therefore the clause is void. If it is void in one case it must be void in all.

Dav010

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Someone has to be the buyer eventually and therefore the clause is void. If it is void in one case it must be void in all.

You may be stretching that a bit thin, the buyer may get a refund on registration fee if they argue the toss.

Again, the fee is a registration fee to enter the auction, there is no obligation to buy. You could look at your statement above and apply the inverse, there are many registrants whom the auction house are entitled to charge for using the platform as they are neither buyer nor seller.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

You may be stretching that a bit thin, the buyer may get a refund on registration fee if they argue the toss.

Again, the fee is a registration fee to enter the auction, there is no obligation to buy. You could look at your statement above and apply the inverse, there are many registrants whom the auction house are entitled to charge for using the platform as they are neither buyer nor seller.

The only reason they pay is so they can bid on the properties.

Dav010

Claw Hammer wrote: »

The only reason they pay is so they can bid on the properties.

Only one buyer though, or none at all. If the Auctioneer can only accept payment from one party in a sale, I don’t see why they would be prevented from receiving payment from anyone not a party to the contract.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

Only one buyer though, or none at all. If the Auctioneer can only accept payment from one party in a sale, I don’t see why they would be prevented from receiving payment from anyone not a party to the contract.

The auctioneer is being paid by the vendor, they have a contract with every bidder and eventually there is a contract between the buyer and seller. The whole point of the legislation is to prevent agents fromk charging both sides.
In any event the successful bhidder must have been registered so the clause is void and it must then be a void clause from the start since any bidder or potential bidder is signed up to it, all must have a void clause in the contract with the auctioneer.
This is a matter whchi the PSRA should deal with.

Dav010

Claw Hammer wrote: »

The auctioneer is being paid by the vendor, they have a contract with every bidder and eventually there is a contract between the buyer and seller. The whole point of the legislation is to prevent agents fromk charging both sides.
In any event the successful bhidder must have been registered so the clause is void and it must then be a void clause from the start since any bidder or potential bidder is signed up to it, all must have a void clause in the contract with the auctioneer.
This is a matter whchi the PSRA should deal with.

Buying at auction has been around a long time, it would be inconceivable that this would not have been checked if it was illegal.

I can’t see what contract exists apart from the one which allows a registrant to bid. The sale agreement exists only with the buyer when the hammer falls on the highest bid, there is no sale contract with any of the under bidders.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

Buying at auction has been around a long time, it would be inconceivable that this would not have been checked if it was illegal.

I can’t see what contract exists apart from the one which allows a registrant to bid. The sale agreement exists only with the buyer when the hammer falls on the highest bid, there is no sale contract with any of the under bidders.

Bidding online has not been around for a long time. It is a very recent development. Nobody ever paid a fee to attend a property auction before this. Nothing is being done probably because nobody has complained.
There is a contract between the agent and every bodder with the terms and conditions of the auction incorporated in it. It would not be possible to have an auction otherwise.

Dav010

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Bidding online has not been around for a long time. It is a very recent development. Nobody ever paid a fee to attend a property auction before this. Nothing is being done probably because nobody has complained.
There is a contract between the agent and every bodder with the terms and conditions of the auction incorporated in it. It would not be possible to have an auction otherwise.

I don’t want to get bogged down on this, I know that when you sink your teeth into something, you won’t let go, even if you are wrong.

The registration fee allows you access to the online auction, there is no obligation to bid.

The Act you linked earlier states:

PROPERTY SERVICES (REGULATION) ACT 2011
90.— (1) Subject to subsection (2), any provision (whether express or implied) in an AGREEMENT in respect of the sale or letting of land whereby the purchaser or tenant, as the case may be.....

I’m struggling to see how this applies to anyone not party to the sale agreement. Can you link to where it applies to underbidders or people who do not bid at all?

The contract between the online auctioneer and registrants relates to the online platform, once registered they have access to it, that is not to say they have any contract with the vendor, nor agreement in respect of the sale, so how could that provision of the Act apply to anyone other than the seller and buyer?

As I said earlier, you are stretching your interpretation of the Act to include persons other than the seller and buyer, I’m not sure why.

Graham

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Nobody ever paid a fee to attend a property auction before this.

That's not correct

Allsop Space charged a €200 registration fee as far back as 2013 with 850+ bidders registering to participate in an auction at the RDS.

C3PO

I wold be surprised if BidX haven’t covered their ass on this one!

Graham

Graham wrote: »

That's not correct

Allsop Space charged a €200 registration fee as far back as 2013 with 850+ bidders registering to participate in an auction at the RDS.

Before this by claw didn't mean this actual event. He was speaking about the fairly new online bidding.

2013 is only 8 years ago

Galwayhurl

Graham wrote: »

That's not correct

Allsop Space charged a €200 registration fee as far back as 2013 with 850+ bidders registering to participate in an auction at the RDS.

Funnily enough, Bid X1 is Allsop as far as I know. Bid X1 is the new name for Allsop essentially.

Claw Hammer

Dav010 wrote: »

I don’t want to get bogged down on this, I know that when you sink your teeth into something, you won’t let go, even if you are wrong.

The registration fee allows you access to the online auction, there is no obligation to bid.

The Act you linked earlier states:

PROPERTY SERVICES (REGULATION) ACT 2011
90.— (1) Subject to subsection (2), any provision (whether express or implied) in an AGREEMENT in respect of the sale or letting of land whereby the purchaser or tenant, as the case may be.....

I’m struggling to see how this applies to anyone not party to the sale agreement. Can you link to where it applies to underbidders or people who do not bid at all?

The contract between the online auctioneer and registrants relates to the online platform, once registered they have access to it, that is not to say they have any contract with the vendor, nor agreement in respect of the sale, so how could that provision of the Act apply to anyone other than the seller and buyer?

As I said earlier, you are stretching your interpretation of the Act to include persons other than the seller and buyer, I’m not sure why.

You have omitted subsection (2) in your quote, in order to spin your argument.
It is clear from the act that the buyer cannot be charge a fee unless the buyer has retained the agent to acquire a property. As things stand it is inevitable that the buyer will be charged a fee. The scenario as it now stands is incompatible with the act.
the onlince platform is simply the means by which the agent accepts bids and is no different, from a legal point of view, to a rostrum with a gavel and buyers present in a room waving their arms.