Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XII (The Byrne Supremacy)

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118029849#Comment_118029849

I'd argue Sheehan is better than Kelleher.

But either way, Leinster and Ireland have a great 80 minutes in the hooker position.

RichieRich_89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118029814#Comment_118029814

You've never seen a hooker under 110 kilos?

Dubinusa

I suppose Ryan and Ringrose were mediocre and awful again!

Interesting game, bit of a slow start and disjointed play from Leinster.

Scrum being that dominant against a decent Scarlets front row is a very positive sign in the build up to the six nations.

Furlong looked a smidge unfit but scrummed well. Conan picking up where he left off, incredible athlete.

Sexton playing great rugby. Made a bit of a meal of the late tackle, but then it was the last time it happened all game so he was probably right to draw the ref's attention.

Lowe a bit unconvincing so far this season. We're playing the ball wide so fast that quite a few times in that game a last gasp blind backhand / reverse throw was needed to prevent being bundled into touch - teams will get wise to this quick enough, it's not a reliable retention strategy and I was disheartened to see it relied upon so often.

For the maul try, if a player connected to the maul goes into touch does that have any impact on play? I presume not as it was very obvious but not something I was sure about.

Both Sheehan's tries impressive, but fielding like that from a front row should be celebrated. Great try, different mindset entirely. Kelleher had a very strong showing until he was subbed and Sheehan picked up where he left off. Both Leinster hookers outperformed Owens, how he toured with the Lions only Gatland knows.

Baird had a better game, when he made that big break down the middle I've no idea why he didn't pin the ears and force the Scarlets player to make contact.

Ryan got through a mountain of work, Doris grew into the game albeit I probably would have given a forward pass against Lowe for his try.

We're still not at full pitch, I suspect plenty is being left behind in training with the guts of the season still ahead.

Good to get some of the big guns back and healthy.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118029812#Comment_118029812

Healy very clearly holding him in at that ruck, bit of a 'dark arts' penalty.

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118029958#Comment_118029958

Why would you say that?

Thought Ryan was good today

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118029958#Comment_118029958

Ryan excellent today. Ringrose went well but not as impactful as he is capable of.

I think the entire back line look like they are finding their feet in whatever style of play we're trying to implement. Interesting to see Frawley at first receiver a few times with Sexton in the 12 channel as second pivot.

Dubinusa

It was in jest! There are some here that constantly state how far both lads have fallen!

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030049#Comment_118030049

But their form did dip last season.

It's possible to acknowledge that, while also acknowledging that they both played well today. Which they did.

Dubinusa

If you can factor in the concussions and broken jaws etc! Of course their form dipped. People seem to discount the physical aspects of the injuries. A broken jaw is certainly no picnic. I've had one. Mine was from boxing. Concussions are more worrying and I believe the union should have stood Ryan down for the season after his repetitive concussions.

eclipsechaser

What did the ref say about the head to head collision on Frawley? It looked pretty awful in person. I know he dropped the ball and lowered his head a bit but he got smashed head to head by the Scarlet's player. It's a very bad look for the game when only a scrum is awarded for something as dangerous as that.

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030125#Comment_118030125

I know they had injuries. I never denied that. Hopefully they put the injuries behind them and find form again. And it looks like they will because they were good today.

I don't know why you're being very defensive about it and making sarcastic remarks.

Nobody ever said they were mediocre and awful.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030181#Comment_118030181

I don't think Evan's could have predicted he would have spilled the ball, and Frawley dipped substantially before contact. You could maybe argue some recklessness but for me it was purely accidental and the ref was right to mark it as a play on.

Frawley came back on also.

salmocab

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030411#Comment_118030411

I thought Frawley actually looked down to see where the ball went which actually made the dip even worse

eclipsechaser

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030411#Comment_118030411

I've just seen a replay of it there.

https://twitter.com/MicilGlennon/status/1449431492938063879?s=20

I appreciate he didn't mean to clock him in the head but there has to be some strict liability if that's what you end up doing - especially so severely. Going in for a tackle, you have a responsibility not to smash your head off the head of another player. It can't just be a scrum.

Frawley coming back on concerned me but apparently the Scarlet's player didn't even go for a HIA. That's crazy. I'm getting old and crochety but I considered heading home after that decision. I had invited someone so I didn't. It's just hard to support a game that allows that negligence go unpunished.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118030728#Comment_118030728

I don't think there was much of a contact all things considered, it was a superficial hit and the players being fine so quickly afterwards supports that. Looked worse than it was in my opinion.

Dubinusa

Who's been defensive! The furor over injured lads coming back in and not been top shelf.

molloyjh

Back from the game and the pub. Some normality returning. Surprisingly my form with the pints wasn’t as bad as expected. I picked up not far from where I left off 19 months ago!

I have to say I’m really enjoying how Leinster are looking to play at the moment. Our eagerness to keep the ball alive and play out of contact is exciting. Sure we’re making errors at times but that’s stuff that we can work on and fix. That knock on from Frawley off the VDF pass in the first half was something that I looked at and thought “what if” instead of being annoyed at the mistake. Frawley was hitting the line at speed and probably got his timing slightly off. But if he had taken that, he was gone. I want to see more and more of that kind of thing as it’s exactly what we’re all crying out for these days.

We scored 50 today, but it could have been 60+. And we didn’t let up. I want more of this stuff from this team. I almost don’t care if we win the HEC or not. We’re seeing Leinster play an entertaining brand of rugby that, if they can bed it down fully, will provide us with some great results and some really good days out. If we can add a trophy or two on at the end of the season then great, but we can still enjoy the journey regardless. And if we see more of today, with a bit more cohesion etc, then I’ll be pretty happy.

Dubinusa

It was a good effort! I thought Frawley getting MOTM was strange. Kelleher really caught my eye, as did Porter. The entire pack was very good. Molony has really stepped up. He's carrying really well and is a fine l/o operator.

Was happy to TOB. I hope he gets the nod next week!

Interested Observer

Don't have a lot to say beyond I very much enjoyed that from the terrace, thought there was a decent bit of intensity in the first half, game ran out of steam a bit in the second but decent evenings work.

arsebiscuits1

Hard to pick a standout as there was some excellent performances out there.

Doris has to be up there though. A lot of people doubting his ability to play 6 but he had a phenomenal performance and himself and Conan could be a very potent combo. 9 carries for 55m was a strong return for his attacking in the wide channels. He could well be a revelation playing as wide as he did with his hands, carrying and general rugby nous.

Dan Sheehan has bashed the door down for the strongest Leinster 23 now and has to be picked in the 16 shirt at the very least. November internationals might be a bit too soon for him for get a look in to Irish camp but sky looks to be the limit for him.

Jack Conan continuing exactly where he left off. Great to see him being so consistently excellent.

Backline looked quite sharp. JGP was better but really doesn't look to have started this season overly well. I like the look of Frawley and Ringrose as a combination. They were quite effective together. Frawley looks more assured every time I see him play even if his motm was a bit charitable...

Nice to get glimpses of Tommy again after a torrid few months with injury. Rust to be expected which will hopefully get ironed out. His natural ability is so distinct when he plays and he adds to it with his attitude. He had a great moment of 2 big tackles in the space of 2 seconds. Big hit, straight onto feet, big hit. Great to see.

Lowe is becoming worryingly ineffective. Teams seem to be figuring him out. Very little game changing moments which were to be expected of him 3 seasons ago. Same mistakes being made on D too. That Scarlets try was well taken but should never have happened.

TRC10

Dan Sheehan is easily the 3rd best hooker in Ireland.

He should have been in the squad in July tbh.

Ireland's starting hooker in 2023. I'm calling it now.

Clegg

I think we all have a bit of shiny new toy syndrome re Sheehan. He has played well and looks extremely promising, but I think Kelleher is comfortably ahead of him at the moment and that will probably be the story for the next few years as well.

Kelleher also played excellently at the weekend. He's another of that new breed of frontrows who have excellent handling skills to go along with their power game. I think, pound for pound, he's probably the most powerful carrier in Ireland.

What also really surprised me is that he's actually younger than Sheehan. Both are 23 years old but Kelleher is vastly more experienced right now. We rightly praise Sheehan for his potential, but Kelleher is younger, currently better and has just as high a ceiling, if not higher.

It's a great selection problem for Cullen to have tbf. Until one of the other provinces start sniffing around at least.

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118035602#Comment_118035602

From my pov I don't think there is shiny new syndrome at all. I think he absolutely has the capability to establish himself as first choice in Leinster this side of xmas. But Kelleher is the deserved number 1 as he showed yesterday

But recent evidence absolutely has Sheehan as second choice for Leinster. His lineouts have been consistent and he's a destructive carrier whose general comfort in open play has him with a real point of difference.

Can't wait to see how he develops

I think Sheehan looks to have the goods but needs a few higher profile fixtures to showcase them before he's in the running for a wider Ireland camp let alone a debut.

If we had a Champions cup semi final tomorrow I'd suspect Tracy or Cronin might get in ahead of him given that they've been there, done that and delivered. I'm not saying they are better, but they are proven.

Dubinusa

So far, I think the stand out are Kelleher and Molony! As a unit the pack have been very good.

Some lads are not quite at the races yet! JGP was better this week and hopefully he continues to improve. Lowe hasn't been bad, nor has he been good. I don't think he deserves a call up for the autumn. RB has been shaky. He was better this week. Overall, I think he'll be disappointed with his season thus far.

It's early days still and I hope that we gel a little better. We've played some of the minnows or perceived minnows and have won. But, the performance against Dragons is worrying. It was pretty headless and mistake ridden. That type of effort is worrisome.

This week's tilt will be very physical. Glasgow are a big physical side. I would rest Ryan after his his and Sexton will probably be rested. Farrell can't afford Sexton picking up an injury. Perhaps the international lads will be rested. I expect Adam Byrne will play and hopefully Henshaw. It's only 4 matches in and we are down to 2 healthy 10's. That's not ideal.

molloyjh

Cullen confirmed last week that Henshaw won’t be available this week and suggested he probably won’t be available for the Nov games.

Sexton now also a doubt with a hip injury.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/johnny-sexton-scare-ahead-of-november-internationals-as-ireland-captain-suffers-hip-injury-40959884.html

molloyjh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118036810#Comment_118036810

I reckon he’s fine. If Harry is fit he’ll be rested. If Harry sits this one out then Sexton will be in the 23. He was totally fine after the game. It’s probably all just precautionary.

stephen_n

Any update on Ryan’s concussion?