Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XII (The Byrne Supremacy)

Interested Observer

Thought that was a really strong performance from a group who wouldn't have played much together and with quite a few guys who are really inexperienced at this level.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800802#Comment_119800802

I sure hope you didn't actually go through with a bet!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119806476#Comment_119806476

As another posted above, he was fully rested out of the 23 for Connacht in Galway.

He's started 6 games this year, which is joint most alongside Ross Molony and Luke McGrath. Molony has played the most, as he came off the bench in the game he didn't start, which really underlines his value to us.

Really encouraging to see how much rugby we've got into some young guys so early in the season: John McKee (6 match squads, 1 start), Rob Russell (4 match squads, 3 starts) and then a little less for guys like Brian Deeny (2 apps), Martin Moloney (2 apps) & Liam Turner (2 starts).

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119808167#Comment_119808167

John McKee (6 match squads, 1 start)

This is more than a little disengenuous, tbh when 4 of the "match squads" amount to 9 minutes in total.

Dubinusa

Just watched the match. Fantastic result. Very good team performance. Ed Byrne and Penny were immense, imo. Russell went really well and Cosgrave did well.

Great seeing the young lads getting stuck in. Turner is a center in a hookers body. Seriously stocky lad. He's worth keeping. I'd like to see him at 12. Molony is just so good! Our most consistent performer over the last year or so, my opinion.

Dubinusa

Glasgow next up and then Ulster. The team will be depleted due to the autumn series. But here should be lads recovered by then. Baird will be back and Lowe too, hopefully.

Glasgow completely hammered Benetton. They could be a tough nut to Crack minus the international lads. Ulster will have a strong side also.

Some good early season performances by the lads. Molony; Jenkins have been great. Deegan is looking like he's ready to challenge Conan and Doris. The kiddies have done well. Russell has been good and Cosgrave was really good this week. Turner is a good player and he's really powerful. The injuries have been disruptive but, they've handled it well. This coming block including Europe will be a challenge. Racing away itself is a massive tilt.

7 wins is really great! I think some of the performances were off. Zebre and Connacht put it to us. We did the job though. Scarlets this week was a fine performance. Our lads were great. The scoreline was deservedand I thought it was the best performance this season.

DelMcG

Vakh Abdaladze called up by Georgia for their game against Wales on Nov 19th.

Interesting to see what happens there. Am I right in thinking that as soon as he gets minutes for Georgia, he immediately becomes classified as an overseas players, despite being from Blanchardstown?... I'm pretty sure that's how it worked when AJ McGinty signed for Connacht.

Former Former Former

Fair play to him, he's 26 now and 4th choice for Leinster so time to be looking at options.

Clegg

Very encouraged by Leinster's start to the season. Leinster's attacking hasn't been quite as precise as last seasons, but that's understandable when you consider we have a new attack coach and contact skills coach.

I'm encouraged by the increased use of attacking kicks we've seen this season and I hope that continues to be developed and put into use against the bigger sides. I've also seen us try new set piece moves an more quick pop passes to runners on a short, tight line. We're seeing new things that'll take time to fully bed in.

We've definitely seen our pack improve in terms of set piece defence. We seem more adept at repelling driving mauls. Our own driving maul is coming along too.

The big negatives also centre around our set piece. There's a big issue surrounding actually securing out own throws. The Bulls destroyed our set piece in last seasons Pro 14 semi final and I've seen no improvement in that regard this season either.

I suppose another negative, from a purely selfish perspective, is that the Emerging Ireland tour stopped us seeing more of Osborne and McCarthy. I'm convinced that these two will be Leinster and Ireland mainstays in the coming years.

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814889#Comment_119814889

Look at the Welsh hooker who was benched by Ulster as soon as he got called fairly recently.

Then his contract was allowed run out and he was let go.

I feel for Vakh but as said he is in his mid 20s and 4th choice. It might be time to move on at the end of the season.

That said it will be hard for Leinster as they iirc will be losing 2 nie tight head props.

Dubinusa

They should retain him until the season is ended. Mike A could also be out the door at season's end. We're in trouble if we lose both. Maybe we could sign another NIQ? Or even John Ryan? Clarkson is a bit away from being reliable. I think he will get there eventually.

PMC83

Good for Vakh, a class player he doesn't get a whole lot of game time at Leinster. You'd assume it's the beginning of the end of his time in Ireland.

Vakh would be out of his mind to accept that call up.

If he has a strong desire to represent Georgia then fair enough, that's understandable and I wouldn't argue against it - but he will limit his prospects in Ireland dramatically if he is no longer eligible.

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815774#Comment_119815774

If he isn't being renewed by Leinster (I have no idea if he will or won't be but he may have a better idea of his contract status than we do) or he isnt happy with contracts offered playing international rugby for Georgia could be a better shop window than being 4th choice at Leinster.

I'm sure Leinster can't afford to offer a big contract for 4th choice prop. Perhaps a 26 year old won't be happy taking the salaries offered to depth players.

That said given that Georgia are only playing a single game this autumn window it wouldn't be much of a shop window.

PMC83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815774#Comment_119815774

I don't agree with this at all, hes not getting much of a look in at Leinster and has been overlooked for Emerging Ireland / Ireland A sides. He doenst seem to be in Andys plans. He could hang around in the tracksuit and find himself leap frogged or head off for some new experiences and potentially more game time / money.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119816128#Comment_119816128

He's had ongoing and serious injuries for years. Leinster play a far, far superior brand of rugby and are better coached than Georgia. He's in a much better window playing for the one of the best teams in world rugby than playing for Georgia.

His attractiveness to Irish provinces diminishes dramatically if he declares for another country. Unless it's personally important to him it would be a mistake.

Dubinusa

Vakh has lived in Ireland for years. He played u20 and went through the academy and sub academy. I can't see the sense in not signing him if he's capped with Georgia. He was raised in Ireland, he's probably on average money and has battled through serious injuries. It's different to the Bradley Robert's scenario. I hope he stays! He won't be a top tier lad but, could and is a good enough squad player. Besides, who's next up? Lasisi just switched over to th and is probably nowhere near ready! McGuire is injured? Plus he's only year 1 in the academy. Big Mike may run for the cash when his contract is up, who's available to come in? That's why Clarkson needs to play and learn. He's young and has still a way to go!

PMC83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119816431#Comment_119816431

He's not in the window at all though, because he hardly plays for Leinster. He's never started for them and has something like 21 appearances overall. If hes decided he's happy to be capped by Georgia I suspect he's made peace with the idea that his days of playing in Ireland (for any province) are coming to an end. He could get a good contract in the top 14 and play international rugby for Georgia. The other option is to hang around the gym in UCD and hope he can break through, but at 26 he may be thinking about making hay when the suns shining...

salmocab

If he’s going to be away with Georgia when the Ireland players are away with Ireland then his worth to Leinster massively diminishes, that said I think he could probably play elsewhere and earn a decent wage, good luck to him.

pickarooney

It's a sign of a major downturn in Georgian rugby if they're calling up bit-part players like Vakh. They used to have the pick of the Top 14 in their front row.

I can't see any French club signing Leinster's 4th choice TH on big money either. Maybe he'll turn it around, stay injury free and become a star for club and country and, much as I wish him the best, that's highly unlikely.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818105#Comment_119818105

To be fair at Leinster you have the best TH in the world & Samoa captain ahead of him. Also this could be more of Georgia trying to cap tie Vakh more than anything, if he was 100% Georgian and had no Irish roots and was playing in the Top 14 I wonder would he have been picked.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818105#Comment_119818105

Not in the slightest. To my understanding he wasn't far off having to retire due to a persistent back problem. He's obviously rated if Leinster maintained faith in him and kept him on the roster and I wouldn't be surprised if we see that investment justified in the coming seasons. I also wouldn't be surprised if his potential hasn't been telegraphed and Georgia are acting opportunistically with this call up.

Serbian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818105#Comment_119818105

I think they're just expanding their pool of available players. Why not cap someone who is playing for one of the best teams in Europe if they're open to it, even if he is only 3rd or 4th choice?

I'd be of the opinion that we probably will drop him now as playing international rugby does negate the benefits of keeping someone like that around in the squad. I'm not sure what he'd earn at Leinster, but I'd imagine it's not great, so he doesn't need big money to go to France, I'd say he'd be happy with the low end of medium French money if he can get it.

Dubinusa

I can't see Vakh getting a contract in the top 14. He's got the injury history and he's not a regular player at Leinster. He could go to the lower league. I hope he's retained and develops. He's put a lot into his career at Leinster and it would be nice to see him develop at Leinster.

Besides, if Big Mike leaves who do they sign? At what cost? With Sexton leaving and Healy too, the team will not be as good. Replacing Sexton will be difficult. The job falls to RB and I can't see him bringing ur silverware. HB is not a sure thing and Frawley hasn't gotten a look in at 10. We could be enroute to some lean years soon.

Happyhouse22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818105#Comment_119818105

It’s actually a really strange front row selection from Georgia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_national_rugby_union_team

Vakh is actually the second oldest prop named, only one of the six props named has more than one cap, and it includes an 18 year old and a 20 year old.

I wonder are there others being rested or is Georgian rugby about to fall off a cliff?

PMC83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818495#Comment_119818495

Now theres some fairly middle of the road players in the Top 14 tbh. Maybe Vakh wouldn't land at the Racings /Clermonts but theres plenty of teams who favour piano lifters as apposed to piano players in that league.

Shehal

Another thing people forget about Vakh is he can cover both sides of the scrum, is still relatively young & is unlikely to command a huge wage given he's 3rd/4th choice at Leinster which considering its up there with fly half as the most crucial position on the field. When you add all this up I can definetly see alot of interest in the Premiership or Top 14, will he be the most expensive player ever and be a key player at a Toulouse for instance? maybe not but I at the very least can see him doing a job for most Top 14 sides in at the very least a sporadic role.

arsebiscuits1

It's entirely possible Vakh is being pragmatic about his career here with one very achievable goal - the Rugby World Cup.

He's had a debilitating back injury which had to have been hit or miss about keeping on going. I think he knows the ship has sailed on any Ireland involvement at any point in his career.

Why not take a stab at international rugby? I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that he puts together some performances for Georgia and he is front and centre for some test caps at a Rugby World Cup. That's something no one could take away from him and obviously I can't speak for the lad - but I'd imagine it would be an enormous honour for him.

I think he knows that there's not much chance he'll be on the winners step togged out for a trophy with Leinster, I think he knows that and Ireland cap wont ever materialise. And that's ok.

Buer

Abdaladze does not appear to be rated by Leinster. He's 4th choice and sits on the bench for a significant period of time when he does feature in the 23. Of his 4 appearances this season, last weekend was the only time he got over 20 minutes. He hasn't started a game in years even allowing for his injuries. It was telling that he remained on the bench for the full 80 last season away to Cardiff when Ala'alatoa was absolutely exhausted and conceded the match losing penalty in the closing seconds. The coaching team don't trust him. Lasisi is being developed as a tighthead now and will be out of the academy in 18 months.

Him declaring for Georgia is totally understandable. I'd imagine he's not going to be with Leinster too much longer regardless. His father was a Georgian international and I'd imagine it hold a strong emotional pull for him. It's also an opportunity to put himself in the shop window for a contract elsewhere. Teams will watch Georgia specifically to see if there are any gnarled front five guys who might do a job for them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119819372#Comment_119819372

The fact he's accepted the call up points to him not expecting to be offered a new contract at the end of the season.

I imagine this isn't the first time Georgia have been in contact with him, and he's going to be only too aware of the fact he won't be carried by Leinster if he's NIQ.

Good for him. I always thought he could have broken through for more time at Leinster but injuries took a big toll.