Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XII (The Byrne Supremacy)

Interested Observer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120102663#Comment_120102663

It probably works however the IRFU/Nucifora says it does for any given case. In the example you've given, they'd probably sanction a higher wage but I'd imagine Nucifora would have to sign off on it, rather than Connacht just saying "come west and we'll up your wage by 50k".

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103862#Comment_120103862

Yeah, plus for context, Max Deegan is an Irish international, so it wouldn't surprise me if he was earning more than Connacht's first choice #8 (or similar money if we assume that's Paul Boyle).

I don't think this concept of 'depth charts' is a factor in determining player salaries, and nor should it be. Perfect example will be the fact that post the next set of contract renewals, you'd imagine Dan Sheehan and Ronan Kelleher will be the two highest paid hookers in the country (get your mind out of the gutter) and that's entirely justifiable.

Clegg

The starting 15 is still a very strong one, especially up front even with the loss of Furlong and Jenkins. Player for player I feel we have the advantage there, but hopefully the game won't descend into a dog fight. That sort of game against a decent Premiership side on their own patch could be very difficult. Especially when missing Jenkins.

I do feel like we sometimes miss a spark of creativity in the backline when Lowe is absent. Larmour can create something through his footwork, but Lowe has the line running and passing/offloading ability that none of our other players possess at the same high level. Maybe Ringrose is his equal there, but the nature of being a centre makes it harder to demonstrate. Keenan and Larmour are quality in their own rights, but Lowe has that bit extra.

If the game is tight in the final 20 minutes I'd worry a bit. Our bench isn't as strong as I would like. But these are the games that show if you're champion material. I'd we can't beat an injury hit Gloucester, even with our own squad issues, we'd be showing that we aren't at the level required to win the entire thing.

This is a great challenge for some of our younger players like Osborne and Deeny. If the former is as good as we think he is, he needs to step up and show it I have faith that he will too. He's so good for such a young player.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103783#Comment_120103783

At any stage of their career, zero. At least in leinster's or Ireland’s game plan, there is no one better.

I just meant that its not just waiting for VdF to get injured or to lose form. It’s reasonably likely that a fit Connors is ahead of him too, right? Or has that changed?

One good thing is that there is no one obviously threatening behind him.

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103912#Comment_120103912

Till Connors gets fit it is hard to know, I always highly rated him and Connors if he comes back would be ahead of Penny.

Connors is also probably looking at the Ireland squad and thinking if he can get fit and a run of games can he force himself back into at least the training squad for the WC

I think Penny will be aiming for 2027, plus we all know the backrow is a position that players pick up injuries

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103862#Comment_120103862

Of course, the IRFU can't have a position that a player just moves from one province to another and gets another 50k. That would just mean they end up paying a lot more for a player than they should have

I am just guessing and I don't know how it works

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103931#Comment_120103931

With the age profile of JvdF, and Connors’ injury history plus what’s behind him, he has the inside track at at least starting for leinster by … 2025/26… or sooner. Lots of assumptions built into that.

Dubinusa

By 25/26, VDF will be 32 or so, have a lot of miles on the clock. Connors is a good player, can he stay fit? I wouldn't bet on it. Penny is not in a bad spot. He'll get match time in S.A and probably will play most of the remaining fixtures. The lad has got 50 odd appearances for Leinster at 33 years old. Connors has ...29. He's 26 years old.

ulsteru20s

Unless some absolute phenom comes through soon, he’s in a great spot.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120103783#Comment_120103783

I don’t think anyone is expecting him to start ahead of JVdF.

But equally, I don’t think him not having featured is a meaningless datapoint.

Thru injury or otherwise, you’d have expected a scenario where he could have featured on the bench. (For example, if Baird has started in the 2nd row, he covers 6 so you might be more comfortable putting Penny on bench).

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120104625#Comment_120104625

Penny is just the latest in a long line of players that people like to discuss with the view of saying he should move.

To give a comparison of a player who Penny will probably rival for international honours in the future

From wiki

Coombes 62 (135) and has got games in Europe and Ireland caps but 2 years older

Penny 48 (125) games for Leinster so far

Penny seems to be fairly on track for a player post WC he will be looking to crack into Leinster European team with a view to Ireland squad if injuries dont happen.

JVDF will be playing in WC we hope so he will have extended breaks next season

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120104858#Comment_120104858

But in that sense, the fact it’s a long list of players is kinda the point.

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120105274#Comment_120105274

But it's not, go back and Im sure you had the same conversation about JVDF who went on to be World PLayer of the Year

Conan who went on to play all 3 test for the Lions

The list goes on.

The one player to jump was Jordi, he moved because he though he was in a queue, then Heaslip retired. His move to Ulster is not something you could say is a success

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120105396#Comment_120105396

You could say it was a success for Leinster as Doris, a superior player, replaced him.

And tbh, I don’t remember those conversations for VdF or Conan; they always seemed higher up the depth chart than Penny.

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120105414#Comment_120105414

Conan was talked about going to Ulster a few times. 2015/2016 ish. Then Heaslip retired and Murphy moved north leaving space in the Leinster squad for Conan.

Leinster imo do need to make space in their backrow.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120105414#Comment_120105414

Doris was always going to break through anyway. He is not comparable to e.g. Penny to my mind.

ulsteru20s

Doris and Penny arent really comparable. Culhane is way more like doris as in he’s the archetype for his position. He could play 5 good games for leinster and show up in an ireland squad. He fits so closely to what Farrell wants.

However, the path is actually reasonably clear. VdF is 29. It’s not outlandish that injuries or dropoff might start happening after 30. Connors is very injury prone. And there is no one behind him.

He should absolutely stay. Conan seems more like the odd one out to me. Him or Deegan.

Dubinusa

The problem with leaving is the new environment will not be as good as it is at Leinster. Penny should be patient. I can see him get capped, I don't think he's going to amass too many.

Deegan should absolutely stay. He's just 26 and has 90 appearances on one of the best sides in Europe. Conan is 30! How long before he starts the inevitable decline? Deegan will see action to close out the season.

The lad who is going to find it difficult to get match time, will be Sean O'Brien. Good player from what I've seen, but the logjam in front of him...

Culhane will hopefully get his turn. Great prospect! Really lit up last seasons u20's. Culhane is probably a year or so away from a debut.

Just looking at the lads who left or did not get a chance is insane!

Conor Oliver

Cian Prendergast

Paul Boyle. All at Connacht

Nick Timoney

JORDI. Ulster

Dom Ryan left for Leicester.

Serious players in that group!

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120106165#Comment_120106165

Doris and Penny aren't comparable cause Doris is way, way better.

Given the choice between Doris of JvDF in my team, I would probably tend towards Doris. He's exceptionally good (his **** hands having been something he has worked on and improved).

Doris absolutely did not make it into the team cause Jordi left.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120106203#Comment_120106203

yea, i would agree with this. Doris is an elite player. I dont really ever see Penny getting to that level. Culhane might. Ruadhan Quinn also. Maybe McNabney.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120106195#Comment_120106195

Did Leinster choose O’Brien or Moloney over Prendergast? I know they are a year older so maybe not.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120106208#Comment_120106208

It's hard to know. But the talent is undeniable.

Penny should go get cash abroad. He's good enough to get a decent wage but he'll never play for Ireland beyond token caps. There's far too many brilliant back rows in leinster let alone Ireland.

molloyjh

Just saw there that Stormers have gone pretty much full strength again for their LI game. They have a 6 day turnaround for their home game vs Clermont, which you’d imagine they’ll target to ensure a home R16 game. They then have a 6 day turnaround for their game in Belfast before a 7 day turnaround for their game away to the Sharks. Given they went strong against Glasgow last week there is surely no way they’ll go strong in Belfast. So Ulster could take a good deal of pressure off us with a win there. We could have a 14-15 point cushion going against into Feb, albeit that Stormers will have a game in hand. With them away to both Sharks and the Bulls a loss in either of those should mean Stormers can’t catch us.

Baird could have easily competed for that

Burkie1203

Beautiful

Bogwoppit

So clever, making Glaws look like amateurs already.

Exclamation Marc

That was marvellous. They made it look so simple.

Bogwoppit

Doris and Ryan wearing the same scrum cap just to confuse everyone.

Exclamation Marc

Jeez that was like a training ground try.