Leinster Team Talk Thread (Love you Furlong time)

Must love hardship

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121368904#Comment_121368904

Ross is good player but limited. I think Harry has abit more mobility to him. Ross is an excellent squad player. Rarely injured, kicks his peno's but there is a reason he was 3rd choice at the World cup.

I only moved ringrose to 14 ro get the 3 best players on the field in ringrose, henshaw and Osborne.

As I said elsewhere I think Lowes powers are on the wane. Had a poor season for leisnter last year.

I think healy might move to 18. Simply put there are serious contenders coming through on the loose head side. Alalatoa is leaving at the end of the season so might not be used as much.

Leinster need to freshen it up a bit with team selection.. otherwise its gone abit stale.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121368959#Comment_121368959

Harry had a couple of decent games this year so far but was largely either awful or injured last year.

It's a strange argument to say that because Ross was no. 3 for Ireland at the WC, he's not good enough. Harry wasn't even in contention and was seen as a less viable option than Frawley at out-half and he rarely plays 10. That says a hell of a lot of the mountain that Harry has to climb.

Must love hardship

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369009#Comment_121369009

About 15 months ago Harry went on the tour to NZ ahead of Ross and was in Ireland squads ahead of him.

He's had an injury plagued 18 months or so. If he gets a decent run I think he gets ahead of Ross this year.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369063#Comment_121369063

15 months ago doesn't count for much now to be fair. If anything it shows how far he's fallen and admittedly a lot of that is down to his injury profile but also some fairly dismal outings when internationals were away. Either way, there's no doubt who Leinsters starting 10 is right now.

Must love hardship

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369134#Comment_121369134

By the same logic 15 months ago even 12 months ago ross byrne was not in the irish picture. He got his chance took it but was promptly dropped back to 3rd choice when a viable alternative got some significant game time.

Ross has gotten plenty of opportunity with leinster but unfortunately hasn't got them over the line.

Ross is a great squad player. But IMO he is not going to lead the team to multiple championships unfortunately.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369219#Comment_121369219

And nor is Harry, based on what we've seen.

I'm not using any historical logic here, you are when you brought up a tour 15 months ago as a barometer of how they are today.

Ross is now Irelands second choice out half and Harry can't get ahead of Frawley in Farrell's eyes. If Harry was so good and so much better than Ross, why wasn't he on the plane to France?

Harry has shown flashes of brilliance every now and again but has rarely strung them together, rarely stays fit for a prolonged period and he didn't do anything of note when he had the chance last season.

I hope he comes good and if he passes Ross out, then we're all the better for it because I agree that we need Ross to be better than he's shown to get us over the line. But Harrys shown nothing to suggest that he's our long term out-half or that he would do any better.

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369219#Comment_121369219

Your logic isn't unreasonable regarding Ross. I would be inclined to agree.

But I don't see how you can say it about Ross but not Harry. Harry is in his 5th season as a Leinster player and is 24. He has 55 appearances over half of which are starts.

By the same age and stage of his career Ross was a regular starter in Europe and had played important roles in some excellent wins. Think Exeter in the Aviva 2017, Montpellier away that same season, Ulster Aviva 2019.

You can have all the hope you want for Harry. But at this point in time, Ross is the player for it

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369342#Comment_121369342

Ross is now Irelands second choice out half and Harry can't get ahead of Frawley in Farrell's eyes. If Harry was so good and so much better than Ross, why wasn't he on the plane to France?

Is the point not that, for spells during Farrell's tenure, Ross couldn't get ahead of Harry either? Ross seems to be in the driving seat, but it's potentially a position that could see some flux for Leinster this season if any of them can put a run of form together.

clsmooth

My concern with Harry Byrne is his consistency within games. Always seems to have a few errors in him along with some lovely touches. Ross Byrne is a more consistent performer.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369390#Comment_121369390

I agree 100% that it's not like when Sexton was there that he was the defacto 10 and that any of Ross, Harry or Prendergast can take that jersey.

My point is simply that of the three, Ross is very clearly our starting ten and I've seen nothing to suggest that Harry will challenge that based on his form this season/ end of last season particularly when you factor in his injury profile. I think Prendergast has shown more promise but there's a huge caveat that most of that was shown in U20s games.

My point on the Ireland preference was simply that MLH's suggestion that because Ross was Irelands #3 somehow meant he wasn't good enough for Leinster but Harry (who can't get a sniff ) has somehow shown he's ahead of him at Leinster was a strange barometer.

I really hope and want Harry to skyrocket but since Harry emerged it was all talk and hype about how he was the heir apparent. And he never backed it up outside of flashes here and there.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369446#Comment_121369446

Ross is 4 years old isn't he and has massive experience compared to Harry. I would expect Ross to be a lot more consistent.

Harry style is also different so you would expect some more errors as he pushs it more. Not saying Ross is safe but its just a more controlled game plan.

To me Ross is the clear starter in the big games, Harry is behind him and needs to get more games and minutes in. Over the next 2 season will he be able to push ahead of Ross is the question.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369463#Comment_121369463

That's fair and it also speaks to the point that different coaches will want different things. And on that point, there's also the Nienaber replacing Lancaster factor.

In that regard, you'd imagine Ross is more aligned to Nienaber's type of game.

It'll be interesting to see what way it develops in any case.

Podge_irl

Harry was brought into the Irish squads when he was because his ceiling was higher. When we were closer to crunch time of the world cup and none of the high upside options had gone anywhere except Crowley, then Ross was brought back into the fold.

Ross' ceiling is still higher, but he's also shown few enough signs he will ever reach that level. But with consistent gametime, who knows.

conquestscarer

Never really understood the Harry Hype, he is a grand player but I don't think he does the basics to a high enough level to be the 10 that he is talked up to be. I think RB will start for us for the next 2 or so years and then Prendergast will have bulked up abit and will probably be at the physical level he needs to be to consistently play games for us.

Id have this for the first 15:

Porter Sheehan Furlong

McCarthy Ryan

Baird Doris VDF

JGP RB

Osborne Ringrose

Lowe Keenan TO'B

pickarooney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369482#Comment_121369482

"Harry style is also different so you would expect some more errors as he pushs it more. Not saying Ross is safe but its just a more controlled game plan."

I dunno, he always seems to go in one direction.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121369676#Comment_121369676

Harry was talked up before he even got into the Leinster academy from recollection. It was an off the cuff comment from Joe Schmidt when he was asked about Ross. Something like "wait till you see his brother". Of course the press ran with that because of the whole "who will replace Sexton" which was favourite for year

I think then BOD made a comment after a few Pro 14 games to say he looked good, can't remember exactly but it was on a podcast from recollection. Since then it has been used as a rod to beat the guy with and he had no control over it at all. So much to the point that BOD was saying loads of fans go up to him and remind him about his prediction about Harry Byrne.

It seems a lot of people would like Harry to fail just so they can have a pop at BOD. Also others just seem to want to critique him because the press said he was the next Sexton. Has Harry ever made any comment himself to say anything like that? has Cullen ever said it either come to think of it?

If those comments never got made would people be so hard on him? Maybe I am a bit biased, met Harry a few times and he was a great guy! A lot bigger than you would expect and last time he was standing beside Ruddock.

He has been unlucky, mostly with injury.

It seems a few people are also waiting in the long grass for Predergast to make an error and go after him the same way Harry has, especially since Keith Wood made the suggest of Predergast going to the World Cup on a podcast, again totally outside the control of Leinster and the player but it will be used against him in the future, just wait and see

Clegg

H Byrne was a big prospect a few years ago. Was playing well in the league and was lined up for a start in the Champions Cup. Got injured before that game and has never been able to stay fit since. I think this run of games is the longest he's stayed fit for in two years.

Clegg

Most Irish media outlets say Nienaber will arrive next week. It's probably too soon for him to have input into the Munster game, but I'm glad we have him before the back to back European Cup games.

I hadn't looked at Leinsters schedule until recently. The next 8 fixtures after Scarlets are huge and already potentially season defining. Glad to have the new coach and returning Ireland players.

There's a small gap between the Sale and Munster game for Christmas and a two week gap between the Ulster and Stade games. But other than that they're mostly weekly matches. Will really test Leinsters strength in depth.

Munster (H)

Connacht (A)

La Rochelle (A)

Sale (H)

Munster (A)

Ulster (H)

Stade Francais (H)

Leicester (A)

sydthebeat

harrys byrnes hype came from his appearances in the U20s, playing in 2 different 6 nations in 2018 and 2019, and the u20s JWC in 2018

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121370350#Comment_121370350

There has to be room for reasonable criticism tho. Whether that's of Harry, BOD, the media or whomever.

I often think reasonable criticism gets lump in with the "waiting in the long grass" type comments.

Dubinusa

Harry is only 24. He hasn't had any luck with injury. He's going to be fine, injury permitting.

Dubinusa

Is Frawley now out of the out half speculation? If he is the player that Farrell like at 10, he's not getting opportunities with Leinster.

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121376158#Comment_121376158

Lancaster never saw him as a 10 and was pretty open about that. Any time he listed Leinster 10s by name Frawley was never on that list.

I reckon in Stus eyes Frawleys ability at out half was a nice to have rather than a core position.

Neinebar may see differently however!

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121376158#Comment_121376158

Who knows really. The depth chart at Out-Half is Ross followed by Harry followed by Prendergast. Frawley was picked at 10 in a friendly against Munster in July. He was picked at 12 against Ulster in September. And so far this season he's playing 15.

I think in a depth chart, he'd likely be our second choice 15 (if we consider that Jimmy was a first/second choice winger) but can fill in at 10, 12 or 13.

pickarooney

Has Tector still got a contract?

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121376527#Comment_121376527

Still in the Academy, yes.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121376527#Comment_121376527

Tector has an obstacle filled route to match time ahead of him. I really think high of him. It's got to be daunting from his perspective.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121376158#Comment_121376158

I think AF was considering Frawley as a third 10/utility back for the WC only because we didn't have another good enough 10 at the time (Burns and Carty aren't at the required level). The emergence of Crowley meant AF had his three 10s, and Crowley has similar flexibility as Frawley. I think we need to move on from the idea that AF is interested in having Frawley as a 10. He experimented briefly, that is all.

leakyboots

Maybe he'll end up nailing down a position but I get the feeling Frawley will end up being a jack of all trades and master of none. Will be a useful squad player to be shunted around á la JOD at Munster or ROL at Leinster before him

degsie

Was there a team announcement for the game on Sat? The Leinster website is cack!