Almost all young women in the UK have been sexually harassed [MOD WARNING 1st POST]

Ffff221

Martina1991 wrote: »

To call the widespread harassment of women "crap" is so insulting. Its attitudes like yours which is why people dont come come forward when it happens to them, because they wont be believed.

You are so unbelievably ignorant. You have no idea.

"Widespread harassment of women" are you having a laugh the women here in Ireland and the UK are the most well off and live jn the most fair societies to women in the whole world.

All it is is spoiled upper class girls looking for something to complain about and are trying to convince themselves and others that they have some sort of struggle in life.

You watch too much sky news and read too many feminist newspapers.

Sonics2k

Ffff221 wrote: »

"Widespread harassment of women" are you having a laugh the women here in Ireland and the UK are the most well off and live jn the most fair societies to women in the whole world.

All it is is spoiled upper class girls looking for something to complain about and are trying to convince themselves and others that they have some sort of struggle in life.

You watch too much sky news and read too many feminist newspapers.

Hopefully someday you'll get to meet a real life woman and have an actual conversation with one.

anewme

Ffff221 wrote: »

"

All it is is spoiled upper class girls looking for something to complain about and are trying to convince themselves and others that they have some sort of struggle in life.

You watch too much sky news and read too many feminist newspapers.

This attitude.

Any wonder people are complaining?

Martina1991

Ffff221 wrote: »

"Widespread harassment of women" are you having a laugh the women here in Ireland and the UK are the most well off and live jn the most fair societies to women in the whole world.

All it is is spoiled upper class girls looking for something to complain about and are trying to convince themselves and others that they have some sort of struggle in life.

You watch too much sky news and read too many feminist newspapers.

From the OP
"Among women aged 18-24, 97% said they had been sexually harassed."

It is clearly widespread form the countless accounts of women openly telling people they have experienced the same.

And you're just blatantly ignoring it, dismissing it, belittling it.

You are disgusting.

Tokyo

Ffff221 wrote: »

"Widespread harassment of women" are you having a laugh the women here in Ireland and the UK are the most well off and live jn the most fair societies to women in the whole world.

All it is is spoiled upper class girls looking for something to complain about and are trying to convince themselves and others that they have some sort of struggle in life.

You watch too much sky news and read too many feminist newspapers.

Mod: Try harder. Preferably elsewhere. Don't post in the thread again.

Eric Cartman

Sonics2k wrote: »

Hopefully someday you'll get to meet a real life woman and have an actual conversation with one.

this is just rampant sexism, theres many posters on this thread have responded to questions, queries or dissent from the survey with posts basically labelling them as men who either have no interaction with women / have never been out with a woman etc..

Sonics2k

Eric Cartman wrote: »

this is just rampant sexism, theres many posters on this thread have responded to questions, queries or dissent from the survey with posts basically labelling them as men who either have no interaction with women / have never been out with a woman etc..

Lmao that is not sexism. If you think that's sexism then maybe that explains why you can't wrap your mind around the discussion.

nullzero

There's not a whole lot left to discuss here.

We live in a world where the behaviour outlined in the linked survey has been clearly made to be unacceptable for decades in yet this type of behaviour persists.

The majority of men wouldn't dream of engaging in this behaviour and do not sit back and allow it to happen without calling it out, yet it persists.

This behaviour at this point in time is not something that men who do not engage in it are responsible for.

The only way to stop such behaviour is through legislation to clamp down further on said behaviour with attention to making it easier for women to come forward to report such behaviour.

There will always be creepy people, men and women. We can strive to root out such behaviour from society but we will never remove it completely, there is also an element of throwing the baby out with the bath water in striving to achieve this as the genders become unwilling to engage with one another, but as the consensus is that this goal is what should be strive for then we just have to accept that the divide between genders will increase as a consequence.

meeeeh

Long time ago I decided this type of thread is worth participating in only in first few pages. After that the usual crowd descends and women are told that they are imaging things, then some trans and Muslim issues are dragged in and above all we are constantly told we are accusing all men of harassment.

I don't need men to cross the road when walking towards me. All I want from them is to leave me alone. If all the harassment is done just by 1.5% of men they are very busy men. Maybe some here would do well and just listen to women what this is making them feel like instead of constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences.

I'm fairly hardy woman, I don't get scared, I don't avoid things because I'm afraid something will happen, l even take risks. All harassment I had to deal with happened when I was with friends, going to the cinema (someone kissing my neck and grabbing my breasts from behind when I was 12), in hostel on holidays (digital rape), walking to parked car from friends flat (cycling around me with trousers off telling me he will **** me), a guy selling me fruit pointing at his erection and so on....

I don't know what the likes of men who constantly point out it's not all men want. A medal, a universal recognition how great they are? Well then good for you, you didn't do the stuff I listed above to me or any other girl but too many did and got away with it. And constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences will help them get away with it in future.

nullzero

meeeeh wrote: »

Long time ago I decided this type of thread is worth participating in only in first few pages. After that the usual crowd descends and women are told that they are imaging things, then some trans and Muslim issues are dragged in and above all we are constantly told we are accusing all men of harassment.

I don't need men to cross the road when walking towards me. All I want from them is to leave me alone. If all the harassment is done just by 1.5% of men they are very busy men. Maybe some here would do well and just listen to women what this is making them feel like instead of constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences.

I'm fairly hardy woman, I don't get scared, I don't avoid things because I'm afraid something will happen, l even take risks. All harassment I had to deal with happened when I was with friends, going to the cinema (someone kissing my neck and grabbing my breasts from behind when I was 12), in hostel on holidays (digital rape), walking to parked car from friends flat (cycling around me with trousers off telling me he will **** me), a guy selling me fruit pointing at his erection and so on....

I don't know what the likes of men who constantly point out it's not all men want. A medal, a universal recognition how great they are? Well then good for you, you didn't do the stuff I listed above to me or any other girl but too many did and got away with it. And constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences will help them get away with it in future.

Nobody should belittle or dismiss your experiences.

By the same token you're stating that a large percentage of men are actively harassing women which is an opinion based on your own prejudice.

More middle ground and less prejudice required on both sides.

the_pen_turner

meeeeh wrote: »

Long time ago I decided this type of thread is worth participating in only in first few pages. After that the usual crowd descends and women are told that they are imaging things, then some trans and Muslim issues are dragged in and above all we are constantly told we are accusing all men of harassment.

I don't need men to cross the road when walking towards me. All I want from them is to leave me alone. If all the harassment is done just by 1.5% of men they are very busy men. Maybe some here would do well and just listen to women what this is making them feel like instead of constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences.

I'm fairly hardy woman, I don't get scared, I don't avoid things because I'm afraid something will happen, l even take risks. All harassment I had to deal with happened when I was with friends, going to the cinema (someone kissing my neck and grabbing my breasts from behind when I was 12), in hostel on holidays (digital rape), walking to parked car from friends flat (cycling around me with trousers off telling me he will **** me), a guy selling me fruit pointing at his erection and so on....

I don't know what the likes of men who constantly point out it's not all men want. A medal, a universal recognition how great they are? Well then good for you, you didn't do the stuff I listed above to me or any other girl but too many did and got away with it. And constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences will help them get away with it in future.

i think most would be happy just not to be accused of such crimes and horrible things .
a bit of fairness and true representation of the facts would be nice aswell.
nothing major just some respect.

meeeeh

nullzero wrote: »

Nobody should belittle or dismiss your experiences.

By the same token you're stating that a large percentage of men are actively harassing women which is an opinion based on your own prejudice.

More middle ground and less prejudice required on both sides.

Where did I say that. Or should I assume from response you think I'm some sort of coincidence and this doesn't happen to other women. How naive.

nullzero

meeeeh wrote: »

Where did I say that. Or should I assume from response you think I'm some sort of coincidence and this doesn't happen to other women. How naive.

You dismissed the 1.5% of men notion (not sure how that was arrived at) by saying that group would be "very busy men". Perhaps you could expand on that but your statement suggests you believe a larger percentage of men are engaging in said behaviour.

Also the condescending tone of the end of your post does your argument no favours.

I'm sorry you've had such disagreeable experiences, but I'm not responsible for them nor are the majority of men. I've been groped and had unsavoury things said to me by women, but I don't believe all women are likely to engage in such behaviour.

Gradius

meeeeh wrote: »

Long time ago I decided this type of thread is worth participating in only in first few pages. After that the usual crowd descends and women are told that they are imaging things, then some trans and Muslim issues are dragged in and above all we are constantly told we are accusing all men of harassment.

I don't need men to cross the road when walking towards me. All I want from them is to leave me alone. If all the harassment is done just by 1.5% of men they are very busy men. Maybe some here would do well and just listen to women what this is making them feel like instead of constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences.

I'm fairly hardy woman, I don't get scared, I don't avoid things because I'm afraid something will happen, l even take risks. All harassment I had to deal with happened when I was with friends, going to the cinema (someone kissing my neck and grabbing my breasts from behind when I was 12), in hostel on holidays (digital rape), walking to parked car from friends flat (cycling around me with trousers off telling me he will **** me), a guy selling me fruit pointing at his erection and so on....

I don't know what the likes of men who constantly point out it's not all men want. A medal, a universal recognition how great they are? Well then good for you, you didn't do the stuff I listed above to me or any other girl but too many did and got away with it. And constantly dismissing and belittling our experiences will help them get away with it in future.

The type of fool that goes around genuinely harassing women is not going to pay heed to anything.

They won't pay attention to education, they won't pay attention to what people say to them, they won't be reading the millionth article on this, they won't be taking part in discussions, they don't care.

The next time someone does something genuinely wrong, make sure they don't get away with it. Don't store it up as some anecdote to tell people years later who don't do these things. It's pointless.

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

The type of fool that goes around genuinely harassing women is not going to pay heed to anything.

They won't pay attention to education, they won't pay attention to what people say to them, they won't be reading the millionth article on this, they won't be taking part in discussions, they don't care.

The next time someone does something genuinely wrong, make sure they don't get away with it. Don't store it up as some anecdote to tell people years later who don't do these things. It's pointless.

What would you suggest a woman should do in this scenario;
Woman walking down the street, few men standing outside pub, one man grabs his cock, makes sex moves at the woman, stands in font of her, says something disgusting about what she should suck and what else he would do with it.

What should she do?
Or maybe that's not genuinely wrong, to you?

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

What would you suggest a woman should do in this scenario;
Woman walking down the street, few men standing outside pub, one man grabs his cock, makes sex moves at the woman, stands in font of her, says something disgusting about what she should suck and what else he would do with it.

What should she do?
Or maybe that's not genuinely wrong, to you?

Go around the next corner, ring the police and tell them a group of people are harassing people.

Or here's an alternative, don't do anything and then direct your anecdote at other men years later.

Tough choices!!

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

Go around the next corner, ring the police and tell them a group of people are harassing people.

Or here's an alternative, don't do anything and then direct your anecdote at other men years later.

Tough choices!!

Lol.
Where is the offence?

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

Lol.
Where is the offence?

Sure if I see a maniac in a dark alley with an axe huffing and puffing in obvious rage, what's the point in ringing the police..."laugh out loud what's the offence?"

Cop on.

Stateofyou

Gradius wrote: »

Go around the next corner, ring the police and tell them a group of people are harassing people.

Or here's an alternative, don't do anything and then direct your anecdote at other men years later.

Tough choices!!

Women would be ringing the guards all day if they had to report all the shít they have to put up with. Are you for real. Guards would be called for assault or stalking or things of that nature.

Are you feeling a certain kind of way, like these anecdotes are being directed "at you" for some reason? How about just listen. If you're a man in this conversation, how about just stop the smart arse judgemental comments about what a woman should do, and just listen without judging their story or experience. This is exactly why they don't speak up. Because everything they say gets picked apart and turned back on them.

You also said "make sure they don't get away with it." Well tell that to the women who can't speak up out of fear, or have spoken up but have been judged and torn apart or lost their jobs or promotions or perhaps friends for doing so. There's a lot of reasons women (or people) don't speak up or don't get justice when they do. Just think about how you would even prove sexual harassment happened. Your attitude is belittling and dismissive.

My mother told me about two incidents when she was a young woman. One happened by a close enough relative and the other by the (now) husband of a close friend. She's only ever told few people these stories. Sometimes there are very tough reasons they might not ever speak up. Especially that generation. And who often tell those of the next generation to not bring trouble to their door and keep quiet. It still happens.

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

Sure if I see a maniac in a dark alley with an axe huffing and puffing in obvious rage, what's the point in ringing the police..."laugh out loud what's the offence?"

Cop on.

Are you feeling ok?
Point out where the offence is in my scenario please.
Nothing to do with people behaving suspiciously while carrying weapons.

Sarcozies

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Nobody on this thread is blaming men as a whole though.

Dunno about that though.

AdrianBalboa wrote: »

Men can do whatever they like and the women in the UK just have to lie back and think of England. :rolleyes:

iamstop wrote: »

I think men, and boys for that matter, should read first hand account of women this type of this has happened to and how it made them feel and how it makes them feel going forward.
I think many of the men doing this type of thing don't ever put themselves in the women's shoes (figuratively) and many don't realize the damage it causes.
I think if more men understood the ripple effect of their actions many would treat women with more respect.

bubblypop wrote: »

It would depend on the behaviour. You can check the legislation I posted above.
The everyday issues of men saying disgusting things in the street, commenting on women's body or face, grabbing their crotch, making humping movements while shouting at you, those are things women just have to put up with. Those are the things that need to be stopped.
If society believed those 'little' things to be wrong, perhaps it could stop 'bigger' things happening, if you know what I mean?

Faith wrote: »

And with this, you're starting to touch on what women experience.

We don't know if Man A is a great guy who is no threat to us, or a potential rapist/murderer/abuser/creep/whatever. We can take one of two positions: 1. Assume safety and work from there; 2. Assume risk and work from there.

Because so many women have experienced unwanted sexual advances, for many of us it becomes the default position to assume risk to begin and hope to be proven wrong. That way, we keep ourselves safer if there is risk.

You're saying you're unhappy that you might have to change your behaviour to avoid a damaging situation. We're saying that we learned at a very young age to change our behaviour to avoid damaging situations, and yet most of us still experience them.

Absolutely, we'd all prefer it if we didn't have to worry about our interactions with each other and how they're perceived. But rather than complain about what women find threatening or harassing, it would be most helpful if men could really listen and try to understand why we might find behaviours like staring, suggestive comments or jokes, or being complimented by strangers to be potentially threatening, and be prepared to adjust your own behaviour on the basis of that, and ideally call out others for behaving inappropriately in the future.

There's nothing wrong with reflecting on your own behaviour in light of new information and acknowledging it could change for the better, if that's applicable.

Stateofyou wrote: »

I have missed a bunch of posts in between the first 10 or so and the last handful of pages. Has there been a meaningful discussion yet on what men in particular can do to help?

1. Men should listen, believe her, and encourage her to report. But main thing is support her.

2. Stop shouting compliments or whistling at women in public.

3. Pull up your mates for being aggressive or sexist or degrading towards women. Step in and say something, tell him to knock it off.

4. Stay with/support women who you notice are being harassed.

5. If a woman is walking alone at night, maybe keep your distance by crossing to the other side and keeping your distance in general.

6. Keep your hands to yourself.

7. Back off and tell her to have a good night or day if she seems uninterested. Don't be an @rsehole because your ego got hurt.

8. Don't say stupid crap online either and don't send picks of your lad unless it was asked for.

9. Don't leer/stare at them. You know when a woman is looking and flirting back, and when she looks uncomfortable.

YellowLead wrote: »

I’m on the fence about the men should cross the street thing late at night.

I’ve often been walking home alone in the dark and freaked out by dodgy looking people - but equally have been very grateful to have a normal looking guy walking near me and making me feel safe from threat from the menacing ones.

Would you be as quick to dismiss generalising if the word men was replaced in the above post with "blacks" or "Muslims" or "Jews"?

Like "Blacks need to listen"

"Muslims can do what they like and the Christians in the UK need to just lie back and think of England"

"Black's, and black boys for that matter need to listen"

"I think blacks, and black boys for that matter, should read first hand account of whites this type of this has happened to and how it made them feel and how it makes them feel going forward.
I think many of the blacks doing this type of thing don't ever put themselves in the white persons shoes"

"We don't know if Muslim A is a great guy who is no threat to us, or a potential rapist/murderer/abuser/creep/whatever. We can take one of two positions: 1. Assume safety and work from there; 2. Assume risk and work from there."

"The everyday issues of muslims saying disgusting things in the street, commenting on a jews body or face, grabbing their crotch, making humping movements while shouting at you, those are things jews just have to put up with."

"I’m on the fence about the blacks should cross the street thing late at night."

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

Are you feeling ok?
Point out where the offence is in my scenario please.
Nothing to do with people behaving suspiciously while carrying weapons.

My apologies for assuming you could join the dots. Let me spell it out for you.

You say, basically, what's the point in reporting that specific harassment you dreamt up, stating that there is no point in calling the police because it isn't an offence. A technical offence.

Then I used my maniac analogy to show the absurdity of your statement. Namely, that hanging around a dark alley with an axe is not technically an offence either, but that is no reason not to inform the police, not would the police tell you on the phone "sorry, that's not an offence".

Get it?

Stateofyou

You know race and gender and religion are all different, right Sarcozies? You can't just insert and replace one word for the other in every scenario.

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

My apologies for assuming you could join the dots. Let me spell it out for you.

You say, basically, what's the point in reporting that specific harassment you dreamt up, stating that there is no point in calling the police because it isn't an offence. A technical offence.

Then I used my maniac analogy to show the absurdity of your statement. Namely, that hanging around a dark alley with an axe is not technically an offence either, but that is no reason not to inform the police, not would the police tell you on the phone "sorry, that's not an offence".

Get it?

Carrying an axe in a dark alley is an offence under section 9 of the Firearms and Offensive Weapons act 1990.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'technical offence' could you explain the difference between that and an actual real offence?

Stateofyou

Telewomo wrote: »

I suspect some people have never really grown up. Officially they are adults, but in reality they are still children. They still yearn for the world where mammy and daddy make sure that everything is OK and give them the approval they need.

What happens is they grow up and and try to replace mammy and daddy with some other authority, such as "society" or the law or whatever else their mind comes up with.

The concept of personal responsibility is alien to them, and quite terrifying that they would be responsible for their own well being. So when someone suggest they take measures to reduce the risk of assault that "triggers" them. It's like finding out mammy and daddy can't make sure that everything will be OK.

As they still think liken children, obsessed with approval, any suggestion that they didn't do the right thing to avoid a bad scenario is almost traumatising to them, they need mammy and daddy to tell them what a good little boy/girl that they are.

In the real world bad things can happen sometimes and there is nothing you can do to eliminate the risk. You could get in the car and obey the rules of the road, only to be killed due to someone else's wreckless behaviour. Welcome to life, 8f you haven't accepted these realities then you haven't really grown up yet, you have the body of an adult but the mindset of a child.

Is there an actual point somewhere?

Gradius

Stateofyou wrote: »

Women would be ringing the guards all day if they had to report all the shít they have to put up with. Are you for real. Guards would be called for assault or stalking or things of that nature.

Are you feeling a certain kind of way, like these anecdotes are being directed "at you" for some reason? How about just listen. If you're a man in this conversation, how about just stop the smart arse judgemental comments about what a woman should do, and just listen without judging their story or experience. This is exactly why they don't speak up. Because everything they say gets picked apart and turned back on them.

You also said "make sure they don't get away with it." Well tell that to the women who can't speak up out of fear, or have spoken up but have been judged and torn apart or lost their jobs or promotions or perhaps friends for doing so. There's a lot of reasons women (or people) don't speak up or don't get justice when they do. Just think about how you would even prove sexual harassment happened. Your attitude is belittling and dismissive.

My mother told me about two incidents when she was a young woman. One happened by a close enough relative and the other by the (now) husband of a close friend. She's only ever told few people these stories. Sometimes there are very tough reasons they might not ever speak up. Especially that generation. And who often tell those of the next generation to not bring trouble to their door and keep quiet. It still happens.

Yeah you're right, best not do anything then.

"Just listen". Yeah...now what? Now what's going to happen? Now what's going to change?

Stateofyou

Gradius wrote: »

Yeah you're right, best not do anything then.

"Just listen". Yeah...now what? Now what's going to happen? Now what's going to change?

Then you're one more person beginning to be a part of the solution, of change for the better. If you're listening and supporting, then you're not judging and blaming women (or people) for what happened to them. That's a great start. If more men/people did that, then others would feel more comfortable speaking up. If more people speak up and support and refuse to blame victims and instead hold perpetrators accountable, then culture shifts. Norms change. Children learn healthier behaviours earlier. Etc. It takes all of us to start thinking about and approaching this differently for real change. Be a part of the solution instead of the problem with old thinking.

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

Carrying an axe in a dark alley is an offence under section 9 of the Firearms and Offensive Weapons act 1990.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'technical offence' could you explain the difference between that and an actual real offence?

Carrying an axe is an offence...

How about a fork then. Or just standing there in the shadows. Or sitting in a car all live long night outside a row of houses. Or any number of things. Not technically illegal so there's no point calling the police.

Stupid, all day long.

Don't do anything out of fear for being technically incorrect, build up your stories and tell people about them years later. Ingenious.

Stateofyou

Telewomo wrote: »

Yes I'm explaining why some people react so hysterically at the suggestion they look out for their own well being.

Where's the hysterics? If you could be so kind to point it out.

Gradius

Stateofyou wrote: »

Then you're one more person beginning to be a part of the solution, of change for the better. If you're listening and supporting, then you're not judging and blaming women (or people) for what happened to them. That's a great start. If more men/people did that, then others would feel more comfortable speaking up. If more people speak up and support and refuse to blame victims and instead hold perpetrators accountable, then culture shifts. Norms change. Children learn healthier behaviours earlier. Etc. It takes all of us to start thinking about and approaching this differently for real change. Be a part of the solution instead of the problem with old thinking.

Seriously, me passively "listening" results in nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Telling stories does absolutely nothing.

the_pen_turner

bubblypop wrote: »

What would you suggest a woman should do in this scenario;
Woman walking down the street, few men standing outside pub, one man grabs his cock, makes sex moves at the woman, stands in font of her, says something disgusting about what she should suck and what else he would do with it.

What should she do?
Or maybe that's not genuinely wrong, to you?

there are only 3 people there, they are the only ones who can do anything

the victim cant do a lot,
the perperatator wont change
the onluckers, they are probably scumbags too so think its alright behaviour.


i will ask you what do you think everybody else. men and women should do about it. there is nothing i can do. there is nothing you could do either

Stateofyou

SoiLent1987 wrote: »

It's fun to rewrite ant-man rhetoric as Jew or Muslim bashing rants.

If you say so. I don't see the amusement. Ant Man was a great film though.

Stateofyou

This is a great talk by men on this issue.. Ye will get something out of it if you take the time to watch.

Justin Baldoni, Matt McGorry, Tony Porter, Lewis Howes, Scooter Braun

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i21xmCbd8iw&t=14s

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

Carrying an axe is an offence...

How about a fork then. Or just standing there in the shadows. Or sitting in a car all live long night outside a row of houses. Or any number of things. Not technically illegal so there's no point calling the police.

Stupid, all day long.

Don't do anything out of fear for being technically incorrect, build up your stories and tell people about them years later. Ingenious.

Yes, a fork could indeed be an offensive weapon.

I am telling you that there is no offence, so there is nothing a woman can do, nor is there anything a garda can do.
Do you understand that now?

Any update on the difference between a technical offence and an actual real offence?

U2erthy

I don't agree this will not happen out in the street it will happen in office or someone she knows. 10% will be from strangers also using 1000 as a sample you can't say nearly every woman has been sexual assaulted. Also sexual assault can be from some one touching you to rape there's a big difference

the_pen_turner

the_pen_turner wrote: »

there are only 3 people there, they are the only ones who can do anything

the victim cant do a lot,
the perperatator wont change
the onluckers, they are probably scumbags too so think its alright behaviour.


i will ask you what do you think everybody else. men and women should do about it. there is nothing i can do. there is nothing you could do either

I was pointing that very thing out to the poster who said women need to do something about it and just stop talking about it.

anewme

U2erthy wrote: »

Also sexual assault can be from some one touching you to rape there's a big difference

And they need to stop.

Every single one of them.

Quantum Erasure

bubblypop wrote: »

Which is the point of the thread.
Women are sexually harassed all the time.
Some posters seem to think that's not true

I'd love to know where the 97% stat came from though...

Necro

Sarcozies wrote: »

*warbling bad faith strawmanning nonsense*

Threadbanned

Quantum Erasure

biko wrote: »

The numbers in Guardian and the actual report (added in OP) differs. Guardian's numbers have added 10%.

Guardian
Among women aged 18-24, 97% said they had been sexually harassed, while 80% of women of all ages said they had experienced sexual harassment in public spaces.

The report
71% of women of all ages in the UK have experienced some form of sexual
harassment in a public space – this number rises to 86% among 18-24-year-olds.

I found where I think it came from, other stats available at same link

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/relationships/articles-reports/2021/03/08/eurotrack-two-thirds-women-sweden-and-half-britain


Which of the following would you consider to be sexual harassment if a man, who was not a romantic or sexual partner or friend, did them to a woman?
% who said "This would always be sexual harassment" or "This would usually be sexual harassment with some exceptions"

A man trying to take a photo up a woman's skirt

Britain: 97%

Stateofyou

Gradius wrote: »

Seriously, me passively "listening" results in nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Telling stories does absolutely nothing.

That is not true at all. There is healing and learning and change when people tell their stories. That's a really disappointing thing to say Gradius.

Quantum Erasure

Martina1991 wrote: »

From the OP
"Among women aged 18-24, 97% said they had been sexually harassed."

It is clearly widespread form the countless accounts of women openly telling people they have experienced the same.

And you're just blatantly ignoring it, dismissing it, belittling it.

You are disgusting.

Pdf link
https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/qepiqi9xaf/YouGov%20Sexual%20harassment.pdf

Would you say you have ever been sexually harassed by a man?
[This question only contains the answers of female respondents]
GB 18-19 Oct '20
Yes, I have: 52%
No, I have not: 44%

meeeeh

Gradius wrote: »

Seriously, me passively "listening" results in nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Telling stories does absolutely nothing.

I wasn't telling stories. Anyway I didn't think that telling you something would change anything. I think we are safe there.

However 'telling stories' does change things. #Metoo wasn't perfect but it did make certain behaviour a lot less acceptable and hopefully a lot less pervasive. Perpetrators ard bullies once the societal acceptance is taken away they will think twice what they want to loose before they plant their hand on someone's arse. It won't stop really horrible crimes but it could help with lesser offences.

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

Yes, a fork could indeed be an offensive weapon.

I am telling you that there is no offence, so there is nothing a woman can do, nor is there anything a garda can do.
Do you understand that now?

Any update on the difference between a technical offence and an actual real offence?

You stand 100% behind doing nothing then.

There's something particularly agitating about the type of person who complains about a problem then tells you all about how it's not worth doing anything about the problem. No personal agency whatsoever, then the cliched retort comes of "victim blaming'.

Tell your stories until the cows come home then.

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

You stand 100% behind doing nothing then.

There's something particularly agitating about the type of person who complains about a problem then tells you all about how it's not worth doing anything about the problem. No personal agency whatsoever, then the cliched retort comes of "victim blaming'.

Tell your stories until the cows come home then.

I'm telling you, there is nothing the gardai can do, because there is no offence.

I never said it's not worth doing anything.
Now, I didn't say that I wouldn't do anything, I'm quite capable of telling someone to fcuk off, but there's plenty of other women who would be extremely upset by that behaviour.
If it was your mother? Your daughter?

If me telling stories makes someone realise the kind of treatment that women have to put up with, then it's worth it.

Gradius

Stateofyou wrote: »

That is not true at all. There is healing and learning and change when people tell their stories. That's a really disappointing thing to say Gradius.

No. Talking endlessly in a one way "conversation" is useless and achieves nothing.

"Learning"...what am I learning if I hear the millionth variation on something?

"Change"....what's going to change from repetitively telling the wrong people about things that happened God knows when and they have zero control over?

Look at the other poster here, explaining how they can't report street harassment because it's not technically an offence. It's a joke.

Do something about your own life if it's worth doing. That's all I have to say, and it might be actually worth considering versus the result infinite hand-wringing and sermons have produced.

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

No. Talking endlessly in a one way "conversation" is useless and achieves nothing.

"Learning"...what am I learning if I hear the millionth variation on something?

"Change"....what's going to change from repetitively telling the wrong people about things that happened God knows when and they have zero control over?

Look at the other poster here, explaining how they can't report street harassment because it's not technically an offence. It's a joke.

Do something about your own life if it's worth doing. That's all I have to say, and it might be actually worth considering versus the result infinite hand-wringing and sermons have produced.

Women should just suck it up then?
Put up with the behaviour and keep their mouths shut?
It's not the 1950s anymore.

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

I'm telling you, there is nothing the gardai can do, because there is no offence.

I never said it's not worth doing anything.
Now, I didn't say that I wouldn't do anything, I'm quite capable of telling someone to fcuk off, but there's plenty of other women who would be extremely upset by that behaviour.
If it was your mother? Your daughter?

If me telling stories makes someone realise the kind of treatment that women have to put up with, then it's worth it.

In all honesty now, do you think there isn't a person alive in the western world that doesn't know these things by now?

If you were talking about telling stories to some nomad tribe in the Kalahari desert I'd buy into it. But not here.

Everyone has heard it, everyone is aware of it. And further to that point, it only proves how little impact it has on the type of people who genuinely harass others; none.

Gradius

bubblypop wrote: »

Women should just suck it up then?
Put up with the behaviour and keep their mouths shut?
It's not the 1950s anymore.

Good jayssssus Christ.

I said that a woman should report genuine harassment to the police.

You say it's not worth doing....

Then accuse me of thinking that it's not worth doing anything.

Are you taking the fooking piss? I'm done. Good luck.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Gradius wrote: »

You stand 100% behind doing nothing then.

There's something particularly agitating about the type of person who complains about a problem then tells you all about how it's not worth doing anything about the problem. No personal agency whatsoever, then the cliched retort comes of "victim blaming'.

Tell your stories until the cows come home then.

You spent part of yesterday afternoon complaining about the problem, telling us how it's not worth doing anything other than "training all women from the get-go in martial arts, mandatory to an expert level, mandatory education courses on how to "toughen up" mentally and be more aggressive?" and some how trying to convince that doesn't make it an issue for the victim...?