Single mortgage but partner living in the house

Emma2019

Hi All,

I searched through threads but couldn't find anything on this scenario, but apologies if it has been answered before.

I am buying a house and my partner (not married) will live in it. They will be paying rent but we are not intending on it giving them a stake in the house. Potentially when we are together a few more years we will remortgage and add them to the deeds/mortgage or buy a new house together.

Our plan is to
- Claim rent a room relief on the rent paid
- Sign a basic contract saying that we agree the money paid is rent and is not intended to give them any stake in the house

Is there anything else we can do? Neither of us are the type to make money an issue and even if the relationship did break down I would expect it to be amicable but we want to be prudent anyway.

seannash

I believe that after a certain amount of time any contract you have is basically worthless if the relationship was to dissolve amd she seeks "her share"
My understanding is she is entitled to the rent she paid back as it went off the mortgage.

I have the exact same scenario as you and the mortgage comes out of my account. Everything else is split with no amount of money sent to me as "rent"
Why wouldn't you do the above. I dont think you get any extra protection with your contract.

seannash

seannash wrote: »

I believe that after a certain amount of time any contract you have is basically worthless if the relationship was to dissolve amd she seeks "her share"
My understanding is she is entitled to the rent she paid back as it went off the mortgage.

I have the exact same scenario as you and the mortgage comes out of my account. Everything else is split with no amount of money sent to me as "rent"
Why wouldn't you do the above. I dont think you get any extra protection with your contract.

OP is named Emma, but you assume it's a man who will be buying!
Anyhoo! I believe if you live as a couple that the above is correct, after a certain amount of time your partner would have some rights, but it would depend on a lot of things.
How much they put into the house etc.

On the relationship side of things, I lived in a boyfriends house with him many years ago, paid him some rent. When we broke up, you wouldn't believe the people who told me to go after 'my share'
I didnt, it was very amiable and I wouldn't do that to him. If course, I suppose there's always the chance that I didn't buy with him and only paid rent maybe went towards the break up.......

seannash

bubblypop wrote: »

OP is named Emma, but you assume it's a man who will be buying!

You assmuend sexual preference of the OP similar to me. Could be two women. I never said man in my post.
At the end of the day who cares, if my incorrect assumption offends you I'm not really that bothered

silver2020

bubblypop wrote: »

OP is named Emma, .

Emma's partner may be a girl too and such arrangement was something a relation of mine had (with her female partner) and when the relationship did end there was a lot of arguing about "I contributed to mortgage, so I own x%".

That the house had gone up in value by 30% probably had a bearing.

So doesn't matter what form the couple are, it can become acrimonious and a water-tight fixed term agreement should be in place. I'd suggest 2 years and then revisit it.

If you are in a couple they will have a claim on the property after 5 years, or 1 year if a child is involved.

Gradius

seannash wrote: »

You assmuend sexual preference of the OP similar to me. Could be two women. I never said man in my post.
At the end of the day who cares, if my incorrect assumption offends you I'm not really that bothered

It could also be three goats that self-identify as a single human male that self-identifies as a woman that has a preference for polyamourous multi-goat relationships.

You never know, but it's always worth someone pointing out that you never know. You know?

seannash

Gradius wrote: »

It could also be three goats that self-identify as a single human male that self-identifies as a woman that has a preference for polyamourous multi-goat relationships.

You never know, but it's always worth someone pointing out that you never know. You know?

Or you could just assume no intention to offend was made and say nothing. Or not pull people up if the OP doesn't, they may not carenor be offended. I could have guessed right that it was two women.

Green Mile

I’m about to get into a similar situation as this, haven’t spoken to the banks yet though.
The plan is to buy as a single person even though my girlfriend will be living in the house too.
She has little from a disability income only.

I wonder if I inform the bank and try get a mortgage with her on the deeds, will the bank be more favourable to my application as there are two lives on the policy or would they see her as a dependent, which would hinder my application?

Del2005

Emma2019 wrote: »

Hi All,

I searched through threads but couldn't find anything on this scenario, but apologies if it has been answered before.

I am buying a house and my partner (not married) will live in it. They will be paying rent but we are not intending on it giving them a stake in the house. Potentially when we are together a few more years we will remortgage and add them to the deeds/mortgage or buy a new house together.

Our plan is to
- Claim rent a room relief on the rent paid
- Sign a basic contract saying that we agree the money paid is rent and is not intended to give them any stake in the house

Is there anything else we can do? Neither of us are the type to make money an issue and even if the relationship did break down I would expect it to be amicable but we want to be prudent anyway.

You can't sign away your rights so saying that they are only paying rent won't work. The only way to protect your property is for your partner to contribute zero to it and to split all the other bills evenly.

Once you live together for 5 years, 2 if you have children, they have all the rights of a spouse with none of the protection spouses have.

Everyone thinks that their relationship is special and you will still be friends if you break up, legions of highly paid divorce lawyers proof the opposite.

ongarite

Green Mile wrote: »

I’m about to get into a similar situation as this, haven’t spoken to the banks yet though.
The plan is to buy as a single person even though my girlfriend will be living in the house too.
She has little from a disability income only.

I wonder if I inform the bank and try get a mortgage with her on the deeds, will the bank be more favourable to my application as there are two lives on the policy or would they see her as a dependent, which would hinder my application?

Might be better off on your own if you can afford it.
Your joint mortgage life insurance policy would be greater with your partner on the mortgage deeds due to her disability IMO.

Gradius

seannash wrote: »

Or you could just assume no intention to offend was made and say nothing. Or not pull people up if the OP doesn't, they may not carenor be offended. I could have guessed right that it was two women.

If an offence was hidden beneath a grain of sand in the Gobi desert there are certain people that will go out of their way to find it.

To the OP, time is the issue. It can render all declarations and assurances asunder. It's not the most comfortable knowledge.

I still think it’s better to go it alone if just starting out in a relationship as if it breaks down in the first year or so then there will be no legal issues. Once it passes the 5 years though it’s a different matter then.

Emma2019

We are together a few years already, and live together but wouldn't be at buying together territory. From what I am seeing on the Citizens Advice website is it's not as clear cut as "once you live together for 5 years they get half". Also we wouldn't intend on it being that long a period either.

"If your relationship breaks down and your name is not on the title deeds to the house, you may still be able to show that you have some ownership rights in relation to the house. These rights are based on the fact that you made a contribution to the purchase price of the house with the intention of gaining a share in the ownership of the house.

...

As well as showing that you made a financial contribution to the purchase price of the house, you must also show that your contribution was made with the intention of gaining a share in the ownership of the house and that you were not making a gift of the money to the legal owner of the house."

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/problems_in_marriages_and_other_relationships/property_rights_and_the_breakdown_of_a_cohabiting_relationship.html

I would think that the contract would demonstrate that the intention was never to make a financial contribution to the purchase of the house

If I don't go down the rent a room route, I am technically avoiding CGT. I'd rather do everything above board.

seannash

seannash wrote: »

You assmuend sexual preference of the OP similar to me. Could be two women. I never said man in my post.
At the end of the day who cares, if my incorrect assumption offends you I'm not really that bothered

Jaysis, it was a joke, relax, I'm not offended. Touchy

Emma2019

Emma2019 wrote: »

We are together a few years already, and live together but wouldn't be at buying together territory. From what I am seeing on the Citizens Advice website is it's not as clear cut as "once you live together for 5 years they get half". Also we wouldn't intend on it being that long a period either.

"If your relationship breaks down and your name is not on the title deeds to the house, you may still be able to show that you have some ownership rights in relation to the house. These rights are based on the fact that you made a contribution to the purchase price of the house with the intention of gaining a share in the ownership of the house.

...

As well as showing that you made a financial contribution to the purchase price of the house, you must also show that your contribution was made with the intention of gaining a share in the ownership of the house and that you were not making a gift of the money to the legal owner of the house."

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/problems_in_marriages_and_other_relationships/property_rights_and_the_breakdown_of_a_cohabiting_relationship.html

I would think that the contract would demonstrate that the intention was never to make a financial contribution to the purchase of the house

If I don't go down the rent a room route, I am technically avoiding CGT. I'd rather do everything above board.

Do you mean that he would be selling again within 5 and a half years? Or just that you would hope to buy together within that time?
You already live together, you're together a few years already, you plan to buy together in a few years.
Why not wait, till you both are happy to buy together?
Or is that you want to buy now, and your partner doesnt?

grassylawn

I'm married and have a kid. I paid the deposit and all the mortgage so far. I wanted a single mortgage as this was always going to be the case. I found that this wasn't an option.

Afaik the situation is pretty much the same once you've lived together five years. First thing you should do is find out if a single mortgage is even an option for you.

Bio Mech

Writing a contract doesn’t change the facts though really. You admit they are paying you “rent” and if it’s a fixed payment every month it would be obvious that’s what it really is. Regardless of what you put in the contract. If it’s a “gift” then there could be tax implications on that.

If you are going to take the rent from the partner then you either have to keep that arrangement shorter than 5 years or else take the chance that it won’t get messy if it goes beyond that.

The contract won’t change anything.

Maybe spend a couple of hundred and go speak to a solicitor?

seannash

They dont get half but they can be reimbursed for "rent" they paid over the years as it contributed to the mortgage.
Contract doesn't mean anything after a while as many have said.

Del2005

seannash wrote: »

They dont get half but they can be reimbursed for "rent" they paid over the years as it contributed to the mortgage.
Contract doesn't mean anything after a while as many have said.

If they live together for 5 years at €500pm rent then the OP would be on the hook for €30k. Nut half the house but still a substantial sum of money to pay.

Emma2019

This question might have been better suited to the Legal forum as most of the responses seem to be in disagreement with what I have seen on various legal sites and from actually reading the Civil Partnership and Certain Rights and Obligations of Cohabitants Act 2010 - Particularly section 202.

In the interests of anyone reading the thread in future

- You can make a cohabitants agreement which deals with division of property on break up
- In this you can agree that neither will request an order to have property conferred
- You just need to both have had separate legal advice before signing.
- Usually some form of financial dependence would have to be demonstrated anyway, it's not a case that you just get the rent you paid back.


Thanks for the replies anyway, I think we're sorted as we are.

alwald

Out of curiosity, is rent paid the only contribution that can be taken into consideration in case of a separation? Can other contributions be considered?
If the mortgage owner is paying his/her mortgage and the cohabitant is paying for the food/bills can this be taken into consideration?

Emma2019

In the absence of the agreement they look at lots of different things. The list is here: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2010/act/24/section/173/enacted/en/html#sec173

One is "any contributions made by either of them in looking after the home" which could potentially include food and bills. I had read that case law shows that giving up your job to look after kids/the home is not sufficient grounds but I don't know the particulars of the case.

If you're already together for a few years and not ready to buy together - or are already thinking of how to protect your assets if you break up down the road, then maybe you're not in the right relationship.

Nozebleed

OP i hate to say it but...i will..your relationship is doomed.

you seem to be very protective of your own self interest..more concerned about you and your property/money than you are about your partner. no offence intended. i dont blame o be honest we've all seen how poorly men have been treated and continue to be treated when it comes to the family home etc.

grassylawn

Nozebleed wrote: »

OP i hate to say it but...i will..your relationship is doomed.

you seem to be very protective of your own self interest..more concerned about you and your property/money than you are about your partner. no offence intended. i dont blame o be honest we've all seen how poorly men have been treated and continue to be treated when it comes to the family home etc.

Her relationship isnt "doomed" because she doesn't want to give her boyfriend half of an asset that probably embodies the vast majority of her personal wealth. Hysterical nonsense to suggest otherwise and these posts serve no purpose other than to snipe at someone asking a straightforward question.

grassylawn

grassylawn wrote: »

Her relationship isnt "doomed" because she doesn't want to give her boyfriend half of an asset that probably embodies the vast majority of her personal wealth. Hysterical nonsense to suggest otherwise and these posts serve no purpose other than to snipe at someone asking a straightforward question.

But there is some issue, according to the OP, they are together a few years, they live together now, they plan to buy together within 5 years.
The OP hasn't explained why she needs to buy now and their partner rent from them.
Even financially, buying again within 5 years may not make sense.

grassylawn

bubblypop wrote: »

But there is some issue, according to the OP, they are together a few years, they live together now, they plan to buy together within 5 years.
The OP hasn't explained why she needs to buy now and their partner rent from them.
Even financially, buying again within 5 years may not make sense.

No idea, but I know it's none of my business. She asked a technical question. She didn't invite commentary on her personal life.

Nozebleed

grassylawn wrote: »

Her relationship isnt "doomed" because she doesn't want to give her boyfriend half of an asset that probably embodies the vast majority of her personal wealth. Hysterical nonsense to suggest otherwise and these posts serve no purpose other than to snipe at someone asking a straightforward question.

all im saying is..if the OP finds the idea of having to share an asset such as a house with her partner some time down the line, how does someone thinking along these lines consider sharing a child!! should they have children..and seperate. just break up now..

Mrs OBumble

Nozebleed wrote: »

all im saying is..if the OP finds the idea of having to share an asset such as a house with her partner some time down the line, how does someone thinking along these lines consider sharing a child!! should they have children..and seperate. just break up now..

You have no idea of her age or childbearing status.

If I buy a house, it will be on the same basis the OP is considering, because my partner has very limited earning capacity: if he wasn't living with me he would be getting a nice chunk off welfare every week.

Wanting my assets to go to my neices and nephews when I die isn't selfish, it's realistic: my partner would simply drink them.