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Is boss unreasonable?

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    #242
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Nah, you are getting to emotional about this, you’d be kicked to the curb for the last bit.

    All that was needed was for her to say, fine, I’ll phone you next time I have to leave. Simples.

    No I wouldn't be I have been in similar situations where I intervened on other employee behalf and the managers both backed down.

    All the owner manager had to do was not open his mouth. In general in small companies there is no policy. In general they make it up on the hoof. In this case I say he was annoyed she hung up on told him she would not deal with him when she was following an ambulance.

    Like I said if he said that to me I say fine next time I just ring you and you can sort the priorities. It amazing when you let any manager know what the repucussions are they way they see the light.

    One of the funniest that I saw happen was one day a manager was trying to reprioritize work. In ths case the individual was assigned work by two managers. The one trying to reprioritize this lads schedule was not his direct line manager. He requested him to him twice to send through his LM. There was about 8-10 of us in hearing range when for the third this manager tried to reschedule his work load and finally he said in a loud clear voice

    '' what part of f@@k off do you not understand''

    we fell around the place laughing when he went out with his tail between his legs

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #243
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    .... more important it is to exactly follow the protocol that is established for these scenarios.

    ...and another tick box...
    micromanagers accept inefficiencies as less important than their retention of control or of the
    appearance of control.


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    #244
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    From the opening post it does appear that you and your boss don’t have a great relationship before any of this happened, and this latest incident is more like the straw that broke the camels back - you’re both tired of each other’s shìt. In a small company it can be a toxic and claustrophobic environment, especially when you and your boss appear to be on different pages as to what your responsibilities are towards each other and towards the business.

    What’s done is done so there’s no point in suggesting what you should have done, never mind the fact that you were in the wrong and you’re now peeved over being pulled up on it, having assumed you’d earned certain privileges like a degree of trust between yourself and your boss.

    Your boss had every right to be ticked off when they called and you gave them short shrift, how were they to know what you were at? They made what anyone should really consider a reasonable request if they’re going to leave in an emergency situation. It’s the first thing I do as I consider it’s just basic manners, and it’s never been an issue with anyone I’ve worked for or anyone who has worked for me or with me. I’d understand if someone wasn’t clear-headed at the time that they gave me short shrift, but if when talking to them upon their return they got all defensive as if I was in the wrong, it could cause me to think they’re not taking it seriously.

    I’ve been in situations too where I’ve had my ear bent by the boss and sure, it’s not pretty, but I know I could have handled it better so I’m not one for thinking I was in still in the right when I wasn’t. It’s not even a question of flexibility, but taking responsibility for your actions is all and knowing when you’re in the wrong, take it on the chin and move on rather than storing it up and letting it fester.

    Rubbish

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #245
    kathleen37
    Registered Users Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    I too thought the OP was a fella. I obvs have no idea if they are male or female, it was just a presumption *shrug*

    Having managed staff for many years, I would never, never mention anything related to work at a wake. Completely unprofessional and inappropriate. It's a wake. For someone's Dad.

    Also, if I had a member of staff leaves the office due to a family emergency of this nature, I would appreciate that they took the time to hand off work to others and asked others to contact me. It's a medical emergency. Normal rules do not apply. There is a difference between a leaking washing machine, for example, and having to follow a flashing light ambulance. Had it been the former, then a word would have indeed been appropriate. The later, no.


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    #246
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    KeepItLight wrote: »
    What are you even talking about? What difference does it make - the OP's situation was a family emergency and they were chasing an ambulance.

    I'm talking about you constantly making comments like "they were following their dying father's ambulance" when that wasn't what happened, and now you're making snarky comments about asking for permission to attend funerals.

    Again, go back and read the original post. They weren't "chasing an ambulance" until a full two hours later - it takes one minute to send a text.

    Some drama queens on this thread.


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    #247
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,571 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    No I wouldn't be I have been in similar situations where I intervened on other employee behalf and the managers both backed down.

    All the owner manager had to do was not open his mouth. In general in small companies there is no policy. In general they make it up on the hoof. In this case I say he was annoyed she hung up on told him she would not deal with him when she was following an ambulance.

    Like I said if he said that to me I say fine next time I just ring you and you can sort the priorities. It amazing when you let any manager know what the repucussions are they way they see the light.

    One of the funniest that I saw happen was one day a manager was trying to reprioritize work. In ths case the individual was assigned work by two managers. The one trying to reprioritize this lads schedule was not his direct line manager. He requested him to him twice to send through his LM. There was about 8-10 of us in hearing range when for the third this manager tried to reschedule his work load and finally he said in a loud clear voice

    '' what part of f@@k off do you not understand''

    we fell around the place laughing when he went out with his tail between his legs

    The lads all sniggered at the hero saying that to the manager, what brave little heroes you are. Of course in most workplaces you ass would be the first part of your body to hit the pavement.

    Tell me, when you were falling around laughing after embarrassing a guy doing his job, did you feel big?


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    #248
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kathleen37 wrote: »
    I would appreciate that they took the time to hand off work to others and asked others to contact me.

    OP never made it clear if they asked anyone to contact the manager on their behalf.

    Just that they handed off the job, and told the other member of staff who was there that they were leaving.


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    #249
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    There is no right or wrong. There's only the boss way or the high way. That's just life. I wouldn't be losing sleep over it. If you don't like how your being treated leave. It's the same if you don't like micro managing. You either put up with it, or go elsewhere. Or find ways to deal with.

    If course to deal with it you have to recognise what is is and how to counter it.


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    #250
    KeepItLight
    Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭KeepItLight


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I'm talking about you constantly making comments like "they were following their dying father's ambulance" when that wasn't what happened, and now you're making snarky comments about asking for permission to attend funerals.

    Again, go back and read the original post. They weren't "chasing an ambulance" until a full two hours later - it takes one minute to send a text.

    Some drama queens on this thread.

    Its clear you haven't a notion of the point I was trying to make, or you're being wilfully ignorant and looking for 'gotchas' on details that are irrelevant to the point that was being made. In either case, I'm done with this thread, so good luck - it seems that there are two camps here and neither is going to change their mind.

    P.S. If certain posters like yourself don't like snark, perhaps they should learn to take it if they are going to around calling people snowflakes and drama queens ;)


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    #251
    kathleen37
    Registered Users Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    Deleted User wrote: »
    OP never made it clear if they asked anyone to contact the manager on their behalf.

    Just that they handed off the job, and told the other member of staff who was there that they were leaving.
    Sorry, I thought I'd read that.

    I guess I would have just expected a little initiative and compassion from colleagues to pass on what had happened.

    I see this thread seems to be getting a bit snippy, which I have no interest in. I am genuinely interested though in if anyone does think it appropriate to mention work at a wake? I'd be less concerned about the snarky comment concerning following procedures, just illustration of a dcik, in my opinion. Process needs to be followed, but there can be exceptions.


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    #252
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    In general in small companies there is no policy. In general they make it up on the hoof.
    indie warrior wrote: »
    Am I over reacting or are they right to say that I was in the wrong as I didn't follow company procedure and contact them directly ?? I am really peeved off and seriously contemplating staying here. Interested to hear other people's views or if I should just put up and shut up

    It appears this company did have a policy, and the OP didn't follow it.

    Allowances can be made for being panicked.

    But then getting peeved off and resentful and defensive because the manager then reminded them of the policy a few days later - and from what was posted, reminded them nicely - is a total overreaction, IMHO.

    Now, question answered, as far as I'm concerned.


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    #253
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kathleen37 wrote: »
    I am genuinely interested though in if anyone does think it appropriate to mention work at a wake?

    Mentioning returning to work at the wake was inappropriate, I posted as much earlier in the thread myself.


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    #254
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Dav010 wrote: »
    The lads all sniggered at the hero saying that to the manager, what brave little heroes you are. Of course in most workplaces you ass would be the first part of your body to hit the pavement.

    Tell me, when you were falling around laughing, did you feel big?

    He was not a brave little hero. Rather twice he asked him to follow procedure. The main reason was that his LM had given him priority work and prioritized his workload. This manager was only interested in getting his own work completed. He was asked twice to put the work through the process.

    What was the funny part was he was that he was a really quite timid guy. In lot of workplaces it a lot easier to replace managers than specialist's in a lot of situations. Manager's with arts degrees are easy enough to find.

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #255
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    KeepItLight wrote: »
    Its clear you haven't a notion of the point I was trying to make, or you're being wilfully ignorant and looking for 'gotchas' on details that are irrelevant to the point that was being made. In either case, I'm done with this thread, so good luck - it seems that there are two camps here and neither is going to change their mind.

    And its clear you didn't bother to read the opening post properly.

    Good luck to you too. :)


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    #256
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,571 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    He was not a brave little hero. Rather twice he asked him to follow procedure. The main reason was that his LM had given him priority work and prioritized his workload. This manager was only interested in getting his own work completed. He was asked twice to put the work through the process.

    What was the funny part was he was that he was a really quite timid guy. In lot of workplaces it a lot easier to replace managers than specialist's in a lot of situations. Manager's with arts degrees are easy enough to find.

    So if a process or policy isn’t followed, you laugh while a coworker is abused. That’s an interesting paradox considering the topic of this thread, wouldn’t you think?


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    #257
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 23,893 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    Rubbish


    Never mind the OP for a minute, what’s your problem?


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    #258
    JoChervil
    Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    Dav010 wrote: »
    You don’t know why people are making assumption on gender, then you make an assumption on gender.

    No, I wondered what made people think that OP was a woman. I know what made me think that OP was a man and wanted to know this other point of view.


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    #259
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Dav010 wrote: »
    So if a process or policy isn’t followed, you laugh while a coworker is abused. That’s an interesting paradox considering the topic of this thread, wouldn’t you think?

    No I laughed because a really quite timid guy stood up for himself. Twice he asked this manager to send the work through the channel.

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #260
    kathleen37
    Registered Users Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    JoChervil wrote: »
    No, I wondered what made people think that OP was a woman. I know what made me think that OP was a man and wanted to know this other point of view.

    I'm curious too. The reason I presumed a man was based off the OP's name, but having read a few of their other posts, I'm actually guessing they may be a woman? Could of course still be wrong though!


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    #261
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,571 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    No I laughed because a really quite timid guy stood up for himself. Twice he asked this manager to send the work through the channel.

    The op’s boss only asked once, in a nice conversation the week after the event, but you wanted to call him a dickhead. Can you see the pattern, big man?

    Bass Reeves wrote: »

    He is being a dick and if I was working in that office I have no problem after hearing it walking into the office and telling him.

    Verbally abusing a coworker, and laughing at it is never the right way of standing up for yourself when asked to do a task at work, but it’s a clever way of getting fired.


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    #262
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Never mind the OP for a minute, what’s your problem?

    Any manager or owner manager that first of all says come into the office on Thursday at a wake or removal and then pulls them up about '' policy and procedures'' after an serious emergency where they had to leave work lacks a lot of common sense especially after she prioritized work and told a senior colleague she had to leave lacks serious management skills

    As a experiences manager posted here in such situation's the rulebook go out the window

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #263
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Dav010 wrote: »
    The op’s boss only asked once, in a nice conversation the week after the event, but you wanted to call him a dickhead. Can you see the pattern, big man?


    Because he is one I see you are a real expert at attempting belittlement when someone calls it straight

    It ok to call posters snowflakes but not call a manager acting the dick a dickhead.

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #264
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 23,893 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    Any manager or owner manager that first of all says come into the office on Thursday at a wake or removal and then pulls them up about '' policy and procedures'' after an serious emergency where they had to leave work lacks a lot of common sense especially after she prioritized work and told a senior colleague she had to leave lacks serious management skills

    As a experiences manager posted here in such situation's the rulebook go out the window


    Well that’s at least a more constructive response than your earlier effort. It’s bullshìt, but at least it’s a better effort than your first response.


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    #265
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    10 years is a lot of time to give to a small company, I think we can agree the ten years means they are a good worker or are valuable.

    That's' shocking bad form and quite frankly smacks of aspiration to be the next Michael O Leary..the fact that they were required so badly and it was mentioned at said funeral, means the boss values and cannot be without the OP or it means the boss is a disrespectful ****! either way it says more about him than the OP.

    10 years has bought this person lots of good will and respect, it should be extended and believe me the boss will do better for it in the end.


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    #266
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,571 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    Because he is one I see you are a real expert at attempting belittlement when someone calls it straight

    It ok to call posters snowflakes but not call a manager acting the dick a dickhead.

    One is a discussion forum, the other is a workplace. There of course is a difference.


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    #267
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Well that’s at least a more constructive response than your earlier effort. It’s bullshìt, but at least it’s a better effort than your first response.

    So I was right first time to call you little ramble ''rubbish''

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #268
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users Posts: 18,632 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Dav010 wrote: »
    One is a discussion forum, the other is a workplace. There of course is a difference.

    So you'd have no problem me calling you a dickhead on boards ( not that I am)but not in the workplace. Anyway I was calling this owner manager a dickhead on a discussion forum

    Slava Ukrainii



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    #269
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,571 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    So you have no problem me calling you a dickhead on boards but not in the workplace.

    None whatsoever, I suspect most employers would fire you if you called the owner a dickhead though. Know your audience Bass.


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    #270
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 23,893 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    rusty cole wrote: »
    10 years is a lot of time to give to a small company, I think we can agree the ten years means they are a good worker or are valuable.

    That's' shocking bad form and quite frankly smacks of aspiration to be the next Michael O Leary..the fact that they were required so badly and it was mentioned at said funeral, means the boss values and cannot be without the OP or it means the boss is a disrespectful ****! either way it says more about him than the OP.

    10 years has bought this person lots of good will and respect, it should be extended and believe me the boss will do better for it in the end.


    Generally speaking that’s true, and I’m assuming in the OP’s case it’s true too, especially in a small company of what was it, ten or twelve people working there I think? Surely then the OP’s boss will have earned that same lots of good will and respect from the OP, and thought they weren’t being unreasonable? I’ve worked for bosses like the OP describes and they just have a very direct way about them - their personality influences their management style, direct! Sometimes people are over-sensitive and can find that kind of management style grating, but fine to work in the business if they aren’t dealing with it every day and can avoid it if at all possible.


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    #271
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Generally speaking that’s true, and I’m assuming in the OP’s case it’s true too, especially in a small company of what was it, ten or twelve people working there I think? Surely then the OP’s boss will have earned that same lots of good will and respect from the OP, and thought they weren’t being unreasonable? I’ve worked for bosses like the OP describes and they just have a very direct way about them - their personality influences their management style, direct! Sometimes people are over-sensitive and can find that kind of management style grating, but fine to work in the business if they aren’t dealing with it every day and can avoid it if at all possible.

    Yes I agree in terms of some boss's being very direct and if confronted or pulled aside in correct settings, can be surprisingly taken aback by OP's feelings. However I think any fool and his dog knows, "time and place".a Myers Briggs test wouldn't go astray on the boss to be honest.. all that aside, yes OP may be a little fragile but on the face of it, all things being equal and taking the OP at face value..it's bad form and anyone that says different is getting emotionally involved as a business tycoon!!!:D


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