United Ireland Poll - please vote

BonnieSituation

tom1ie wrote: »

Lol! Who rattled your cage!
How do you know I have a “vast wage packet” which really is none of your concern.
Maybe I’ll get some sort of answer from you (I doubt it tbh),but how will we pay for UI if people don’t want a tax increase which they don’t.
Would you be in favour of service cuts to cover the cost?

Only one cage here that's rattled and it ain't mine.

We will pay for a UI the same way we pay for everything.

drdidlittle

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Only one cage here that's rattled and it ain't mine.

We will pay for a UI the same way we pay for everything.

Which is through tax....

BonnieSituation

drdidlittle wrote: »

Which is through tax....

Did anyone say otherwise?

tom1ie

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Only one cage here that's rattled and it ain't mine.

We will pay for a UI the same way we pay for everything.

Nope.
We’ll pay more taxation for a UI or there will be service cuts to pay for it.
Show how it will be afforded otherwise.

drdidlittle

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Did anyone say otherwise?

No but 67 billion into a pot of 57 billion just doesn't work unless your using a SF calculator.

FrancieBrady

drdidlittle wrote: »

No but 67 billion into a pot of 57 billion just doesn't work unless your using a SF calculator.

When I bought my house the maths was similar...now though I have a secure place to live and a big asset for my children. That's how 'investment' works. I went into it too fully realising it might not work out.

BonnieSituation

drdidlittle wrote: »

No but 67 billion into a pot of 57 billion just doesn't work unless your using a SF calculator.

Cool. Cool cool.

drdidlittle

FrancieBrady wrote: »

When I bought my house the maths was similar...now though I have a secure place to live and a big asset for my children. That's how 'investment' works. I went into it too fully realising it might not work out.

We'd better get saving for the deposit so. Ensure we have 2 years good credit and have our life insurance in place. Might have a bit of an issue with the estate agents valuation on the property for the loan though. Structural issues, neighbourhood prone to disturbance and current property owner not too bothered about up keep.
Nice estate near by though. :-)

tom1ie

drdidlittle wrote: »

We'd better get saving for the deposit so. Ensure we have 2 years good credit and have our life insurance in place. Might have a bit of an issue with the estate agents valuation on the property for the loan though. Structural issues, neighbourhood prone to disturbance and current property owner not too bothered about up keep.
Nice estate near by though. :-)

Lol!

FrancieBrady

drdidlittle wrote: »

We'd better get saving for the deposit so. Ensure we have 2 years good credit and have our life insurance in place. Might have a bit of an issue with the estate agents valuation on the property for the loan though. Structural issues, neighbourhood prone to disturbance and current property owner not too bothered about up keep.
Nice estate near by though. :-)

You guys really struggle with a comeback when it is presented as an investment.

drdidlittle

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You guys really struggle with a comeback when it is presented as an investment.

How much will the tax increase. Still waiting for answer on that

tom1ie

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You guys really struggle with a comeback when it is presented as an investment.

You talk about houses and investments?
You do know the risk of negative equity right?

tom1ie

drdidlittle wrote: »

How much will the tax increase. Still waiting for answer on that

Does not compute.

FrancieBrady

tom1ie wrote: »

You talk about houses and investments?
You do know the risk of negative equity right?

See my post on it. Read it all.

FrancieBrady

drdidlittle wrote: »

How much will the tax increase. Still waiting for answer on that

You won't get an answer n that. Because nobody knows the answer yet. I also answered this already. Stop asking me please.

BonnieSituation

drdidlittle wrote: »

How much will the tax increase. Still waiting for answer on that

Again, what tax increase will be required to pay for Metrolink?

jimmycrackcorm

ittakestwo wrote: »

No. In the post years of the crash the ROI was running defcits of 10%+ of GDP. Ireland (ROI +NI) in 2019 ran a defcit of 3%. By no means this would be the same situation. It is scaremongering. Also overall debt as percentage of GDP will be initially lower in a UI compared to the ROI as NI will presumably will be handed over with little or no debt of the UK.

The deficit in 2019 is meaningless because you are implying that it's the standard to judge by. But if you look at deficits over the last 20 years, it doesn't look as pretty.

And that's before you examine how much of a subsidy NI was being given.



There's no doubt about it - NI would become a millstone around our necks - and for what - a fuzzy feeling of unification that a very angry portion of NI don't share.

Seathrun66

tom1ie wrote: »

That extra tax could be spent on more needy projects.
Serious question and don’t take this the wrong way but do you pay income tax?

Yes. Hence my clear and unambiguous response three times that I'm willing to pay more.

tom1ie

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Again, what tax increase will be required to pay for Metrolink?

Lol!
NI is not metrolink and doesn’t require 10 billion a year to run.
Next.

tom1ie

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Yes. Hence my clear and unambiguous response three times that I'm willing to pay more.

Well fair play.
It’s great you have no issue paying more tax. Your in a minority.

drdidlittle

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Again, what tax increase will be required to pay for Metrolink?

Budgets.... We all understand budgeting and how it works?
I want to bulid a metro to Ballydehob. I get finance in place. If I can not get finance I get loan as Francie did for his house. Governments intake to cover these loans is...... Anyone... Give it a guess.... OK Tax.
You say what tax increase covers it. I say what lack of tax reduction doesn't cover it. It swings both ways.
Instead of top rate coming down it stay as is. Growth kicks in and more tax is generated. Tax rise by default. So that is how your metro is funded.
Now add an ongoing 10 billion over say 15 years to reform a UI .... Too much to be covered by normal inflation so yes again same old chestnut tax increase.

So, we're in agreement with garnishing social welfare payments to create our utopian United Ireland?

ittakestwo

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

The deficit in 2019 is meaningless because you are implying that it's the standard to judge by. But if you look at deficits over the last 20 years, it doesn't look as pretty.

And that's before you examine how much of a subsidy NI was being given.



There's no doubt about it - NI would become a millstone around our necks - and for what - a fuzzy feeling of unification that a very angry portion of NI don't share.

Why is 2019 meaningless? What is the piont at looking at the defcit of Ireland 20 years ago? That is meaningless. It is the most accurate year to judge as 2020 and 2021 are going to be thrown by the pandemic. The most recent year the all Ireland economy ran a 3% defcit. If NI was handed over with no UK debt which is probable then total debt of Ireland to GDP would be less than 60%. Both a 3% deficit and total debt of less than 60% are with in the EU rules. NI is not unaffordable.

Seathrun66

blanch152 wrote: »

It is a discussion point without any answer.

Bland slogans like seize the opportunity, or view it as an investment are nothing more than lies told to hide the reality that NI would be a drag on a UI for at least half a century. The evidence of a unified Germany is sufficient to tell you that.

I'm still awaiting your explanation on German economic failure.

German reunification was in 1990. Thirty-one years ago. East Germany was decades behind the West in economic development. NI is much closer to the ROI.

Taxes diverted from the church to the German unification process have since stopped. A short-term measure.

And are you also telling us that the economic powerhouse of Europe has not been a success? This I have to hear.

Seathrun66

tom1ie wrote: »

Well fair play.
It’s great you have no issue paying more tax. Your in a minority.

No I'm not. Consistent polling shows a great majority in the Republic want a united Ireland. This may incure extra taxation. It may not. People still want it anyway.

Stop making claims with no factual back up.

Seathrun66

Seathrun66 wrote: »

No I'm not. Consistent polling shows a great majority in the Republic want a united Ireland. This may incure extra taxation. It may not. People still want it anyway.

Stop making claims with no factual back up.

Do those polls explicitly mention taxation?

Seathrun66

Deleted User wrote: »

Do those polls explicitly mention taxation?

Why would they? And why would they mention the political system in the new state or any federalisation?

That's all for the Border Poll discussion and the governance that follows. People vote in referenda based on an awareness of the possible outcomes. They will again in this imminent border poll. They're a savvy electorate.

Seathrun66

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Why would they? And why would they mention the political system in the new state or any federalisation?

That's all for the Border Poll discussion and the governance that follows. People vote in referenda based on an awareness of the possible outcomes. They will again in this imminent border poll. They're a savvy electorate.

So without the pertinent information that renders your precious opinion polls invalid.

There's a big difference between "do you want a United Ireland?" versus "Do you want one with a range of taxes on your income?".

I'd stop bringing them up, if you want to be honest with people.

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

So without the pertinent information that renders your precious opinion polls invalid.

There's a big difference between "do you want a United Ireland?" versus "Do you want one with a range of taxes on your income?".

I'd stop bringing them up, if you want to be honest with people.

And a difference in 'Would you be prepared to invest in a new Ireland'.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And a difference in 'Would you be prepared to invest in a new Ireland'.

... out of your pocket.

No thanks. I'm not sure I'd take it for free, tbh.