Covid 19 Part XXXIV-249,437 ROI(4,906 deaths) 120,195 NI (2,145 deaths)(01/05)Read OP

h2005

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Germany and France have apparently suspended the AZ vaccine for under 60s.

Does that mean it’s suspended entirely? I thought AZ was only to be used on under 65s?

Deeper Blue

People have lost their minds if they seriously believe social distancing will be a long term thing.

Deeper Blue

Deeper Blue wrote: »

People have lost their minds if they seriously believe social distancing will be a long term thing.

Dr Mary Ramsay of PHE thinks it could: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56475807

"Dr Ramsay said restrictions such as face coverings in crowded places and social distancing had become accepted by many and still allowed the economy to function.

She said "people have got used to those lower-level restrictions now, and people can live with them, and the economy can still go on with those less severe restrictions in place".

"So I think certainly for a few years, at least until other parts of the world are as well vaccinated as we are, and the numbers have come down everywhere, that is when we may be able to go very gradually back to a more normal situation," she added."

stephenjmcd

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Germany and France have apparently suspended the AZ vaccine for under 60s.

The French only brought it back after EMA approval for over 55s. Its been in use since & continues to be in use

Leftwaffe

I think you’ll see some elderly people with masks on yet for quite a while, also those ineligible for the vaccines, etc. Masks will be with us on a minor, minor scale for a few years yet I’d imagine. Tbf ive never been as well since this all began, touch wood. I put some of that down to masks.

Sanitising hands will be here to stay for the long haul I’d imagine, which is only a good thing.

Social distancing will be binned fairly sharpish I think. Once the critical mass is vaccinated people will go back to normal pretty rapidly in that sense. Again, this it depends on your age and vulnerability leve to the virus.

Klonker

What happens if by end April we have less than 200 cases a say, 150 in hospital and 40 in ICU from covid? Is there any scope for bringing the reopening forward do people think?

I think the lifting of restrictions in April are overly cautious but I'd have taken it if offered beforehand such was my expectations.

Its May onwards that is most frustrating to me. It sounds like restaurants won't open until July or intercounty travel. Every adult who wants a vaccine will probably have one by then? Why wait so long? The rest of Europe will have nightclubs opened and holidaying around Europe by then and we'll be grateful if they let us get a haircut!

Hopefully if numbers decrease heavily like I expect them too they might speed it up slightly.

jobeenfitz

I know there's travel restrictions within Ireland. Does anyone know if people are allowed to travel from Ireland to Spain? Was on government site and it says a negative pcr test within 72 hours is required.

Ficheall

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't get why they're not voluntary. Compliance is almost 100% anyway and if they were made voluntary it wouldn't drop dramatically.

Like speed limits on roads?

Klonker

Deeper Blue wrote: »

People have lost their minds if they seriously believe social distancing will be a long term thing.

What's social distancing actually mean? If it means leaving 1-2 metres between people or:rolleyes: avoiding groups then that would be no concerts, no nightclubs, no pubs, no cinemas, no parties and no weddings as we know them and the death of thousands of businesses. No chance of that happening.

Deeper Blue

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Dr Mary Ramsay of PHE thinks it could: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-56475807

"Dr Ramsay said restrictions such as face coverings in crowded places and social distancing had become accepted by many and still allowed the economy to function.

She said "people have got used to those lower-level restrictions now, and people can live with them, and the economy can still go on with those less severe restrictions in place".

"So I think certainly for a few years, at least until other parts of the world are as well vaccinated as we are, and the numbers have come down everywhere, that is when we may be able to go very gradually back to a more normal situation," she added."

She said nothing about it being long term or indefinite

Deeper Blue

Deeper Blue wrote: »

She said nothing about it being long term or indefinite

Isn't years long term? And even after a few years it's only may revert to a more normal situation. Not normal, but a more normal situation.

MrMusician18

Klonker wrote: »

What happens if by end April we have less than 200 cases a say, 150 in hospital and 40 in ICU from covid? Is there any scope for bringing the reopening forward do people think?

I think the lifting of restrictions in April are overly cautious but I'd have taken it if offered beforehand such was my expectations.

Its May onwards that is most frustrating to me. It sounds like restaurants won't open until July or intercounty travel. Every adult who wants a vaccine will probably have one by then? Why wait so long? The rest of Europe will have nightclubs opened and holidaying around Europe by then and we'll be grateful if they let us get a haircut!

Hopefully if numbers decrease heavily like I expect them too they might speed it up slightly.

I'd be more optimistic than that, if hospital and death numbers continue to fall, with static or rising case numbers we will still see further easing. The whole point of the restrictions is to prevent the health service from becoming overwhelmed, so if these key metrics decouple because of vaccination (and they will at some point), case numbers become less relevant. Lots of reasons to be hopeful.

Ficheall

Deleted User wrote: »

12 weeks left and normality returns.

Deleted User wrote: »

But the idea that we immediately return to a pre-pandemic situation, as if the pandemic never existed and has no opportunity to re-emerge in some nasty form, is both delusional and almost ideologically driven to the point of naivety.

Deleted User wrote: »

Stop playing games.

No pandemic ends at a defined date. Stop it. Now.

Are there, by any chance, two or more people using your account?

Deeper Blue

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Isn't years long term? And even after a few years it's only may revert to a more normal situation. Not normal, but a more normal situation.

I'm assuming you think things will go on long term so I don't think there's any point continuing this conversation as it won't go anywhere.

MrMusician18

Klonker wrote: »

What's social distancing actually mean? If it means leaving 1-2 metres between people or:rolleyes: avoiding groups then that would be no concerts, no nightclubs, no pubs, no cinemas, no parties and no weddings as we know them and the death of thousands of businesses. No chance of that happening.

To be honest, pre-pandemic, niteclubs were moving into God's waiting room so they may not come back all that strong. Dublin even had a nite-czar of all things to try to revive it.

Social distancing will stay permanently for a small number of people. They will make personal choices (and maybe not all the time either) to keep distance. Thinking about myself, while never being a fan of large crowds, I'll likely continue to keep distance in places like supermarkets.

Deeper Blue

Deeper Blue wrote: »

I'm assuming you think things will go on long term so I don't think there's any point continuing this conversation as it won't go anywhere.

I don't think it will or want it to. Australia and New Zealand have scrapped all restrictions (but they have reinstated them briefly with snap lockdowns) so other countries should follow suit.

PTH2009

MrMusician18 wrote: »

I'd be more optimistic than that, if hospital and death numbers continue to fall, with static or rising case numbers we will still see further easing. The whole point of the restrictions is to prevent the health service from becoming overwhelmed, so if these key metrics decouple because of vaccination (and they will at some point), case numbers become less relevant. Lots of reasons to be hopeful.

Klonker wrote: »

What happens if by end April we have less than 200 cases a say, 150 in hospital and 40 in ICU from covid? Is there any scope for bringing the reopening forward do people think?

I think the lifting of restrictions in April are overly cautious but I'd have taken it if offered beforehand such was my expectations.

Its May onwards that is most frustrating to me. It sounds like restaurants won't open until July or intercounty travel. Every adult who wants a vaccine will probably have one by then? Why wait so long? The rest of Europe will have nightclubs opened and holidaying around Europe by then and we'll be grateful if they let us get a haircut!

Hopefully if numbers decrease heavily like I expect them too they might speed it up slightly.

Wish i could feel as positive as you 2

With the constant shifting of goalposts by NPHET and the never ending Variants talk it's hard to see any accelerated lifting of restrictions. This whole 'you act to fast we will be in danger of another wave' thing is putting stop to that

Vaccine in both supply & effectiveness needs to stay onside for us, the last thing we need is a hiccup which will set us back.

I think we need a plan like the UK has with metrics and different scenarios and not this 'wait and see' approach

MrMusician18

PTH2009 wrote: »

Wish i could feel as positive as you 2

With the constant shifting of goalposts by NPHET and the never ending Variants talk it's hard to see any accelerated lifting of restrictions. This whole 'you act to fast we will be in danger of another wave' thing is putting stop to that

Vaccine in both supply & effectiveness needs to stay onside for us, the last thing we need is a hiccup which will set us back.

I think we need a plan like the UK has with metrics and different scenarios and not this 'wait and see' approach

There cannot be another wave with serious consequences after the most vulnerable have been vaccinated, there simply won't be enough people to infect that would be liable to get hospitalised. The UK has started to pass that key point hence their easing even though their cases have effectively flatlined.

We are about a month behind the UK vaccination-wise. We will get there. There is every reason to be hopeful and to ignore the agitators.

Ficheall

MrMusician18 wrote: »

We are about a month behind the UK vaccination-wise. We will get there. There is every reason to be hopeful and to ignore the agitators.

A month ago the UK had about 30% of people vaccinated, whereas we currently have about 10%.. (I realise we're doing better on the fully-vaxxed than they were a month ago, but it seems(?) the first vax makes a much bigger difference than the second.)

Rodin

Ficheall wrote: »

A month ago the UK had about 30% of people vaccinated, whereas we currently have about 10%.. (I realise we're doing better on the fully-vaxxed than they were a month ago, but it seems(?) the first vax makes a much bigger difference than the second.)

The British have more double-dosed than we have

Rodin

MrMusician18 wrote: »

There cannot be another wave with serious consequences after the most vulnerable have been vaccinated, there simply won't be enough people to infect that would be liable to get hospitalised. The UK has started to pass that key point hence their easing even though their cases have effectively flatlined.

We are about a month behind the UK vaccination-wise. We will get there. There is every reason to be hopeful and to ignore the agitators.

A month behind?
They have over 50% of their adults vaccinated.
You think we will have that in a month's time?

We've vaccinated a total of about 16% of our population with a dose since we started.
The British have done 15% in the last month alone...

wes

Leftwaffe wrote: »

I think you’ll see some elderly people with masks on yet for quite a while, also those ineligible for the vaccines, etc. Masks will be with us on a minor, minor scale for a few years yet I’d imagine. Tbf ive never been as well since this all began, touch wood. I put some of that down to masks.

I hope people wearing masks, when they have a cold etc becomes the norm. Better yet just stay at home, and make it easier under law to take sick days.

WoollyRedHat

Widdensushi wrote: »

Because it will become the new normal here as it has for Asian countries due to other flu etc

The reason a lot of people from Asia wear masks on a day to day basis is because of air pollution correct me If I'm wrong?

Icyseanfitz

Leftwaffe wrote: »

Can anyone explain to me how all kids are in classrooms together but they can’t train together outside yet?

good question

FishOnABike

Widdensushi wrote: »

I totally agree that we should be wearing masks, when they became mandatory though I didn't see any change in numbers, I am not talking about cases, I am talking about supermarket staff cases, they handle every item that a customer has, and a customer handles every item they have. Surely superspreaders, it hasn't been the case, from what I can see supermarket staff are less likely to have covid than the general public, this was the case premask and after mandatory mask wearing, the conclusion I take is that contact in a high ceiling, well ventilated for less than 10 minutes is low risk, handling products that someone infected is very low risk. Either way we will all be wearing masks for the foreseeable and I agree with it, just surprised at the lack of noticeable difference when it was introduced

This study would indicate the opposite. https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroom/high-rate-of-symptomless-covid-19-infection-among-grocery-store-workers/

The study found "those in customer-facing roles 5 times as likely to test positive as their colleagues in other positions" and that overall the prevalence of CoViD among staff "was significantly higher than the prevalence of the infection in the local community at the time"

FishOnABike

Rodin wrote: »

The British have more double-dosed than we have

More in absolute numbers or as a percentage of their population?

speckle

FishOnABike wrote: »

This study would indicate the opposite. https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroom/high-rate-of-symptomless-covid-19-infection-among-grocery-store-workers/

The study found "those in customer-facing roles 5 times as likely to test positive as their colleagues in other positions" and that overall the prevalence of CoViD among staff "was significantly higher than the prevalence of the infection in the local community at the time"

That is an observational study does not prove causation...all supplementary info not necessarily peer reviewed... alot of it was questioneer based... small numbers hence a possible nomilaly re the rest of the community... lacking data I would want...many households can have 20% ie 1 in a family of group of 5..no info on size of shop and ventilation or ppe used or screens etc.... or why a higher % of supervisors positive.do they share a locker room or lunch area .. it was over a 3 day period last may...is there a public holiday just before...were they sequenced...interesting though those more anxious more at risk...note also more outgoing/extrovert people in customer facing roles in general...the smoking issue arises again..what were the weightings?what amount of pcr cycles..did they contact trace?

beyond belief what gets past peer reveiw (but it was early on last year)and then used to put* fear into people if some one of it is read out of context ...though to be fair the authors did reconise some of its limitations

If I tried to present this in uni..I would have either been sent back to the drawing board or have to accept a grade lower than 2.2.

Fish I am not saying that you have *.. (hope all going good and quieter at work) but that everyone must look deeper some times to the context surrounding results...we have had some tiny amount of clusters on the island here in supermarkets amongst staff from the early one up north country to a few later ones but no data on proper contact tracing etc and numbers low anyhow still and all in the epidemiology reports.

Anyhow thanks for the link an interesting easy to read paper that has kept me buzy while my legs are cramping badly and cant sleep.

Space ventillation time hands and face everyone..and dont be having long chats in the aisles take it outside

Edit..to be fair one potential importance that this type of research may have is to pick up on smaller nuanced issues which may lead to further more detailed research.

Del Griffith

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The whole point of the restrictions is to prevent the health service from becoming overwhelmed..

That narrative was binned ages ago.

oceanman

look at it it this way guys.....in a few short years we will look back and say do you remember covid 19...it will just history, time marches on.

Banana Republic 1

paddyisreal wrote: »

I will come back when I want to after having a few lovely pints on my cross border excursions. Might even take a game of 5 a side soccer up there also considering you can't even do that here for another 6 weeks

There is a reason there’s a delay on those things and if you don’t know what it is then there is no point talking to you.