Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

suicide_circus

JRant wrote: »

The shear arrogance of that statement is something else. This chap actually believes he controls everyone's lives.

"F*ck off, Tony"

CalamariFritti

Russman wrote: »

Why should they have sacked the CMO ? Presumably because he advised going to Level 5 ? Why would he be sacked ?

Does the Taoiseach deciding to follow the advice of NPHET not count as a decision or is it only deciding to open things up that counts ?

I concede your second point to a degree. But only a little. There is clearly a responsibility ping pong going on. The one guys are saying we are not in charge. The other guys are saying we aren't either. Somebody called it very aptly Schroedingers government, responsible and not responsible at the same time.

The first question is an easy answer. He undermined the government by creating pressure through the public. Forced us into level 5 when level 3 would have been fine. Probably cost a billion or two and created penned up demand in December. Seemed and still seems an awful decision to me. Look at him now and listen to his language. He doesnt even advise anymore, he tells us straight up forget June. Like the de facto Taoiseach that he is.

Helpneeded86

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

No they are not. I’ve driven a bit today around my locality and most ppl are following the guidance.

Dream on.

zerosugarbuzz

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Thanks. But I’ll take his advice over a randomer on boards and I’d suspect the govt will too.

I have a couple of friends who think like you do, They end our phone conversations with an kind of terrified "stay safe" exclamation as though I were off to climb the himalayas alone. My first reaction is that they are taking the piss, but they're not, they are genuinely still terrified. I simply can't understand it as they are otherwise intelligent people capable of independent critical thinking. But not on this subject anymore unfortunately.

The government can take whoever's advice they want, the people are moving on, hopefully for the last time.

Windmill100000

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

No they are not. I’ve driven a bit today around my locality and most ppl are following the guidance.

Same. Was out walking in the local woods today. Plenty around and people are social distancing. Great to be out in the sunshine and see people in good spirits.

Beechwoodspark

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

I have a couple of friends who think like you do, They end our phone conversations with an kind of terrified "stay safe" exclamation as though I were off to climb the himalayas alone. My first reaction is that they are taking the piss, but they're not, they are genuinely still terrified. I simply can't understand it as they are otherwise intelligent people capable of independent critical thinking. But not on this subject anymore unfortunately.

The government can take whoever's advice they want, the people are moving on, hopefully for the last time.

I’m quite rational and far from terrified.

but I have close family and friends who are vulnerable and I’m willing to put up with the restrictions until later in the year when hopefully the vaccines have been rolled out to a greater extent.

LeakyLime

B2021M wrote: »

How would NPHET justify to the government the continued closure of pubs if they had opened everywhere else?

It happened last year. Pubs reopened in the UK and Ireland but not here.

They didn't provide a justification because they were never asked for one by the media.

It doesn't seem to matter what science the rest of Europe are following. In Ireland, it's just accepted we will be subjected the longest strictest lockdowms.

B2021M

CalamariFritti wrote: »

I concede your second point to a degree. But only a little. There is clearly a responsibility ping pong going on. The one guys are saying we are not in charge. The other guys are saying we aren't either. Somebody called it very aptly Schroedingers government, responsible and not responsible at the same time.

The first question is an easy answer. He undermined the government by creating pressure through the public. Forced us into level 5 when level 3 would have been fine. Probably cost a billion or two and created penned up demand in December. Seemed and still seems an awful decision to me. Look at him now and listen to his language. He doesnt even advise anymore, he tells us straight up forget June. Like the de facto Taoiseach that he is.

Im uncertain as to why we need advice at this point. Our neighbours are further ahead in their vaccine programme so the result of their relaxation of restrictions will be clear to us. Its a numbers game now.....not a medical one. We couldnt be luckier than to have this data available on our doorstep as a result of actions we were too terrified to do ourselves (larger gaps between doses)

pgj2015

B2021M wrote: »

How would NPHET justify to the government the continued closure of pubs if they had opened everywhere else?

If you worked nights like I do with the drunk Irish public, you wouldn't be asking this question. The pandemic goes out the window when alcohol is involved, people act like its still 2019 when out on the beer. They should have closed the pubs a week earlier than they did at Christmas. the nights before Christmas 2020 in Ireland were a disgrace, I know I saw it first hand.

B2021M

pgj2015 wrote: »

If you worked nights like I do with the drunk Irish public, you wouldn't be asking this question. The pandemic goes out the window when alcohol is involved, people act like its still 2019 when out on the beer. They should have closed the pubs a week earlier than they did at Christmas. the nights before Christmas 2020 in Ireland were a disgrace, I know I saw it first hand.

Yes i am sure you are right but I was talking about a point where pubs have reopened elsewhere...not today.

Natterjack from Kerry

Kiith wrote: »

What the **** is NPHET's actual plan here? Less then 200 in hospital, under 50 in the ICU, and a decent chuck of the population (large chunk of the vulnerable) vaccinated. So lets have more severe restrictions then last summer when we had no vaccines?

Yes. So as to ensure we dont have a spike just as we are achieving vaccine coverage, and to avoid having to shut anything that opens. This is the clear message, and consistent from all quarters - are rare enough thing. But the flip side of not risking re-closing anything, is that things will be open that bit later rather than that bit sooner. A sustainably fully open and normal country by and large, from September is the goal. All decisions are geared to that. Pubs and crowds as sports and concerts and the likes, the last piece of the jigsaw sometime in the Autumn when all else is validated, rather than reclosing them in the Autumn again. Pubs are the problem really. There would be no issue about everything else if it werent for this Irish obsession. And some compromise risk will likely be made here. But NPHET know what they are at for sure.

PTH2009

Will MM/Leo reject Tony's advice??

Will they ****

Aph2016

With almost 1 million of the most vulnerable people having received their 1st vaccination, we're a few days from May, what's the justification for the continued measures? It's complete bull***t!

Stheno

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

Yes. So as to ensure we dont have a spike just as we are achieving vaccine coverage, and to avoid having to shut anything that opens. This is the clear message, and consistent from all quarters - are rare enough thing. But the flip side of not risking re-closing anything, is that things will be open that bit later rather than that bit sooner. A sustainably fully open and normal country by and large, from September is the goal. All decisions are geared to that. Pubs and crowds as sports and concerts and the likes, the last piece of the jigsaw sometime in the Autumn when all else is validated, rather than reclosing them in the Autumn again. Pubs are the problem really. There would be no issue about everything else if it werent for this Irish obsession. And some compromise risk will likely be made here. But NPHET know what they are at for sure.

This the same NPHET who.estimated 400 cases a day by January 4th?
Know what they are at alright

daydorunrun

For those jealous of the beer gardens being open in the UK.......

https://twitter.com/pjcoogan/status/1386134636535894016?s=20

giveitholly

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

Yes. So as to ensure we dont have a spike just as we are achieving vaccine coverage, and to avoid having to shut anything that opens. This is the clear message, and consistent from all quarters - are rare enough thing. But the flip side of not risking re-closing anything, is that things will be open that bit later rather than that bit sooner. A sustainably fully open and normal country by and large, from September is the goal. All decisions are geared to that. Pubs and crowds as sports and concerts and the likes, the last piece of the jigsaw sometime in the Autumn when all else is validated, rather than reclosing them in the Autumn again. Pubs are the problem really. There would be no issue about everything else if it werent for this Irish obsession. And some compromise risk will likely be made here. But NPHET know what they are at for sure.

If pubs are the problem then why not let 25% of a crowd into the Aviva for the Euros,even if it did mean only fully vaccinated could go? That has nothing to do with pubd

growleaves

For those keeping score, the New York Times reports that four US states still have stay-at-home orders.

Five have (partial) restrictions on businesses.

Around half have mask mandates.

See Coronavirus Restrictions and Mask Mandates for All 50 States

Edit: Puerto Rico has a curfew

11521323

I genuinely look forward to July when we'll have 80% of adults with their first dose and the place will still be locked down, I wonder what the lockdown supporters will use to rationalize their support then.

People are gone insane, I actually cannot believe some of the opinions I'm seeing.

TrangiaCoffee

11521323 wrote: »

I genuinely look forward to July when we'll have 80% of adults with their first dose and the place will still be locked down, I wonder what the lockdown supporters will use to rationalize their support then.

People are gone insane, I actually cannot believe some of the opinions I'm seeing.

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

Tenzor07

11521323 wrote: »

I genuinely look forward to July when we'll have 80% of adults with their first dose and the place will still be locked down, I wonder what the lockdown supporters will use to rationalize their support then. .

"De Variants"

daydorunrun

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

Wut

corcaigh07

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

Absolute nonsense

funnydoggy

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

What are you talking about?

Parachutes

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

Moronic post.

KrustyUCC

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

What?

We had 7.9% full vaccinated as of Friday

https://twitter.com/COVID19DataIE/status/1386269257835716611

eleventh

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

funnydoggy wrote: »

What are you talking about?

Possible they mean something like: 1 jab won't be enough....10 won't be enough. They will wear off within months or weeks (or days if someone tests positive).

mohawk

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Well that's very bleak

Plenty of businesses won't survive that long

So we'd have majority vaccinated yet no hospitality for over a year lol

Some joke from NPHET

Wouldn’t fancy being a politician looking for votes when people see Europe having a summer and we don’t.

Honestly a week or two away in the summer was what kept people going through the last few months.

Kivaro

mohawk wrote: »

Wouldn’t fancy being a politician looking for votes when people see Europe having a summer and we don’t.

Honestly a week or two away in the summer was what kept people going through the last few months.

The problem is that those in government know that they will be in trouble in the next election, so they will do everything possible to keep the coalition together until the next scheduled election in February, 2025. Another 4 years of terrible representation and incompetent decision-making.

FintanMcluskey

The dole queues on Reeling in the years 2012 is grim viewing

History does repeat itself it seems

It was a credit problem back then

This time the blame is on NPHEt and government

dublin_paul

Kivaro wrote: »

The problem is that those in government know that they will be in trouble in the next election, so they will do everything possible to keep the coalition together until the next scheduled election in February, 2025. Another 4 years of terrible representation and incompetent decision-making.

Oh man, they must know they're f***** :pac:

dirkmeister

Sandra Hurley just said on the news intercounty travel could be July.

I’d love to know where she got that?

Tenzor07

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The dole queues on Reeling in the years 2012 is grim viewing

A Government that Varadkar and Coveney were senior ministers back in 2012... still here almost 10 years later...ready to lead us into the next economic abyss..

walus

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The dole queues on Reeling in the years 2012 is grim viewing

History does repeat itself it seems

It was a credit problem back then

This time the blame is on NPHEt and government

It does indeed. People typically have short memory when it comes to economic hardship, and for those who have caused this one now economic hardship is something they haven’t experienced in many, many years. At this stage they don’t know what it is like.

Natterjack from Kerry

Tenzor07 wrote: »

A Government that Varadkar and Coveney were senior ministers back in 2012... still here almost 10 years later...ready to lead us into the next economic abyss..

The correct read is that they steered us out of an economic abyss then, and are bringing us out of another now. Neither abyss of their making. There is no other way to see that, other than as quite an impressive double.

Jinglejangle69

Tenzor07 wrote: »

A Government that Varadkar and Coveney were senior ministers back in 2012... still here almost 10 years later...ready to lead us into the next economic abyss..

They got voted in in 2011.

And we exited the recession back then.

Stupid comparison.

JRant

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

Are you one of the super duper mathematicians that Nolan is using on his modelling by any chance?

JRant

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

No they are not. I’ve driven a bit today around my locality and most ppl are following the guidance.

People are just calling in to each other's houses now to get away from the prying eyes of nosey parkers who can't keep out of other people's business. And, do you know what, I don't blame them in the slightest.

You've gimps putting videos on social media of people out enjoying themselves at every chance they can get. Thankfully, the tide is turning on people who do that and long may it continue.

Tenzor07

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

They got voted in in 2011.

And we exited the recession back then.

Stupid comparison.

Hang on a second there FG.... after the Catastrophic handling of the bailout by FF-Greens then FG was a shoe in and just rode the wave of Global recovery in the following years, not to mention the fact that Irish citizens are Still paying for that bailout!

Now we have FF-Greens back again...with the longest restrictions in Europe and no plan to get out of it!
Only difference now is Varadkar and co. are along for the ride, undermining FF as they go and ready to ride the next wave of Global recovery in spite of their policies as part of the coalition....

11521323

TrangiaCoffee wrote: »

80% with first dose is still basically 0% vaccinated

*Sigh*

Helpneeded86

I would say that I have taken a reasonably sensible apporach for most of the 2020 lockdown. I also took a reasonable approach for early 2021. I dont claim to have followed every rule for this period but I was very sensible.

I have gotten a bit sick of the policy since mid March. My parents and girlfriend are vaccinated and while I appreciate there are still people out there who need a vaccination we are getting close to the point where there is not many in that situation.

All I would ask for is a solid roadmap that shows a plan. I would have expected this a month ago. If we need to deviate from that plan due to issues then so be it.

I am now in a position where I will decide what to do myself. I had two friends in the car today which is the first time in a year or more. I will start to attend more house party events. I have a weekend in the North next weekend.

I will still do my best to avoid catching Covid within reason. I have no major issues with people who are Covid Paranoid but it is now on them to take things in their own hands and stay inside. I think we are smart enough to understand if things take a turn we have to do a U turn.

KrustyUCC

dirkmeister wrote: »

Sandra Hurley just said on the news intercounty travel could be July.

I’d love to know where she got that?

Intercounty travel was originally mooted for June

Another restriction that could be pushed out a month since Tony has come back

Nice coincidence

11521323

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Intercounty travel was originally mooted for June

Another restriction that could be pushed out a month since Tony has come back

Nice coincidence

It's worse than that. Michael Martin seems to think we will be able to go for a pint 'by the end of the year'

I'm honestly baffled, how can people watch other countries open back up at a reasonable rate while we languish in lockdown and actually support that?

KrustyUCC

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Intercounty travel was originally mooted for June

Another restriction that could be pushed out a month since Tony has come back

Nice coincidence

It's almost clever, trying to normalise what isn't acceptable (delaying easing of certain restrictions for a month or longer) by letting the air out of the balloon slowly before Friday. So that people are deflated to the point there is little fight in them and passively accept what constitutes a benign dictatorship. Tony has thought all of this through, those leaks over the past few days have been orchestrated for the desired effect.

_Kaiser_

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I’m quite rational and far from terrified.

but I have close family and friends who are vulnerable and I’m willing to put up with the restrictions until later in the year when hopefully the vaccines have been rolled out to a greater extent.

And that's exactly what you SHOULD do just as they should similarly take the appropriate precautions until they are vaccinated

But expecting the rest of the country to continue to put their lives on hold at the expense of their own mental wellbeing and possibly their employment/financial stability to protect that - thankfully - very very small number of people isn't sustainable or realistic. It's even less so when you look at the impact on the wider country and economy as a whole.

Again, "we're all in this together" is NOT the same as "everyone is in this with me"

kerrylad1

Tenzor07 wrote: »

A Government that Varadkar and Coveney were senior ministers back in 2012... still here almost 10 years later...ready to lead us into the next economic abyss..

Bang on.I remember waiting for hours to sign on,in limerick.Looking back it was embarrising to be in that line.
Thats what awaits 500,000 people over the next few months.

Dickie10

theres a massive rupture about to happen in government within FF and FG when no real restrictions are taken away in june , i would guess no roadmap for pubs open either. i think in the end the pressure will toll on martin and varadker probably varadker will make something happen, but cant see pubs open before mid august, i said it a few weeks ago its set up for 2 weeks staycation with a load of restrictions in mid august before schools go back. the only difference this time is the genie will be out of the bottle this time, theres no killing granny or grandad anymore so when pubs open it will be a free for all, i would think very few restrictions will be adhered to any in reality outside of PR stunts very few will be either inspected or sanctioned. Tony knows this and is probably trying to drag out until everyone over 40 is vaxxed along with just his personal hatred for pubs and nightclubs to nail them a bit longer. Now if the government do cant muster any sort of response to tony i really am now worried , pubs will be shut until january 2022. i truly think that is tony and a lot of NYPHET end goal to keep pubs shut until january 2022 and hope a lot are gone out of business or they have resocialised the population not to binge drink anymore. i actually believe they dont mind people drinking on beachs in parks etc as its not in the hedonistic environment of a disco bar or nightclub where people easily fall into binge Britian booze nation mode with a race against closing time to get shots into system.

Richard Hillman

There is no reason why NPHET need to exist anymore. Open up. If hospital numbers go up, make some restrictions. If they stay similar or lower, do nothing. That's it. They don't need The Legion of Doom to tell them the freaking obvious.

A simple ****ing chart could tell them what to do.

growleaves

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

The correct read is that they steered us out of an economic abyss then, and are bringing us out of another now. Neither abyss of their making. There is no other way to see that, other than as quite an impressive double.

FG ran on a promise of debt cancellation then reneged on it. Now they've run up more insane deficits.

Three factors things FG are (partly) responsible for:

The national debt pile-ons of 2008-12 and 2020-21

The shutdown of construction earlier this year

Subsidising asylum seekers in means-tested accommodation

These three factors taken together are going to push house prices and rent up into the stratosphere. A lot of frustration ahead for anyone not earning above-average wages - get ready for co-living, tiny pods, living in a parent's shed etc.

helimachoptor

Dickie10 wrote: »

theres a massive rupture about to happen in government within FF and FG when no real restrictions are taken away in june , i would guess no roadmap for pubs open either. i think in the end the pressure will toll on martin and varadker probably varadker will make something happen, but cant see pubs open before mid august, i said it a few weeks ago its set up for 2 weeks staycation with a load of restrictions in mid august before schools go back. the only difference this time is the genie will be out of the bottle this time, theres no killing granny or grandad anymore so when pubs open it will be a free for all, i would think very few restrictions will be adhered to any in reality outside of PR stunts very few will be either inspected or sanctioned. Tony knows this and is probably trying to drag out until everyone over 40 is vaxxed along with just his personal hatred for pubs and nightclubs to nail them a bit longer. Now if the government do cant muster any sort of response to tony i really am now worried , pubs will be shut until january 2022. i truly think that is tony and a lot of NYPHET end goal to keep pubs shut until january 2022 and hope a lot are gone out of business or they have resocialised the population not to binge drink anymore. i actually believe they dont mind people drinking on beachs in parks etc as its not in the hedonistic environment of a disco bar or nightclub where people easily fall into binge Britian booze nation mode with a race against closing time to get shots into system.

Won't open in Jan 22, too múch socialising for Christmas, so lockdown again

Indestructable

The EU is set to allow vaccinated US tourists in during the Summer. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/25/world/europe/american-travel-to-europe.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

How will the Government or NPHET handle that? It'll be the EU who loosen the restrictions here.