Private school teachers prioritised for vaccinations

ted1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When I was in school the final bell went at 3.45 and by 4.00 there would be 3 cars left in the car park. I had a teaching position lined up last year and it hadn't changed, within 10 minutes of the final bell there were fewer than 10 staff there out of ~65 within a few minutes of the last bell.
Pretending they didn't know what was going on or that it was wrong is a nonsense.

When I was in semi private school. There was generally teachers around till 5:30. Most teachers coached teams , did drama or something after school

astrofool

"Hey, I need 20 adult people quickly, it's 4:30pm, I'm thinking the police station, the hospital patients, maybe the workers over in that supermarket that I can see with my eyes"
"You know who's famously known for working extra hours and being available at a short notice?"
"I don't know, who?"
"TEACHERS!"
"Why yes, of course, they're famous for being available after hours, I'll give the one next door a call"
"Don't do that, there is a school 15KM away that we should call instead"
"Why yes, let us do that, because, after all, we can only make, dun, dun dun, 1 PHONE CALL!"

Said no one (apart from ted1) ever.

PuddingBreath

khalessi wrote: »

I teach primary and there are often at least 20 teachers in my school after 430 might not be a fix.

Look the CEO chanced his arm to help out his children's school, he should not have done it and should be held accountable but the school should not be blamed.

The issue is not the teachers, it is the CEO pulling a fast one.

However teachers should be further up the priority list especially in light of the increasing numbers of cases among children.

no, teachers shouldn't, all public transport drivers should be higher, all supermarket workers, the guards... anyone facing the general public on a regular basis. these are far more uncontrolled environments than schools.

A bus driver/shop worker could be handling cash from strangers covered in sh!t, pi$$ and covid. shop workers have to stack their shops/clean/serve with people wandering around with their masks half off .



but teachers are the real heroes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAg9M-O9wGo

khalessi

khalessi wrote: »

Would you believe that things change in schools, I know cos I work in one and regualrly would be there till 5

Well it hadn't changed in my old one 10 years later like I said.

No-one's saying the teachers were all co-conspiring from the start. However someone at the school knew about it and once the call came the they made a choice to go. That choice is on them. I'm not even particularly criticising them for it.

The CEO's position is untenable from the HSE's point of view. Can't be trusted.

ted1

plodder wrote: »

.. to go before what? they clocked off for the evening?

The vials last for six hours, and I doubt that the last two were unsealed at 11am that morning.

Staff were going home , end of shift. They would be gone off by the morning

kirving

RebelButtMunch wrote: »

False argument pretending it was a choice between what happened and dumping the vaccines.

You would want to be incredibly naive to believe they the only other option was to dump the vaccine.

Or, people peddling that narrative know well that it's rubbish, but repeat it anyway to minimise the fallout from this. Perhaps those people have a relationship to the school, hospital, they themselves have received a vaccine out of turn, or know others who have.

Even if that was the only option in a black and white world, I think it's better to throw them in the bin rather than undermine confidence in the entire system. There would be no difference to the general public who didn't receive the vaccine anyway, and noone could be accused of corruption.

I'm no fan of SF, but rightly or wrongly, I suspect the CEO would be much more fearful of consequences of actions like this, if SF were in power.

astrofool

astrofool wrote: »

"Hey, I need 20 adult people quickly, it's 4:30pm, I'm thinking the police station, the hospital patients, maybe the workers over in that supermarket that I can see with my eyes"
"You know who's famously known for working extra hours and being available at a short notice?"
"I don't know, who?"
"TEACHERS!"
"Why yes, of course, they're famous for being available after hours, I'll give the one next door a call"
"Don't do that, there is a school 15KM away that we should call instead"
"Why yes, let us do that, because, after all, we can only make, dun, dun dun, 1 PHONE CALL!"

Said no one (apart from ted1) ever.

"Let's hope that a third of all the teachers in the school happened to stay late, aren't on the way out the door, are reachable and won't be abandoning kids (because of course they stay late to coach) under their supervision."

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

It’s stupid comment , end of.

“ mental health service users roam around but individually only”

Read the thread, people said 20 mental
Health service users could not be got.

Hence the satirical comment poking at the obvious bollocks in that statement.

plodder

ted1 wrote: »

Staff were going home , end of shift. They would be gone off by the morning

Are there no doctors or nurses in the Beacon after 5pm?

ted1

thomas 123 wrote: »

Read the thread, people said 20 mental
Health service users could not be got.

Hence the satirical comment poking at the obvious bollocks in that statement.

20 people * 3 min phone call. No 20 could not be got. That’s providing they could even get the phone numbers

ted1

plodder wrote: »

Are there no doctors or nurses in the Beacon after 5pm?

Not for doing vaccines. They have other duties.
It’s a private hospital, staff aren’t being paid to do vaccines at that time

JimmyVik

ted1 wrote: »

Staff were going home , end of shift. They would be gone off by the morning

Its the perfect choice as far as i can see.
A large enough group of poeple all just finished up for the day that can be got with one phone call.


You call any other employer and you might be making multiple calls and doing all sorts of toing and froing because they cant just get up and leave work.

poppers

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The CEO's position is untenable from the HSE's point of view. Can't be trusted.

Does it matter what the HSE think of him as its a private hospital.

Brendan Bendar

Muahahaha wrote: »

This is the bit I dont get because the Beacon Hospital has 180 beds. Is the CEO of this hospital with nearly a couple of hundred patients in their care seriously expecting us to believe that he couldnt have found 20 non vaccinated patients in the very hospital where the vaccines were located? Any patient in his hospital is at higher risk of catching Covid just by virtue of them being in the hospital in the first place.

Yet instead of looking after the patients under their care they hand them out to teachers in a school miles away. Id imagine he's got a lot of very angry patients staying there now, they paid their thousands in fees yet the hospital CEO neglected to priortise the health of the hospital patients.

What I can’t understand is how 20 doses can suddenly be ‘available at the very last minute’ .

Surely the last 20 patients can’t have been ‘no shows’.

As the ‘no shows’ occurred would the list not be checked and a patient alerted following a check.

Given the alleged extremely tight time frame I find it hard to believe that 20 persons could be rounded up and gotten in from 14km away without some pre-arrangement or pre warning.

Strong smell off this, in my opinion.

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

20 people * 3 min phone call. No 20 could not be got. That’s providing they could even get the phone numbers

Do you usually call the service users who require a social care worker to make them cups of tea or do you call the social care workers manager / organization?

It’s a pity they didn’t have a list of all of these folks - oh wait they do ...

ted1

poppers wrote: »

Does it matter what the HSE think of him as its a private hospital.

It’s what Dazzler thinks..

thomas 123

JimmyVik wrote: »

Its the perfect choice as far as i can see.
A large enough group of poeple all just finished up for the day that can be got with one phone call.


You call any other employer and you might be making multiple calls and doing all sorts of toing and froing because they cant just get up and leave work.

That does not account for one thing though - why that school?

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

20 people * 3 min phone call. No 20 could not be got. That’s providing they could even get the phone numbers

You would just contact the home/hostel. If it was a hostel, there would be a nurse based there. Co-ordinate from that and actually help vulnerable people.

ted1

thomas 123 wrote: »

Do you usually call the service users who require a social care worker to make them cups of tea or do you call the social care workers manager / organization?

It’s a pity they didn’t have a list of all of these folks - oh wait they do ...

The beacon, a private hospital have these numbers?
The social care workers then have to rely the messages and make calls.
Once again , 1 phone call sorted it all

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

The beacon, a private hospital have these numbers?
The social care workers then have to rely the messages and make calls.
Once again , 1 phone call sorted it all

YES. They have a list for the 30th time - they are supposed to anyway.

RandomViewer

AZ or Pfizer?

ted1

thomas 123 wrote: »

That does not account for one thing though - why that school?

Because it’s a 12 minute drive and the knew the headmaster could organise the staff if he said he could. Why bother with someone else

thomas 123

The Beacon Hospital in Dublin has confirmed it administered 20 left over Covid-19 vaccines to a number of teachers at a private school earlier this week.

In a statement, the hospital apologised for the upset caused by the move, acknowledging that "the decision was not in line with the sequencing guidelines in place from the HSE" for administering the vaccine roll out. | https://bit.ly/3skNLjz

From rte ^

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

Because it’s a 12 minute drive and the knew the headmaster cooks organise the staff if he said he could. Why bother with someone else

Christ

steddyeddy

JimmyVik wrote: »

Its the perfect choice as far as i can see.
A large enough group of poeple all just finished up for the day that can be got with one phone call.


You call any other employer and you might be making multiple calls and doing all sorts of toing and froing because they cant just get up and leave work.

Jimmy you may think that's how health services are organised but they're not. As was explained in the last scandal in the Coombe there's always a back up list. Medicine isn't some sort of mickey mouse operation where you randomly ring a school over 10 miles away at the last minute.

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

Because it’s a 12 minute drive and the knew the headmaster cooks organise the staff if he said he could. Why bother with someone else

The CEO is in the wrong. He misused public property (the vaccine) to further his pull with his children's teachers. How can you not see this is wrong?

hynesie08

astrofool wrote: »

"Hey, I need 20 adult people quickly, it's 4:30pm, I'm thinking the police station, the hospital patients, maybe the workers over in that supermarket that I can see with my eyes"
"You know who's famously known for working extra hours and being available at a short notice?"
"I don't know, who?"
"TEACHERS!"
"Why yes, of course, they're famous for being available after hours, I'll give the one next door a call"
"Don't do that, there is a school 15KM away that we should call instead"
"Why yes, let us do that, because, after all, we can only make, dun, dun dun, 1 PHONE CALL!"

Said no one (apart from ted1) ever.

"hi random supermarket, need you to close at your busiest time of day and send all your staff over to be vaccinated"

Good luck being the manager who has to make that call......

JimmyVik

thomas 123 wrote: »

That does not account for one thing though - why that school?

Because he had a contact that he could ring who he could depend on to say yes or no, he could gather the people straight away.
Im sure if he said he couldnt get it sorted right there and then it would have been on to the next contact he thought he could do it.


I would have done exactly what he did, had I the number of someone in a school, a factory or a building site that I knew knocked off at that time.

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

Because it’s a 12 minute drive and the knew the headmaster could organise the staff if he said he could. Why bother with someone else

Did you mean to say crooks by chance ?

thomas 123

JimmyVik wrote: »

Because he had a contact that he could ring who he could depend on to say yes or no, he could gather the people straight away.
Im sure if he said he couldnt get it sorted right there and then it would have been on to the next contact he thought he could do it.


I would have done exactly what he did, had I the number of someone in a school, a factory or a building site that I knew knocked off at that time.

Perfect so we are on the same page that “who you know” got these teachers vaccinated rather than due process!

Good.

RandomViewer

It does draw attention to the state paying the teachers wages and grant aiding these fee paying schools, if they are getting all this state money where is all the fee money going?

carveone

RandomViewer wrote: »

AZ or Pfizer?

AZ.

ted1

thomas 123 wrote: »

Christ

So it’s begrudgary. Ok for another school but not this school?

iamwhoiam

ted1 wrote: »

Because it’s a 12 minute drive and the knew the headmaster could organise the staff if he said he could. Why bother with someone else

Why bother ? Good God , because it was not in line with the HSE guidlines .Even the Beacon know that


Beacon Hospital today apologised for the decision that was made "not in line with the sequencing guidelines in place from the HSE".

ted1

RandomViewer wrote: »

It does draw attention to the state paying the teachers wages and grant aiding these fee paying schools, if they are getting all this state money where is all the fee money going?

Oh sweet Jesus.

The state save money from private schools. The pupils receive less funding. The fees pay for additional teachers and resources

khalessi

PuddingBreath wrote: »

no, teachers shouldn't, all public transport drivers should be higher, all supermarket workers, the guards... anyone facing the general public on a regular basis. these are far more uncontrolled environments than schools.

A bus driver/shop worker could be handling cash from strangers covered in sh!t, pi$$ and covid. shop workers have to stack their shops/clean/serve with people wandering around with their masks half off .



but teachers are the real heroes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAg9M-O9wGo

Teachers have been prioritised in other countries as the research has shown the real risk in schools and the HSE and Paul Reid can see it here but instead of admitting it they skirt around it.

Our own Taoiseach has identified teachers as frontline workers or essential worker depending on his whim, they should be moved up. It is laughable that Prof Nolan said on NewTalk last week there were no new safety measures in schoool this term and when asked about the B117 replied he was relying on hope and optimism that previous methods would work and look schools not fully back and numbers increasing rapidly in children.

Hope and Optimism the hope and prayers for 2021

In Sept/Oct last year over 6000 teachers took Covid sick leave and how did HSE respond, they tightened up the definitions of who is a close contact in schools.

But the wrong element in this is not the teachers, but the CEO for not even looking at patients in his own hospital for eligible candidates or referring to any list of patients who could be there. Even if here was not an offical list there is a database of patients that could have been narrowed down using the local postcode.

ted1

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Why bother ? Good God , because it was not in line with the HSE guidlines .Even the Beacon know that


Beacon Hospital today apologised for the decision that was made "not in line with the sequencing guidelines in place from the HSE".

Read the rest of that sentence. They did not want up waste the rest

thomas 123

ted1 wrote: »

So it’s begrudgary. Ok for another school but not this school?

No it’s maths and logic.

In the case that a had to be picked and the school was the last chance they had there are 3 schools in the immediate vicinity of that hospital. There is a big fat “why” hanging over why that school was chosen.

joe40

PuddingBreath wrote: »

no, teachers shouldn't, all public transport drivers should be higher, all supermarket workers, the guards... anyone facing the general public on a regular basis. these are far more uncontrolled environments than schools.

A bus driver/shop worker could be handling cash from strangers covered in sh!t, pi$$ and covid. shop workers have to stack their shops/clean/serve with people wandering around with their masks half off .



but teachers are the real heroes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAg9M-O9wGo

No they're not. I'm in the same room with over 20 teenagers (some over 18) for extended periods of time. Shop workers have very brief interactions. Time is important in transmission.

I'm not in any way condoning the Beacon actions. It was totally wrong. The school and teachers involved also bear responsibility.

They must have known this would cause controversy.

I just really hope it wasn't planned in advance that leftover vaccines would go to the school.
We'll never know.

plodder

ted1 wrote: »

Not for doing vaccines. They have other duties.

Not sure if you're having a laugh here, but that doesn't paint a great picture of the place. Priority number one was to get 20 people in together so the staff can knock off at 5pm as normal.

iamwhoiam

ted1 wrote: »

Read the rest of that sentence. They did not want up waste the rest

I can read but can also know when not to be drawn in.

astrofool

hynesie08 wrote: »

"hi random supermarket, need you to close at your busiest time of day and send all your staff over to be vaccinated"

Good luck being the manager who has to make that call......

What? Are you saying the manager doesn't want to prioritise people so wouldn't want to take a call? Or that a supermarket in walking distance of the hospital wouldn't have enough staff around (usually about ~100) to go and get vaccinated?

The explanation is ridiculous, no one in their right mind would think that the best way to round up 20 adults in a short time frame is to ring a school 15 minutes drive away after the school day was finished, UNLESS IT WAS PRE-ARRANGED.

And because it was pre-arranged, that is called corruption, and that has consequences for those who carried out the corruption.

khalessi

thomas 123 wrote: »

No it’s maths and logic.

In the case that a had to be picked and the school was the last chance they had there are 3 schools in the immediate vicinity of that hospital. There is a big fat “why” hanging over why that school was chosen.

No why, it was his kids school, he would have the number on his phone and probably thought, why not but he could have made a beter decision.

Banana Republic 1

poppers wrote: »

Does it matter what the HSE think of him as its a private hospital.

Do the beacon pay for there own vaccines

iamwhoiam

I am sure the CEO is a very clever man and not stupid .So how on earth did he not grasp how stupid it was to pick the school your children go to ? I am seriously ?

thomas 123

khalessi wrote: »

No why, it was his kids school, he would have the number on his phone and probably thought, why not but he could have made a beter decision.

If this is found to be the case a serious follow through from the hse needs to take place. This is just not good enough.

I’d imagine the CEO was not on the floor vaccinating people, it wouldn’t be as mad if it was say the attending DR or manager of the vaccinations kids school even.

joe40

khalessi wrote: »

Teachers have been prioritised in other countries as the research has shown the real risk in schools and the HSE and Paul Reid can see it here but instead of admitting it they skirt around it.

Our own Taoiseach has identified teachers as frontline workers or essential worker depending on his whim, they should be moved up. It is laughable that Prof Nolan said on NewTalk last week there were no new safety measures in schoool this term and when asked about the B117 replied he was relying on hope and optimism that previous methods would work and look schools not fully back and numbers increasing rapidly in children.

Hope and Optimism the hope and prayers for 2021

In Sept/Oct last year over 6000 teachers took Covid sick leave and how did HSE respond, they tightened up the definitions of who is a close contact in schools.

But the wrong elelment in this is not the teachers, but the CEO for not even looking at patients in his own hospital for eligible candidates or referring to any list of patients who could be there. Even if here was not an offical list there is a database of patients that could have been narrowed down using the local postcode.

I largely agree with you on the risk in schools, but how can you say the teachers in this case we're blameless.

If it was wrong for the Beacon to do this, then it was wrong for the school to accept.

They know about the priority listing and they're bound to have known this would cause serious issues.

ted1

thomas 123 wrote: »

No it’s maths and logic.

In the case that a had to be picked and the school was the last chance they had there are 3 schools in the immediate vicinity of that hospital. There is a big fat “why” hanging over why that school was chosen.

Simply because he knew them, he knew they would have 20 available.
12 minutes is within the vicinity

If he had of picked 1 of the three, then it could be argued why not the others

hynesie08

astrofool wrote: »

What? Are you saying the manager doesn't want to prioritise people so wouldn't want to take a call? Or that a supermarket in walking distance of the hospital wouldn't have enough staff around (usually about ~100) to go and get vaccinated?

The explanation is ridiculous, no one in their right mind would think that the best way to round up 20 adults in a short time frame is to ring a school 15 minutes drive away after the school day was finished, UNLESS IT WAS PRE-ARRANGED.

And because it was pre-arranged, that is called corruption, and that has consequences for those who carried out the corruption.

Where the jaysus are you shopping that has 100 staff on the premises?