Private school teachers prioritised for vaccinations

jmayo

thebaz wrote: »

Thats good to hear , and sort of confirms my point about the difference between healthy adults getting vaccinated and a man in hospital with cancer (VHI executive) -
was it the case of the Daily Mail being the Daily mail ?

The question is did the VHI chief jump the queue with regards to him getting the vaccine ahead of more deserving patients?
Yes he was cancer patient in Beacon, but he is now back in work.

There are other cancer patients in Beacon that did not receive vaccine even though it was given to teachers at the school that teaches the CEO's kid(s).

And yes some cancer patients can't get it, but some can.

Cyrus wrote: »

No it’s as a direct result of the daily mail releasing the story.

Because our own connected papers probably would not really touch this story.
But go right ahead and shoot the messenger.

*mod snip - no need to bring children into this*

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

First Up wrote: »

My guess is the HSE first told them it was 5 and they changed that to 20.

My other guess it was the first 20 teachers they could find but I could be wrong.

It sounds like it was a fast moving situation.

The HSE?

Are you deliberately telling lies now to try to spread blame. The HSE had no involvement in contacting the school, as you well know.

Yeah I spotted that as well.

One has to wonder about why certain posters are continously on here trying to muddy the waters and excuse this saga?

josip

Cyrus wrote: »

You should tell harvard and others.

https://www.chron.com/coronavirus/article/You-might-be-COVID-19-carrier-after-vaccine-16063690.php

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/fully-vaccinated-against-covid-19-so-what-can-you-safely-do-2021032522230

The Harvard article is from the 25th, and is outdated.
You need to come up to date with the latest understanding.
The "others" link is a personal opinion which is irrelevant compared to a CDC announcement.

History Queen

astrofool wrote: »

The TUI and ASTI represent all teachers, and there will be nary a peep out of them to condemn the St. Gerard's teachers who went along with this.

I thought ASTI made a statement?

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

I thought ASTI made a statement?

Have you got a link?

Treppen

History Queen wrote: »

I thought ASTI made a statement?

On st Gerard's?

History Queen

Treppen wrote: »

On st Gerard's?

Apologies not a statement. Ann Piggot was asked about it in an interview. Reference to it in this article.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0327/1206526-beacon-hospital-vaccine/

From the article:

Earlier, the President of the Association of Secondary Teachers in Ireland said the vaccination of teachers at a school by the Beacon Hospital, first revealed in the Irish Daily Mail, was "not the right thing to happen".


Speaking on RTÉ's Today with Katie Hannon, Ann Piggott said the teachers who received the vaccines "may well have been ASTI members" but she could not confirm this.

She said HSE guidelines around contingency planning for vaccine administration should have been followed in this case.

"It is wrong, it shouldn't happen, it's unfortunate," she added.

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

"It is wrong, it shouldn't happen, it's unfortunate," she added.

Ya that's condemnation of the highest order :rolleyes: :pac:

History Queen

Lillyfae wrote: »

Ya that's condemnation of the highest order :rolleyes: :pac:

I didn't say it was? I was just responding to a poster who seemed to think the unions hadn't responded to the issue.

Treppen

Lillyfae wrote: »

Ya that's condemnation of the highest order :rolleyes: :pac:

Ahh they said it was wrong!

Does that not fit with your feeble attempt to bash unions.

Were those teachers of St. Gerard's ASTI members anyway?

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

I didn't say it was? I was just responding to a poster who seemed to think the unions hadn't responded to the issue.

I don't know why you're taking umbrage with me, I'm just quoting the statement. If this is the ASTI's official view of the matter then it's really not good enough.

CUCINA

I heard a journalist on the radio coming out with a great phrase about this episode:
Jabs for the boys...

Fian

CUCINA wrote: »

I heard a journalist on the radio coming out with a great phrase about this episode:
Jabs for the boys...

If you look back in this thread you will see a poster in this thread coined that phrase about 5/6 days ago.

History Queen

Lillyfae wrote: »

I don't know why you're taking umbrage with me, I'm just quoting the statement. If this is the ASTI's official view of the matter then it's really not good enough.

I'm not taking umbridge with you. She said it shouldn't have happened. What more do you want? Maybe listen back to the interview for full context.

Cyrus

am_zarathustra wrote: »

That's a blog not a scientific paper. And it says it doesn't go to zero not that it doesn't reduce transmissibility or infectivity. Please don't spread misinformation about a vitla vaccine. In all likelihood there is at least a four fold decrease in transmissibility due to a significant drop in viral load. Also the infectivity numbers a far lower (nice surprise). It's important we consider the actual facts when discussing the implications of these things.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sciencenews.org/article/coronavirus-covid-vaccine-moderna-pfizer-transmission-disease/amp

A good article with links to the relevant, and emerging data. It definitely has an effect, it's about unravelling the effect to see if there are clinic benefits now. Scientist are cagey when it comes to definite statements, unlike the general public

so you are agreeing with me, you can have the vaccine and still spread covid,

thanks glad we cleared that up.

all i was responding to was a poster thinking if he had it his parents were safe with him around, that is not necessarily the case and one would prefer to be more cautious in that scenario i would have thought.

josip

Cyrus wrote: »

so you are agreeing with me, you can have the vaccine and still spread covid,

thanks glad we cleared that up.

all i was responding to was a poster thinking if he had it his parents were safe with him around, that is not necessarily the case and one would prefer to be more cautious in that scenario i would have thought.

It would seem that your views on the likelihood of transmission are so entrenched, that you prefer to remain with your outdated misunderstanding, whereas the rest of us will learn and move on.

Cyrus

josip wrote: »

It would seem that you are so entrenched in your views that you prefer to remain with your outdated misunderstanding of the likelihood of transmission whereas the rest of us will learn and move on.

something i posted from the 25th of March is outdated, i'd wait for some more data to emerge before putting the vunerable at risk if its all the same to you.

I assume given this new data that if all the staff in a hospital are vaccinated they will be doing away with current protocols when dealing with vulnerable patients immediately?

also this is based on one study of 4,000 people, even the author of the article doesn't share your certainty.

The CDC concluded, based on those results, that Pfizer and Moderna's COVID-19 vaccines are roughly 90% effective at preventing COVID-19 infections in the real world, even the asymptomatic kind.

This is a great sign, because it means that vaccinated people likely protect those around them from catching the coronavirus very, very well.

But, more data is still needed to say so definitively, which is why researchers are currently recruiting thousands of college students across the country to find out more about the likelihood of asymptomatic spread of this virus among vaccinated people.

RoseStick

I am a healthcare assistant and I received a vaccine at the end of a vaccine clinic. I went down the route of signing up to the hse portal for the vaccine. I wasn't expecting the vaccine so quick. My employer rang me one day to say there's a clinic popping up and recommended for me to leave my phone on all the time, to have it charged, to have it on me at all times.

Eventually I got a call to say there's a vaccine available. I made it my business to turn up for the vaccine.

I work in the country and I don't know anyone in Dublin and I don't know any of the teachers who were vaccinated. I'm telling my story about how I was added to the end of a vaccine clinic.

I can't see anything wrong with what happened from the Beacon. They were probably dipping into the community for one or 2 or 3 people in case there were any vaccine spares at the end of a clinic. It's possible one or two people from the school were put on standby and then when the day came and progressed, they got a call to gather 20 people. They probably never anticipated 20 no-shows and 20 spares. There will be a lot more of this as time goes on. The vaccines are just so precious. Clinics will have to dip into communities to use up any spares at the end of clinics. I don't think it's very fair to put vulnerable people into a standby mode for a couple of days in case a vaccine becomes available for them. I think that might cause more harm than good. I know if my mother got a call like that, that would cause her anxiety. I think it's only fair to give those on the list to receive the vaccine, an appointment for a guaranteed vaccine and not leave them hanging and waiting in case one becomes available.

Who are people to say these teachers are not worthy of a vaccine? Nobody here knows them or their circumstances. My vaccine has provided a level of protection for myself but also to my family and my work and my partner too. So I don't see 20 vulnerable people denied vaccine. I see 20 more people vaccinated that will lead to less spread of this disease.

JimmyVik

RoseStick wrote: »

I am a healthcare assistant and I received a vaccine at the end of a vaccine clinic. I went down the route of signing up to the hse portal for the vaccine. I wasn't expecting the vaccine so quick. My employer rang me one day to say there's a clinic popping up and recommended for me to leave my phone on all the time, to have it charged, to have it on me at all times.

Eventually I got a call to say there's a vaccine available. I made it my business to turn up for the vaccine.

I work in the country and I don't know anyone in Dublin and I don't know any of the teachers who were vaccinated. I'm telling my story about how I was added to the end of a vaccine clinic.

I can't see anything wrong with what happened from the Beacon. They were probably dipping into the community for one or 2 or 3 people in case there were any vaccine spares at the end of a clinic. It's possible one or two people from the school were put on standby and then when the day came and progressed, they got a call to gather 20 people. They probably never anticipated 20 no-shows and 20 spares. There will be a lot more of this as time goes on. The vaccines are just so precious. Clinics will have to dip into communities to use up any spares at the end of clinics. I don't think it's very fair to put vulnerable people into a standby mode for a couple of days in case a vaccine becomes available for them. I think that might cause more harm than good. I know if my mother got a call like that, that would cause her anxiety. I think it's only fair to give those on the list to receive the vaccine, an appointment for a guaranteed vaccine and not leave them hanging and waiting in case one becomes available.

Who are people to say these teachers are not worthy of a vaccine? Nobody here knows them or their circumstances. My vaccine has provided a level of protection for myself but also to my family and my work and my partner too. So I don't see 20 vulnerable people denied vaccine. I see 20 more people vaccinated that will lead to less spread of this disease.

Very sensible post.

Treppen

RoseStick wrote: »

I am a healthcare assistant and I received a vaccine at the end of a vaccine clinic. I went down the route of signing up to the hse portal for the vaccine. I wasn't expecting the vaccine so quick. My employer rang me one day to say there's a clinic popping up and recommended for me to leave my phone on all the time, to have it charged, to have it on me at all times.

Eventually I got a call to say there's a vaccine available. I made it my business to turn up for the vaccine.

I work in the country and I don't know anyone in Dublin and I don't know any of the teachers who were vaccinated. I'm telling my story about how I was added to the end of a vaccine clinic.

I can't see anything wrong with what happened from the Beacon. They were probably dipping into the community for one or 2 or 3 people in case there were any vaccine spares at the end of a clinic. It's possible one or two people from the school were put on standby and then when the day came and progressed, they got a call to gather 20 people. They probably never anticipated 20 no-shows and 20 spares. There will be a lot more of this as time goes on. The vaccines are just so precious. Clinics will have to dip into communities to use up any spares at the end of clinics. I don't think it's very fair to put vulnerable people into a standby mode for a couple of days in case a vaccine becomes available for them. I think that might cause more harm than good. I know if my mother got a call like that, that would cause her anxiety. I think it's only fair to give those on the list to receive the vaccine, an appointment for a guaranteed vaccine and not leave them hanging and waiting in case one becomes available.

Who are people to say these teachers are not worthy of a vaccine? Nobody here knows them or their circumstances. My vaccine has provided a level of protection for myself but also to my family and my work and my partner too. So I don't see 20 vulnerable people denied vaccine. I see 20 more people vaccinated that will lead to less spread of this disease.

They're not from the community near the Beacon.
That's 100% fact.

I'll say they're not worthy if they take someone else's place who are really in need of it. If you haven't heard the stories of people within the Beacon and immediate vacinity in the last few days you must be deaf.

Like there was a guy who is terminally ill and the only thing he wants is to die from his terminal illness and not get covid to hasten his last few moments.

But ya I suppose if someone less worthy can push him and people aside then that's fine!

elefant

RoseStick wrote: »

They were probably dipping into the community for one or 2 or 3 people in case there were any vaccine spares at the end of a clinic. It's possible one or two people from the school were put on standby and then when the day came and progressed, they got a call to gather 20 people.

Do you think the CEO of the hospital is usually the one personally doing this dipping?

am_zarathustra

Cyrus wrote: »

something i posted from the 25th of March is outdated, i'd wait for some more data to emerge before putting the vunerable at risk if its all the same to you.

I assume given this new data that if all the staff in a hospital are vaccinated they will be doing away with current protocols when dealing with vulnerable patients immediately?

also this is based on one study of 4,000 people, even the author of the article doesn't share your certainty.

Cyrus wrote: »

it wont though, there is widespread misunderstanding of how the vaccine works, it wont stop you from getting covid or from transmitting it, it just means you wont get badly sick if you get covid.

This is what you said. In fact it will stop a large number of people both getting and transmitting the virus. In a small number of cases you may contract and have a sufficiently high viral load to still transmit but normal SD will more than suffice in these cases.

This is a nuanced scientific argument based on emerging data..........scientist rarely use definitive language with serious data and a peer review. Can I ask what your science background is that you are so confident in giving advice on this topic using FAQs from a blog?

This is all rather good news, best at least take a small wins we can at the moment

Treppen

elefant wrote: »

Do you think the CEO of the hospital is usually the one personally doing this dipping?

...and what community did he dip into?

The Beacon community... I think not.

First Up

Lillyfae wrote:

So it's better to give them to my children's teachers, in case I be accused of favoritism by some rando on Boards.ie. Gotcha.

The point being that you will be accused of favouritism no matter who you give them to.

Cyrus

am_zarathustra wrote: »

This is what you said. In fact it will stop a large number of people both getting and transmitting the virus. In a small number of cases you may contract and have a sufficiently high viral load to still transmit but normal SD will more than suffice in these cases.

This is a nuanced scientific argument based on emerging data..........scientist rarely use definitive language with serious data and a peer review. Can I ask what your science background is that you are so confident in giving advice on this topic using FAQs from a blog?

This is all rather good news, best at least take a small wins we can at the moment

sorry i wasnt as up to date as you are professor, as i said im sure if you are correct and the science supports you that hospitals will remove all of the protocols now that their staff are vaccinated.

what i posted was the general guidance that everyone has given up until yesterday it seems.

First Up

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Are you deliberately telling lies now to try to spread blame. The HSE had no involvement in contacting the school, as you well know.

I think it was the HSE who told the school they couldn't use all of the vaccines. Who else could it have been?

Lillyfae

First Up wrote: »

The point being that you will be accused of favouritism no matter who you give them to.

If they are being vaccinated in line with scheduling?

The Beacon and St Gerard's accept and admit that what happened was wrong- why is it so difficult for you?

First Up

Lillyfae wrote:

The Beacon and St Gerard's accept and admit that what happened was wrong- why is it so difficult for you?

You said it would take you only a few seconds to find recipients for vaccines. I've asked you how you could find the most deserving recipients in so short a time.

Anyone could find recipients quickly. That's what the Beacon did with St Gerard's and they are getting hammered over it

josip

Lillyfae wrote: »

If they are being vaccinated in line with scheduling?

The Beacon and St Gerard's accept and admit that what happened was wrong- why is it so difficult for you?

It's an anonymous discussion board on the internet so posters have nothing to lose by entrenching in ridiculous positions.
In the real world, where people have names, and there are consequences to actions, they are usually more willing to admit wrongdoing.

Lillyfae

First Up wrote: »

You said it would take you only a few seconds to find recipients for vaccines. I've asked you how you could find the most deserving recipients in so short a time.

Anyone could find recipients quickly. That's what the Beacon did with St Gerard's and they are getting hammered over it

All very innocent then? Nothing to see here? Why have we any lockdown at all?

Cluedo Monopoly

josip wrote: »

It's an anonymous discussion board on the internet so posters have nothing to lose by entrenching in ridiculous positions.
In the real world, where people have names, and there are consequences to actions, they are usually more willing to admit wrongdoing.

Great point!