Factory Build Home/Modular Homes

jayo94

Del2005 wrote: »

Have you checked with the council if you will be able to build a one off house? Are there any sites available for building or will you need change of use and how much will the site cost?

I'd be doing that before I start pricing the cost to build.

I have my eye on a site for sale subject to planning. Have a pre-planning meeting in a couple of weeks.

purplefields

dubrov wrote: »

I don't think you'll find any savings going with a factory built house as it will still need to meet building regs

Why do you think that?

We've also been looking at Factory built houses and they are a fraction of the cost of hiring labour in Ireland to do a standard build.

The houses are also built in the EU, so I imagine they'll meet regulations.

I see massive savings to be made - or at least a house built at a 'normal' price.

jayo94

Deeec wrote: »

Jayo how much do you have to spend on the site? Affordable sites that you will get planning on are hard to find in most areas.
Getting planning permission could also be an issue. I would think spending €275K on a house in an estate would be a much cheaper option.

Have an eye on a site for sale subject to planning and have to be able to demonstrate local need requirement. Have a preplanning meeting in the next couple of weeks. I can't justify paying €275 for a house in an estate, I'd rather wait a few years and hope the god prices become a bit more realistic!

jayo94

purplefields wrote: »

Why do you think that?

We've also been looking at Factory built houses and they are a fraction of the cost of hiring labour in Ireland to do a standard build.

The houses are also built in the EU, so I imagine they'll meet regulations.

I see massive savings to be made - or at least a house built at a 'normal' price.

I agree with your opinion, it seems like an affordable option for those with a small budget. (I know there are more costs that what these companies quote). The prices of houses at the moment is crazy. I'd much prefer to at least toy with the idea of one of these houses rather than committing to a life in a cramped estate. I've nothing against estates I'd just rather my own space and privacy, I'm just trying to see can I build one of these homes rather than spending the same amount on a 3 bed semi D. I know where I'd be happiest.

Deeec

jayo94 wrote: »

Have an eye on a site for sale subject to planning and have to be able to demonstrate local need requirement. Have a preplanning meeting in the next couple of weeks. I can't justify paying €275 for a house in an estate, I'd rather wait a few years and hope the god prices become a bit more realistic!

Best of luck Jayo. I hope it works out for you. Building your own home is very rewarding. Its hard work and big headaches but worth it when you move in.
Have you seen any modular houses built near you - it would be great if you could get in touch with them as they will be able to advise on the benefits and the pitfalls.

purplefields

Jayo94 - I was considering getting a team of barristers to build the house as it may work out cheaper!

sydthebeat

jayo94 wrote: »

I might be able to get buy a site get planning/groundworks/foundation done with deposit. Leaving me with 200k from the bank build the house. Am I in dreamland or is it maybe achievable. Some advice and info is all I'm looking for.

and believe it or not you are not the first to ask for such similar advice on here, and the advice is invariably the same each time.

if it looks too good to be true it normally is.

where these modular homes builds tend to fall down is on certification and proving that they comply with irish building regulations.
you have already mentioned in this thread "international building regulations" and "EU regulations".... but im afraid youve no idea of the requirement of whats required to build in Ireland.

Irish regulations are extremely onerous

any mortgage company will only lend to you if the way you are building is certified to comply with ALL Irish building regs.
These modular homes tend to have difficulty in proving this... and the ones that are able to prove it, tend not to be any cheaper than traditional building costs in Ireland.

you certainly can build a modest home for 200k... but unless you carry out a significant amount of work yourself, or get people to do work for free.. its highly highly unlikely youll get a 195 sq m irish reg compliant house finished on a greenfield site for 200k.

there are modular homes which are sold as compliant

https://www.scanhome.ie/archive/pricelist/Atlanticas.pdf

spot the price difference??

jayo94

sydthebeat wrote: »

and believe it or not you are not the first to ask for such similar advice on here, and the advice is invariably the same each time.

if it looks too good to be true it normally is.

where these modular homes builds tend to fall down is on certification and proving that they comply with irish building regulations.
you have already mentioned in this thread "international building regulations" and "EU regulations".... but im afraid youve no idea of the requirement of whats required to build in Ireland.

Irish regulations are extremely onerous

any mortgage company will only lend to you if the way you are building is certified to comply with ALL Irish building regs.
These modular homes tend to have difficulty in proving this... and the ones that are able to prove it, tend not to be any cheaper than traditional building costs in Ireland.

you certainly can build a modest home for 200k... but unless you carry out a significant amount of work yourself, or get people to do work for free.. its highly highly unlikely youll get a 195 sq m irish reg compliant house finished on a greenfield site for 200k.

there are modular homes which are sold as compliant

https://www.scanhome.ie/archive/pricelist/Atlanticas.pdf

spot the price difference??

Yes maybe it is too good to be true but for now I'll dream. You're right I have no idea of the building regulation and I never will, that's not my job. They have told me there no issue with planning and mortgage drawdown, whether or not is true I'll need to figure out. The fact that they openly say it makes me think that in fact they are telling the truth but thats another day's work. Thanks for your advice.

PapaBill

jayo94 wrote: »

Yes maybe it is too good to be true but for now I'll dream. You're right I have no idea of the building regulation and I never will, that's not my job. They have told me there no issue with planning and mortgage drawdown, whether or not is true I'll need to figure out. The fact that they openly say it makes me think that in fact they are telling the truth but thats another day's work. Thanks for your advice.

I can't speak for any specific manufacturer, but there is no reason why a factory built/modular timber frame home cannot comply with Irish regulation https://www.nsai.ie/about/news/nsai-launches-new-timber-frame/
Cost savings and quality can exceed what is achievable in an on-site, stick built house. Factors which allow this are: house modules constructed in doors, year round, no weather constraints. Timber is cut and joined using jigs and fixtures which ensure quality joints and fit up. Many times windows and doors can be pre-hung at the factory. Many times sections of exterior siding or cladding can be fitted at the factory, requiring only areas where sections are joined to be filled in on site. Much of the factory work can be performed by operatives at lower wages than those demanded by skilled trades. Once a suitable foundation and services are provided, the house can be assembled in a few days. Then plumbed, wired, insulated, dry walled and painted in a week. None of this is especially good news for traditional Irish home builders. If I was looking to build a new house it would definitely be a factory built, modular timber frame house. Many advantages of timber frame over masonry block construction.

Calahonda52

purplefields wrote: »

Why do you think that?

We've also been looking at Factory built houses and they are a fraction of the cost of hiring labour in Ireland to do a standard build.

The houses are also built in the EU, so I imagine they'll meet regulations.

I see massive savings to be made - or at least a house built at a 'normal' price.

Forty post in a few hours on a maybe, the sooner this lockdown ends the better.:D
Great well referenced language above.
Anyway, seeing as I am just off the BER training course and my pencil is still sharp, what would be really interesting is to see how the flatpack house, built at a fraction of imagined costs, will be able to get a preliminary and as built BER.
The other point is that the site will have to be fully serviced with a proper slab, to their spec in place. this slab will also need certification

beggars_bush

Check out SIP in athenry
Insulated panel houses. Hugely heat efficient and you can definitely have a fixed price for the walls and roof

purplefields

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Forty post in a few hours on a maybe, the sooner this lockdown ends the better.:D
Great well referenced language above.
Anyway, seeing as I am just off the BER training course and my pencil is still sharp, what would be really interesting is to see how the flatpack house, built at a fraction of imagined costs, will be able to get a preliminary and as built BER.
The other point is that the site will have to be fully serviced with a proper slab, to their spec in place. this slab will also need certification

The problem is that Irish construction prices for traditional houses are unaffordably high at the moment. Much of this is due to lock downs, labour shortages and cheap lending.

I do not blame people in the construction industry. I'd do the same if I was in that industry. After all, you do not know how long it'll last, and construction always seems to get hammered by recessions.

However, when prices are beyond the reach of people, they will look for alternatives. 'Flatpack' (as you refer to it), importing labour or other building methods. That's just the way it works. My own industry can now be purchased from anywhere in the world. I've just had to learn to compete.

I don't believe it's wise to dismiss all prefab houses as being unable to achieve the appropriate standards. Having to have a certified slab shouldn't be a deal breaker.

Del2005

purplefields wrote: »

I don't believe it's wise to dismiss all prefab houses as being unable to achieve the appropriate standards. Having to have a certified slab shouldn't be a deal breaker.

Nobody has said that pre fab can't meet the appropriate standards, what they are saying is that you won't save any money going for a pre fab house that meets Irish building regulations vs a traditional build.

If they are so cheap why are there so few in the country? You aren't the 1st person to think that traditional building is too expensive, who wants a €400k mortgage if they could meet regulations with a €200k building?, so why aren't people using pre fab?

looksee

jayo94 wrote: »

Yes maybe it is too good to be true but for now I'll dream. You're right I have no idea of the building regulation and I never will, that's not my job. They have told me there no issue with planning and mortgage drawdown, whether or not is true I'll need to figure out. The fact that they openly say it makes me think that in fact they are telling the truth but thats another day's work. Thanks for your advice.

There is almost no practical connection between planning and building regs. That may be slightly overstating it but getting planning and abiding by regs are not the same things at all.

I had a quick look at that link you gave and it said that the roof was a specific Kinspan standing seam, which is suitable for a very lowpitch, ie flat roof. But the roof shown on the image was a pitched and apparently tiled roof?

I did in fact do some research on a modular built house but it was only when you really started digging you realised how much was not included in the price, and the extent to which you were responsible for getting other contractors on and off site exactly to suit the firm supplying the house. We abandoned the idea precisely because of that issue.

purplefields

Del2005 wrote: »

If they are so cheap why are there so few in the country? You aren't the 1st person to think that traditional building is too expensive, who wants a €400k mortgage if they could meet regulations with a €200k building?, so why aren't people using pre fab?

There appears to be a good few of them in the EU. I'm not restricting myself to Irish companies.

Are Irish standards and regulations much more stringent than the EU average?

(It reminds me of dentist treatment thing a few years back. Some Irish dentists were pointing out negatives of going abroad for treatment. I went aboard and not only was it half the price, but the standard was superb. They had some amazing equipment in their surgeries that I had not seen in Ireland.)

beauf

Del2005 wrote: »

Nobody has said that pre fab can't meet the appropriate standards, what they are saying is that you won't save any money going for a pre fab house that meets Irish building regulations vs a traditional build.

If they are so cheap why are there so few in the country? You aren't the 1st person to think that traditional building is too expensive, who wants a €400k mortgage if they could meet regulations with a €200k building?, so why aren't people using pre fab?

Very hard to get anything built as you want it here never mind something different.

Whatever about how our standards compare internationally. I would wonder how our enforcement of regulations and adherence to those standards in practise, compare internationally.

BryanF

OP
Best of luck with your enquiries, please come back and tell us if you find a company to sign/ provide proof that the modular houses (linked to) are compliant with Irish building regs.

Gumbo

Gumbo wrote: »

I’m waiting on their engineer to call me back with regards to certification etc

Your mixing up the guarantee here with the equivalent homebond or similar guarantee.

They also will not provide the timber finish for a dwelling in most cases as they state that the planners don’t like it one bit. So you have to go for a tendered finish.

I'm still waiting on the Engineer to call me back.
They didn't like the questions I was asking over the phone. That speaks volumes to me.

Gumbo

beauf wrote: »

Whatever about how our standards compare internationally. I would wonder how our enforcement of regulations and adherence to those standards in practise, compare internationally.

Very active believe it or not
Between BCAR and the statement you have to make during the Commencement Notice about its construction, Building Control Sections and the NSAI monitoring, you can be sure it is an active area of monitoring and enforcement.

Lets put it this way, with all of the construction going on in Dublin, all of the demand for housing, not one site, not one, is being constructed using a system, materials or a product similar to what the OP has linked.

TheMilkyPirate

So hypothetical situation :

There's a site here in Wexford for 50,000 subject to planning. Say we pay the deposit and get planning on the site. What costs above what are shown in the link below would we incur? We're looking at something similar to or a bit smaller than the second house in the Balticas section, 136m2.

https://www.scanhome.ie/pricing

€206,000 to go from an empty field to a completed house only lacking paint, tiles and kitchen cabinets to me is fantastic much cheaper than a traditional build? 1,500 per sqm. From what I've seen these days it's 2,000 per sqm up for a trad build.

We have the cash to buy the site and 200k is our max we can get from the banks. As far as I know site can be used as deposit so with a few alterations to bring it under 200k what are the other costs we would come across?

Thanks

Gumbo

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

So hypothetical situation :

There's a site here in Wexford for 50,000 subject to planning. Say we pay the deposit and get planning on the site. What costs above what are shown in the link below would we incur? We're looking at something similar to or a bit smaller than the second house in the Balticas section, 136m2.

https://www.scanhome.ie/pricing

€206,000 to go from an empty field to a completed house only lacking paint, tiles and kitchen cabinets to me is fantastic much cheaper than a traditional build? 1,500 per sqm. From what I've seen these days it's 2,000 per sqm up for a trad build.

We have the cash to buy the site and 200k is our max we can get from the banks. As far as I know site can be used as deposit so with a few alterations to bring it under 200k what are the other costs we would come across?

Thanks

Price for a local contractor to put it together.
Price for certification and who inspects that it’s put together properly.
Heating and fit out.
Foundations.
Contributions, levies, connections and renewables.

Metric Tensor

Add in all site works - major part being effluent treatment system but also driveway, footpaths, etc.

TheMilkyPirate

Gumbo wrote: »

Price for a local contractor to put it together.
Price for certification and who inspects that it’s put together properly.
Heating and fit out.
Foundations.
Contributions, levies, connections and renewables.

Foundations are included and underfloor heating. Being a passive house I've read we might not need anymore than the underfloor heating. I'm surrounded by tradespeople thankfully so that would knock a good bit off the price of putting it all together. Site works will need to be done also.

Site works to prepare for foundation, Certification, contributions, levies, connections and renewables. Tradesmen to finish from the following onwards which will be done by scanhome for 100k :

Foundations and she'll + underfloor heating
Partition walls + doors + wooden floors
Interior mouldings
Ventilation heat recovery system
Toilet, bath, taps + handbasin

What's left after that possible with 100k?

Housing market is shocking so building is an option we have to explore now.

Gumbo

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

Foundations are included and underfloor heating. Being a passive house I've read we might not need anymore than the underfloor heating. I'm surrounded by tradespeople thankfully so that would knock a good bit off the price of putting it all together. Site works will need to be done also.

Site works to prepare for foundation, Certification, contributions, levies, connections and renewables. Tradesmen to finish from the following onwards which will be done by scanhome for 100k :

Foundations and she'll + underfloor heating
Partition walls + doors + wooden floors
Interior mouldings
Ventilation heat recovery system
Toilet, bath, taps + handbasin

What's left after that possible with 100k?

Housing market is shocking so building is an option we have to explore now.

Sorry yeah, just read this now. So foundations included.

Distant locations: For houses far from Galway we only do foundation and erection of the shell as it is much cheaper to have local contractors finish the house.

In this case we usually leave a kit with materials and instructions for local contractors to finish the job.

The extent to which the kit will finish the house is tailored to what each customer wants.

0lddog

What chance https://www.independent.ie/life/home-garden/homes/built-in-72-hours-this-15m-dublin-home-with-indoor-swimming-pool-went-from-foundations-to-functional-in-just-three-days-40266570.html would be permitted under present regs ?

sydthebeat

0lddog wrote: »

What chance https://www.independent.ie/life/home-garden/homes/built-in-72-hours-this-15m-dublin-home-with-indoor-swimming-pool-went-from-foundations-to-functional-in-just-three-days-40266570.html would be permitted under present regs ?

whos to say it doesnt comply??

dubrov

0lddog wrote: »

What chance https://www.independent.ie/life/home-garden/homes/built-in-72-hours-this-15m-dublin-home-with-indoor-swimming-pool-went-from-foundations-to-functional-in-just-three-days-40266570.html would be permitted under present regs ?

I had a look at a similar company called Huf Haus before and I have no doubt they would have complied easily with the building regs.
Quality appeared to be excellent but the cost was about 50% more than a conventional block/timber frame build.

72 hours is a bit misleading as well as there would have been months of design and assembly before it even arrives on site.
I'd say 4-6 months is realistic though.

The other downside was they would have to make some alterations to the original design which would have meant reapplying for planning permission.