Belfast Disturbances

overshoot

downcow wrote: »

I tiny little bit of fairness was all that was required.
Only check what’s necessary and stop the nonsense. Accept UK is left and stop using ni issue to try and punish UK.
My daughter wants to come over from Scotland next month but she will have to get her dog vaccinated for rabies first. Mad.
If Eu would sort out covid vaccines instead of worrying about my daughters dog having rabies.

Its the Uk, or more accurately GB who left and diverged from the standards implemented up to last year. You wanted to be a third country and now you are, or at least GB is as you wanted different rules. The EU is under no obligation to align itself to the rules and regulations the UK wanted IF it even knew what it wanted, and as a far bigger trading/economic block and has much less incentive. Would you expect the USA to change for you? This is the reality of Brexit, its as fair as it is to every other country in the world, its not a punishment, GB is just on the outside of it as England & Wales voted for.

I would say what isnt fair is that Boris cut off a piece of his country to get the Brexit another part of the UK wanted, but I cant see you ever sharing that view as it naturally questions the two way relationship of the Union rather than the easier option of blame someone else.

Seth Brundle

downcow wrote: »

Don’t know what you are talking about

Really?
The DUP ignored the will of the people of NI, their electorate, in terms of Brexit.
The border down the Irish sea was the only solution the UK government could come up with after the DUP scuppered May's plan to have all of the UK in the Customs Union.

Sunny Disposition

RobMc59 wrote: »

We all see our own country and its history differently to how we're viewed around the world. (Irish people do this too imo)British people are generally proud of their country's identity and history although many are aware there have been some shameful episodes in that history.This is probably the same for all countries that had a colonial past.

Ye have an awful history, constant disgrace. You think ye had ‘some’ shameful episodes??? British people should never be proud of their country’s terrible history. People shouldn’t feel guilty about things that happened before they were born, but being proud of British history is outrageous. Sick, really.

Lucy8080

lawred2 wrote: »

I said to my wife earlier in the week to wait and see how the PSNI reacts if similar carry on kicks off in a nationalist area..

Being British she didn't quite believe me.

She sees it now.

You have succeeded in misleading yourself and by extension your Wife.

The P.U.L. community need to take responsibility for what kicked off this week and start asking questions within their own community about who is failing to represent them. It has nothing to do with "themun's"

That said, with buses being hi-jacked and petrol bombed, the P.S.N.I. must have felt no choice but to release some baton rounds in the interest of saving life/property.

It was rioters from the P.U.L. community that rushed the peace wall.

I never want to see anything more lethal than a water cannon used against any kid on either side.

But, tell your wife...the baton rounds were discharged against the community that Hi-Jacked and petrol bombed a bus. That petrol bombing/Hi-Jacking was caught on T.V.

The P.S.N.I. still took a softly /softly approach.

God only knows what the P.S.N.I. were dealing with off camera.

No baton rounds were fired into Catholic/Republican/Nationalist areas. No buses were hi-Jacked in those areas either. It was P.U.L. adults/kids who went looking to provoke more trouble by attacking the peace wall/divide (looking for a reaction).

I'll take water cannon all day if that helps dampen the enthusiasm for violence on both sides.

But, the P.U.L. side must take responsibilty for putting their own children in a situation that leads to the P.S.N.I . feeling baton rounds need to be fired.

Back to my first point, you saw water cannon being used ,but did not acknowledge that baton rounds had been used too ( and not against "Nationalists").

At least be honest with yourself (and your wife) about who got the batons fired at them (This Week)!

downcow

downcow wrote: »

I tiny little bit of fairness was all that was required.
Only check what’s necessary and stop the nonsense. Accept UK is left and stop using ni issue to try and punish UK.
My daughter wants to come over from Scotland next month but she will have to get her dog vaccinated for rabies first. Mad.
If Eu would sort out covid vaccines instead of worrying about my daughters dog having rabies.

Your daughter wouldn't have to have that done if the DUP hadn't nuked the Backstop. Stop whinging about the EU and start asking questions about why your own community went full retard with Brexit. They could not have played their hand any worse.

Unionists went against the rest of the UK's wishes regarding a measure that secured their position within the UK. It was senseless vandalism against your own state.

ILoveYourVibes

Does anyone feel unease about the fact that unionists rioted for 6 nights and no water canons but nationalists riot for one and the PSNI used water canons on night one?

Also the PSNI say a lot of this is to do with the fact that they recently clamped down on Unionist drug gangs of late.

Lucy8080

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Does anyone feel unease about the fact that unionists rioted for 6 nights and no water canons but nationalists riot for one and the PSNI used water canons on night one?

Would you rather water cannon fired at you or baton rounds?
I'm delighted that water cannon have been introduced into the situation.

Six baton rounds were fired this week on the streets of Belfast.

ILoveYourVibes

Lucy8080 wrote: »

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Does anyone feel unease about the fact that unionists rioted for 6 nights and no water canons but nationalists riot for one and the PSNI used water canons on night one?

Would you rather water cannon fired at you or baton rounds?
I'm delighted that water cannon have been introduced into the situation.

Six baton rounds were fired this week on the streets of Belfast.

They were fired at nationalists too. And they had attack dogs.

https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2021/04/10/news/concerns-raised-about-the-use-of-plastic-bullets-2283219/

Are these those you are referring to?

Lucy8080

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Lucy8080 wrote: »

They were fired at nationalists too. And they had attack dogs.

...the above quote is not mine, dunno what went wrong here ....I'm replying to "Ilyv" s words .
"

Batons or water? Get these kids off the streets , whatever community you feel you represent.

Attack dogs? The kids on these streets (both sides) have dogs that would eat anyone's dogs!

ILoveYourVibes

Lucy8080 wrote: »

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Batons or water? Get these kids off the streets , whatever community you feel you represent.

Attack dogs? The kids on these streets (both sides) have dogs that would eat anyone's dogs!

Batons and canons both fired ONLY in nationalist areas.

That is definite two tier policing.

And yes we need these kids off the street. And those adults in charge of them should be ashamed.

Lucy8080

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Lucy8080 wrote: »

Batons and canons both fired ONLY in nationalist areas.

That is definite two tier policing.

And yes we need these kids off the street. And those adults in charge of them should be ashamed.

Are you sure about that?

"Batons and Cannons" both fired "ONLY" in nationalist areas? I'll take correction if that is what has happened this week!

ILoveYourVibes

Lucy8080 wrote: »

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Are you sure about that?

"Batons and Cannons" both fired "ONLY" in nationalist areas? I'll take correction if that is what has happened this week!

I will take correction too if I am wrong. But as far as I can tell yes.

I can only find reference to attack dogs canons and plastic bullets in relation to springfield and says the canon was used against nationalist youths.

I can't find evidence it was used on loyalists.

Also it was an actual loyalist who told me about the attack dogs in springfield.

https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2021/04/10/news/concerns-raised-about-the-use-of-plastic-bullets-2283219/

But I will take correction if i have not come across it yet.

IMO plastic bullets should not be fired at ANYONE in the North.

We have seen how coming down hard goes wrong in the past.

If i am wrong its just because I have not come across it yet i dont mean to mislead anyone. So if people have further info please put it here.

Lucy8080

Am I /you noticing that boards is quoting your words as " originally posted by me", and my words as " originally posted by you" ?

It's disconcerting ( and kinda funny).

ILoveYourVibes

Lucy8080 wrote: »

Am I /you noticing that boards is quoting your words as " originally posted by me", and my words as " originally posted by you" ?

It's disconcerting ( and kinda funny).

I know. Sorry it's only happening to me in this thread for some reason.

Lucy8080

OKAY! Might be a boards glitch. Talk later, today is for sport.... soccer ,racing and rugby!

ILoveYourVibes

Lucy8080 wrote: »

OKAY! Might be a boards glitch. Talk later, today is for sport.... soccer ,racing and rugby!

Enjoy!

circadian

Batattackrat wrote: »

Never going to happen, i worked in Belfast for years.

I kept neutral when asked about it and just said i don't give a ****.

Its generations and generations, neither side will ever give in.

It's minorities, it always has been. The majority of people in the North are appalled at what's happening, the vast majority just want a home, food on the table and income into the house.

https://twitter.com/stjamesswifts/status/1380232065770217474?s=20

ILoveYourVibes

circadian wrote: »

It's minorities, it always has been.

The violence is a minority. But the feelings behind it ....are much more than that.

There are many many more people who FEEL like that there. Its still very divided.

circadian

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

The violence is a minority. But the feelings behind it ....are much more than that.

There are many many more people who FEEL like that there. Its still very divided.

I'm from the North. I know many on both sides, including family. The resentment isn't as widespread as it was previously and largely, people just want to get on with life.

gmisk

circadian wrote: »

I'm from the North. I know many on both sides, including family. The resentment isn't as widespread as it was previously and largely, people just want to get on with life.

I am the same and would tend to agree.
But there are still imo a large minority who are extremely bitter, anti catholic/protestant and set in their ways.

downcow

dd973 wrote: »

It's odd how thousands of U.K citizens live happily in the ROI yet it's obvious these Loyalists/Unionists will never be happy here even after being here for generations. They seem to hate Ireland and Irish people and culture but are strident about living here, if I lived in France but hated France and the French I'd just leave.

There is the crux of the, either arrogance or downright misunderstanding, right there.
You think ireland is one 32 county country. I love ni and love the people. Your point makes no sense. I would not dare be so arrogant as to say to republicans living in this part of the UK - if you hate us get out.

downcow

Five Eighth wrote: »

It's often said that you get the political representation that you deserve. While we have had many gob****e and corrupt politicians, NI unionism seems to have a talent for producing the most dislikeable of characters. It is their leaders who are the ambassadors for those in NI who define themselves as British. I wonder do they ever consider how they are perceived as a people throughout the world? How come they cannot produce a relatable leader such as Naomi Long? Here is a woman, who I believe has unionist leanings but is respectful in tone and speaks sense.

This post is such a contradiction it is funny.
Naomi long is born reared and still part of the PUL community. She is a Protestant (quite strong faith), a unionist and loyal to the crown.

FrancieBrady

It's easy to over exaggerate what is happening, this is Belfast this morning. People with agendas will manipulate these youths for political ends.

The vast majority are not in conflict.

https://twitter.com/LauraNoonanFT/status/1380797540325548032

downcow

plibige wrote: »

You asked for fairness

But you also want to be treated like a non eu member.

Then kick up a fuss because we treat someone trying to bring a dog in from a non eu member the way we would treat a dog coming from Cameroon, or Uruguay or Thailand?

If the EU stopped exporting vaccines to the uk (which would just be doing what the uk done to the eu) then you wouldn't have half the population you have vaccinated.

So in summary, do you want us to treat you like Sudan, Tuvalu and Peru? Therefore get your dog vaccinated before you try bring it into our customs union. British exceptionalism means nothing in 2021.

If you want to take a dig at are vaccine program, i'd hope you are self sufficient (you aren't)

This is nonsense.
The dog is moving within the UK. It is not entering the Eu.
The vaccines are as they are because we are not in the Eu and our government did not get smothered in Eu red tape and got them ordered early. And are you proposing the Eu adopt a policy of not exporting?

downcow

overshoot wrote: »

Its the Uk, or more accurately GB who left and diverged from the standards implemented up to last year. You wanted to be a third country and now you are, or at least GB is as you wanted different rules. The EU is under no obligation to align itself to the rules and regulations the UK wanted IF it even knew what it wanted, and as a far bigger trading/economic block and has much less incentive. Would you expect the USA to change for you? This is the reality of Brexit, its as fair as it is to every other country in the world, its not a punishment, GB is just on the outside of it as England & Wales voted for.

I would say what isnt fair is that Boris cut off a piece of his country to get the Brexit another part of the UK wanted, but I cant see you ever sharing that view as it naturally questions the two way relationship of the Union rather than the easier option of blame someone else.

Oh I agree boris cut us off - but he gave in to Eu/Roi nonsense about threat of violence and damage to gfa. Watch the violence and damage to gfa going forward.

downcow

Lucy8080 wrote: »

You have succeeded in misleading yourself and by extension your Wife.

The P.U.L. community need to take responsibility for what kicked off this week and start asking questions within their own community about who is failing to represent them. It has nothing to do with "themun's"

That said, with buses being hi-jacked and petrol bombed, the P.S.N.I. must have felt no choice but to release some baton rounds in the interest of saving life/property.

It was rioters from the P.U.L. community that rushed the peace wall.

I never want to see anything more lethal than a water cannon used against any kid on either side.

But, tell your wife...the baton rounds were discharged against the community that Hi-Jacked and petrol bombed a bus. That petrol bombing/Hi-Jacking was caught on T.V.

The P.S.N.I. still took a softly /softly approach.

God only knows what the P.S.N.I. were dealing with off camera.

No baton rounds were fired into Catholic/Republican/Nationalist areas. No buses were hi-Jacked in those areas either. It was P.U.L. adults/kids who went looking to provoke more trouble by attacking the peace wall/divide (looking for a reaction).

I'll take water cannon all day if that helps dampen the enthusiasm for violence on both sides.

But, the P.U.L. side must take responsibilty for putting their own children in a situation that leads to the P.S.N.I . feeling baton rounds need to be fired.

Back to my first point, you saw water cannon being used ,but did not acknowledge that baton rounds had been used too ( and not against "Nationalists").

At least be honest with yourself (and your wife) about who got the batons fired at them (This Week)!

We disagree about a lot Lucy , but a very fair challenge on the baton rounds.

Seth Brundle

downcow wrote: »

This is nonsense.
The dog is moving within the UK. It is not entering the Eu.
The vaccines are as they are because we are not in the Eu and our government did not get smothered in Eu red tape and got them ordered early. And are you proposing the Eu adopt a policy of not exporting?

1. The UK was operating under EU rules during the Transition Period when it procured it's vaccines from AZ. Brexit had nothing to do with the vaccine procurement. Ireland for example could have ordered our own just like the UK but chose not to as a small country woukd not have been placed high up the queue.
2. The EU ordered from AZ before the UK.
3. The EU is behind in terms of vaccinations partly because AZ failed to meet its contractual obligations but also because we followed a plan of reciprocal exports. As it happens the UK and US did not reciprocate. Much of the UK vaccines came from the EU so yes we should stop the exports until such time as we receive some back.

downcow

circadian wrote: »

I'm from the North. I know many on both sides, including family. The resentment isn't as widespread as it was previously and largely, people just want to get on with life.

This sounds a wee bit like when paisley continually achieved the highest personal vote in the Eu but it was rare to find anyone who admitted voting for him. Lol
I can’t reflect the nationalist feelings but I can reflect the rural unionist position and feelings are strong and widespread

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's easy to over exaggerate what is happening, this is Belfast this morning. People with agendas will manipulate these youths for political ends.

The vast majority are not in conflict.

https://twitter.com/LauraNoonanFT/status/1380797540325548032

This is niave. During almost any point in the last 50 years you could have taken endless pictures just the same.

downcow

Seth Brundle wrote: »

1. The UK was operating under EU rules during the Transition Period when it procured it's vaccines from AZ. Brexit had nothing to do with the vaccine procurement. Ireland for example could have ordered our own just like the UK but chose not to as a small country woukd not have been placed high up the queue.
2. The EU ordered from AZ before the UK.
3. The EU is behind in terms of vaccinations partly because AZ failed to meet its contractual obligations but also because we followed a plan of reciprocal exports. As it happens the UK and US did not reciprocate. Much of the UK vaccines came from the EU so yes we should stop the exports until such time as we receive some back.

The above is still nonsense.
.... and how would you stop the exports. Unfortunately for you the Irish protocol is a back door into UK Unless you are going to try and use article 16 again. I can’t wait lol