Belfast Disturbances

Fionn1952

I've said it before, but no matter how many times Unionism gets screwed by the Tories, going right back to the foundation of NI, they just never seem to lose faith. Always so eager to believe that this time it will be different, this time they'll keep their promise. Given that for generations, they've demonstrated that they'll take whatever they're given and come back for more, why would the Tories bother changing?

Rob's accusations that others are deflecting by discussing Boris (while laughably ignoring that he was brought up by someone from a strongly Unionist viewpoint) is unsurprising, but after several years of his assurances that the British are getting their cake this time, and it is only a matter of time before the EU blinks....well I can see why he's comfortable in that company.

Seth Brundle

RobMc59 wrote: »

Seth,you must live in a bunker if you`ve never heard that said before!:rolleyes:

You're still making claims that we can only assume are untrue. Doesn't say much for your argument if you need to do that.

RobMc59

Seth Brundle wrote: »

That particular article is just saying that the checks are burdensome but sure we all warned of this in advance. It doesnt make a comparison that says NI has seen more checks than major ports in France and Holland.

Eventually found it,apologies for delay.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-56760658

Seth Brundle

RobMc59 wrote: »

Eventually found it,apologies for delay.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-56760658

I suspect that is simply down to a lack of exports of products of animal origin from the UK to the EU

CelticRambler

Seth Brundle wrote: »

I suspect that is simply down to a lack of exports of products of animal origin from the UK to the EU

Could also be that EU importers know what they have to have in the way of documentation, so they make sure it's in order before the load is put on a ship. NI importers weren't told what they needed to do, then they were told they didn't need to do anything, and finally they were given a 7-day deadline to do way more than they ever thought they'd have to.

I'd be wary of those claims, too - the guy gives numbers for Rotterdam, but compares NI to France. Rotterdam isn't in France ... :rolleyes:

downcow

RobMc59 wrote: »

I`d wager francie is expecting `changes` to the interpretation of the protocol which is why he`s currently pulled his horns in,trying to divert attention to johnson. :rolleyes:

Yes. He and other posters know my post was clearly referring to boris as a fool and yet he continues to imply I trust him and am putting my faith in him. Nothing could be further from the truth. But Francie shouldn’t trust him either.

downcow

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Are you referring to the unsubstantiated claims by Martin Ingram? Even the Irish Times reckons it's bull: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/mcguinness-smear-does-not-hold-up-1.1012550?mode=amp

The Belfast telegraph done very detailed article years ago demonstrating how the derry brigade of the ira failed in every action for many years at the end of the troubles. In a sense they were on ceasefire (unknown to the volunteers on the ground) long before the rest of the country. They put that down to M McG work as an agent.
Check the stats for yourself

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

Yes. He and other posters know my post was clearly referring to boris as a fool and yet he continues to imply I trust him and am putting my faith in him. Nothing could be further from the truth. But Francie shouldn’t trust him either.

I learned my lesson with British Tories a long time ago downcow. So much so I was telling you a long time ago that you would get shafted. You disagreed and you were shafted, several times.

The wee girl that does marching band programme on Facebook page that was on the BBC's Spotlight last night was asking why unionists do it over and over and over again - 'trust the British'.

Maybe the new generation of Unionist is beginning to cop on...there is nothing for them in the UK anymore.

Crooked Jack

downcow wrote: »

A number of posters here (can’t remember if you were one) said that all the rules eg about soil entering the Eu were not up for negotiation.
Whether you like it or not the street violence focused minds and I will predict that many rules which apply to the rest of the world will be eased, no matter what posters here say

It really didnt and I'm really sick of listening to unionists claim they dont condone violence while going on to condone violence

Crooked Jack

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Are you referring to the unsubstantiated claims by Martin Ingram? Even the Irish Times reckons it's bull: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/mcguinness-smear-does-not-hold-up-1.1012550?mode=amp

The "such and such was a british agent" allegations from unionists always confused me.
Surely he'd be a hero to them, then?

Seth Brundle

Crooked Jack wrote: »

The "such and such was a british agent" allegations from unionists always confused me.
Surely he'd be a hero to them, then?

Plus it would also mean that the British government were behind a number of killings of civilians, mainly on the unionist side. Can't see the unionists admitting that!

c.p.w.g.w

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I don't want anyone to attack protestants in anyway. BUT

You can't be a member of any of these bands and be a catholic.

In fact for most of them including the orange order you can't be even MARRIED to a catholic or have one catholic parent.

Most of them won't allow muslims to join.

You can't join many of them if you are gay.

And for the orange order you can't even join if you are just a liberal even if you are a protestant if you have been a member of labor for instance.

I think you need to admit that these bands are not very diverse. To say the least.

Also the idea that these bands don't have the same membership requirements as the orange order ...well some of them have worse requirements ...

I mean the Royal black you can't even have a catholic friend more or less.


And even if all the bands are not a part of the orange order ...they all part take in the orange festival.



I mean these are not part of the orange order. They are just a band called the Pride of Ardoyne. But they march with the names of loyalist paramilitaries on their backs.

And by the way i don't want to get rid of the orange order. I would be MORE in favor of changes coming from within the orange order and the other marching bands.

I mean WHY don't any of these bands march in BELFAST PRIDE ETC???

Show people they are changing?

And by the way i don't want anyone to go about attacking these bands etc not even verbally. But i think some things can be criticized.

I think you have to admit the festivals they take part on on the 12th ....they can be be seen as places simply where they burn the irish flag.

I mean they seem to like playing offensive songs around catholic areas and not want catholics to join these bands etc or feel welcome..and that is not just the orange order.

Have heard of the orange order being compared to KKK by a number of folks, I think it's fairly accurate

Crooked Jack

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Plus it would also mean that the British government were behind a number of killings of civilians, mainly on the unionist side. Can't see the unionists admitting that!

Exactly, it makes no sense. More than likely it's just another "this doesnt make sense but I think it will wind the fenians up" type thing. A bit like that Bobby Sands sausage supper song.

RobMc59

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Plus it would also mean that the British government were behind a number of killings of civilians, mainly on the unionist side. Can't see the unionists admitting that!

What exactly are you suggesting about Martin Mcguinness here?Can you substantiate those claims?

Crooked Jack

RobMc59 wrote: »

What exactly are you suggesting about Martin Mcguinness here?Can you substantiate those claims?

The quote was "such and such was a British agent."

FrancieBrady

Crooked Jack wrote: »

The quote was "such and such was a British agent."

They don't like the logical conclusion of the accusations Jack.

RobMc59

Crooked Jack wrote: »

The quote was "such and such was a British agent."

His convictions were fairly minor and I said he was allegedly a British agent.

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I learned my lesson with British Tories a long time ago downcow. So much so I was telling you a long time ago that you would get shafted. You disagreed and you were shafted, several times.

The wee girl that does marching band programme on Facebook page that was on the BBC's Spotlight last night was asking why unionists do it over and over and over again - 'trust the British'.

Maybe the new generation of Unionist is beginning to cop on...there is nothing for them in the UK anymore.

We are the british

downcow

Crooked Jack wrote: »

It really didnt and I'm really sick of listening to unionists claim they dont condone violence while going on to condone violence

I am not condoning violence.

Sure you go on believing it’s all coincidence

If you think

downcow

Crooked Jack wrote: »

The "such and such was a british agent" allegations from unionists always confused me.
Surely he'd be a hero to them, then?

Not at all. He was a nasty evil piece of work, responsible for numerous torture and death. He then double crosses his own for self interest Not my type of hero

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

We are the british

You identify as British...the British in the context of this point live in Great Britain and the British Tory government keep shafting you. You are expendable when selfish British interests are at stake and always have been, along with Nationalists.

You need to accept this, as that young Unionist on Spotlight has.

cameramonkey

downcow wrote: »

We are the british

I think we got that.

RobMc59

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You identify as British...the British in the context of this point live in Great Britain and the British Tory government keep shafting you. You are expendable when selfish British interests are at stake and always have been, along with Nationalists.

You need to accept this, as that young Unionist on Spotlight has.

I see you're at it again.Your own government has acknowledged those born in NI are British yet you continue to spout the same load of old cobblers about 'choosing to identify '.

6541

downcow wrote: »

We are the british

You consider yourself British - But half the people that you share your land mass with aren't.

lurleen lumpkin

RobMc59 wrote: »

I see you're at it again.Your own government has acknowledged those born in NI are British yet you continue to spout the same load of old cobblers about 'choosing to identify '.

Oh dear.

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You identify as British...the British in the context of this point live in Great Britain and the British Tory government keep shafting you. You are expendable when selfish British interests are at stake and always have been, along with Nationalists.

You need to accept this, as that young Unionist on Spotlight has.

You need to accept the headline on our local radio etc from the spotlight poll ie their is an increase on the number who would vote to stay in the U.K. compared to same pollster last time.
Hardly music to your ears

downcow

6541 wrote: »

You consider yourself British - But half the people that you share your land mass with aren't.

Far more than half. It’s more like 5:1

Fionn1952

downcow wrote: »

Far more than half. It’s more like 5:1

*citation needed*

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

You need to accept the headline on our local radio etc from the spotlight poll ie their is an increase on the number who would vote to stay in the U.K. compared to same pollster last time.
Hardly music to your ears

Would vote to stay if the poll was held TODAY. Now look at the rest of findings.

McMurphy

downcow wrote: »

We are the british

Yet you chose Northern Irish on your census form, despite British being an option available to you.

downcow wrote: »

I have just completed census recently and I ticked the box Northern Irish, but I am every bit as british as I ever was. So when you do your sums don’t assume Northern Irish are less british than those who tick british