Why do people hate on SUV drivers?

magicbastarder

e.g.

The royal borough of Kensington and Chelsea is in the top three districts for the sale of large SUVs, said the report. More Range Rovers were sold in Kensington and Chelsea than anywhere else; with one in 10 new cars registered in the borough belonging to the Land Rover brand of SUV.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/apr/07/stereotype-of-chelsea-tractor-reflects-reality-of-urban-suv-sales-says-report

colm_mcm

So you’re saying rich people are buying Range Rovers?

liamog

colm_mcm wrote: »

It’s specifically large SUVs sold new.

If you go to the data, you'll see that it's not. Here's a table from the report.
To me the report show's a statistically insignificant split between the types of cars registered in urban and rural areas, except for Large SUVs which are more likely to registered in rural areas.

These include the BMW 5 Series and X5,
Mercedes-Benz E Class, the Land Rover Discovery, Range
Rover and Range Rover Sport, the Audi A6 and Q7 and the
Volvo XC90.

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5ebd0080238e863d04911b51/t/6065dbeb73734b58372d797b/1617288180453/Mindgames+On+Wheels+-+how+advertising+sold+false+promises+of+safety+and+superiority+with+SUVs.pdf

markpb

stephenmarr wrote: »

Love my Volvo XC90. High seating position is a godsend, full adult 7 seats comes in very handy. Dont care about speed just waft about in comfort.

What’s the advantage of the high seating position? I recently moved from a saloon (Insignia) to a CUV/SUV thing (Model X) because I needed four seats for young children in car seats. I can’t see any benefit to me in being a bit higher off the road. It’s actually harder to negotiate tight corners like car parks but that’s probably something that I’ll adapt to. It is a tiny bit easier when inserting children into their thrones but it’s not so important that I’d cry if it disappeared in the morning.

liamog

colm_mcm wrote: »

So you’re saying rich people are buying Range Rovers?

I think you've nailed it, why do people hate on SUV drivers? because they can afford to buy them.

magicbastarder

some people like the higher viewpoint. some popular opinion would have you believe that is more common among nervous or more insecure drivers, but i don't know if there's any data to back that claim up.
that said, i also was curious as to why it's 'a godsend'.

stephenmarr

markpb wrote: »

What’s the advantage of the high seating position? I recently moved from a saloon (Insignia) to a CUV/SUV thing (Model X) because I needed four seats for young children in car seats. I can’t see any benefit to me in being a bit higher off the road. It’s actually harder to negotiate tight corners like car parks but that’s probably something that I’ll adapt to. It is a tiny bit easier when inserting children into their thrones but it’s not so important that I’d cry if it disappeared in the morning.

Better visibility, ive been driving 4x4 for years never once kerbed an alloy

Eric Cartman

liamog wrote: »

I think you've nailed it, why do people hate on SUV drivers? because they can afford to buy them.

Absolutely, I always find the more poorly maintained / cheaper a car someone drives, the more likely they are to make a glib remark about cars like a Range Rover.

stephenmarr

FrankC21 wrote: »

It so high You might need stairs to get of it.

Good job im 6 foot

Eric Cartman

FrankC21 wrote: »

It so high You might need stairs to get of it.

The Range Rover comes with deployable side steps to allow shorter people easily climb in, quite handy in reality.

magicbastarder

liamog wrote: »

I think you've nailed it, why do people hate on SUV drivers? because they can afford to buy them.

i'm sure some people do have that reaction. but it'd be kinda funny to tar everyone who has an objection to SUVs with that brush.

liamog

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Absolutely, I always find the more poorly maintained / cheaper a car someone drives, the more likely they are to make a glib remark about cars like a Range Rover.

I think it goes with pretty much anything in out society, people are so quick to condemn others who spend money on things they don't themselves. I'm sure many people would be annoyed about how much I spend on technology, whereas I don't understand people who spend money on a week in Spain

liamog

magicbastarder wrote: »

i'm sure some people do have that reaction. but it'd be kinda funny to tar everyone who has an objection to SUVs with that brush.

Is it any more unfair than hating a person solely based on the car they choose to drive?

magicbastarder

stephenmarr wrote: »

Better visibility, ive been driving 4x4 for years never once kerbed an alloy

not sure i follow; i've never kerbed an alloy, and i don't think it's anything to do with a high or low seating position?

magicbastarder

liamog wrote: »

Is it any more unfair than hating a person solely based on the car they choose to drive?

i think this is a case of 'hate the game, don't hate the player'.

there may be people who do hate SUV drivers, but the debate in this thread seems to be more about a dislike/objection to SUVs rather than a dislike of the drivers per se?

markpb

stephenmarr wrote: »

Better visibility, ive been driving 4x4 for years never once kerbed an alloy

Isn’t it proven that the visibility out of taller cars is worse, at least for things or people closer to it?

Trucks are taller again than SUVs and yet they’ve require at least three mirrors on each side and one on the front just so the driver has some home of setting what’s going on. Surely they have amazing visibility?

magicbastarder

anyway, a reaction of 'the reason you hate SUVs is because you're jealous' could also speak to insecurity in the person who claims that, rather than insecurity in the people that's aimed at.

stephenmarr

FrankC21 wrote: »

It so high You might need stairs to get of it.

markpb wrote: »

Isn’t it proven that the visibility out of taller vehicles is worse, at least for things or people closer to the car? Trucks are bigger again than SUVs and yet they’ve require at least three mirrors on the sides and one on the front just to see what’s going on. Surely they have amazing visibility?

Well ive owned most types of vehicles, 2 seaters, saloons, estates, coupes and by far the best visibility are the 4x4's i have owned.

magicbastarder

but the one advantage of visibility you mentioned as an advantage was not kerbing your wheels?
an expensive way of protecting your wheels, no?
which i still don't see the logic of.

stephenmarr

magicbastarder wrote: »

i find bemusing the claim from volvo that no one in an xc90 will die after 2020. it's going to achieve it through sheer bulk.
looks like the minimum kerb weight is 2.1 tons.

Think its more down to the safety measures volvo have designed

liamog

Have you not seen examples in other areas of people with irrational hatred of things with perceived high cost of entry?
People will jump through hoops to justify why the thing they don't have is not worth having at all.

stephenmarr

magicbastarder wrote: »

but the one advantage of visibility you mentioned as an advantage was not kerbing your wheels?
an expensive way of protecting your wheels, no?
which i still don't see the logic of.

another poster said

''It’s actually harder to negotiate tight corners like car parks''

iv never had an issue with tight car parks.

magicbastarder

liamog wrote: »

Have you not seen examples in other areas of people with irrational hatred of things with perceived high cost of entry?
People will jump through hoops to justify why the thing they don't have is not worth having at all.

of course i have.
but that doesn't mean everyone does it. it's a completely disingenuous argument to use in a thread where people are for the most part engaging in debate in good faith, and willing to discuss their reasons.

Eric Cartman

stephenmarr wrote: »

another poster said

''It’s actually harder to negotiate tight corners like car parks''

iv never had an issue with tight car parks.

Yeah or 'harder to park'

I daily a Range Rover around Dublin City and have never found it hard to navigate streets or fit in to parking spots.

The only problem places are multi storey car parks like the Irish life or Fleet Street which are problems for any medium or larger car.

liamog

magicbastarder wrote: »

of course i have.
but that doesn't mean everyone does it. it's a completely disingenuous argument to use in a thread where people are for the most part engaging in debate in good faith, and willing to discuss their reasons.

Well so far, I'm failing to see any consistent argument other than sight lines on large American pickup trucks, and the SUVs that are built on similar platforms.

How that quite extends to the common SUVs on Irish roads like Qashqai's I'm still failing to see.

stephenmarr

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Yeah or 'harder to park'

I daily a Range Rover around Dublin City and have never found it hard to navigate streets or fit in to parking spots.

The only problem places are multi storey car parks like the Irish life or Fleet Street which are problems for any medium or larger car.

Im down in lovely Co Clare. plenty of open air here.

Damien360

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Yeah or 'harder to park'

I daily a Range Rover around Dublin City and have never found it hard to navigate streets or fit in to parking spots.

The only problem places are multi storey car parks like the Irish life or Fleet Street which are problems for any medium or larger car.

Try the quik park on queens St. First level down is no issue. Getting to the next is tight and you risk clipping your rear left wheel off the kerb on turn. I get around it with a estate skoda superb and park sensors screaming all around but I always wonder how the big SUV’s like yours get around it.

Eric Cartman

Damien360 wrote: »

Try the quik park on queens St. First level down is no issue. Getting to the next is tight and you risk clipping your rear left wheel off the kerb on turn. I get around it with a estate skoda superb and park sensors screaming all around but I always wonder how the big SUV’s like yours get around it.

It probably would be a bit of a challenge, that said those type of car parks would be problems for someone in a 5 series. A badly designed carpark or 2 isn't going to stop me driving what I want ha :pac:

magicbastarder

liamog wrote: »

Well so far, I'm failing to see any consistent argument other than sight lines on large American pickup trucks, and the SUVs that are built on similar platforms.

as i mentioned, for me the main thing i find myself disliking about them is their unnecessary height; people who drive them often claim the increased visibility is a bonus, but that increased visibility comes almost by definition at a cost of reduced visibility for other road users, so it's kind of an arms race in the visibility stakes.
if you're sitting in your car at a junction, and someone driving a car of equal height pulls alongside, it's obviously not going to affect your visibility as much as someone pulling alongside in a vehicle whose door handle you are now staring at.
and from a pedestrian or cyclist point of view, they also affect sightlines, etc.
i used to - before the pox hit - do 20km each way on the bike to get to work. and it *is* safer to cycle behind a car you can see over. you have much more chance of anticipating what that driver might do if you can also see what they're seeing.
out walking, you can step out from behind a 'normal' car and the oncoming motorist will have been able to see you, and you to have seen them. with a car six foot tall, both of you have lost advantage here.

stephenmarr

magicbastarder wrote: »

as i mentioned, for me the main thing i find myself disliking about them is their unnecessary height; people who drive them often claim the increased visibility is a bonus, but that increased visibility comes almost by definition at a cost of reduced visibility for other road users, so it's kind of an arms race in the visibility stakes.
if you're sitting in your at a junction, and someone driving a car of equal height pulls alongside, it's obviously not going to affect your visibility as much as someone pulling alongside in a vehicle whose door handle you are now staring at.
and from a pedestrian or cyclist point of view, they also affect sightlines, etc.
i used to - before the pox hit - do 20km each way on the bike to get to work. and it *is* safer to cycle behind a car you can see over. you have much more chance of anticipating what that driver might do if you can also see what they're seeing.
out walking, you can step out from behind a 'normal' car and the oncoming motorist will have been able to see you, and you to have seen them. with a car six foot tall, both of you have lost advantage here.

We all drive different vehicles the world would be very boring if every vehicle was the same.

As for your points , you have to be responsible for your own safety.
Im not going to worry about ''reduced visibility for other road users''

magicbastarder

stephenmarr wrote: »

We all drive different vehicles the world would be very boring if every vehicle was the same.

As for your points , you have to be responsible for your own safety.
Im not going to worry about ''reduced visibility for other road users''

yeah, that's a common response.

magicbastarder

stephenmarr wrote: »

the world would be very boring if every vehicle was the same.

though that did give me a chuckle, that what is preventing the world from being boring is that some people drive cars over a foot taller than other cars, and that's what keeps life exciting.

liamog

magicbastarder wrote: »

as i mentioned, for me the main thing i find myself disliking about them is their unnecessary height; people who drive them often claim the increased visibility is a bonus, but that increased visibility comes almost by definition at a cost of reduced visibility for other road users, so it's kind of an arms race in the visibility stakes.

Ahh yes, I do agree with you here, I kind of missed it with all the arguing about what is an SUV and driver sight lines.

.anon.

liamog wrote: »

I think you've nailed it, why do people hate on SUV drivers? because they can afford to buy them.

The old "dont mind them there only jealous!!11" argument gives far more of an insight into the minds of the kind of people who justify to themselves the expense of buying financing a far bigger car than they need. Like most people in full-time employment, I could easily afford a PCP deal on a Tucson or a Qashqai if I was that way inclined.

Personally, I dislike non-4x4 SUVs because they make no utilitarian sense, and also because throughout the >40 hours I spend on urban and suburban roads every week, I see them being driven particularly badly in comparison with other vehicles.

Someone earlier in the thread cited better visibility as a practical reason for owning one, because in all the years he's been driving a 4x4, he's never kerbed an alloy. It'd be cheaper to just learn to drive properly.

JustAThought

Along with blocking the sightlines for other normal car users and blocking sightlines for people trying to get out of parking spaces, SUV drivers are usually totally distracted and spend more time with theor heads half twisted back trying to referee in car fights between their kids or switching their tables on/off and generally being a danger to themsleves and everyone else on the road.

That and the fear of what the football team of infants and jaded kids will do to your paintwork when they are released simultaneously from their boosters.

liamog

.anon. wrote: »

The old "dont mind them there only jealous!!11" argument gives far more of an insight into the minds of the kind of people who justify to themselves the expense of buying financing a far bigger car than they need. Like most people in full-time employment, I could easily afford a PCP deal on a Tucson or a Qashqai if I was that way inclined.

You are the second person to make it, but I still don't get the point. It's nobody else's business as to why I spend money on the things I do, whether I choose to drive a 2005 Yaris or 2020 Mini is my decision to make.

If anybody chooses to have an opinion on what I do with my money, then yes I'm going to blame jealousy, because quite frankly why else would it occupy any of their thoughts.

beauf

SUVs are largely a fashion statement. I like them, but they are some of the most inefficient vehicles around.

It would be someone bringing the kids to school in a tank, because they like tanks.

NSAman

beauf wrote: »

SUVs are largely a fashion statement. I like them, but they are some of the most inefficient vehicles around.

It would be someone bringing the kids to school in a tank, because they like tanks.

Yeah but think how cool it’ll be when Mammy rolls up to pick up Tarquinius in a hummer EV .... and she is being kind to the planet!

beauf

NSAman wrote: »

Yeah but think how cool it’ll be when Mammy rolls up to pick up Tarquinius in a hummer EV .... and she is being kind to the planet!

Be cooler in an actual tank.

Bit smoky maybe... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fh3lf2i5mWc&ab_channel=MasterMilo

.anon.

liamog wrote: »

You are the second person to make it, but I still don't get the point. It's nobody else's business as to why I spend money on the things I do, whether I choose to drive a 2005 Yaris or 2020 Mini is my decision to make.

If anybody chooses to have an opinion on what I do with my money, then yes I'm going to blame jealousy, because quite frankly why else would it occupy any of their thoughts.

The proliferation of the things in urban areas is everyone's business. The amount of public space they occupy is everyone's business. That they're so often driven by people who show no awareness of their surroundings is everyone's business.

They're marketed so aggressively nowadays, and credit is so cheap, I don't blame people for buying them. I blame the manufacturers for creating something so obnoxious, and also governments for enabling this by focusing too heavily on emissions and not incentivising smaller cars.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

This whole argument of not being able to see the road ahead of an SUV is bollox

What's wrong that you can't stay safe by just keeping a safe distance from the car in front of you ? Why do you have to see the road up ahead ?

Simple answer is you don't !

Too many times I've been driving a bus/coach/truck and I'd be moving along work traffic in front of me and when I look in the mirror there's always some clown up my hole and poking of the right hand side of me to either push me on or get ahead of me.

All just to see the road ahead ? Bollox.

Keep a safe distance behind and you won't need to see the road ahead, look at the vehicle in front of you and don't be up it's arse. You'll see more too.

At the rate some people in this thread are going we'll have to remove Vans, trucks, buses and all sorts from the roads.

AndrewJRenko

stephenmarr wrote: »

We all drive different vehicles the world would be very boring if every vehicle was the same.

As for your points , you have to be responsible for your own safety.
Im not going to worry about ''reduced visibility for other road users''

Any practical advice for two week old babies on taking responsibility for their own safety?

https://twitter.com/ormondroyd/status/1379166345451868161?s=19

magicbastarder

liamog wrote: »

You are the second person to make it, but I still don't get the point. It's nobody else's business as to why I spend money on the things I do, whether I choose to drive a 2005 Yaris or 2020 Mini is my decision to make.

The thing though is that there's nothing else you'll buy which is so large and costs so much, and which many people *do* use as a statement of their wealth, which by definition, is used in public and which everyone else will have to see/deal with as you use it.
If you spent 5k on a watch, I wouldn't notice (or care), and same would be the case if you collected art.

I know loads of people with what you could argue are unnecessarily expensive cars - my father in law drives a long wheelbase 7 series, which has a bigger ground footprint than enormous merc GLS mentioned earlier in the thread, but I don't really have a problem with that because it doesn't affect me as another road user. My BIL drives a Porsche, and someone else I know 'drives'* two ferraris, but they're great, a ten year old could see over them.

*At least one is not drivable. Needs a new timing chain, and that's 12k job iirc.

Wibbs

I don't mind them tbh. They are what they are. Yes they're bloated and too big in many ways, but cars have gotten more bloated and bigger anyway. A 1970's BMW could be carried in the boot of a 2021 example. Our lives themselves and many of us have become pretty bloated so..

People buy them for all sorts of reasons. They're easier to get child seats in and out of I gather, some need them for actual reasons like towing and the like, they certainly feel safer for many, though mostly I suspect people buy them because it's a current trend and their suburban neighbours bought one. As it's always been.

However and though not an SUV I would suggest anyone who bought a Skoda Roomster should just be taken out and shot to reduce the risk of polluting the human gene pool any further.



That abomination is so bereft of any understanding of proportion and aesthetics that any person with two functioning eyeballs who walked into a dealership and slapped down money to buy one is not deserving of life. Yeah they can give me an itch in the centre of my head alright. I have been tempted to enquire from owners, why? sweet Jesus, why?

magicbastarder

it's just a cut'n'shut done with two completely different donor cars.

Wibbs

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

This whole argument of not being able to see the road ahead of an SUV is bollox

What's wrong that you can't stay safe by just keeping a safe distance from the car in front of you ? Why do you have to see the road up ahead ?

Simple answer is you don't

Bingo. If I can't see the road ahead because of a car or truck or bus I quite simply don't drive around them until I can see the road ahead.

Wibbs

magicbastarder wrote: »

it's just a cut'n'shut done with two completely different donor cars.

I count three. From the bumper to the A pillar it's grand and it feels perfectly fine, then from the A to the B pillar it's holy... WTF? and then they grafted a van on the back and got a double glazing salesman to install windows.

BanditLuke

We are plagued by them here in D14. There is one particular private school on Mount Anville road where you can see a hoard of them parked two deep on the roadside to pick up their kids daily with zero fcuks given for other road users. It's frankly bizarre to see how bad the driving is from the people driving them as most are clearly out of their depth.

Keyzer

Why do people hate on Rice Krispies?

It can be annoying in the kitchen when you pour Rice Krispies and they go everywhere and someone else comes along and pours a bowl of some other cereal and, while your still cleaning up the Rice Krispies, they tuck into their wholesome breakfast. Maybe it's because they think they are more superior with their fancy Special K, I have eaten basically every cereal so I have my own opinion but I'd just like others perspective.

In other news, I just picked my nose.

stephenmarr

Here's a question for all the suv bashers on this thread.
What do ye all drive and the reason you bought why you bought it.

Just for the record I drive a

2005 Xc90, it's in mint condition.
I love the extra space inside and the high driving position.