Vaccine Megathread - See OP for threadbans

JTMan

Interesting NY Times article here on what next with the Pfizer vaccines ...

- Pfizer expects to apply to the Food and Drug Administration in September for emergency authorization to administer its coronavirus vaccine to children between the ages of 2 and 11. (Previously targeted 5-11 in September, now 2-11 in September).
- White house preparing for make the vaccine "accessible to younger generations". (As previously noted, approval for 12-15 expected early next week).
- The company said it also plans to apply this month for full approval of the vaccine for use in people from ages 16 to 85 change.
- Obtaining full FDA approval would, among other things, allow the companies to market the vaccine directly to consumers. Full approval would also allow the vaccine to remain on the market as the pandemic fades. It may also make it easier for companies, government agencies, schools and other entities to require vaccination.
- Pfizer’s chief executive approached the FDA on Friday with new data that it hopes will persuade the agency to allow its vaccine to be kept at refrigerator temperatures, rather than frozen, for up to four weeks. Current limit is 5 days.
- Pfizer make up a bit more than half of all doses administered in the US so far.

All positive developments by Pfizer.

SusanC10

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Donnelly to consult with NIAC regarding the HSEs prefered plan

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/donnelly-to-consult-with-niac-over-proposed-changes-in-covid-19-vaccine-plan-1.4555336?mode=amp

Article updated now - expanded.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/with-targets-in-the-balance-what-is-going-on-with-the-vaccine-rollout-1.4555413

pc7

I’m very pro vaccinations, but have to admit I’ll be very hesitatant to have my smallies take this one. The risk to them
Is very very low of c19 I just don’t know that I’ll want to give them this at this stage.
As said I’m pro vaccination, paid for Men b for one before it was added to schedule and chicken pox vaccine.

Russman

podgeandrodge wrote: »

But then you have Denmark coming out with statements like "“the benefits of using the Covid-19 vaccine from Johnson & Johnson do not outweigh the risk of causing the possible adverse effect in those who receive the vaccine”."

So it's not just the way AZ was handled. When an EU country says the above, it's reasonable for some to disagree with the assertion that "it's been clear all along....". Not myself, but you know the point I am making.

I think this is important. Personally I don’t know enough about vaccines and thresholds of risk in medicine etc etc., so I’d pay heed to what the likes of NIAC say. Maybe they’re right, maybe they’re wrong, but something about the HSE appearing to try to work their way around a NIAC recommendation doesn’t sit right with me. I think medical guidance should be more or less sacrosanct and not subverted for ease of the rollout. If the advice changes, fine, no issue.

stephenjmcd

SusanC10 wrote: »

Article updated now - expanded.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/with-targets-in-the-balance-what-is-going-on-with-the-vaccine-rollout-1.4555413

I don't see what's updated there? No new information in it

Stheno

stephenjmcd wrote: »

I don't see what's updated there? No new information in it

Same here

daydorunrun

pc7 wrote: »

I’m very pro vaccinations, but have to admit I’ll be very hesitatant to have my smallies take this one. The risk to them
Is very very low of c19 I just don’t know that I’ll want to give them this at this stage.
As said I’m pro vaccination, paid for Men b for one before it was added to schedule and chicken pox vaccine.

100% agree. Especially with mRNA vaccines as they need to have full trials on younger people before we start rolling out to kids.

Strazdas

SusanC10 wrote: »

Article updated now - expanded.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/with-targets-in-the-balance-what-is-going-on-with-the-vaccine-rollout-1.4555413

They make some good points here. They say that leaving the over 50s waiting for weeks until supplies of J & J arrive and vaccinating the over 40s instead would be risky : what if J & J gets held up for some reason and the hundreds of thousands of doses don't materialise?

They also suggest that the plan may well be to give AZ and J & J to the under 50s - the alternative of binning those doses or sending them abroad when large sections of the population haven't even been vaccinated yet seems unthinkable.

Happydays2020

Strazdas wrote: »

They make some good points here. They say that leaving the over 50s waiting for weeks until supplies of J & J arrive and vaccinating the over 40s instead would be risky : what if J & J gets held up for some reason and the hundreds of thousands of doses don't materialise?

They also suggest that the plan may well be to give AZ and J & J to the under 50s - the alternative of binning those doses or sending them abroad when large sections of the population haven't even been vaccinated yet seems unthinkable.

Do they mention allowing people to reject a dose of AZ or JJ?

Zipppy

daydorunrun wrote: »

100% agree. Especially with mRNA vaccines as they need to have full trials on younger people before we start rolling out to kids.

I'm also very much pro vaccination (got my first pfizer jab yesterday)
if I had kiddies (mine are grown ups who are equally just waiting for their turn) there's no way I'd give them any covid vax .. not yet anyhow.
Adults can make their own mind up..kids cant.
Covid will do little harm to a 12 year old...lets have lots of trials first...LOTS!!

Strazdas

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Do they mention allowing people to reject a dose of AZ or JJ?

Well any person can reject any vaccine. When they get the text, they are told what vaccine they are receiving and asked to confirm whether they will show up for it. Therefore they are free to reject it.

CrowdedHouse

Strazdas wrote: »

Well any person can reject any vaccine. When they get the text, they are told what vaccine they are receiving and asked to confirm whether they will show up for it. Therefore they are free to reject it.

Nope

Strazdas

Strazdas wrote: »

Well any person can reject any vaccine. When they get the text, they are told what vaccine they are receiving and asked to confirm whether they will show up for it. Therefore they are free to reject it.

And get to the back of the queue?

The opt-in approach would make far more sense.

Strazdas

CrowdedHouse wrote: »

Nope

What do you mean 'nope'?? The person is asked to confirm with a yes or no by text if they will attend for the vaccination.

Strazdas

Flying Fox wrote: »

And get to the back of the queue?

The opt-in approach would make far more sense.

Well if you're offered a vaccine and refuse it, you're pretty much pushing yourself down the queue. You can hardly expect them to contact you a few days later with the offer of a different vaccine.

degsie

Zipppy wrote: »

Covid will do little harm to a 12 year old...

BUT they can transmit and potentially harm others :rolleyes:

CrowdedHouse

Strazdas wrote: »

What do you mean 'nope'?? The person is asked to confirm with a yes or no by text if they will attend for the vaccination.

I'm helping a neighbour with the booking this is the text she got today for later in the week.

No confirm or reject option

COVID-19 vaccine dose 1 appointment: , age 60 Years


- When:

- Where: Abbeycourt Hotel Vaccination Centre (CVC),

Abbeycourt Hotel

Dublin Rd,

Nenagh,

E45 KA99


- Vaccine: AstraZeneca

- Read the patient information leaflet: https://hse.ie/!8PDV4P



Bring your phone, photo ID and a face covering. If you do not bring photo ID, you cannot enter the vaccination centre.


Be on time but do not arrive more than 5 minutes before your appointment.


Read more about going to a vaccination centre: https://hse.ie/vacctr


If you need to:

- reschedule your appointment, reply "New" to this text

- ask a question about your appointment, call the COVID-19 helpline on 1850 24 1850

.



EDIT 6000 POSTS \o/

Strazdas

Strazdas wrote: »

Well if you're offered a vaccine and refuse it, you're pretty much pushing yourself down the queue. You can hardly expect them to contact you a few days later with the offer of a different vaccine.

If you're bang in the middle of the most at risk group for clotting, you shouldn't be offered a vaccine that is not recommended for you by NIAC, and not offered an alternative.

This is why the opt-in/waiver approach makes more sense.

Even the FDA decision on J&J included guidance that women under 50 should be offered an alternative vaccine.

stephenjmcd

Strazdas wrote: »

What do you mean 'nope'?? The person is asked to confirm with a yes or no by text if they will attend for the vaccination.

Nope no option on my father's one either.

Time and date and where to go that's it

ACitizenErased

Only those referred by a hospital/as a healthcare worker are given yes or no option, and its not even every hospital. Anyone who signs up by the portal or is given a date from a GP cannot say no.

hmmm

Russman wrote: »

I think this is important. Personally I don’t know enough about vaccines and thresholds of risk in medicine etc etc., so I’d pay heed to what the likes of NIAC say. Maybe they’re right, maybe they’re wrong, but something about the HSE appearing to try to work their way around a NIAC recommendation doesn’t sit right with me. I think medical guidance should be more or less sacrosanct and not subverted for ease of the rollout. If the advice changes, fine, no issue.

I agree with this. I thought the NIAC recommendation was clear, over 50s only, and administer it to younger groups only if the mRNA vaccines were unfeasible - the latter provision being for difficult groups like homeless etc., and not general usage.

I happen to disagree with the over 50s provision, particularly for males given the evidence which is currently available, but if I was the HSE I'd make the prospect of large amounts of unused vaccines NIACs problem and not try and work around it.

I don't know also who is reporting to who, but the Minister for Health needs to start taking more responsibility here in finding the balance between extending lockdowns, vaccine risk and the prospect of good vaccines going unused.

Strazdas

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Only those referred by a hospital/as a healthcare worker are given yes or no option, and its not even every hospital. Anyone who signs up by the portal or is given a date from a GP cannot say no.

Oh right, I wasn't aware of that. But the person can simply not show up of course.

SJFly

Flying Fox wrote: »

If you're bang in the middle of the most at risk group for clotting, you shouldn't be offered a vaccine that is not recommended for you by NIAC, and not offered an alternative.

This is why the opt-in/waiver approach makes more sense.

Even the FDA decision on J&J included guidance that women under 50 should be offered an alternative vaccine.

With the vaccination passports and the single dose for j&j I don't think they'd be short of people opting in. Men in particular seem extremely low risk. I don't understand why this seems to have been taken off the table.

Wolf359f

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Only those referred by a hospital/as a healthcare worker are given yes or no option, and its not even every hospital. Anyone who signs up by the portal or is given a date from a GP cannot say no.

Anyone who signs up to the portal is basically requesting a vaccine and been told which one it is. So there's no excuse/reason to refuse it (apart from having to reschedule).
Some GP's are sending texts to patients to book a slot on an online booking system, the vaccine being administered is listed and again, no need to refuse a vaccine you have booked yourself.

Russman

Flying Fox wrote: »

If you're bang in the middle of the most at risk group for clotting, you shouldn't be offered a vaccine that is not recommended for you by NIAC, and not offered an alternative.
.

Exactly this. If there happened to be the odd case of it occurring because of circumstances, well, that happens. If it becomes stated policy to do this, and it’s flagged in advance that you’ll be doing it, then I think it’s potentially a big problem.

Wolf359f

SJFly wrote: »

With the vaccination passports and the single dose for j&j I don't think they'd be short of people opting in. Men in particular seem extremely low risk. I don't understand why this seems to have been taken off the table.

Last count from the FDA, there was 1 male case under review, but I haven't heard anything since. So there is potential there for it to be given to all males 18+ if we end up having excess supply (which we very well may have, I can't see J&J delivering Q2 on schedule)

franciscanpunk

appears some GP's are nowhere near making progress on cohort 4 and 7, some even not fully through over 70s. i assume GPs will only get pfizer to administer here so should all pfizer be kept for the GP and given to the 50-59 group given cohort 4 and 7 supposed priority?

podgeandrodge

franciscanpunk wrote: »

appears some GP's are nowhere near making progress on cohort 4 and 7, some even not fully through over 70s. i assume GPs will only get pfizer to administer here so should all pfizer be kept for the GP and given to the 50-59 group given cohort 4 and 7 supposed priority?

Good few GP's with Astra stocks as discussed earlier - they are being asked to use up supplies of Astra before it goes out of date.

astrofool

The risk from AZ is tiny and has a known treatment and easily caught. Do not self diagnose yourself as vulnerable to the side effects, you're not, the CVST condition that can occur and is treatable is a very specific condition unrelated to other clotting events. If you are refusing a vaccine that may very well save your life, then that is your choice and you will need to live with the consequences of that action.

Did I mention the futility of self diagnosing yourself as vulnerable to CVST yet?

When we get to July /August/ September and have excess supplies, go and be choosy, most importantly, get a vaccine. If you already passed up a vaccine, whatever you do, don't gamble, you're not very good at calculating risk.

moonage

Up to 21 April there have been over 1,000 deaths in the UK linked to the covid vaccines, according to official sources.

There were over 700,000 adverse reactions reported. Of course this is only the tip of the iceberg as only a small proportion ever get reported.

For AstraZeneca:
Total Adverse Reactions—573,650
Total Reports—153,098
Total Fatal Outcome Reports—685

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/982453/COVID-19_AstraZenenca_Vaccine_Analysis_Print.pdf

For Pfizer:
Total Adverse Reactions—149,082
Total Reports—52,130
Total Fatal Outcome Reports—347

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/982474/Covid-19_mRNA_Pfizer_BioNTech_vaccine_analysis_print2.pdf