Vaccine Megathread - See OP for threadbans

zebastein

seamus wrote: »

The numbers who will refuse are dropping, while the numbers who will take it are increasing;
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/about-85-of-people-willing-to-get-covid-19-vaccine-survey-finds-1.4547738

Back in October, the number willing to take a vaccine was something like 55%. Now it's 85%.

This is typical and was generally expected; as more and more people get the vaccine, see no issues and talk positively about it, then hesitancy amongst the unvaccinated reduces.

I expect as we get to the under-40 cohort, they'll start driving the encouragement forward; ads asking people to register, etc.

In that latest poll, when you exclude the "unknowns", the number willing to take a vaccine is 94%

That is missing half of my point, which is that people may not jump and rush to the MVC and that the delay between the time a cohort is contacted and the cohort is vaccinated will increase a lot. Sure 80-something % of people say that they'll get the vaccine eventually. But how many people will get the first appointment they will be offered, short notice, in the middle of a work day ?



The study is interesting overall but does not give any detail about how much effort people are ready to do to get a vaccine. They theoretically want it if it comes to their door step when they are ready to get it. That also does not take into account that some people want to be vaccinated but not with AZ. Or people who already got covid and that will delay their appointment because they feel protected at the moment.



In share of the population (not eligible population):
- It took 46days for Israel to move from 60% first doses to 62.6%
- It took 38days for UK to move from 45% to 51%
- US vaccination is also getting slower, having too many doses not used in MVC and they are only reaching 45% first doses.



That is a struggle to reach all the population and make them come to get vaccinated. We'll probably reach 80% later in the year, but the idea of prioritizing by age cohort does not seem realistic to me. After 2-3weeks of vaccinating the 40-49yo, they'll see that only half of them came to their first appointment and they'll have to open to everyone to use these doses

is_that_so

duffman13 wrote: »

AZ gets an awful lot of criticism from arm chair critics. They've had huge production issues but managed to create a very effacious vaccine and are offering it to middle and low income countries at cost. At the end of the day, if it was the only show in town the clotting issue wouldn't be an issue however given we have alternatives then it's fair enough to restrict the use of it.

My issue is the constant abuse of AZ which is a bit harsh. Like every major pharmaceutical company, they looked for a vaccine, theirs worked and is suitable to be used far more widely than mRNA vaccines. They arent a company known for industrial scale production of vaccines so it was always going to be a challenge. If Sanofi had discovered it then we would probably have 20 times more supply of AZ. AZ will play a huge part in the worldwide vaccination programme

Most of the abuse is down to overpromising and the hubris of a company who've never made a vaccine before. Yes it is efficacious but the minor risks cannot be ignored especially in light of the huge numbers it will be used on. With multiple vaccines on offer it was inevitable comparisons between them would be made. It's also unfortunate for themselves and Janssen that we've found a better way to make vaccines and that their use will not be as widespread once this is over.

Jane1012

Tony H wrote: »

Got my jab 30 minutes ago ( AZ) I'm 60 and registered on the 23rd April , easiest shot ever , other half getting hers tomorrow ,
quite an emotional experience if I'm honest , the relief I'm feeling is unreal .

So you registered 4 days before you were meant to.... guess skipping the Q works

hmmm

This interview is talking about masks, but really it's about the impact of vaccines in the US. Gottlieb is saying that public health in the US should start considering lifting the requirement to wear masks indoors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQc94yLrGYM

is_that_so

Jane1012 wrote: »

So you registered 4 days before you were meant to.... guess skipping the Q works

You're not skipping the queue if you're first in line! At most a week between the top and bottom of that age group.

ArthurDayne

duffman13 wrote: »

AZ gets an awful lot of criticism from arm chair critics. They've had huge production issues but managed to create a very effacious vaccine and are offering it to middle and low income countries at cost. At the end of the day, if it was the only show in town the clotting issue wouldn't be an issue however given we have alternatives then it's fair enough to restrict the use of it.

My issue is the constant abuse of AZ which is a bit harsh. Like every major pharmaceutical company, they looked for a vaccine, theirs worked and is suitable to be used far more widely than mRNA vaccines. They arent a company known for industrial scale production of vaccines so it was always going to be a challenge. If Sanofi had discovered it then we would probably have 20 times more supply of AZ. AZ will play a huge part in the worldwide vaccination programme

It’s worth also bearing in mind (and I say this as someone who is very pro-EU), that the EU’s approach to the relationship with AZ has been pathetically meek to a tragic degree. As someone who works in law myself, the way they published that contract and have more or less used the “but but but we had a contract and they didn’t live up to it so we are very angry and we are gonna sue them” line really left me with my head in my hands.

You only really have to compare the manner in which the US approached the production and procurement process to get a feel for how badly the EU got it wrong. The US approached it as a partnership between the supplier and State — whereby the State proactively threw money and resources at the market and co-participated to drive forward the process. The EU on the other hand approached it as a seller-buyer relationship and just “trusted” the market — i.e. but but but we had a contract!. The EU position was pathetically presumptuous and naive — treating the most important procurement exercise in history like little more than an Amazon delivery.

The EU, which includes our government as a member, should be getting f-ing hammered for this. Instead, people seem to just be going along with being forgiving towards our government’s infuriating passivity, and the EU’s PR exercise of suing AZ to make it look like the EU was a blameless victim of AZ’s dishonesty / incompetence / overpromising.

iamwhoiam

Tim Robbins wrote: »

I've been jumping in and out of this thread. I am Cohort 7. Got a PFO from my GP who is claiming they can't provide a normal GP service and are ending vaccination after Cohort 4. Really annoyed and frustrated. I have rung the HSE twice. Emailed Leo, Donnelly, Nphet, the IMO and the asthma society. Nothing from any of them.

I can only guess it is so much easier to administer if you base it on age and if some GPs are well organised enough they can also help with and follow the cohort guidelines. The GP thing is a bonus, if you live in a busy suburb with lots of parent bringing their kids to the Doctor on freebies it's impossible for the GP to provide a vaccination program.

Other than that, it's just tough luck hold our for another few weeks for the Cohort 4 and 7.

What really annoys me, is the lack of an apology. I'd could take this if the government said, listen sorry this way is quicker and better for the country but its tough on you. Instead, they are milking it saying they are protecting the most vulnerable. Which is utter BS.

I am so sorry that you are stressed about this . Its a dreadful situation to be in

I was listening to a GP at the briefing today
He said that 1000 GPs had signed in to doing the cohorts . ( not sure how many GPs there are ) Someone asked if a person had no GP and he said to get in touch with your local HSE Primary care office . Now how successful that will be I don’t know but certainly worth lodging your upset over it

revelman

Jane1012 wrote: »

So you registered 4 days before you were meant to.... guess skipping the Q works

The request for people in certain cohorts to register on certain dates is a request not a rule. The wording is “we are asking” people to register on certain days, not requiring. The reason for this is presumably because they don’t want the IT system to break down. It doesn’t mean you will get vaccinated any quicker. Cork is now down to the 60/61 age group.

If you think this is “queue skipping”, I don’t know what to say. There have been actual real and egregious examples of queue skipping in recent months. This is not one of them.

Well done Tony H, also because you were willing to take AZ when there is so much misinformation out there about it.

Lumen

revelman wrote: »

Well done Tony H, also because you were willing to take AZ when there is so much misinformation out there about it.

I'm surprised he didn't get vaccinated ages ago given his position.

Necro

Mod: drunkmonkey's threadban lifted after discussion with poster

is_that_so

ArthurDayne wrote: »

It’s worth also bearing in mind (and I say this as someone who is very pro-EU), that the EU’s approach to the relationship with AZ has been pathetically meek to a tragic degree. As someone who works in law myself, the way they published that contract and have more or less used the “but but but we had a contract and they didn’t live up to it so we are very angry and we are gonna sue them” line really left me with my head in my hands.

You only really have to compare the manner in which the US approached the production and procurement process to get a feel for how badly the EU got it wrong. The US approached it as a partnership between the supplier and State — whereby the State proactively threw money and resources at the market to drive forward the process. The EU on the other hand approached it as a seller-buyer relationship and just “trusted” the market — i.e. but but but we had a contract!. The EU position was pathetically presumptuous and naive — treating the most important procurement exercise in history like little more than an Amazon delivery.

The EU, which includes our government as a member, should be getting f-ing hammered for this. Instead, people seem to just be going along with being forgiving towards our government’s infuriating passivity, and the EU’s PR exercise of suing AZ to make it look like the EU was a blameless victim of AZ’s dishonesty / incompetence / overpromising.

There are two parts to this, the contract and what AZ have done since January. Whatever the ins and outs of the contract their performance on deliveries has been very shoddy, so bad that the HSE have expressed a lack of confidence in them. The upshot, the vaccine issues aside, is that the EU contract will lapse at the end of the year.

Tim Robbins

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I am so sorry that you are stressed about this . Its a dreadful situation to be in

I was listening to a GP at the briefing today
He said that 1000 GPs had signed in to doing the cohorts . ( not sure how many GPs there are ) Someone asked if a person had no GP and he said to get in touch with your local HSE Primary care office . Now how successful that will be I don’t know but certainly worth lodging your upset over it

Hey thanks for that. You don't have a link for that by any chance?
My GP said it's game over after cohort four. So I wonder did they only half sign in?

There is a massive difference between an anti-vaxxer coming along spouting rubbish, and genuine posters discussing real verifiable data and citing valid sources.

Accusing people who are discussing the current Astrazeneca issues of spreading misinformation is ridiculous.

is_that_so

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Hey thanks for that. You don't have a link for that by any chance?
My GP said it's game over after cohort four. So I wonder did they only half sign in?

Maybe it's this?

https://twitter.com/roinnslainte/status/1390658664474755073

irishlad.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cUZy6AMCwuA2zhtRuKK7cqMVgmhdDsGsZrFWJTkw9DY/edit#gid=1421952725

17.5k done in cohort 5.

Tony H

Jane1012 wrote: »

So you registered 4 days before you were meant to.... guess skipping the Q works

In a way I did , but my wife (61)who registered on the "recommended" day is getting her vaccine tomorrow , so not by much

by the way I could have gotten the Pfizer vaccine from my GP as I have several autoimmune diseases ,including ulcerative colitis , rheumatoid arthritis ,kidney disease and I'm waiting for my gall bladder to be removed , just finished my most recent dose of corticosteroids as well

but my GP could not vaccinate me for at least another 2 weeks

snotboogie

duffman13 wrote: »

AZ gets an awful lot of criticism from arm chair critics. They've had huge production issues but managed to create a very effacious vaccine and are offering it to middle and low income countries at cost. At the end of the day, if it was the only show in town the clotting issue wouldn't be an issue however given we have alternatives then it's fair enough to restrict the use of it.

My issue is the constant abuse of AZ which is a bit harsh. Like every major pharmaceutical company, they looked for a vaccine, theirs worked and is suitable to be used far more widely than mRNA vaccines. They arent a company known for industrial scale production of vaccines so it was always going to be a challenge. If Sanofi had discovered it then we would probably have 20 times more supply of AZ. AZ will play a huge part in the worldwide vaccination programme

They were awarded the contract to produce a vaccine developed by Oxford. Had Oxford paired with Sanofi instead of AZ there would be a lot more people vaccinated now.

ArthurDayne

is_that_so wrote: »

There are two parts to this, the contract and what AZ have done since January. Whatever the ins and outs of the contract their performance on deliveries has been very shoddy, so bad that the HSE have expressed a lack of confidence in them. The upshot, the vaccine issues aside, is that the EU contract will lapse at the end of the year.

Yes, though I guess the HSE as a State body isn’t going to also say that the State (by virtue of its EU membership) bears responsibility for the naivety at the heart of the EU approach to vaccine procurement, or in terms of whether Ireland could have (as it was legally able to) deviated and collaborated more closely with the UK — with Northern Ireland providing a bit of a justifiable grounds for a collaborative approach. The State will rarely blame itself willingly.

I’m not necessarily saying that AZ haven’t been shoddy in their performance of their contractual obligations, nor am I even saying that suing them is not justifiable. What I am saying is that there was a deficiency in the EU’s approach to the vaccine procurement and a naivety / passivity to it which stands in stark contrast to the US approach (all while the UK continues its rollout with remarkable efficiency too).

is_that_so

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Yes, though I guess the HSE as a State body isn’t going to also say that the State (by virtue of its EU membership) bears responsibility for the naivety at the heart of the EU approach to vaccine procurement, or in terms of whether Ireland could have (as it was legally able to) deviated and collaborated more closely with the UK — with Northern Ireland providing a bit of a justifiable grounds for a collaborative approach. The State will rarely blame itself willingly.

I’m not necessarily saying that AZ haven’t been shoddy in their performance of their contractual obligations, nor am I even saying that suing them is not justifiable. What I am saying is that there was a deficiency in the EU’s approach to the vaccine procurement and a naivety / passivity to it which stands in stark contrast to the US approach (all while the UK continues its rollout with remarkable efficiency too).

The HSE were referring to the effect on their vaccination plans, which as recently as two weeks ago were still being disrupted by AZ. There are two sides to this story. In real life one party would have every right to seek termination of the contract. Not sure how we could have collaborated more with a country led by an inveterate liar. We signed up to the EU pooling of vaccines for good reason- guaranteed access.

Hurrache

Jane1012 wrote: »

So you registered 4 days before you were meant to.... guess skipping the Q works

You don't get an appointment based on when you registered.

Jane1012

Tony H wrote: »

In a way I did , but my wife (61)who registered on the "recommended" day is getting her vaccine tomorrow , so not by much

by the way I could have gotten the Pfizer vaccine from my GP as I have several autoimmune diseases ,including ulcerative colitis , rheumatoid arthritis ,kidney disease and I'm waiting for my gall bladder to be removed , just finished my most recent dose of corticosteroids as well

but my GP could not vaccinate me for at least another 2 weeks

Yeah sorry I’m just a little touchy on this. My mother is the same she has multiple conditions that come in to both cohort 4 and 7, her gp won’t do her cause she’s 61 and says HSE have told them not to vaccinate anyone over 60. No sign of an appointment though, my dad is 65 and same situation on underlying conditions although he’s cohort 7. He is thankfully getting his vaccine this Sunday though. Just wait and see for my mam

AdamD

Both my parents just got booked in for next week via the portal. Both late 50s, good to see them into the 50s this quickly.

Strazdas

AdamD wrote: »

Both my parents just got booked in for next week via the portal. Both late 50s, good to see them into the 50s this quickly.

That quickly? The portal for them only opened on Tuesday I think....that's exceptionally fast.

pc7

AdamD wrote: »

Both my parents just got booked in for next week via the portal. Both late 50s, good to see them into the 50s this quickly.

Wow can I ask what area? That’s absolutely fantastic

AdamD

Strazdas wrote: »

That quickly? The portal for them only opened on Tuesday I think....that's exceptionally fast.

Though it would be a couple of weeks tbh, maybe related to getting the big AZ delivery?

pc7 wrote: »

Wow can I ask what area? That’s absolutely fantastic

Kildare

Kalimah

I’m 58 so registered on Wednesday. My appointment is Monday! I’m getting the Pfizer one.
Anyone get it and have any side effects?

Necro

Kalimah wrote: »

I’m 58 so registered on Wednesday. My appointment is Monday! I’m getting the Pfizer one.
Anyone get it and have any side effects?

Sore arm for 24hrs, nothing else for me anyways. Had my first dose last Friday.

podgeandrodge

Kalimah wrote: »

I’m 58 so registered on Wednesday. My appointment is Monday! I’m getting the Pfizer one.
Anyone get it and have any side effects?

How do you know which you're getting? What centre?

Ll31

58 registered early Wednesday, appt Monday for Pfizer. Am in Dublin.

ShineOn7

podgeandrodge wrote: »

How do you know which you're getting? What centre?

You get a text as far as I know