Vaccine Megathread - See OP for threadbans

eoinbn

JTMan wrote: »

With the highest under 16 population in the EU, the vaccination of those under 16 is important. We need to plan. This makes me worry ...

Regarding the vaccination of those aged 15 and younger ... MM also said that the European Commission is planning on a rollout of vaccinations for children and teenagers in 2022 and 2023. WTF? 2022 and 2023? What planet is he on?

The FDA is expected to approve Pfizer for those aged 12-15 later this month or early next month. A submission to the EMA is expected soon. It is expected that the approval process will be quicker than the one for those aged 16+. Ireland should be aiming for July for the first dose for those aged 12-15. Not 2022!

Goldman Sachs (who have being very accurate in their predictions) have said that they expect FDA approval for Pfizer for those aged 6 months to 11 in October 2021. I would guess that the EMA will approve around then too. Hence, we should be aiming to vaccinate those aged under 11, mainly in schools, in October or November 2021. Not 2023!

We don't have unlimited supply of Pfizer. Based on the current supply we will still be vaccinating adults with first doses in August so I don't see how we could be vaccinating children in July.
Moderna should be ramping up in Q3, potentially with some supply from the US. That should be cleared for children by that stage.
I think the comments about 2022/23 is that the EU will order with children in mind the next time. The 900m is the figure that is been talked about which is two doses for both adults and children.

jackboy

expectationlost wrote: »

its not a solo run it was already mentioned in the National COVID-19 Vaccination Programme: Strategy https://assets.gov.ie/108854/babc7d1b-cb10-49db-8dd0-0c7408dea162.pdf pg 29 bottom

Yeah but the government told the teachers to get lost based on the fact that they were going to ‘follow the science’ and vaccinate by age downwards. Didn’t take them long to start picking holes in that science.

expectationlost

jackboy wrote: »

Yeah but the government told the teachers to get lost based on the fact that they were going to ‘follow the science’ and vaccinate by age downwards. Didn’t take them long to start picking holes in that science.

no they said doing it by age was the quickest way too...

stephenjmcd

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It was called provisional meaning rough draft.

it was published in December.

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/39038-provisional-vaccine-allocation-groups/

That just the allocation part of it. The strategy document is a living document.

The technical processes etc are all still relevant and accurate only change is the allocation strategy.

There's more to the document than just the allocations.

https://assets.gov.ie/108854/babc7d1b-cb10-49db-8dd0-0c7408dea162.pdf

jackboy

jackboy wrote: »

Yeah but the government told the teachers to get lost based on the fact that they were going to ‘follow the science’ and vaccinate by age downwards. Didn’t take them long to start picking holes in that science.

Asking a question as to whether or not this would be a good strategy is picking holes in the science?

jackboy

expectationlost wrote: »

no they said doing it by age was the quickest way too...

No they clearly said they were following the science.

odyssey06

expectationlost wrote: »

cabinet decides

The cabinet already decided this issue, just a few weeks back, and went out to bat for it in public. And as a member of Cabinet Donnelly is bound by that decision.
If you are reopening this now, so soon without game changing new evidence, you completely undermine that previous decision and public confidence in the process and rollout.

JTMan

eoinbn wrote: »

We don't have unlimited supply of Pfizer. Based on the current supply we will still be vaccinating adults with first doses in August so I don't see how we could be vaccinating children in July.
Moderna should be ramping up in Q3, potentially with some supply from the US. That should be cleared for children by that stage.
I think the comments about 2022/23 is that the EU will order with children in mind the next time. The 900m is the figure that is been talked about which is two doses for both adults and children.

The government have said that the 30 June target to vaccinate 82% of the population aged 16+ remains and that does not include J&J nor CureVac. Also, 82% might not be far from the amount of people who want a vaccine. Hence, I would guess that August is pessimistic.

Yeah, Moderna probably will have a roll to play on the children vaccination programme.

It seems that children 11 and under will not get two doses. Trials are testing 10-30 micrograms. Those aged 16+ get 60 micrograms in total. Hence, less doses will be needed.

Micky 32

https://twitter.com/laoneill111/status/1383454306939019264?s=21

:pac:

GazzaL

Micky 32 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/laoneill111/status/1383454306939019264?s=21

:pac:

I'll take the AstraZeneca, the Sputnik, the Sinovac, just give me a ****ing vaccine.

The zero risk approach, the longest rolling lockdown in the world, the obliteration of businesses, jobs and lives, the utter nonsense of mandatory hotel quarantine, Tony Holohan, Micheál Martin, and Stevie Donnelly have done more damage to Ireland than the Black and Tans.

AMKC

They better mot start vaccinating 18 to 30 year olds before us 40 to 45 year old or there will be maybem I tell you. Fu-ck 18 to 30 year old unless they have a compromised immune system us 40+ are more susceptible to the virus so us before them unless they want there ass sued too.

expectationlost

odyssey06 wrote: »

The cabinet already decided this issue, just a few weeks back, and went out to bat for it in public. And as a member of Cabinet Donnelly is bound by that decision.
If you are reopening this now, so soon without game changing new evidence, you completely undermine that previous decision and public confidence in the process and rollout.

except they already agreed that this was a possibility, so it can't come as a surprise to them.

Szero

When will 69 year olds get a notification of a vaccine appointment? I think I read that it would be this weekend?

AMKC

AMKC wrote: »

They better mot start vaccinating 18 to 30 year olds before us 40 to 45 year old or there will be maybem I tell you. Fu-ck 18 to 30 year old unless they have a compromised immune system us 40+ are more susceptible to the virus so us before them unless they want there ass sued too.

Here here.

Don't worry more chance of pigs flying...

For once most people and parties agree this is a terrible idea.

We won't be talking about it by Wednesday or maybe before.


https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/more-than-two-thirds-against-idea-of-vaccinating-under-30s-as-a-priority-poll-40323010.html

stephenjmcd

AMKC wrote: »

They better mot start vaccinating 18 to 30 year olds before us 40 to 45 year old or there will be maybem I tell you. Fu-ck 18 to 30 year old unless they have a compromised immune system us 40+ are more susceptible to the virus so us before them unless they want there ass sued too.

Your going to sue the state if someone gets a vaccine before you..... yeah good luck with that one.

Bit of realism

odyssey06

expectationlost wrote: »

except they already agreed that this was possibility, so it can't come as a surprise to them.

When did they agree that?

And when did they agree to move to a risk based approach for vaccine prioritisation versus those in situations of high exposure and transmission?

It's pretty obvious why this would be a surprise to them coming so soon after the latter decision and it's disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

Bubbaclaus

Szero wrote: »

When will 69 year olds get a notification of a vaccine appointment? I think I read that it would be this weekend?

My 68 year old father received his appointment a few hours ago. For this Thursday.

ACitizenErased

As of tomorrow Israeli people no longer have to wear masks in public. We too will reach that stage!

ACitizenErased

ACitizenErased wrote: »

As of tomorrow Israeli people no longer have to wear masks in public. We too will reach that stage!

We need to focus on stories like this that lift the spirit. We are only 2 to 3 months away from Israels vaccine numbers.

stephenjmcd

ACitizenErased wrote: »

As of tomorrow Israeli people no longer have to wear masks in public. We too will reach that stage!

I don't mean to dampen the spirits but they're mandatory outdoors over there. They aren't here. They still have to wear them inside, same as us.

Furze99

AMKC wrote: »

They better mot start vaccinating 18 to 30 year olds before us 40 to 45 year old or there will be maybem I tell you. Fu-ck 18 to 30 year old unless they have a compromised immune system us 40+ are more susceptible to the virus so us before them unless they want there ass sued too.

Just kite flying by the government - throw out stories and deflect from real issues. Like the objection of 60-69 yr olds to being lumped with a vaccine that has a question mark over it. They want to kill that story and stop it getting legs in the media.

A few months ago health care workers and people in nursing homes were the be and end all. They had to get the vaccination or face possible serious illness and death. The same rhetoric was shifted to 60 yr olds a week or so ago - suddenly they are all in mortal danger. Today I heard a health professional say over 50s were all at serious risk.

How can you believe a government/ health system that keeps changing the message. At this stage I believe very little of the spin and PR coming out. The only notable figures are cases and hospitalisations and these all coming down and summer coming in.

VG31

ACitizenErased wrote: »

As of tomorrow Israeli people no longer have to wear masks in public. We too will reach that stage!

They're scrapping masks outside, they still have to wear masks indoors.

So really they're only getting rid of a rule which we (thankfully) never had here, and since outdoor spread is almost non-existent probably made very little difference anyway.

LimerickGray

What is actually to the people in Cohort 4 that have not yet been vaccinated? I am one and nobody has contacted me (although my consultant said 2 weeks ago I was on his list) to say what is going on. I know a few people had their AZ appointments cancelled last week and told they would be rebooked but no contact since.
Has anyone any idea please?

lbj666

Its probably the 4th time i have said it today. If the suggestion of bringing younger groups foward is shouted down so much that it will never be considered again, they could be left in a major quandry by time we get to younger cohorts, if there ends up being any age cap on J&J.
Leaving AZ out of it,
The vacine rollout will have kept pace with whats arriving in up until said capped age is reached , then it can only go at the pace of the supply of the mRNAs, despite J&J ramping up their supply into June and July. So for arguement sake, you could get to 70% of the willing adult population under 60 at the pace of supply mRNAs+J&J, but then have to go mRNA only pace for the last 30%. Could be 50:50, 60:40 whatever.

Alternatively do mRNA+J&J eligible cohorts in parrallel with mRNA only cohorts, that way you get to 75% of adult population (irrespective of age cohorts) at same pace but keep that pace for the remaining 25%.

Hopefully theres no cap for J&J, but there needs to be a contingency. I am worried the **** storm or the fear of contradiction/u turns despite new blockers and unblockers being thrown at them nearly daily, will just allow for no flexibility in the few months ahead.

Jinglejangle69

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

My 68 year old father received his appointment a few hours ago. For this Thursday.

That's good to hear.

Meanwhile my two over 70s parents haven't heard anything.

vienne86

Szero wrote: »

When will 69 year olds get a notification of a vaccine appointment? I think I read that it would be this weekend?

This 69 year old got the text yesterday evening.

hmmm

lbj666 wrote: »

if there ends up being any age cap on J&J.
Leaving AZ out of it,
The vacine rollout will have kept pace with whats arriving in up until said capped age is reached , then it can only go at the pace of the supply of the mRNAs, despite J&J ramping up their supply into June and July. So for arguement sake, you could get to 70% of the willing adult population under 60 at the pace of supply mRNAs+J&J, but then have to go mRNA only pace for the last 30%. Could be 50:50, 60:40 whatever.

People are accepting it now, but I think there will be war if any vaccines go unused. Seeing as the Minister is continuously walking into political landmines, I'd just like to helpfully flag that one to anyone in the FF who may be listening.

The health authorities seem to be ascribing very little cost to continued lockdowns and large-scale unemployment, and are debating over very small risks with the vaccines. Fine, that's their job, but if we ever get to the point where someone says "it'll just mean a delay of a few months" and there is a pile of AZ or J&J sitting unused in a corner there will be trouble.

jellybear

LimerickGray wrote: »

What is actually to the people in Cohort 4 that have not yet been vaccinated? I am one and nobody has contacted me (although my consultant said 2 weeks ago I was on his list) to say what is going on. I know a few people had their AZ appointments cancelled last week and told they would be rebooked but no contact since.
Has anyone any idea please?

I am in cohort 4 and received my first dose of Pfizer today, through my GP.

I have heard that from 26th April, cohort 4 will ramp up considerably.

ETA- A quote from the Irish Times 'Deliveries of vaccines for those in cohorts four will be spread across three weeks, commencing on April 26th, May 3rd and May 10th.'

Stark

lbj666 wrote: »

Its probably the 4th time i have said it today. If the suggestion of bringing younger groups foward is shouted down so much that it will never be considered again, they could be left in a major quandry by time we get to younger cohorts, if there ends up being any age cap on J&J.
Leaving AZ out of it,
The vacine rollout will have kept pace with whats arriving in up until said capped age is reached , then it can only go at the pace of the supply of the mRNAs, despite J&J ramping up their supply into June and July. So for arguement sake, you could get to 70% of the willing adult population under 60 at the pace of supply mRNAs+J&J, but then have to go mRNA only pace for the last 30%. Could be 50:50, 60:40 whatever.

Alternatively do mRNA+J&J eligible cohorts in parrallel with mRNA only cohorts, that way you get to 75% of adult population (irrespective of age cohorts) at same pace but keep that pace for the remaining 25%.

Hopefully theres no cap for J&J, but there needs to be a contingency. I am worried the **** storm or the fear of contradiction/u turns despite new blockers and unblockers being thrown at them nearly daily, will just allow for no flexibility in the few months ahead.

I think we've already screwed the pooch tbh by continuing to use up mRNA vaccines on over-70s after the decision was made to put an age cap on AZ. Bringing under-30s forward won't make any difference if over-70s are all done and there's a surplus of AZ for over-60s. They should be nearing first dose done for over-70s soon and they'll all need a matching shot for their second dose.

hmmm

hmmm wrote: »

People are accepting it now, but I think there will be war if any vaccines go unused. Seeing as the Minister is continuously walking into political landmines, I'd just like to helpfully flag that one to anyone in the FF who may be listening.

The health authorities seem to be ascribing very little cost to continued lockdowns and large-scale unemployment, and are debating over very small risks with the vaccines. Fine, that's their job, but if we ever get to the point where someone says "it'll just mean a delay of a few months" and there is a pile of AZ or J&J sitting unused in a corner there will be trouble.

40,000 jandj siting around.

AZ probably lost a week over recent changes.

Those jabs should be in arms building immunity in our population.

In the end im confident both jandj and az are beyond safe.

The pfzier bonus jabs should just of accelerated things.