Vaccine Megathread - See OP for threadbans

ddarcy

is_that_so wrote: »

The original plans for Group 4 was that it would initially be driven by hospitals and then by GPs. What has slowed it down, apart from supplies, is trying to work out who is in Groups 4 & 7. I don't think there was a general plan to do those groups in MVCs. Pfizer is also needed for 2nd doses. The next few weeks will be the 65-69 cohort anyway, followed by the 60-64 group, so my guess is that anyone else will be completed by GP/hospitals.

I’m group 7 by definition (hospital literally just cut and paste everyone over to Group 4 though (most likely) or they needed to make up numbers so that the vaccines didn’t go to waste and moved me over) and I was done in a MVC. I think the hospitals just forwarded on the lists to the HSE and they grouped everyone together for a day.

I’m hearing so far only GPs are handling Pfizer for Group 4, but there will have to be a change to the MVCs as well too or the hope JJ can take its place and be used by everyone. Otherwise there will be no need in a few months for MVCs, but it is still months away to plan

Johnboy1951

Sconsey wrote: »

Do you understand the difference between the virus and the disease? The vaccine provides immunity from the disease (Covid19) for most people. It can reduce the transmission rates of the virus (Sars-Cov).

Yes, obviously I do know the difference between the two.

The vaccine does not provide immunity; it provides a reduction in the seriousness of the resultant disease/illness/Covid.
I tend to believe that, as it is what the manufacturers claim to have proven for their products.

If you have something to contradict that I am willing to read it. It would be great if it were so.

.

Zipppy

is_that_so wrote: »

The original plans for Group 4 was that it would initially be driven by hospitals and then by GPs. What has slowed it down, apart from supplies, is trying to work out who is in Groups 4 & 7. I don't think there was a general plan to do those groups in MVCs. Pfizer is also needed for 2nd doses. The next few weeks will be the 65-69 cohort anyway, followed by the 60-64 group, so my guess is that anyone else will be completed by GP/hospitals.

I'm Group 4, 50s, had vaccination in Aviva cancelled last thurs due to AZ mess...are we saying I'll have to wait until after 60-69s are done?

Johnboy1951

ACitizenErased wrote: »

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/05/health/covid-natural-immunity.html

Although researchers aren’t sure whether a vaccine or the infection itself produces the stronger immune response, one thing is clear: The vaccine is far safer.

The short answer: We don’t know. But Covid-19 vaccines have predictably prevented illness, and they are a far safer bet, experts said.

So nothing definitive there regarding which response is better.
That you are better off taking the vaccine, mainly because most have no idea how well their immune system is working, is clear.
But please read again what I wrote .....

Natural (directly from the virus) immune response is, from what I have read, more potent than that developed by the jab, IF your immune system is working optimally ...

is_that_so

Zipppy wrote: »

I'm Group 4, 50s, had vaccination in Aviva cancelled last thurs due to AZ mess...are we saying I'll have to wait until after 60-69s are done?

It does look like 65-69 are the target for these next few weeks, now that they are all booking themselves in. Good test for the system anyway! Other than that it looks like it's when you hear we have supplies for everyone else. No idea on the 60-64 group BTW, just following what would be a logical path on it, especially with the 80% in June promise.

Johnboy1951

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Yes, obviously I do know the difference between the two.

The vaccine does not provide immunity; it provides a reduction in the seriousness of the resultant disease/illness/Covid.
I tend to believe that, as it is what the manufacturers claim to have proven for their products.

If you have something to contradict that I am willing to read it. It would be great if it were so.

.

That is what was submitted as it would have taken months more to get sufficient data to support the claim of prevention of infection or transmission. This data is now emerging, and what do you know, the vaccine is behaving like a vaccine

Micky 32

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Having done a huge amount of reading over the past six monts and more, I do not recollect each and every article I have accessed.

I’m curious, will you be taking the vaccine?

is_that_so

ddarcy wrote: »

I’m group 7 by definition (hospital literally just cut and paste everyone over to Group 4 though (most likely) or they needed to make up numbers so that the vaccines didn’t go to waste and moved me over) and I was done in a MVC. I think the hospitals just forwarded on the lists to the HSE and they grouped everyone together for a day.

I’m hearing so far only GPs are handling Pfizer for Group 4, but there will have to be a change to the MVCs as well too or the hope JJ can take its place and be used by everyone. Otherwise there will be no need in a few months for MVCs, but it is still months away to plan

Wasn't aware of that extent of MVC involvement with Group 4. Doesn't it depend how many are still remaining in that group? Know of a couple called to their GP this week.

LimerickGray

is_that_so wrote: »

The original plans for Group 4 was that it would initially be driven by hospitals and then by GPs. What has slowed it down, apart from supplies, is trying to work out who is in Groups 4 & 7. I don't think there was a general plan to do those groups in MVCs. Pfizer is also needed for 2nd doses. The next few weeks will be the 65-69 cohort anyway, followed by the 60-64 group, so my guess is that anyone else will be completed by GP/hospitals.

they were being done in MVC here locally - cohort 4. Its bizarre that they've moved on to people at less risk and never updated the group at very high risk.

robindch

For anybody interested in family/friend experiences:

By now, around 35 of my friends and family have come down with covid resulting in five deaths - three directly (one in Ireland, one in Brazil, one in Russia), plus two where covid was a contributory factor (one in Ireland, one in Russia). Two more of the 35 are suffering from long-term side effects including muscle and joint pain, extreme tiredness, loss of taste and smell and irregular recovery (only taste/smell sensations are sewage/metal/burnt rubber from unrelated things), heart problems and depression. AFAIK, around 15 family and friends have had their first jab, and around five have had their second - no side effects beyond the expected - soreness on the upper arm and mild symptoms which dissipate within a day or two. All are thrilled.

We have one anti-vaxxer in the extended family who has neither scientific nor medical training, but believes herself to be profoundly well informed in both science and medicine. She is a member of a fundamentalist church which, as well as anti-vaccine propaganda, also propagates anti-climate change, creationist, anti-immigrant and anti-semitic rhetoric. Back at the end of January, she told her husband of over 50 years that, if he got vaccinated, she'd "throw him out of the house and refuse to care for him" - and, following months of aggressive propaganda, he appears to believe that the vaccine will likely kill him. Both are refusing to take calls from their GP who has vaccines ready and waiting for the two of them. They're both in their 80's and last week, she re-iterated that she'd "never take a vaccine" with her chin up, her chest out and with a huge grin on her face, like that of a child who'd just managed to defecate into a potty without making too much of a mess.

is_that_so

LimerickGray wrote: »

they were being done in MVC here locally - cohort 4. Its bizarre that they've moved on to people at less risk and never updated the group at very high risk.

Yeah, until we got to the first portal group that's how it's been. Based on other posters notifications have come out of the blue. Hopefully, notification may not be too far away. It's in everyone's to get those first 7 groups finished.

Micky 32

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Worth a read

https://twitter.com/sailorrooscout/status/1384112892857905154?s=20

Then we have NPHET, if it was up to them we’d never get out of lockdowns or quarantine


https://gript.ie/nphet-tells-high-court-the-vaccines-might-not-work-you-know/?fbclid=IwAR30hz3JCecBahH7Tq06tmvqDRL5oU-kXB_fVsv5blhokQZCZW69igekWcg


“” if NPHET gets its way, the re-opening is years, not months, away.””

firemansam4

embraer170 wrote: »

Sorry to hear. My mom (75-80 age group) finally got her first dose last week. It must be incredibly frustrating to still be waiting to even get an appointment.

celt262 wrote: »

That has to be down to mismanagement of the roll out by the practice more than anything else. I would not be at all happy if that was my parents.

Its very frustrating, and they dont really know whats happening. Doctors keep saying not to call them and that they will be in contact instead.
But when you hear that nearly everyone else in their age group has either had it or at least been given a date of when to get it, something doesn't seem right.

Think I will call the surgery myself if they dont hear anything in the next day or two

Seems that the rollout is going pretty well overall but there seem to be outliers where patients are being left in limbo.

El Weirdo

Valhallapt wrote: »

The MVCs are only doing AZ at the moment, probably some complexity in running different booths for Pfizer, by all accounts the MVC are a well oiled machine, might be best not to risk making changes to it, just apply pressure on gps to get the finger out

Some MVCs are also using Moderna this week.

ddarcy

Zipppy wrote: »

I'm Group 4, 50s, had vaccination in Aviva cancelled last thurs due to AZ mess...are we saying I'll have to wait until after 60-69s are done?

No I think they have to get it sorted out with GPs or potentially moved into hospital. I believe Beaumont have a clinic set up (not sure if it is MVC though). I’d say you should get sorting this week or early next week.

Zipppy

ddarcy wrote: »

No I think they have to get it sorted out with GPs or potentially moved into hospital. I believe Beaumont have a clinic set up (not sure if it is MVC though). I’d say you should get sorting this week or early next week.

Fingers Crossed!

Johnboy1951

Micky 32 wrote: »

I’m curious, will you be taking the vaccine?

I have not yet been offered a jab.
I will decide when offered, based on the current information available to me at that time.

The vaccines are still in trial mode, with new information being gathered every day.

.

Micky 32

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I have not yet been offered a jab.
I will decide when offered, based on the current information available to me at that time.

The vaccines are still in trial mode, with new information being gathered every day.

.

Lol, that’s a no then. Your posts make more sense now, i see where it’s going

Johnboy1951

Micky 32 wrote: »

Lol, that’s a no then. Your posts make more sense now

You can draw whatever conclusions you wish ...... it does not matter a whit to me how wrong you are!

is_that_so

Speaking of groups, is there any up to date data on where we are with the completion of various groups?

Micky 32

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

You can draw whatever conclusions you wish ...... it does not matter a whit to me how wrong you are!

Would it not have been easier just to type “ no” instead of the spiel you typed? There’s currently enough info on the current vaccines . The program is well under way. Not much is going to change when you get offered one.

Geuze

robindch wrote: »

By now, around 35 of my friends and family have come down with covid resulting in five deaths -

I find this staggering.

I must lead a very dull life.

I know of two people who acquired coronavirus: one a relation aged about 80 who acquired it in hosp, and the son of a friend.

I must have a small circle of friends compared to other people.

35!!!! I can't get over that.

Tyrone212

Any more word on 80% vaccinated with first dose by end of May if the the second mRNA doses are increased beyond 4 weeks. I've checked all the papers,Rte etc and haven't seen it mentioned apart from someone saying it was on the News last night.

1huge1

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I have not yet been offered a jab.
I will decide when offered, based on the current information available to me at that time.

The vaccines are still in trial mode, with new information being gathered every day.

.

Hi Johnboy, not sure what your definition of trial is (presumably as long as it suits your argument), but just to tease that out, 894m doses across 155 countries have been given out so far. Is that still a trial to you?

Also, regarding the link you posted earlier showing the lack of data on whether the vaccines reduced transmission, I find it odd that you link a article from early December before the vaccines were rolled out and blissfully ignored all the data and scientists showing clear correlation between reduced transmission and the vaccine. One just needs to look at Israel an the UK to see this.

If as your username suggests, you were born in 1951, I'd suggest you make your mind up soon.

1huge1

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Any more word on 80% vaccinated with first dose by end of May if the the second mRNA doses are increased beyond 4 weeks. I've checked all the papers,Rte etc and haven't seen it mentioned apart from someone saying it was on the News last night.

I heard on the radio this morning that nphet will make their recommendation early this week and it will go to cabinet from there. My guess is we'll know by the end of the week.

LimerickGray

is_that_so wrote: »

Speaking of groups, is there any up to date data on where we are with the completion of various groups?

https://covid-19.geohive.ie/pages/vaccinations

LimerickGray

ddarcy wrote: »

No I think they have to get it sorted out with GPs or potentially moved into hospital. I believe Beaumont have a clinic set up (not sure if it is MVC though). I’d say you should get sorting this week or early next week.

in the hospital? I suppose that might make sense too. Wouldn't it be easier to send cohort 4 to the MVC like they were doing up to last week???
Given this cohort is consultant driven, it makes great sense to keep list under the control of the consultant.

Charles Babbage

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Any more word on 80% vaccinated with first dose by end of May if the the second mRNA doses are increased beyond 4 weeks. I've checked all the papers,Rte etc and haven't seen it mentioned apart from someone saying it was on the News last night.

While a positive voice is sometimes welcome, Luke O'Neill is not being entirely scientific on this one. If they only give AZ to over 60s and don't get J&J back then they don't have enough to mRNA vaccine to go much beyond 60% of the population even with one dose.

Probably they can reach 80% by mid June rather than the end of June if they adjust the time period, and that is a worthwhile benefit, especially as they'll then have loads of vaccine to do the second doses.

stephenjmcd

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Any more word on 80% vaccinated with first dose by end of May if the the second mRNA doses are increased beyond 4 weeks. I've checked all the papers,Rte etc and haven't seen it mentioned apart from someone saying it was on the News last night.

It was Luke O'Neill's estimated if they went with 12 weeks.

That's the only person to have mentioned it.

It's unlikely that there'll be any change in the spacing of 2nd dose for those currently being vaccinated and the over 70s.

It's possible for younger age groups that it may well be spaced longer

cameramonkey

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

You can draw whatever conclusions you wish ...... it does not matter a whit to me how wrong you are!

Would you take one tomorrow if you were offered one?