Minnesota officer shoots dead another innocent black victim

Danzy

10000maniacs wrote: »

When cops pull over someone who is suspected of a relatively trivial misdemeanour, they need to show restraint, respect and human decency when dealing with the suspect. In other words, speak to the suspect as an equal.
That is the crux of the issue and is what is missing in Minneapolis at the moment.
Maybe then will the situation not escalate to manslaughter.
For a lot of these cops, their only qualification is a high school diploma and 16 weeks cop training. And as such should not be given leave to wave firearms in the general direction of the public.

That's what happened and he acted the thug.

That led to his death.

Tragic for him and his family. For the Cop 5gat shot him especially.

Beneficial to his community that he is no longer a threat.

Funny how it works out for good or bad.

GreeBo

tayto lover wrote: »

She intended to use non-lethal force. This one was an accident proved by the fact that she only fired one shot and by the dialogue in the video.

A tazer isnt "non-lethal" its "less lethal".

I certainly don't question that shooting him was an accident, I am questioning why he needed to be tasered for resisting arrest? Give a guy a hammer and all he will see are nails. Why not pepper spray him, for example?

GreeBo

Danzy wrote: »

That's what happened and he acted the thug.

That led to his death.

Tragic for him and his family. For the Cop 5gat shot him especially.

Beneficial to his community that he is no longer a threat.

Funny how it works out for good or bad.

What threat was he to the community?
This wasn't some hostage taking bank robber, it was a dad driving around town. I think the community was safe enough tbh.

Also, "acting the thug" still isn't punishable by death.

GreeBo

Gradius wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qkfpe2yrOY

Go to the end of that video, that's cut short, to see what police can face in the USA at anytime, anywhere.

Try doing that job every day and see how hesitant you are about interactions with people.

Police getting ambushed is a growing trend. Wonder why? It'll certainly calm things down anyway

That is the job they sign up for!
Do you think *any* of them are unaware that its a dangerous job that may lead to them being shot at?
but just because some people ambush or shoot police doesnt give the police to shoot first, especially when they keep getting to so terribly wrong.

bewareofthedog

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer isnt "non-lethal" its "less lethal".

I certainly don't question that shooting him was an accident, I am questioning why he needed to be tasered for resisting arrest? Give a guy a hammer and all he will see are nails. Why not pepper spray him, for example?

Why not tickle him with a feather, or better yet, bend over?

nolivesmatter

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer isnt "non-lethal" its "less lethal".

I certainly don't question that shooting him was an accident, I am questioning why he needed to be tasered for resisting arrest? Give a guy a hammer and all he will see are nails. Why not pepper spray him, for example?

Pepper spray is no picnic either, and the effects last much longer. After a quick search online it seems given the choice a lot of people would rather be hit with the taser.

Example:
Although McAdams said the Taser was more painful during the five seconds that the charge lasts, overall, most recruits agreed the more intense pain of the Taser was preferable to the prolonged discomfort of OC spray.
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/police-recruits-test-tasers-pepper-spray/#:~:text=Although%20McAdams%20said%20the%20Taser,prolonged%20discomfort%20of%20OC%20spray.

GreeBo

GreeBo wrote: »

What threat was he to the community?
This wasn't some hostage taking bank robber, it was a dad driving around town. I think the community was safe enough tbh.

Also, "acting the thug" still isn't punishable by death.

Lol.

A dad driving around town.

Jesus wept.

nolivesmatter

Deleted User wrote: »

Lol.

A dad driving around town.

Jesus wept.

Yeah seriously. Talk about a half-truth.

GreeBo

bewareofthedog wrote: »

Why not tickle him with a feather, or better yet, bend over?

So we are back it "do nothing or shoot them"?
Again I ask how the rest of the world manages?

GreeBo

nolivesmatter wrote: »

Pepper spray is no picnic either, and the effects last much longer. After a quick search online it seems given the choice a lot of people would rather be hit with the taser.

Example:
Although McAdams said the Taser was more painful during the five seconds that the charge lasts, overall, most recruits agreed the more intense pain of the Taser was preferable to the prolonged discomfort of OC spray.
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/police-recruits-test-tasers-pepper-spray/#:~:text=Although%20McAdams%20said%20the%20Taser,prolonged%20discomfort%20of%20OC%20spray.

Oh Im sure its uncomfortable and renders you powerless for longer, but I kinda thought that was the point?

GreeBo

Deleted User wrote: »

Lol.

A dad driving around town.

Jesus wept.

nolivesmatter wrote: »

Yeah seriously. Talk about a half-truth.

So what was he then?
He was pulled over driving along like any other person would be, he wasnt living in a cave hiding from the authorities.
Whats the worst that would happen if he had escaped? They pick him up in CostCo next week?

nolivesmatter

GreeBo wrote: »

So what was he then?
He was pulled over driving along like any other person would be, he wasnt living in a cave hiding from the authorities.
Whats the worst that would happen if he had escaped? They pick him up in CostCo next week?

If he resisted arrest now why wouldn't he resist it then?

GreeBo

nolivesmatter wrote: »

If he resisted arrest now why wouldn't he resist it then?

And if he did, what then? Shoot him?

I reckon some intelligent officer somewhere could figure out how to apprehend a suspect without using lethal force on them.

tayto lover

Yada yada yada there should never be anyone arrested. Just let them carry on committing crimes and beating people up. If he wasn’t arrested and went on to injure some other woman then they’d be lambasted for that too.
This was an accidental shooting however and the female cop will be on trial for it in time.

Fandymo

GreeBo wrote: »

So what was he then?
He was pulled over driving along like any other person would be, he wasnt living in a cave hiding from the authorities.
Whats the worst that would happen if he had escaped? They pick him up in CostCo next week?

And if he shot someone in the meantime? Tough?

GreeBo

GreeBo wrote: »

What threat was he to the community?
This wasn't some hostage taking bank robber, it was a dad driving around town. I think the community was safe enough tbh.

Also, "acting the thug" still isn't punishable by death.

Really - the community was safe? He wasn't some hostage taker!??

"Defendant Wright then pulled a black handgun with silver trim out from either his right waistband or his right coat pocket and pointed it at victim and demanded the rent money".

He was scum.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9467375/Daunte-Wright-warrant-arrest-attempted-aggravated-robbery-charges.html?ico=amp-comments-viewall#article-9467375

GreeBo

Fandymo wrote: »

And if he shot someone in the meantime? Tough?

So arrest him before he does something? What if you shoot someone next week? Should we arrest you now just in case?

This isn't a Tom Cruise film!

GreeBo

Student_111 wrote: »

Really - the community was safe? He wasn't some hostage taker!??

"Defendant Wright then pulled a black handgun with silver trim out from either his right waistband or his right coat pocket and pointed it at victim and demanded the rent money".

He was scum.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9467375/Daunte-Wright-warrant-arrest-attempted-aggravated-robbery-charges.html?ico=amp-comments-viewall#article-9467375

So firstly you are confusing allegations with convictions.
Secondly that was in 2019, how long do you hold previous allegations or even convictions against someone? Is everything a life sentence in your opinion?

In any case, your opinion of him is irrelevant, a judge sentences people, not cops.

GreeBo

The relevant ruling:

The U.S. Supreme Court established that that a police officer who has probable cause to believe a suspect poses a threat of serious harm to the officer or others may use deadly force to prevent escape. (Tennessee v. Garner, 471 U.S. 1 (1985).) This might happen, for instance, if the suspect threatens the officer with a gun. The Court, however, indicated that officers should issue warnings when possible. It also held that deadly force is unjustified when the suspect poses no immediate threat to the officer and no threat to others.

tayto lover

GreeBo wrote: »

The relevant ruling:

It was still an accident.

GreeBo

tayto lover wrote: »

It was still an accident.

A tazer is a lethal weapon, she accidentally used her gun, a more lethal weapon.

The problem is that she felt deadly force was the correct and only next step in this scenario, it seems pepper spray, for example, wasn't considered. So what was it that the victim did that required lethal force?

Potential-Monke

GreeBo wrote: »

Please read my posts!
I am simply asking is a taser an acceptable and appropriate response to someone resisting arrest.

Yes. The alternative is a strong arm response, which wasn't working as he was getting away. The incident then escalated and a tazer/pepper spray would be next. Tazers are better, so they get used more, and have less side effects compared to pepper spray. She intended to taze him, not shoot him.

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer is a less lethal, not non lethal weapon, I would want far more justification than "there might have been X" before using lethal force on someone. There are numerous examples of people being killed when officers mistakenly believe something, their job is not to act first, its to respond to facts. If they dont like this reality then policing isnt for them imo.

You seem to know how to do the job so well, you should apply! Their job is to protect themselves, the public and property. None of us have ANY idea what it's like to be a cop in an area like that, with the reduced funding and actual hate towards people just because of their job (i'm willing to retract that if someone on here is a serving cop in Minnesota).

GreeBo wrote: »

Thats real easy to say right now from your keyboard, you must be the only person in the world who acts and thinks with the same clarity sober as when 3 times over the limit!

I've often been well over the limit when interacting with the police. Then again, I wouldn't be stupid enough, while over the limit, to put a bb rifle out the window of a hotel in America. Do you think being drunk is an excuse? Does it just apply to that case, or every case where drink is involved, such as rape?

GreeBo wrote: »

People make mistakes, the result of which shouldnt be death.

Correct, but if he didn't make those mistakes he would still be alive. If the cop didn't mistakenly shoot him instead of tazing him, he might still be alive. If he didn't have a warrant for his arrest out, he might still be alive. If he didn't previously threaten people with a gun, he wouldn't have a record and may still be alive. Lots of what ifs and buts. A series of events lead to this man dying, most of which were his own fault (warrant, driving on expired plates, history of violence).

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

In other words, use lethal force.

Regarding warning shots, I'm not nessecarily talking about live ammo.

In order to have a blank warning shot, you'd need to either have yet another firearm filled with blanks, or the first 1 or few rounds in your firearm are blanks, which would be completely useless against an active shooter. I understand you may not know much about guns, but the idea isn't practicable in real life in America. Thugs won't fire a warning shot, why should the cops? Best solution is to not resist arrest. Or even better again, don't break the law.

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer isnt "non-lethal" its "less lethal".

I certainly don't question that shooting him was an accident, I am questioning why he needed to be tasered for resisting arrest? Give a guy a hammer and all he will see are nails. Why not pepper spray him, for example?

Yes, the cops had no idea what he could have in the car, nor what he may have done if he got away. I thought you knew how this worked, going by your above statements? Pepper spraying someone in a car is not recommended, because they can still move, and who wants someone who can't see driving around? They have a use of force policy, which none of us are privvy to. In general, tazering is the next level of escalation after strong arm doesn't work.

GreeBo wrote: »

That is the job they sign up for!
Do you think *any* of them are unaware that its a dangerous job that may lead to them being shot at?
but just because some people ambush or shoot police doesnt give the police to shoot first, especially when they keep getting to so terribly wrong.

Do you think it's ok for their job to include being shot at? Yes, they signed up for it, doesn't mean they have to let themselves get hurt first. They don't shoot first, but they're constantly on edge in certain areas because a simply traffic stop can turn into the cop getting shot for no reason. It's easy, as you put it, to sit behind your keyboard and say how it should have happened, but actually living it is far from what one would expect. And they don't keep getting it terribly wrong, this is a miniscule percentage of the interactions they have. 8.13 million reported crimes in 2019, 990 people shot dead by police. That's 0.012% of reported crimes which resulted in a cop shooting someone dead.

GreeBo wrote: »

So we are back it "do nothing or shoot them"?
Again I ask how the rest of the world manages?

The rest of the world doesn't usually have to deal with gun toting trigger happy criminals. Some parts do, and they can't keep a reign on it either. Venezuelian cops kill 1830.2 citizens per 10 million, the US kill 34.8 per 10 million. Here's some more stats on citizens killed by cops, if you're interested.

GreeBo wrote: »

Oh Im sure its uncomfortable and renders you powerless for longer, but I kinda thought that was the point?

But it also allows you to still have some motor function control. It's grand out in an open area, but to do it to someone in a car is dangerous. Why didn't he comply? Why did he resist and try to escape? Why are all the questions directed back towards the cops and not the suspect?

Foxtrol

tayto lover wrote: »

It was still an accident.

It wasn't an accident, it was at best gross negligence.

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1382755638711881736?s=20

Foxtrol

Foxtrol wrote: »

It wasn't an accident, it was at best gross negligence.

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1382755638711881736?s=20

Her nephew was familiar with guns himself... one less criminal on the streets.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9467375/Daunte-Wright-warrant-arrest-attempted-aggravated-robbery-charges.html?ico=amp-comments-viewall#article-9467375

tayto lover

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer is a lethal weapon, she accidentally used her gun, a more lethal weapon.

The problem is that she felt deadly force was the correct and only next step in this scenario, it seems pepper spray, for example, wasn't considered. So what was it that the victim did that required lethal force?

He acted the thug. Just like he was.
It was still an accident too.

Potential-Monke

accident
/ˈaksɪd(ə)nt/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally, typically resulting in damage or injury.
"he had an accident at the factory"
Similar:
mishap
misfortune
misadventure
mischance
unfortunate incident
injury
disaster
tragedy
catastrophe
contretemps
calamity
blow
trouble
problem
difficulty
casualty
2.
an event that happens by chance or that is without apparent or deliberate cause.
"the pregnancy was an accident"

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Foxtrol wrote: »

It wasn't an accident, it was at best gross negligence.

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1382755638711881736?s=20

Cha ching!

nullzero

GreeBo wrote: »

A tazer is a lethal weapon, she accidentally used her gun, a more lethal weapon.

The problem is that she felt deadly force was the correct and only next step in this scenario, it seems pepper spray, for example, wasn't considered. So what was it that the victim did that required lethal force?

The facts are that this incident ended in tragedy due to error.

The officer who shot Duante Wright was immediately remorseful, she resigned from her position and is being tried for manslaughter.

This was a tragedy, but it is notable that police procedure in the United States is clear, if you resist arrest and attempt to flee there is a possibility that a weapon will be discharged and you will be the target.

We can argue about the morality of this situation until we are blue in the face but it won't change the situation. We also have to appreciate that police face situations where their lives are in danger and particularly in a country where gun ownership is commonplace the willingness of police to reach for a weapon is greater than it might otherwise be, we also don't know what experiences those officers have had in the past that may have influenced their decision making process in this type of situation.

So we can defund police, take away their resources and tell them they cannot use their weapons but the problem lies in the gun culture in America itself. You cannot have a right to bare arms for all citizens and have a peaceful utopian society, and a symptom of that is armed police who are more likely to draw and discharge their weapons.

This situation was tragic, but the aftermath has been handled correctly.

nullzero

Foxtrol wrote: »

It wasn't an accident, it was at best gross negligence.

https://twitter.com/therecount/status/1382755638711881736?s=20

Manslaughter is correct in this case.

The killing was not pre meditated.

The young man is still dead, but to suggest this was in some way planned is out of touch with reality.

Foxtrol

Potential-Monke wrote: »

accident
/ˈaksɪd(ə)nt/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally, typically resulting in damage or injury.
"he had an accident at the factory"
Similar:
mishap
misfortune
misadventure
mischance
unfortunate incident
injury
disaster
tragedy
catastrophe
contretemps
calamity
blow
trouble
problem
difficulty
casualty
2.
an event that happens by chance or that is without apparent or deliberate cause.
"the pregnancy was an accident"

Thanks for showing why the term accident is terrible in this situation.

This is much closer

neg·li·gence
/ˈneɡləjəns/
Learn to pronounce
noun
noun: negligence; plural noun: negligences
failure to take proper care in doing something.
"some of these accidents are due to negligence"
Similar:
carelessness
lack of care
dereliction of duty
nonperformance of duty
non-fulfillment of duty
remissness
neglectfulness
neglect
laxity
laxness
irresponsibility
inattention
inattentiveness
heedlessness
thoughtlessness
unmindfulness
forgetfulness
slackness
sloppiness
contributory negligence
culpa
barratry
delinquency
disregardfulness
inadvertence
inadvertency
oscitation
Opposite:
conscientiousness
attention to duty

LAW
failure to use reasonable care, resulting in damage or injury to another.