FF/FG/Green Government - Part 3 - Threadbanned User List in OP

timmyntc

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Effectively expanding the public sector, best of luck with that one, it makes sense in ways, but there probably would be up roar. You d probably have to deal with unionisation, pensions, etc etc etc. Public funding isn't even much of an issue, and we can't even get over this hurdle, so.......

Public funding is THE biggest issue.
Otherwise the state could tender the building of all these units, instead of setting up a state building dept.

The state is limited in what it can borrow due to EU fiscal rules. Cant run deficits if Debt to GDP is over 60%. Cant run deficits more than a few % every year, etc.

Wanderer78

timmyntc wrote: »

Public funding is THE biggest issue.
Otherwise the state could tender the building of all these units, instead of setting up a state building dept.

The state is limited in what it can borrow due to EU fiscal rules. Cant run deficits if Debt to GDP is over 60%. Cant run deficits more than a few % every year, etc.

under normal circumstances yes, but we re not under that now, particularly since covid, the floods gates have opened in regards borrowing, we truly should also setup public banking systems, to partly self fund also, this all can be done with relative ease, not problem free of course

McMurphy

costacorta wrote: »

At least they have the balls to go into government and not just sit on opposition benches moaning day in day out and never doing sweet FA .

Remember hearing the same story last time greens were in government that they would never again be heard of ? .

costacorta wrote: »

At least they have the balls to go into government and not just sit on opposition benches moaning day in day out and never doing sweet FA .

Remember hearing the same story last time greens were in government that they would never again be heard of ? .

Yeah seems like only a minute ago I heard it......

Floppybits

costacorta wrote: »

But it’s true , I know the shinners don’t like to admit it . We see what kind of job SF do when trying to govern in NI they just run away every time they have a problem and wait for the UK and Irish governments to come and sort it out .. Sad but true

It's not true. It is nothing but a soundbite given out as excuse to the formation of this government. The dogs on the street know that no government could be formed without 2 of FF, FG and SF. SF tried it and it didn't work. FF would not talk to SF due to Martin being obsessed with being Taoiseach and went cap in hand to FG and now we are all paying for that with crisis after crisis.

Simple as that now you can keep spinning your yarn that has been taken apart on here time and time again and look foolish but anyone with an ounce of sense knows what you are saying is a yarn and the Martin sold out FF so he could become Taoiseach.

costacorta

Floppybits wrote: »

It's not true. It is nothing but a soundbite given out as excuse to the formation of this government. The dogs on the street know that no government could be formed without 2 of FF, FG and SF. SF tried it and it didn't work. FF would not talk to SF due to Martin being obsessed with being Taoiseach and went cap in hand to FG and now we are all paying for that with crisis after crisis.

Simple as that now you can keep spinning your yarn that has been taken apart on here time and time again and look foolish but anyone with an ounce of sense knows what you are saying is a yarn and the Martin sold out FF so he could become Taoiseach.

.
Ah the same old rubbish from SF nobody wants to talk to us .. They had a chance of forming a government same as rest of parties but ran away to the opposition benches where they know it’s easier to moan moan moan rather than try and govern..

Wanderer78

costacorta wrote: »

.
Ah the same old rubbish from SF nobody wants to talk to us .. They had a chance of forming a government same as rest of parties but ran away to the opposition benches where they know it’s easier to moan moan moan rather than try and govern..

oh dont worry, i think their chance is just about to come about again, and i think they ll take it this time, along side ff, ff will go in for the 'good of the country', i.e. to save themselves!

Floppybits

Wanderer78 wrote: »

oh dont worry, i think their chance is just about to come about again, and i think they ll take it this time, along side ff, ff will go in for the 'good of the country', i.e. to save themselves!

The thing is will FF get enough seats in the next election?

costacorta

Wanderer78 wrote: »

oh dont worry, i think their chance is just about to come about again, and i think they ll take it this time, along side ff, ff will go in for the 'good of the country', i.e. to save themselves!

I don’t worry, enough of ye on here do that . I presume they might get a chance next time with same amount of seats but will they run away again rather than have to really do something constructive like govern ??

Wanderer78

Floppybits wrote: »

The thing is will FF get enough seats in the next election?

theyll probably still get a few, maybe lose a few, theyll probably need others to form a government also, but i suspect it ll be mainly an sff government

Loafing Oaf

costacorta wrote: »

.
Ah the same old rubbish from SF nobody wants to talk to us .. They had a chance of forming a government same as rest of parties b

No they didn't. The numbers weren't there.

Floppybits

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

No they didn't. The numbers weren't there.

Everyone knows the numbers weren't there, it just suit the opponents of SF to repeat that line ad nauseum to justify this government.

costacorta

Floppybits wrote: »

Everyone knows the numbers weren't there, it just suit the opponents of SF to repeat that line ad nauseum to justify this government.

Again typical SF rubbish!! They have more TDS than FG and same number as FF ? BUT BUT BUT .. Always the victims .

Mad_maxx

id be in favour of the government embarking on a huge social housing building spree but with several changes

1. building spec should be lower , its too high right now even for the private market , social housing should be no frills , unfortunately in todays uber PC world , the opposition and media would trash the government for not treating everyone the same in terms of housing standards

2. anyone who goes into a social house is evicted within six months if they quite paying their rent , SF and the rest of the far left oppose evictions under any circumstances so that again is a problem

3. rent in social housing needs to increase drastically , currently people on average pay 400 euro per month for social housing , increase it to twice that in dublin city , if those living there cant afford it , move them to social housing outside dublin where social housing rents can be lower

4. anyone in social housing who is acting the b0ll0cks re_ anti social behaviour gets one warning and are then turfed out . currently we just allow them run riot in their neighbourhoods , again SF and the rest of the far left vehemently oppose these people being evicted


we cant have everything , the trouble is too many people want everything for nothing and this extends to housing, in the social democracy meccas of Scanadanavia and Germany etc , social housing tenants still must adhere to rules , that must change here

costacorta

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

No they didn't. The numbers weren't there.

Really !!! Numbers weren’t there for FF or FG either ? SF on the other hand ran when they thought for a second that they might be able to form a government.

if you take FF|G seats away I’m sure SF had enough to try and make a govt ?? So please stop trotting out the same old rubbish that the numbers weren’t there for SF .

timmyntc

costacorta wrote: »

Again typical SF rubbish!! They have more TDS than FG and same number as FF ? BUT BUT BUT .. Always the victims .

costacorta wrote: »

Really !!! Numbers weren’t there for FF or FG either ? SF on the other hand ran when they thought for a second that they might be able to form a government.

if you take FF|G seats away I’m sure SF had enough to try and make a govt ?? So please stop trotting out the same old rubbish that the numbers weren’t there for SF .

When FG and FF refused to go into coalition with them, there was a brief attempt at a rainbow coalition of the left, which failed because there were far too many small parties and independents involved for there ever to be a consensus.

If you want to discuss this further there are plenty of Sinn Fein threads for you to post in. This is not one of them

Loafing Oaf

costacorta wrote: »

Really !!! Numbers weren’t there for FF or FG either ? SF on the other hand ran when they thought for a second that they might be able to form a government.

if you take FF|G seats away I’m sure SF had enough to try and make a govt ??

In theory. But it would have required the support of every left wing party and over half of the independents, many of whom are not progressive in any way shape or form and would never have supported an SF-led government in a million years.

RandomViewer

Floppybits wrote: »

The thing is will FF get enough seats in the next election?

Doubt it, they've blown their chance, MM should have been removed after the election, 10-20 seats next time?

RandomViewer

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

In theory. But it would have required the support of every left wing party and over half of the independents, many of whom are not progressive in any way shape or form and would never have supported an SF-led government in a million years.

Lowry and the Veronavirus

Cilldara_2000

costacorta wrote: »

Really !!! Numbers weren’t there for FF or FG either ? SF on the other hand ran when they thought for a second that they might be able to form a government.

if you take FF|G seats away I’m sure SF had enough to try and make a govt ?? So please stop trotting out the same old rubbish that the numbers weren’t there for SF .

Pure nonsense. The numbers were such that any possible combination needed two of the big three, SF + all the other parties only totalled 66 seats, and FF and FG wouldn't talk to SF.

Shebean

Mad_maxx wrote: »

id be in favour of the government embarking on a huge social housing building spree but with several changes

1. building spec should be lower , its too high right now even for the private market , social housing should be no frills , unfortunately in todays uber PC world , the opposition and media would trash the government for not treating everyone the same in terms of housing standards

2. anyone who goes into a social house is evicted within six months if they quite paying their rent , SF and the rest of the far left oppose evictions under any circumstances so that again is a problem

3. rent in social housing needs to increase drastically , currently people on average pay 400 euro per month for social housing , increase it to twice that in dublin city , if those living there cant afford it , move them to social housing outside dublin where social housing rents can be lower

4. anyone in social housing who is acting the b0ll0cks re_ anti social behaviour gets one warning and are then turfed out . currently we just allow them run riot in their neighbourhoods , again SF and the rest of the far left vehemently oppose these people being evicted


we cant have everything , the trouble is too many people want everything for nothing and this extends to housing, in the social democracy meccas of Scanadanavia and Germany etc , social housing tenants still must adhere to rules , that must change here

What frills are we talking? Standards for health and safety aren't frills. What PC elements could be removed?


They could deduct from their wages or welfare. The idea that SF control evictions over the last decades is not true. It's a systemic issue. Also local councillors would have pushed for the removal of antisocial families. No councillor would be re-elected supporting an antisocial family in the face of an entire street or neighbourhood.


Rent is based on income, It's supposed to reflect income level. Any issues would be another systemic issue needs addressing.


I can't speak for SF but again, no politician is going to block an eviction based on community reports of antisocial behaviour. Trying to put years of systemic failure on SF or the left is missing the actual picture.


Each tenant has to sign a tenancy agreement. If it's not enforced, it should be.

Currently we waste far too much money going the private route. It will be interesting to see what happens when it's obvious the latest changes are useless.

Floppybits

Surely Michael Martin would not make a mistake such as this.

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1395755589293252614

Shebean

Floppybits wrote: »

Surely Michael Martin would not make a mistake such as this.

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1395755589293252614

Was he deflecting? They tend to do that.

RandomViewer

Handiest way to sort this is for banks to say €300k is maximum mortgage for residential property, watch prices align accordingly

Oymyakon

RandomViewer wrote: »

Handiest way to sort this is for banks to say €300k is maximum mortgage for residential property, watch prices align accordingly

Except that does nothing to improve the supply, the same number of people will still be locked out of home ownership.

RandomViewer

Oymyakon wrote: »

Except that does nothing to improve the supply, the same number of people will still be locked out of home ownership.

No, if €300k plus deposit is the max prices will adjust accordingly, everything the government has done has pushed up prices when the reality is wages aren't anywhere close to affording them, builders need the work ,so do estate agents so they'll adjust their expectations accordingly,
alternatively we take property management out of private hands and make accomodation a government agency that overs sees all sales and leases

CDarby

Was doing a bit of light reading last night about political party's here in the state, and the big hoo-ha created recently about databases etc.
Seems all of the major party's have questions that need answered, and the loudest noisemakers of all FG, seem to be the greatest offenders. Philip Ryan accidentally opened a can of worms on this apparently, it transpires only one political party was storing their database outside the EU (the UK in fine gael case) very very sinister!

titan18

RandomViewer wrote: »

Handiest way to sort this is for banks to say €300k is maximum mortgage for residential property, watch prices align accordingly

If the cost to build is too high, it just means builders won't build then. Only thing government should be doing is driving down that cost and encouraging building through incentives for housing over other projects. Everything else they've done has just made it worse.

Sorting out height limits and overruling all the city/county councils would also be welcome.

RandomViewer

titan18 wrote: »

If the cost to build is too high, it just means builders won't build then. Only thing government should be doing is driving down that cost and encouraging building through incentives for housing over other projects. Everything else they've done has just made it worse.

Sorting out height limits and overruling all the city/county councils would also be welcome.

Anything over 8 stories will become a slum, landlords won't keep elevators maintained so nobody but skangers will live , the actual cost of materials/ labour isn't that high, stupid site prices and Architect and planning fees add a lot,

FullyComp

RandomViewer wrote: »

Anything over 8 stories will become a slum, landlords won't keep elevators maintained so nobody but skangers will live , the actual cost of materials/ labour isn't that high, stupid site prices and Architect and planning fees add a lot,

Ah Jaysis I've heard it all now. Someone should tell the lads living in the Shard it's a slum

RandomViewer

FullyComp wrote: »

Ah Jaysis I've heard it all now. Someone should tell the lads living in the Shard it's a slum

Do the lifts still work?