FF/FG/Green Government - Part 3

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671298#Comment_119671298

Martin is rumoured to want the Foreign Affairs post as a retirement gig.

According to this if Martin takes Foreign Affairs that would be a clear sign he intends to quit FF leadership before the next GE

https://www.thejournal.ie/micheal-martin-leadership-5865471-Sep2022/

presumably because

The job would require him to be out of the country a lot, which would give backbenchers ample opportunity to formulate a heave against the leader and get a successor primed and ready. 

US3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671568#Comment_119671568

The quarry's should repay 100% of the costs. There owned by one of the richest companys in Ireland and are still making massive profits today. Why should I pay for some private quarry's fcukup when I go to build my house .

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119674135#Comment_119674135

FF backbenchers may be worried about this because it is exactly the thing that the useless Gilmore did with Labour and in 2016, Labour only returned 7 TDs. Martin is a partitionist and having him in Foreign Affairs at such a sensitive time for the North (the run up to the Border Poll) would be highly damaging for Ireland. That propsal by Barry Cowen that FF take ownership of the Border Poll issue before SF did showed a political awareness of FF's situation far beyond that of Martin's.

The number of seats that FF got in 2016 was a natural rebound from 2011 and due, in part, to the floating vote that had voted Labour in 2011 shifting. The problem for FF was that Martin wasted it and nearly destroyed the distinct FF identity with the Confidence and Supply agreement with FG. The 2020 GE should have seen FF return more than 50 TDs but Martin's incompetence and obsession with SF damaged FF and lost seats for FF. At the FF think-in, Brian Coady (Kilkenny Hurling team manager) spoke about rebuilding FF's identity. The problem, as has been demonstrated by opinion polls, is that the electorate has begun to think of FF and FG as the same party. There is a clique around Martin that is much too FG than FF and this is damaging FF. Martin's judgement about Robert Troy didn't help the perception that the only thing in which Martin is interested is Martin. FG has a similar problem with Varadkar.

McGrath's smackdown of Varadkar over Donohoe maintaining Finance was interesting. Someone so inherently spineless as Martin wold never have done this. Even the Indo, a very pro-FG newspaper noticed.McGrath seems to have been expecting to get Finance in the reshuffle. The whole agreement for government deal is vey much a snounts in the trough situation with FFers and FGers hoping to get promotions after the reshuffle. Both sides have to keep their backbenchers happy and not wake Eamon Ryan. If FF backbenchers get upset with a lack of promotions, then Martin could be removed and, at worst, these backbenchers may not vote for Varadkar as taoiseach, On current FFG numbers, that would leave Varadkar dependent on non-FFG votes and could even bring down the government. With a real FF leader, these things would be less likely to arise. The best thing that FF could do would be to have McGrath replace Martin before December. The FF Ard Fheis at the weekend would be an opportunity for a vote of confidence in Martin's leadership. Little more than the future of FF as a major party is at stake. If FF does not get rid of Martin, then it might as well merge with FG.

Regards...jmcc

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671534#Comment_119671534

FF is the senior party in the coalition. FG was beaten into third place in the last GE by SF. Only the extremely naive would think that is not a case of snouts in the trough. Even the sainted Greens pulled a similar thing with ministries so that their TDs could get ministerial salaries and pensions. Perhaps I am being too cynical about these politicians and they have the best interests of the people at heart. The question is which people?

Regards...jmcc

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119669701#Comment_119669701

This is a thread about the FFG government. The Border Poll is a big issue as is the eventual Reunification of Ireland. Norman Tebbit was even quoted in the Irish News on the subject and he seems to disagree with you on the future of NI. The government needs to be planning for these things now. Anything else is just incompetence. You don't condone government incompetence, do you?

Regards...jmcc

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119674420#Comment_119674420

Still blabbing on about a border poll, less than 24 hours after the budget.

LOL.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119675563#Comment_119675563

It is mind-boggling. When you are relying on Norman Tebbit to support your misinterpretation of the NI Census outcome, you really are struggling.

A border poll remains decades away, we need to forget about it, and get on with planning for more important challenges like reducing emissions by 2030 etc.

https://twitter.com/tdofclass/status/1575541031172739072?s=46&t=5T7uWZlY20AS2IUKhpdt4w

Well somebody’s looking happy 😂

astrofool

It is interesting on the government thread that one poster continually pushes what is a big issue for the opposition, with a lot of wish-casting, but not really for the government of the day.

Particularly in the wake of the budget.

No government will commit to anything around a border poll until it starts looking likely to happen as doing so would commit their policies needlessly.

And it is unlikely to happen, it would be lost today and be gone for a generation (and I would be in favour of reunification), there is no Brexit facing Ireland that would cause a re-vote to fall back on once lost.

Cluedo Monopoly

FF Ard Fheis today. Poor timing I feel but it will be interesting to see what's said as FF and MM prepare to hand the reins to Leo and the gang. Leo the leak has undermined many of the FF ministers since 2020 so I imagine there will be tensions.

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119683356#Comment_119683356

Even The Journal is covering it.

https://www.thejournal.ie/michael-martin-ard-fhies-5879034-Sep2022/

The comments look a bit negative. Wonder if the FFers will remove him as leader? The attendance figures for the Ard Fheis are supposed to be down on previous years according to the Irish Mirror a few days ago.

Regards...jmcc

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119682327#Comment_119682327

I agree with you, however the 2 current government parties have in the past said that in the event of a border poll they would welcome the 6 counties into the republic. SF and the SDLP (who are now part of FF) do enough campaigning on those grounds

I also agree that a border poll today would today fail in the 6 counties, mainly on grounds of health (No NHS in the republic)

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119683449#Comment_119683449

Good article.

"The coalescing of FF-FG in Government since 2020 has only solidified the public’s perception that the two parties are one and the same, they added."

The Irish language also a higher priority than 'Strong Public Services'. That wont fly in a recession.

"Fianna Fáilers have for a long time known that if they fail to make progress with the housing crisis, it is game over for the party. "

"Those within the party say it will take more than a few social media classes to get the party’s message across. Sorting out the problems within is simply the first step."

That's for sure. The next couple of years will be chaotic.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119683449#Comment_119683449

Another complete flight of fancy from you. After the biggest giveaway budget in the history of the State, you are wondering will FF remove their leader!!!!!

Silly nonsense. Desperate stuff.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119684856#Comment_119684856

Short sighted budget. Completely dependent on MNC taxes too. Let's see how next year's budget compares. The tech stocks are in freefall so that bonanza will end.

The FFG inspired massive national debt has left us completely hamstrung for options as we enter stormy economic waters.

And yet health and housing are still an unmitigated DISASTER.

But at least Bertie will be president.

JP Liz V1

Tommy Bowe asking Leo the tough homeless questions and no real answers

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119684856#Comment_119684856

Back on ignore.

*Plonk*

xxxxxxl

lol whos pricing this stuff. Apparently the hse are going to spend over 600m on bolstering cyber security ??

0ph0rce0

Is it just me or does your man Darragh O'Brien look like Johnny Vegas??

A big 20 chin bag of Malahide shite.

The most houses built in history of the state. 50,000 houses.

How many. Sorry?

How many? Sorry?

Answer the question.

Sinn Fein, Independents, PBP>

So how many?

10 or something.

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119686650#Comment_119686650

Hardware updates, softwhare updates, new software, redesigned networks, backup systems, staff training, hiring people. It all adds up.

Regards...jmcc

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119687715#Comment_119687715

Have worked in the industry. That means they have been running crap for pretty much 20 years say. No regard for security patient data ability to restore was an afterthought. But over half a billion it's pretty insane amount of money. Just think 1/4 of a children's hospital. Makes you wonder what shape the revenue is in sw local government even the dail. I had the misfortune of supporting the Revenue Administrators with no idea what they were doing or talking about. Probably some high ups son. But I don't believe that eye watering figure is accurate. Lets wait and see "who" has a company that gets a contract.

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119687735#Comment_119687735

Hard not to be cynical having worked in the industry. One of the biggest problems with HSE it the lack of uniform sytems. Some software might not work on the latest version of Windows 10 and lots of computers may be incompatible with Microsoft's latest brainfart of Windows 11. There are also different operating systems and potentially Cloud issues. Then there's the licencing costs and staff training. Ideally, a system would require a hot spare that could be put into action at any time.

It is a huge operation and the problem with the government, and previous governments, is that they often appointed ministers with Mickey Mouse intellects and no experience of business to run the department. Donnelly has more of a clue than previous ministers as he worked for a well known consultancy. The problem with governments is that they often base their decisions on which bidder puts on the best dog and pony show. The government procurement process is flawed. If you remember the old expression that "nobody ever got fired for buying IBM" that's the level of knowledge of some politicians. That's why things like PPARS and the HSE happen.

Regards...jmcc

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119684856#Comment_119684856

I would not be too sure on Martin either going voluntarily or being pushed.

I get they feeling that he is not that popular within the party and has not been for some time. Many appreciated after the banking crisis that he saved them from oblivion and did not wish to see him as the first FF leader to break with tradition to not become Taoiseach. There is also a tradition in FF as far as I know, but I may be incorrect, that any leader of FF who stepped down as Taoiseach also stepped down as leader of the party. It will be interesting to see within the parliamentary party what the reaction will be if he does not do so and give a new leader time before the next GE.

If the rumours of him looking for the Foreign Affairs post while remaining on as leader and Tanaiste are true I would not see that endearing him to many. I could see it being looked at as a vehicle for his own aspirations for a future post with the E.U., U.N. or a future run for the Phoenix Park.

Neither would I see this latest budget gaining him much universal praise. Give away budgets are those that leave people with more money in their pockets. That is not what this latest one is. People will still end up with less in those pockets. While this energy crisis is partly the reason for that, there are many, especially among the traditional FF rural based electorate, that would see FF and Martin, especially as leader, also hitting them in the pocket.

Cluedo Monopoly

What is wrong with the gobdaw ministers in our government? They are refusing to answer straight questions these days. Any question on housing brings a coached response...."supply issues"...."won't be fixed overnight". McConalogue on Katie Hannon was asked straight questions about house builds and planning numbers and he just refused to answer. Wafflers. It's clear they haven't a grip on things. The housing minister answers exactly the same way but in a very aggressive and arrogant way.

jmcc

The latest Sindo/ Ireland Thinks poll shows no Budget Bounce.

SF: 37% (+1)

FG: 21%

FF: 17% (+1)

PBP/S: 4% (-1)

GP: 4% (+2)

SD: 3% (-1)

LAB: 3%

AON: 3% +/- 2 Meán Fómh/Sept 2022 Via

@ireland_thinks / @TheSundayIndo

Deir Fómh/Oct 2022 S: 1,254

FFG may have been hoping for a Budget Bounce but it has not shown up in this poll. The movements are all within the Margin of Error but with FF not getting a bounce, the ice beneath Martin is getting thinner.

Regards...jmcc

0ph0rce0

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119689698#Comment_119689698

They shite on about it every day in the media.

Back in 2000 and whatever we had 6 or 7000

Now 20 years later we have 25000 ( the biggest in the history of the state0 don't know if it's social or private but it was fact checked and the number was 127

Seriously though a lot are in Dublin but what good are gaffs selling for 7-800,000 to a million or rentals at 2500 +

I know **** all about it but there must be some levy's or duties hidden in there like the insurance cartels they would do **** all about, they don't want it to decrease because the more we pay the more they get back in tax.

and they all own peoperty everwhere, be it ff, fg, sf, ind....

They really are scum.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119691040#Comment_119691040

I posted a few days ago that I didn't expect there to be a bounce, at best, they have avoided any mis-steps.

It really is going to come down to execution, get builds completed, get things like childcare costs organised and reduced, use the windfall from the energy companies to solve short term pains which makes the opinion polls a long slog.

We may see a bit of FG upswing after the Taoiseach rotates, but I doubt it will be much (and will be interesting who tries to take credit for the windfall).

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119693905#Comment_119693905

It is mid-term, the opposition should be far ahead in the polls, it is only the last four to five months before the election that you would expect to see a change.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119695108#Comment_119695108

Expect away. They will need a miracle 😂

Leo on the way to piss the electorate off even more.

I can imagine the slogan in GE.Next...."We ruined housing and health and crippled you with debt but we gave you a few quid towards the ESB bill in 2022. Vote the power swap."

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119695337#Comment_119695337

Vote FF, get FG. Vote FFG and get higher bills.

Opposition parties will gut FFG at the next GE.

Regards...jmcc

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119693905#Comment_119693905

I'm not sure that the handover will see a rise in support for FG. Its fans in the Sindo/Indo will be doing their bit to promote FG but those energy bills are going to damage any prospects for a boost. Talking down expectations of a Budget Bounce is very much an excuse at this stage. Most of the energy companies have put up their prices and will probably keep trying to increase them. SF is going to use this and is also going with a motion on the bricks issue. AS for FFG not making many missteps, look at its past record with Troy Story. Varadkar got slapped down by McGrath over the Finance position and it looks like someone in FF has decided that Martin's craven grovelling to Varadkar and FG is a thing of the past. If FG tries to hold on to positions that FFers want, it will cause serious problems for the longevity of the FFG government.

While the Sindo/Ireland Thinks polling methodology is generally unfavourable to FF, the RedC poll is yet to come. FFers seem to like the RedC poll if not its results. B&A is more favourable to FF due to its face to face polling. What should be worrying FF is that the 17% is almost becoming a constant across different polls. I think that there's an Irish Times/Ipsos poll due as well. If that's bad for FF then the gloves will come off in FF. FFG had better be praying for a mild Winter because energy bills are going to be the new Water Tax.

Regards...jmcc

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119695926#Comment_119695926

Vote SF, get FF (it will probably be FFFF by the time the election gets here).

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119696421#Comment_119696421

You really do get lost in the polls. There is no point in anyone looking at them at the moment, certainly not to the extent of examining and comparing their methodologies. The time for polls will be when an election has been called.

A portion of the SF support includes people who are angry at the moment. As an emotion, it is difficult to keep anger up for a long period of time, and often, when reflecting, anger fades. That is why mid-term polls, based on emotional anger are not a good long-term guide to elections that are far away.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119697279#Comment_119697279

You should report jmcc for talking about the latest polls in national newspapers 😂😉

I love these polls and jmcc's analysis is excellent.

I get that they make you uncomfortable but feel free to ignore the poll discussions.

The fact that FG had it's worst ever result in a Red C/Business Post poll recently is not an anomaly, it's a serious trend.

howiya

Seán Fleming says its right that the construction industry should make a contribution to mica redress. Then goes on to say that the cost will be passed on to consumers

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119697973#Comment_119697973

That concrete block levy was a crazy decision. A tax on first time buyers essentially. A punishment on new buyers for the Mica disaster.

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698000#Comment_119698000

Affects a lot more people than first time buyers as pointed out by Fitzmaurice on the show

Ha Long Bay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698000#Comment_119698000

Do you think the mica redress scheme should be scrapped as well? If not how should it be funded?

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698066#Comment_119698066

Why do you think it should be funded by consumers?

Ultimately the levy won’t be funding the mica redress scheme if the target is to bring in €80m a year.

Ha Long Bay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698113#Comment_119698113

Where did I say it should be funded by consumers?

I asked another poster a completely different question I am not sure why replied to my post.

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698158#Comment_119698158

You drew a line between a post criticising the levy and the funding of the redress scheme. Do you support the levy?

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119697833#Comment_119697833

I put Blanch on ignore because he/she does not contribute anything other than rabid anti-SF stuff to discussions.

The RedC polls have always been more favourable to FG and to Labour. It could be due to their methodology which uses a 40K panel which RedC thinks represents the electorate. That panel has been sliced and diced so that they already know the locations and age groups of the panelists. It makes it a lot easier to provide breakdowns by location and age. A panel approach is not exactly the random sample that other pollsters use. It is also a bit of a double edge sword for the parties because it will have some of the characteristics of a tracking poll. A tracking poll surveys the same set of voters repeatedly. While RedC selects their sample for each poll randomly from the panel some of these panelists will have been surveyed previously over a year. For politicians, that kind of information is gold because it will show (slightly) how intentions are changing.

There's also a kind of status thing with RedC among the FG/Labour voters. It has been continually treated as the best of the pollsters and that might help with the reponse rate. It also has been running polls for the Sunday Business Post and that has a different readership to that of the Sindo. If RedC polls are beginning to show FG support falling then this is the ice cracking beneath FG. Combine that with FF's poor showing and SF's support and FFG is facing a Titanic problem for the next GE.

The one thing that the pollsters seem to ignore is the rate of change of the electorate. When Ireland was dominated by FF/FG and Civil War politics, the FF/FG axis used to get over 80% of the vote in GEs. That started to change as the generation that was born in the 1960s and 1970s became eligible to vote through the 1980s and 1990s. The old crooked FF/FG ways didn't appeal to many of these new voters and some may have voted Labour for a while as they thought that Labour was different.

Without the Civil War politics dominating things for these voters, a fragmentation of political support happened. But it was nothing compared to what happened with the mismanagement of the economy by FF/FG/PDs in the early 2000s. Almost a generation of voters will have grown up seeing the stress that the bursting of the property bubble and the bank bailouts put on their parents and families while the politicians, banksters and cronys who caused the problems got away with big pensions and no sanctions.

That has had a radicalising effect on voters. And for whom do the voters who have seen the effects of crooked FF/FG/PD/Labour policies on their families vote? Certainly not FF/FG/Labour. What is happening with the rise of SF and the collapse of FF/FG is a generational shift but the political journalists in the media generally have an Arts background rather than STEM background so they are intellectually incapable of properly analysing polls. Support for Labour in the younger demographics has collapsed. Support for FF is collapsing in these demographics. FG isn't doing well. In older demographics, FF and FG are beginning to cannibalise each other's vote.

As part of the 2.5 party model, FF and FG could always rely upon Labour to be the third party. The polls started to show that model breaking down by 2013 but, again, the political journalists and waffling "commentators" never even saw it coming. By 2015, it was obvious that Labour was going to be demolished in the 2016 GE but there was the usual clueless commentary about how Labour wouldn't be badly affected and some were claiming that it would return around 15 seats. Labour was reduced to 7 seats from the 37 seats it won in 2011.

This was the move to the current Big Three model where no two parties of the Big Three had enough seats to form a government. This was being predicted by the opinion polls and was glaringly obvious. Labour's problem was existential. It had shifted away from the unions and industry support base that it had for decades to becoming a (Yet Another Teacher Seeking Election) YATSE party and SF quickly moved in on its old union and Left wing support base as the upwardly mobile teacher/TD wannabes took over Labour. One of the problems with Irish politics is the massive over-representation of teacher/TDs in the Oireachtas. It was around 27% of all representative at one stage. When Labour imploded, FF/FG lost their lobby fodder party.

The current opinion polls show a new political model in development. Some of it is down to a changing electorate but it is closer to being a traditional Left/Right political axis with FF/FG/Labour being on the Right of centre and SF and some others being on the centre to Left side of the political spectrum. What is most interesting is the development of the SocDems. The support for this party, again based on the polls, is a combination of younger voters and formerly Leftist voters who would previously have voted Labour. This is why the aging has-beens in Labour want to get their claws into the SocDem votes by proposing a very Stickies-like "merger". The nightmare scenario for FF/FG and Labour in the next GE is that some SF transfers go to the SocDems rather than to FF/FG candidates and Labour candidates.

As has been seen with FF's moronic strategy of continually attacking SF, attacking SF doesn't work. Even the Sunday/Daily Blueshirt effort from the Sindo/Indo is not effective. The abject stupidity of Foley's comments at the FF Ard Fheis might have worked well with the diminishing number of FF faithful that even bothered to turn up but most people are too busy worrying about how to pay energy bills and deal with the increased cost of living. A similar effect happens when Varadkar and FG try to attack SF to deflect from FG failure.

Few things harden a voter's resolve like politicans attacking the party for which they are considering voting. Rather than winning hearts and minds of floating voters, FF/FG are doing everything they can to drive them to vote for SF. The FF/FG presstitutes in the media are preaching to a shrinking choir as bills and the Homelessness issue radicalise voters.

Many floating voters voted FF/FG out of financial self-interest. To use the quote from "Trading Places", the best way you hurt rich people is by turning them into poor people. Take away the slimey media appearances by Martin and Varadkar and that's exactly what FFG policies are doing.

Regards...jmcc

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698066#Comment_119698066

Penalise the guilty parties.

Regards...jmcc

Murph85

Wrecklessly spending 11 billion, in a hark to the insane pre celtic tiger budget giveaways, is total and utter lunacy! And they wont get thanked for it in the polls... At this state, decades of appalling governance, they are goosed, you cant just waffle and deflect for decades and not expect to run out of road. I hope to god , at the very least, they now stop this nonsense of massively mismanaging the state finances and accept that just flashing the credit card is nowhere near enough at this stage. 54,000 ukranians in ireland now.The calibre of irish politician is a disgrace, all weak , weasels.

After decades of talking about it, it still takes years or decades for housing or infrastructure projects to come to fruition, they have done nothing about the bullshit endless legal challenges, that can hold up development...

Bishop of hope

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698333#Comment_119698333

How do you propose this?

Is it the producers of the bad micah, the builders responsible, Developers in general, please specify.

Murph85

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2022/10/04/ireland-is-a-country-where-people-can-no-longer-be-bought-with-their-own-money/

"One benefit of last week’s budget splurge of €11 billion is that it may be sufficient antidote to keep politics off the streets this winter. If it does, it has probably met its main objective.

It has done the Government no good politically, however, if opinion polls are correct. This is now a country where people can no longer be bought with their own money. If true, that is an appalling vista for politics.

It raises the more profound question of why the Government is chasing the rainbow of public support, with public money, in ways the ultimately bear down on the young and the houseless. It is not just that support from these groups has plummeted for Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, the conversation has stopped.

The row about a levy on concrete blocks tells all we need to know about where power lies and how it is exercised. It is questionable if solidarity with those afflicted by mica in their homes should extend to rebuilding houses sometimes beyond the size of an average home. That cost is borne in part by those, overwhelmingly younger, who can’t afford any house of their own.

The idea of a levy is a good one, however. It expands the tax base on a once-off basis. The obvious place for a levy was to add it to our feeble property tax. Putting it, instead, on blocks increases the cost for all buildings, from new houses to productive infrastructure. Home owners who are overwhelmingly a little better off than the houseless young, would have contributed something back.

If you are housed and over 50 you are better off by accident simply because we house-hunted in the right decade. You are also cruising towards an old age pension years before you are likely to be incapable of further work. In a final display of bad manners, you will probably enjoy indecent longevity afterwards.

But this is where power lies, and how it is exercised. The parlour game of reshuffles is of little consequence to anyone except those immediately involved. But for them, it is all. Outside, the social contract is broken. Even €11 billion is not enough wallpaper to cover over the cracks."

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698475#Comment_119698475

Good article. I feel the only people that will vote for FFG in the next election are the "I'm alright Jack" types. I can see a new party emerge after the next election too.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119697833#Comment_119697833

You aren jmcc can talk all you like about the polls, I don't mind.

The issue is that they give zero guidance to what will happen in the next general election. Things may change dramatically, or only a little, but they will change substantively.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698700#Comment_119698700

Zero guidance? You're deluded.

You can continue to ignore the polling posts and we'll come back to you at the next election.

Local and Euro elections in Summer 2024 are not far away now. Patience...

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119698720#Comment_119698720

Oh, I expect the local and European elections to go the way of these polls. Then when that is out of people's systems, we will see whether it is long-lasting or not.