FF/FG/Green Government - Part 3

Blut2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122057433#Comment_122057433

Irish governments achieved it throughout the history of the Irish state until the 2010s very frequently. When exactly those same needs would have been required, and from a poverty ridden government for all of those decades up until the Celtic Tiger at that.

So clearly its not remotely unachievable, we had a long history of building housing in far larger per capita numbers than we've been doing recently. The only reason we haven't done so since 2015 is either incompetence or ideology on the part of FG governments - take your pick.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122058029#Comment_122058029

Or old people who don't want anymore houses near them and use the system to clog it all up.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122058029#Comment_122058029

As I said in my post, unadulterated nonsense that shows a complete ignorance of the modern realities.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122058039#Comment_122058039

Or old people in a different part of the city block units which has no affect on them at all. Backed by a political party of course.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122057815#Comment_122057815

The last time I saw something gutted and filleted to that degree was on Masterchef.

Funny how RTE and all the other mainstream media outlets are refraining from drawing attention to it.😏

Ah but sure Gript are right wing and covering ministers ineptitude these days is so right wing.

I can't possibly comment on the content as …

Suffice to say she is about as much use in her portfolio, actually one of the most important in government, as a eunuch at an orgy.

Blut2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122060471#Comment_122060471

The statistics would suggest your theory that its impossible to build housing in larger numbers that we currently are is rather more "complete ignorance".

The Irish state managed to build over 20,000 housing units a year, and up to 30,000 some years, almost every year from 1971→1995. This during years when the population of Ireland was between 2.9mn and 3.6mn, and when the country was one of the poorest in Europe, with huge budgetary constraints.

The idea that 33k homes a year being built currently is in any way an achievement, when our population is now 5.1mn (and growing rapidly), and when we have yearly budgetary surpluses in the billions of euros, is absolute nonsense. Its an utter failure of government.

(this also ignoring the fact that we also in recent memory were building 90k units a year, at a time when our population was 4.1mn - that would be the equivalent of 110k housing units in 2024)

We can, and should, be building massive amounts more of housing - but our government has not done so over the last decade. Which, again, is down to either incompetence or deliberate choice - but its one of the two, because we have plenty of evidence within living memory that its certainly not logistically impossible.

Blut2

And rather topically on the above note, new CSO housing statistics just got released today that show that in 2024Q1 we only completed 5841 housing units. And our production volume has now declined for 6 quarters in a row:

https://twitter.com/nwl88444048/status/1783460535188488259

https://twitter.com/nwl88444048/status/1783437188341882980

Some 'achievement' for the government defenders in the thread eh?

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063057#Comment_122063057

Sticking up for herself here?

Edit: - Bad timing of her post with happenings in Newtownmountkennedy

https://twitter.com/HMcEntee/status/1783601979052228819

Didn't want to post in #TheTikTokseach thread, bit of discussion on it there as well.

corkie

Mick Clifford: Helen McEntee needs to get better grip on immigration brief
The main opposition party didn’t cover itself in glory on the asylum issue either this week

• In the course of the meeting she was filleted by independent TD Michael McNamara. He pointed out shortcomings in the current system.

A bit late with this news, but at least other media than Gript are reporting on it, wonder will it be in print tomorrow?

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/joint_committee_on_justice/2024-04-23/

His segment starts at 2:30 ish.

Cluedo Monopoly

Bit of a perfect storm for the government as we head towards June elections. Shocking stories from the health system as per usual, McEntee showing zero grasp of immigration, Housing completions declining, cabinet afraid to take on the RTE/license fee fiasco, more spoof on law and order even though nowhere near enough Gardai or prison capacity, Leo jumped ship and Fine Gael losing half it's TDs.

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122055494#Comment_122055494

what’s the solution so given the information you provided. Or what’s the problem? What is the crux of the problem I suppose is the question I ask. Is it too much immigration,not enough construction staff, too much industrial/commercial development sucking up construction labour, low wages in domestic sector of construction. Combination of all issues?

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122068272#Comment_122068272

PLenty of articles available to discuss why

One of the biggest issues Ireland has is political parties blocking housing/apartments etc

We are also obsessed with houses and not apartments. We also seem to have strange obsession with building out and not up, in a country without an extensive train system this is even more puzzling.

Look at the recent case in Clonliffe Road, perfect location, access to public transport, huge requirement in area for housing. Apartment for students and hospital staff etc. No need for a car etc etc etc. Perfect in every other city

Blocked by Sinn Fein leader

Blocked by someone living in Foxrock???? the question would be why someone in Foxrock is blocking it but anyway you can make your own assumptions.

Seemingly as well 18 storeys is "excessive"

Ireland is a living in cloud cuckoo land with these clowns able to block

You won't get any answers around here either by the way 😂

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122057433#Comment_122057433

there is one thing the government could do. Enforce rates of pay for workers building houses that match the rates of pay that are available on large industrial projects. Admittedly I don’t know how realistic or even possible that would be. The vast majority of construction workers, me being one are chasing the maximum available money while it’s available. That means data centres, intel and pharma. This means commuting distances to a town or city where large development of such projects are currently happening. At the same time there are housing developments happening slowly in every medium to large town in the country but at a much slower pace than is necessary. Seems to me if the wages on those housing sites matched or even came close to industrial development wages then a huge proportion of workers would be happy to give up the commute. But that doesn’t happen simply because it’s not the priority of the state. This is absolutely obvious to us on the ground building these places. But solving it without driving up housing costs even more is a complication that looks difficult to solve.

: Edited to correct loads of grammar and spelling mistakes. Apologies.

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122068377#Comment_122068377

Totally agree with how easy it is to block development in Ireland.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122068377#Comment_122068377

And we have been waiting for new planning legislation and reform for many many years. The bill is only coming to the Oireachtas now. Criminally late. The planning authorities need more powers (and less corruption - FG New Politics anyone?) and planning issues should not be decided In endless court battles. The Mahon tribunal outlined all the planning failures decades ago and still no reform.

JP Liz V1

Record Homeless Figures

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41382853.html

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122068429#Comment_122068429

It's a disgrace and then people jump around trying to make excuses for a political party who have spent years now making the housing crisis worse at every chance. Disgusting behaviour from people who would then claim they want to help the people of Ireland

corkie

For anyone who weren't watching The Late Late Show?

Improvements in housing 'could've happened five years ago' if govt had been 'braver' - Varadkar
“Sorry we haven’t been able to do more for you in the past 13 years.”

• He said he hasn’t decided yet whether he will run in the next general election in Dublin West, but that it will be down to “political calculation” of whether Fine Gael can hang on to the seat without him.
• A lot of the new houses you see being built now, or some of the new transport improvements … they could’ve happened five years ago, or four years ago.

He didn't give any political reasons for stepping down! But a productive and good interview from PK.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122067840#Comment_122067840

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/tanaiste-says-democracy-under-threat-in-face-of-militancy-1618263.html

• Mr Martin made the comments as he condemned scenes of disorder in Co Wicklow on Thursday evening when Garda members were attacked as a protest at a site earmarked for asylum seeker accommodation turned violent.
• “And we understand the challenges and pressures and many local communities and many people out there who have legitimate concerns and legitimate interests that they’re entitled to raise.”

This is a funny skit on TD Michael McNamara's committee questions to McEntee?

https://twitter.com/thelittlegreen6/status/1783933163871359172

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063870#Comment_122063870

Comes across as a somewhat desperate and emotional attempt to regain some credibility after her most recent mauling.

I will give her credit for at least appearing genuine and sincere here, but that doesn't change the fact that she's just completely out of her depth as Minister for Justice on not just this issue, but a lot of others under her remit.

Maybe she's starting to realise that? Maybe it's just getting too much? Either way, the best thing she could do now - professionally and perhaps even personally - is to resign as Minister and take some time to think about whether she's actually suitable for politics.

Silentcorner

McEntee will just call in sick someday soon like the growing list of them, or will she step down from politics like another growing list of them….her remaining presence has completely undermined Simon Harris, who had one shot to make a big difference for his party's hope in the coming elections and he didn't even fire the shot, another man completely out of his depth.

It wouldn't surprise me if we see a further ring of permanent heavy security (like we saw on the night of the last Budget) around surrounding blocks in and around Leinster House. It saddens me to even think that, but it is likely.

It is such a shame to see the political and media class in this country collapse in real time, but there are consequences to behaving like fascists. We are in a dysfunctional relationship with our Government.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122056549#Comment_122056549

How is she stoll in that job?

She's not fit to collect trolleys at a supermarket, and is somehow Minister for Justice.

Podge_irl

The political and media class in Ireland are not "behaving like fascists". What a deeply ridiculous thing to say.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122071551#Comment_122071551

Wasn't Heather Humphreys given the role as mentor/advisor for McEntee when Harris decided to keep her in Justice. It's not working thus far. Harris must already be regretting his mistake.

Beasty

Posts deleted

The NewtownMountKennedy incidents are before the courts - no discussion permitted anywhere on this site

corkie

^^^ Glad I did not post a clip from Una McGurk earlier, when she mentioned it. Her google history didn't look good.

Post was ready to submit but decided against submitting it.

Galwayguy35

This rotating Taoiseach thing wouldn't want to become the norm, we will have to pay for the pensions of three Taoisigh instead of one when this useless Government is eventually put out of its misery.

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122071809#Comment_122071809

And yet the political and media class throw around the term fascist/far right like confetti.

Closing businesses, imposing quotas on privately owned companies, controlling speech, declaring emergencies, using police force to impose government policy are all quiet fascist like behaviours.

hotmail.com

Refugees who come through Britain are not welcome in this country, according to this government.

Blut2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074166#Comment_122074166

Entirely reasonably. Nobody is a refugee fleeing the UK. If someone has already reached there, and is subsequently deciding to try Ireland instead, it makes them an economic migrant rather rather than a genuine refugee.

The only issue here is (as usual) our government is extremely late to actually doing something. We knew the UK was changing its asylum policy a long time ago. To wait until the change actually comes in, and only then panic into actually doing something here in response as is now happening, is typical.

An Claidheamh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122068231#Comment_122068231

Pathetic by Clifford.

He must be gunning for a job at the Sindo, British Telegraph or Spectator magazine when the Irish Times/Examiner goes bust with his constant anti-Shinner rhetoric

He fails to actually quote any SF member or provide a source, then blames them for the British border in Ireland, which both they, and his FFG masters, wanted open.

I'd imagine SF want a reunified Ireland to solve this problem, but then Clifford knows this.

Another West Brit Cork hack

"The main opposition didn’t cover itself in glory either this week. It now seems that every Sinn Fein rep is schooled to begin every utterance on the asylum issue with the words: “Sinn Fein is opposed to open borders”. The strategy is little more than a dog whistle, throwing out to voters that there may well be open borders — as some have been indoctrinated to believe — but the Shinners are not in favour of them.

Apart, of course, from the one open border that was shown during the week to be highly porous, that which divides the northeast with the rest of this island. Maybe Sinn Féin want it closed. Has their desperation to arrest a decline in support now pushed them towards a partitionist mentality? The flip-flopping by the party on this issue has just got a lot flipping floppier."

hotmail.com

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074235#Comment_122074235

But are these people not escaping persecution and war. Is this mantra now over? The government just wants rid of them, by the looks of it.

Markus Antonius

What the government were calling "dangerous, populist, xenophobia" two years ago when people were questioning their no-limit immigration policy, they are now promising deportation left right and centre! 🤣

Seems we have reached the limit at last.

Blut2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074253#Comment_122074253

Botswana, South Africa, Georgia, Bangladesh and Algeria were 4 of the top 10 nationalities of people seeking asylum here last year. What war exactly are they fleeing?

That aside, any migrant who has reached the UK has already successfully fled any persecution or war. They're no longer in any danger.

We should be using our very limited resources to actually select who we offer asylum to, and focus on those who need it most - women and children actually fleeing active war zones, who're currently in them and need help getting here. Thats how we both control our borders, and do the most good for humanity.

hotmail.com

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074264#Comment_122074264

Helen McEntee has gone full populist at the moment but seems to be not that good at it. Her message is Refugees Out.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074291#Comment_122074291

The asylum system has literally never been solely for people fleeing war zones. That is not its intended purpose. I'm not even sure simply fleeing a war zone qualifies you for asylum.

Floppybits

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074312#Comment_122074312

The Government haven't got a clue on what they are doing and are just reacting, badly, to what is going on. Irs no surprise, well except the Government, that there would be an 8mpaact of the UK Rwanda deal.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074252#Comment_122074252

What has he said that is incorrect?

Or you just don't like that he is pointing it out?

When have Sinn Fein said that a United Ireland would solve an immigration problem?

"West Brit" 😂 you really need to start coming up with new terms. People running around the web firing it out and haven't a clue what the origins of the terms of, in the case of Ireland at the moment we have less ties than ever with the UK so the term is totally irrelevant, in reality the party with the most links are Sinn Fein who a lot of them are still been paid by the King and have no problem using the British tax system to hide money when they want.

Blut2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074375#Comment_122074375

Fleeing an active war zone is the easiest way to qualify for asylum.

Its intended purpose is to help people who need it most. Which would be people fleeing actual war zones. Its also the defense of the system that people, including the post I was replying to and our government until very recently, regularly jump to - they attempt to suggest all of our asylum seekers are fleeing war zones so none can be rejected/deported.

The fact the system largely hasn't done that to date, and its been widely abused by economic migrants, is entirely down to government mismanagement - not any flaw with the concept itself. Economic migrants from safe places like Georgia, or people who've decided to come here after already spending months/years in the UK or France or elsewhere, should be being rejected and deported instantly so that they're not using up valuable, scarce, resources that could be better used on people more desperate and deserving for help.

An Claidheamh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074427#Comment_122074427

“When have Sinn Fein said that a United Ireland would solve an immigration problem?”

They haven’t, but it would.

Then again, any other party other than FFG would protect Irish sovereignty.

“a lot of them are still been paid by the King”, who has no problem robbing money from Irish people

An Claidheamh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074427#Comment_122074427

“West Brit, an abbreviation of West Briton, is a derogatory term for an Irish person who is perceived as Anglophilic in matters of culture or politics”

Recycling gammon catchphrases about ‘Eyeland’ and ‘Europe’ not preparing to dissolve itself to help the British exit failure would be construed as not very attractive English characteristics.

“According to Boyd, "The West Briton is the near Englishman ... an unfriendly caricature, the reductio ad absurdum of the least attractive English characteristics”

Clifford knows damn well what he is doing.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074789#Comment_122074789

Thanks for the explanation but I already knew, Sinn Fein have more links with England than any other party in Ireland, so are they all "West Brits"?

Of course he knew what he was doing, it isn't a lie is it?

Sinn Fein are a shambles, have been for years yet nobody read their policies, now they are getting questions on their policies and it is falling around them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074753#Comment_122074753

If you want a United Ireland, then removing Sinn Fein from the discussion is the quickest method to achieve it. The show boating and bickering with everyone in the North is helping nobody.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074381#Comment_122074381

The government look extremely two faced with the latest flip flopping. It's Lisa Chambers style politics. Too late anyway, the electorate will absolute see through their duplicity. I mean last week McEntee showed that she hadn't a scooby doo about the deportation metrics and this week she is bringing in "emergency" legislation. They have known about UK immigration policy for ages and knew the risks. We all knew the NI border was a highway for immigrants. The coalition of chaos have never stopped giving since 2020. June and Oct/Nov are worth waiting for.

hotmail.com

Simon Harris sounded quite tough on this refugee crisis.

Is he about to close the border with the North?

Britain has already said they won't take back asylum seekers according to reports tonight. Well we knew that.

Galwayguy35

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074958#Comment_122074958

Harris and McEntee are going to get their arses handed to them by the Brits and it's good enough for them.

They can bring in whatever legislation they like but I'm guessing the Brits will say the migrants won't be going anywhere and there's f all Harris can do about it.

Tough my eye.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074958#Comment_122074958

Is he about to close the border with the North?

Simon's response to this proposal

Guess we have to hope the Brits crack down so hard they stop most refugees getting there in the first place so the spillover we are currently getting falls proportionately

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122074958#Comment_122074958

It's rather like Leo getting tough in his welfare cheats campaign a few tears ago.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/welfare-cheats-ad-campaign-a-mistake-tds-told/36389454.html

Nothing learned by FG, always punching down.

Cluedo Monopoly

The meeting with the British home secretary is postponed.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122075924#Comment_122075924

Cleverly told her he just remembered he is washing his hair and can't meet her.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122076337#Comment_122076337

And that's clearly a major undertaking

The bould Helen not taking the Brit snub lying down though

https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2024/04/29/helen-mcentee-pulls-out-of-british-irish-conference-after-uk-ministers-meeting-postponed/

tom23

Phew… the country made a massive sigh of relief… no offence to helen but after her performance against mcnamara, this is probably a good thing