FF/FG/Green Government - Part 3

markodaly · 29-09-2021 4:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117954848#Comment_117954848

Again, try harder. This faux concern about Thanksgiving all of a sudden is funny.

Can we talk about something more serious now?

banie01 · 29-09-2021 4:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117954869#Comment_117954869

So just to be crystal clear?

Are you not going to address the circumstances of the issue with supporting a Thanksgiving associated date for the holiday?

Aswell as ignoring the alternative date put forward or indeed making other suggestion?

You waffle on about trying harder? Then ignore the points made?

I should be used to hypocrisy on your part at this stage, but fair play you keep managing to surprise.

Fantastic contribution as always from you, is it due to not getting those talking points yet from HO? Or just because you are happy to tacitly celebrate Genocide rather than disagree with the party?

Edit

Your notion of the Thanksgiving date being a concern **all of a sudden** is total and utter bullshít btw given that Ciaran Cannon tweeted his notion yesterday. The topic is raised and being flown as a kite by government and my response to it, while immediate can only be framed as a response to a nonsensical suggestion.

Shebean · 29-09-2021 4:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117954673#Comment_117954673

You are being evasive. Labelling awkward queries as 'soundbites' is just evasion. What form are these 'social' and 'affordable' taking? Are these more leased, bought and percentage of private estate 'social' or the unaffordable, 'affordable'?

And again until you recognise the government role in setting policy, the minister's role in housing and local authorities, you can't be taken as credible. By your comments the government have little to do with the housing crisis and a lot to do with spending 4 billion on likely making it worse but we'll wait and see. If it's worse it'll be all the councils fault. Both play a role.

RandomViewer · 29-09-2021 4:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117954785#Comment_117954785

Can't see IBEC or ISME too happy about it, less free dinners for Passscal

Ha Long Bay · 29-09-2021 5:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955089#Comment_117955089

His name is Paschal. Not sure why you chose to spell it like that?

FrancieBrady · 29-09-2021 5:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117954890#Comment_117954890

It goes something like, 'The natives should be happy they were invaded and civilised. Time has passed and it is now the time to commemorate and celebrate them'.

I see somebody else touting/kite flying an idea to associate the new holiday with the 12th of July. Seeing a pattern developing here. 😀

29-09-2021 5:50pm

Well done to the Irish Government and citizens. It was a long, hard road, but we are seeing the benefits of our sacrifices

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/ireland-named-best-in-world-for-covid-resilience-after-startling-turnaround-1.4685749

“Ireland has been named the best country to be in as the world learns to live through the coronavirus pandemic, topping the latest Bloomberg Covid Resilience Ranking.

Responding in a social media post, Taoiseach Micheál Martin said the result was down to the hard work of the Health Service Executive (HSE) and the Irish public.

Minister for Health Stephen Donnelly said the same resilience would see Ireland on a safe path to recovery coming into the autumn.”

McMurphy · 29-09-2021 5:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955292#Comment_117955292

Another PR disaster for FG. Honestly, the cretin they put in charge of coming up with these brain farts is depriving a village of it's idiot.

This about sums it up for me.

https://twitter.com/MallowNews/status/1443236795345428481?s=19

Shebean · 29-09-2021 6:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955415#Comment_117955415

I first read about the connection here and I thought it was just another error with the association to Thanksgiving. But after seeing that tweet it's obvious who the turkeys are, it's Fine Gael.

What complete morons.

banie01 · 29-09-2021 6:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955415#Comment_117955415

Sure their Cheerleader here has decided that as Germany (A harvest festival in Sept/Oct) and Grenada( A public holiday celebrating 1983 US Invasion) have holidays that are also called "Thanksgiving" that they are all much of a muchness.

Absolute tone deaf ignorance IMO.

I think the difference between celebrating cultural annihilation and genocide, and a harvest festival or liberation is quite stark myself, but it seems the resident FG shill has a different standard for "different".

That the Idea was floated, let alone pursued speaks volumes to the small rooms and narrow views framing decision making in some quarters.

Shebean · 29-09-2021 6:27pm

The real knife twist was hanging Covid remembrance day, (Flanagan looking for November 11th?), on it while nurses fight for recognition for their work and bank holidays mean nothing to them.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 6:38pm

Ahh I see the faux outrage crowd is up and running on twitter. Today they are complaining about a Bank Holiday. How terrible for people that working during the pandemic to get a day of holiday, can't have that now can we.

Do they actually realise how bitter they sound?

What will we have next? complaining about people working for a living, oh sorry they are already doing that daily

Someone has bought a house, can't have that, complain about them.

Seriously some people need to get out and live their own life instead of complaining about everyone else living theirs

https://twitter.com/irl_aoife/status/1443249235860807691

banie01 · 29-09-2021 6:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955509#Comment_117955509

If you even take a glance at the dates they suggested on their survey. Completely oblivious to the suitability of St Brigid's Day. It also ties in well with the commemorating the emergence from the darkness of Covid, with growing light of Spring and the traditions of Imbolc. It allows a uniquely Irish and Feminine take to be placed on commerative activity.

Yet never seemed to dawn(pun intended) on the focus groups that floated the US Thanksgiving link and association with genocide. Then it's just dismissed by their resident here 🤦‍♂️

It is appalling optics and one that has stuck in my craw.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955566#Comment_117955566

It’s also in 2022 and useless to a lot of people who are exhausted after nearly 18 months non stop working without any real holidays due to lock downs etc

How is having a Bank Holiday on the same weekend as Thanks giving terrible optics? We have a huge relationship with the US and a huge Irish American community.

Maybe it’s time instead of people constantly complaining and demanding what they want just wait and see what everyone else wants. I’m sure whatever day they pick people will find fault as I said already.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955509#Comment_117955509

How does a Bank Holiday mean nothing to a nurse?

banie01 · 29-09-2021 7:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955627#Comment_117955627

Perhaps they will, but while you are looking at "Faux Outrage" people complaining about an extra BH.

There is plenty of the real kind to be assigned at the linking of a National Holiday here with one widely recognised as celebrating land expropriation, genocide and atrocities against Native Americans.

Your effort to draw an equivalence? Are naive and quite poor.

The holiday is needed, we have fewer than most other EU countries. We can surely celebrate a day that's wholly Irish such as St Brigid's Day? Or is there an issue with the Irish nation commemerating as per our own history?

Rather than appropriating a shopping day before Xmas on the basis of an appalling link to Paddwhackery, because of that's what FG are after? It's not a rest day or a bonus especially not for frontline staff whenever it falls.

There's always farmers day.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955652#Comment_117955652

You are the only person shouting about genocide. In all my years on this earth on Thanks Giving I never heard anyone talk about genocide, FG/FF think about a bank holiday not even o Thanks Giving and suddenly we have people who are up in arms about Thanks Giving. Faux outrage alert, if it doesn’t happen on that weekend we won’t hear a mention of genocide again.

Im not drawing any equivalent, just saying no matter what day someone will have a problem.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955647#Comment_117955647

No they don’t. But hospital never shut so you saying we should never give any holidays to nurses because it doesn’t matter?

You so realise not only nurses are front line workers

We really are on the ridiculous level now.

banie01 · 29-09-2021 7:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955677#Comment_117955677

Perhaps you should take the opportunity to educate yourself and read up on how many NA tribes and organisations celebrate a Day of mourning rather than Thanksgiving then.

McMurphy · 29-09-2021 7:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955554#Comment_117955554

I've no problems in the world with an extra bank holiday, bring it on, keep them coming and plenty more too as far as I'm concerned.

It's the complete "Thanksgiving" bolloxollogy they're trying to stick on it, it's going down like a lead balloon and quite rightly, I keep saying it, FG need to keep the hell away from Social Media dudley72, they're a first-rate disaster with it.

Including on here.

Shebean · 29-09-2021 7:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955677#Comment_117955677

I've heard it debated a lot. Point is FG being tone deaf. It was FG made the Thanksgiving link. It's easily sorted no harm done but FG looking like ejits. Nothing new.

You shouldn't let what people think about things you don't find important bother you so much.

Shebean · 29-09-2021 7:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955686#Comment_117955686

Your question was why don't they matter to nurses. Now you are shifting the goalposts. The nurse I read was saying a bank holiday means nothing to them. Point was having this covid remembrance day bank holiday means little to nurses. Meanwhile they are fighting for compensation for the work they did and are doing. So FG want to make a fun thanksgiving. As I said, morons.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955704#Comment_117955704

Thing is Fg don't look like ejits.

We have people now trying to say Nurses don't care about Bank Holidays, never mind the fact that if they have to work they get paid extra plus all the people who get a paid vacation. Plus all of the other front line staff

Plus we now have rambling of genocide and the same people will move on next week if another weekend is picked and never mention a word about Thanks Giving again.

Very predictable faux outrage to everything.

Plus the best, people actually online complaining because people that are working get an extra holiday......I was about to say baffling, but in reality its about normal these days

FrancieBrady · 29-09-2021 7:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955704#Comment_117955704

Entirely predictable and explains why Flanagan and Leo thought a national commemoration of the Black and Tans might be a cuddly idea too.

Read the room lads and lassies!

Shebean · 29-09-2021 7:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955727#Comment_117955727

We had one nurse say they don't mean anything. Why are you trying to blow this up bigger than it is?

No rambling. It's a very common discussion regarding Thanksgiving, Columbus Day etc. etc.

If you don't believe the criticism is real why spend your time getting so upset about it?

FG look like tone deaf buffoons. I guarantee they'll drop it.

banie01 · 29-09-2021 7:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955727#Comment_117955727

Dudley, are you and Marko a tag team?

FG have made a Bollox of what shouldn't really be all that hard to do.

Imagine telling people that they had an extra days paid holiday? And the outcome is the current state of play?

It's a FG TD and a the party itself I've seen floating the Thanksgiving date, with zero actual thought given.

As for wailing about genocide? I asked Mark but he is off elsewhere. So I'll repeat the question to you.

How long is okay before it becomes acceptable to celebrate Genocide?

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955715#Comment_117955715

I aint shifting anything. Makey uppey nurses doesn't really count you know. Nurses will get extra day off of paid holidays if not working and if working they will get extra pay. Plus the hospitals run on reduced staff as only emergencies on a Bank Holiday,. I suppose you knew all this and the makey uppey nurse did as well?

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:34pm

I am sure this will continue to get more & more ridiculous so will leave you to it, hilarious to watch the carry on of the few.

Shebean · 29-09-2021 7:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955755#Comment_117955755

She commented on the FG twitter post McMurph posted. She might be lying but she's right.

You seem to believe more goes into the comments here than likely does. This is just FG making tits of themselves. It'll be added to the list.

Personally I think FF/FG/Green walking us into a possible winter of black outs is more important.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 7:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955753#Comment_117955753

As I said one lad said he would never vote for FF/FG again because they offered an extra bank holiday. Nothing to do with Thank Giving or anything. That the level of ridiculous we are at.

How many times have you marched on the American Embassy on Thanks Giving because of the genocide? 😂

banie01 · 29-09-2021 7:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955789#Comment_117955789

1 lad on a different thread? That you didn't quote...

Much like the thought that FG put into this idea, the lack of any in your replies or even link to the example you relied on not wanting a BH?

To someone objecting to a BH on a date that is explicitly linked with a holiday associated with Racism, Land Expropriation and Genocide.

You do realize that objecting to celebrating a Yanksgiving holiday, isn't the same as objecting to a deserved needed additional BH?

Plenty of other dates available, and rather than discuss or even propose an alternative one? You just double down on a nonsensical position of support for an awfully thought idea.

But yourself and your buddy race to dismiss genocide and it's continuing impact in the US to toe the party line.

Great contribution.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 8:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955875#Comment_117955875

Have you ever marched on the US embassy on Thanks Giving day because of this genocide?

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 8:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955902#Comment_117955902

Ok so you don’t mind about the genocide, but if someone else tries to celebrate Thanks Giving then you will care about the genocide?

Hate to tell you but all over Ireland they have Thanks Giving events, have for years.

banie01 · 29-09-2021 8:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955973#Comment_117955973

Is this seriously the level you want to sink to?

Yanks all over Ireland are perfectly entitled to celebrate their day.

Would you propose that I take action against them? Are they enforcing celebration upon me or upon the nation for a tenuous link?

You do understand the difference between yanks celebrating a holiday? And Ireland as a Nation embracing that same holiday?

It's not really that difficult a concept to grasp you know.

Yanks celebrate Thanksgiving, a holiday tainted with racism and genocide.

Ireland does not, nor should it seriously countenance adopting or conjoining or new bank holiday with it.

What part of that are you not grasping?

Is that deliberate, or is it just actually beyond your ken?

FrancieBrady · 29-09-2021 8:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117955973#Comment_117955973

There is a difference(as Flanagan and Leo found out) between random members of the public celebrating and embracing something and a state recognition/alignment/commemoration.

Luxemburgo · 29-09-2021 8:34pm

This budget is going to infuriate me

Full of populism, empty of action

Luxemburgo · 29-09-2021 8:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884312#Comment_117884312

Yup by becoming SF, they have made SF more attractive

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 8:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956079#Comment_117956079

Apart from the carbon tax increase I haven't seen a whole pile come out on the budget.

Would be interesting to hear what you would like to see in it?

Shebean · 29-09-2021 8:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956087#Comment_117956087

So they became SF by doing all those things repeatedly before SF and having different policies to SF? Interesting analysis. I must say it trumps blaming SF for creating the housing crisis.

Luxemburgo · 29-09-2021 8:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956119#Comment_117956119

Id like to see some plan to tackle our increasing debt.

Id don't want a derisory tax decrease, I want us to reduce our debt and spending to ultimately be in a positon to remove the temporary USC. They'll charge us more carbon tax and also some derisory tax decrease.

I am just sick of the default being to spend money on black holes rather then attempt to reform.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 8:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956049#Comment_117956049

Not sure why you refer to people as "yanks", I stopped reading after that

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 8:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956154#Comment_117956154

I don't want a tax decrease and if the government have listened to the people neither do the majority. I can't remember but they done a poll recently asking if people would like a tax decrease or to spend more money on services like HSE etc. Majority went with spend money on HSE etc.

Carbon tax was always going to happen, nothing we can do about that since we agreed to the Paris agreement

banie01 · 29-09-2021 8:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956187#Comment_117956187

As I said earlier great contribution.

Feel free to let your sensitivity to a label 😉

Shape how you might empathize with a people subjected to 100s of years racial violence, dispossession and sidelining whilst you keep championing an Irish Thanksgiving.

if we hold ourselves to any standard as a nation it should be in supporting the underdog and abused.

Not furthering their suffering by celebrating their conquering.

But rather than address that? Good auld DudleyDoRight gets his knickers in a twist over the word yank👍

Like I said a few posts back, great contribution.

Luxemburgo · 29-09-2021 8:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956213#Comment_117956213

I really really really do not want more money spent on that HSE black hole. It's over funded as it is.

Like I said it's going to infuriate me,

!!money for all!!

Maybe I'm just cranky cos Metro North will never be built but we can spend on vanity populist projects.

dudley72 · 29-09-2021 9:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117956245#Comment_117956245

HSE etc, I do think they need to invest in the Gardai and other services. As you say the HSE seems a black hole but I don't know how to change that and I don't know many governments in the World who have fixed healthcare.