KBC want to leave the Irish Market

donaghs

Announced this morning. Is this basically because you can't get your loan collateral back if the borrower defaults on their payments?
e.g. irish mortgage defaults rarely lead to repossessions
(despite Irish people paying more for mortgages than the rest of Europe).

Or is this too simplistic?

Mike Murdock

donaghs wrote: »

Announced this morning. Is this basically because you can't get your loan collateral back if the borrower defaults on their payments?
e.g. irish mortagages (despite Irish people paying more for mortgages than the rest of Europe).

Or is this too simplistic?

That's a large part of the reason.

It's the main reason that Santander was scared out of opening in Ireland years ago. They thought they had very little recourse if mortgage defaults happened.

Eric Cartman

We really need to get onboard with evictions and repossessions as a nation, we’ve broken our property market completely by trying to ‘protect’ those without money and now every landlord and bank has no interest in staying

Mike Murdock

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We really need to get onboard with evictions and repossessions as a nation, we’ve broken our property market completely by trying to ‘protect’ those without money and now every landlord and bank has no interest in staying

The problem boils down to what I said on another thread, Eric. Everyone has "rights" and are "entitled" to things, without any need to be "responsible" for themselves or their decisions. And the State and courts are fine with it - Nanny-statism at its finest.

Since the fake boom back in the 2000's, everyone is now "entitled" to and has the "right" to own a house. Just seemingly no responsibility if things go tits up due to their own fault/mistakes.

Lofidelity

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We really need to get onboard with evictions and repossessions as a nation, we’ve broken our property market completely by trying to ‘protect’ those without money and now every landlord and bank has no interest in staying

Pat Kenny put that to Pascal Donoghue this morning, Pascal says it's a minority of cases, protecting people etc and basically nothing will change

Leg End Reject

Great, less competition for those who bother to pay their mortgage, I'll look forward to higher interest rates.

The problem is the "won't pay" rather than the "can't pay", but it was ludicrous to offer blanket protection. Although I do laugh at correspondence from the bank declaring in bold that my home is at risk if I don't pay my mortgage.

PhilOssophy

There is no reason whatsoever why a bank wouldn't up sticks and leave.
Lets be realistic here - the only way banks make money he is lending it out. We have let a situation develop where people can do as they please and Prime Time etc peddle the poor mouth brigade.
If you can't afford to repay on your home, you either downsize or go back to renting. The bank should be well able to get the money they lent you back. If you go bankrupt, so be it. Start again.
The current mess cannot continue.
Hard cases make for bad law.

christy c

Lofidelity wrote: »

Pat Kenny put that to Pascal Donoghue this morning, Pascal says it's a minority of cases, protecting people etc and basically nothing will change

And Pascal is from our "right wing" party.

The question I'd be asking is why would anyone expect KBC to stick around after the Strokestown fiasco? Someone who didn't pay a thing for a decade wasn't the main thing politicians were talking about, it was "thugs" who dared to evict the freeloaders.

donaghs

donaghs wrote: »

e.g. irish mortgage defaults rarely lead to repossessions

And yet some people on here claim that repossessions are happening constantly.

Which is it?

Arthur Daley

christy c wrote: »

And Pascal is from our "right wing" party.

Exactly, Tony Benn and Michael Foot couldn't nationalise a banking industry better than Ireland's 'right wing' have managed in the last 12 years.

namloc1980

Deleted User wrote: »

And yet some people on here claim that repossessions are happening constantly.

Which is it?

Repossessions are not happening constantly except in the case of abandoned property. But evictions are very few and far between. The courts just continuously adjourn cases that look like they might require a forced eviction. Banks also have little appetite to force an eviction after the Strokestown fiasco and all the politicians saying how awful it was.

namloc1980

namloc1980 wrote: »

Repossessions are not happening constantly except in the case of abandoned property. But evictions are very few and far between. The courts just continuously adjourn cases that look like they might require a forced eviction. Banks also have little appetite to force an eviction after the Strokestown fiasco and all the politicians saying how awful it was.

Oh, I'm well aware of that, I'm just calling out those who think the opposite is true.

jmayo

donaghs wrote: »

Announced this morning. Is this basically because you can't get your loan collateral back if the borrower defaults on their payments?
e.g. irish mortgage defaults rarely lead to repossessions
(despite Irish people paying more for mortgages than the rest of Europe).

Or is this too simplistic?

So this is the third foreign bank that I will have to close accounts with.
First it was NIB, and now Ulster and KBC. :mad:

And that fooking gimp donoghoe rabbits on about how we have competition because we have our good old two pillar banks. :mad:

Competition my fooking ar**.
Less competitors mean less competition.
Some fooking accountant he is.

KBC offered us better mortgage rates a number of years ago.

Now that option is gone for people.

I said this years ago in Politics or Accommodation & Property that someone would ultimately have to pay for those fooking leeches that refused to pay their mortgages and yet got to keep their properties.

All you got back from some was the bullshyte about "bankers" were wrong and the banks should take the hit.

Not one word about the customers of the banks.
The customers that pay their way.


Well this is just more of it.
All of us banking in this country, and most especially those with or seeking loans and mortgages, are going to be paying for it.

There really is need for a proper right wing party in this state.

Lofidelity wrote: »

Pat Kenny put that to Pascal Donoghue this morning, Pascal says it's a minority of cases, protecting people etc and basically nothing will change

That fooking eejit.

Donald Trump

They might also have looked at the market and concluded that bad times are ahead generally.

Repossession or no re-possession. They might just not want their eggs in a dysfunctional basket/market

Mad_maxx

Mike Murdock wrote: »

That's a large part of the reason.

It's the main reason that Santander was scared out of opening in Ireland years ago. They thought they had very little recourse if mortgage defaults happened.

not " thought "

knew they had very little recourse

Mad_maxx

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We really need to get onboard with evictions and repossessions as a nation, we’ve broken our property market completely by trying to ‘protect’ those without money and now every landlord and bank has no interest in staying

we are a nation of children

Mad_maxx

namloc1980 wrote: »

Repossessions are not happening constantly except in the case of abandoned property. But evictions are very few and far between. The courts just continuously adjourn cases that look like they might require a forced eviction. Banks also have little appetite to force an eviction after the Strokestown fiasco and all the politicians saying how awful it was.

as Keith Mills put it on Twitter recently in relation to statistical reality re_ covid deaths . ( vast majority of deaths involve those over eighty )

"as a people, we are obsessed with personal stories" , print one story about a twenty something succumbing to covid and we beg NPHET to shut the country down for another six months , print one story about a bunch of cowboys in Roscommon who never paid anyone for anything , never mind their bank loan and we demand that nobody be evicted

incredibly easy people to play by pulling at the heartstrings

PhilOssophy

Mad_maxx wrote: »

we are a nation of children

Whingy moany children.

suicide_circus

Idiotic country

Mad_maxx

Mad_maxx wrote: »

as Keith Mills put it on Twitter recently in relation to statistical reality re_ covid deaths . ( vast majority of deaths involve those over eighty )

"as a people, we are obsessed with personal stories" , print one story about a twenty something succumbing to covid and we beg NPHET to shut the country down for another six months , print one story about a bunch of cowboys in Roscommon who never paid anyone for anything , never mind their bank loan and we demand that nobody be evicted

incredibly easy people to play by pulling at the heartstrings

Bonus points for being from a good GAA family.

As a GAA person the irrelevancy of that statement on matters before the courts drives me bonkers.

Incredibly immature mindset as a country. Rules should never be ambiguous and penalties should be consistent when it comes to matters like mortgage arrears.

We all pay for it in the end.

Topgear on Dave

Rabo Gone, Halifax gone, Ulster gone, now KBC gone

There'll be some amount of champagne drank in the boardrooms of AIB and BOI tonight.

Larbre34

In a word, exceptionalism.

Irish people don't do consequences. Rules are for someone else. Waiting your turn, is for someone else. Paying the going rate, is for someone else. Being answerable, is for someone else. Paying tax?....someone else.

'I deserve a parachute, because I'm great'

Bubbaclaus

Hopefully this will cause a good hard look at the repossessions issue in this country. Not a single EU bank will touch Ireland because of it.

It's all well and good to keep people in homes they can't afford to pay for, and troublesome evictions taking years in the courts, but this is the end result.

Bubbaclaus

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Hopefully this will cause a good hard look at the repossessions issue in this country. Not a single EU bank will touch Ireland because of it.

It's all well and good to keep people in homes they can't afford to pay for, and troublesome evictions taking years in the courts, but this is the end result.

Which party would touch it?

Bubbaclaus

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Which party would touch it?

It would need cross party support. Basically it is never going to happen.

jmayo

Larbre34 wrote: »

In a word, exceptionalism.

Irish people don't do consequences. Rules are for someone else. Waiting your turn, is for someone else. Paying the going rate, is for someone else. Being answerable, is for someone else. Paying tax?....someone else.

'I deserve a parachute, because I'm great'

This country has some throwbacks to our history that it';s about time were well and truly dumped.

One is even evident today in another thread on this, about how Irish people were evicted wholesale from their homes once upon a time.
And we couldn't have evictions like that.
FFS time to grow up.
There is a difference between the British backed landlords turfing starving families onto the roadside from their hovel and a bank demanding 4x4 driving fookers give back the keys to their large house because they were refusing to pay for it for years.

And yes we do know people like that.

Anyone that sees the two scenarios as comparable are either fooking morons or have vest interest in screwing the rest of us.

Another more general problem is this mindset about fooking the system, getting one over the establishment, and us and them mentality.

Well the Brits fooking left this part of the island 100 years ago and the system is now us, not some mythical entity from across the water or somewhere else.

You screw the system, you screw the banks, the tax authorities and all you are doing is screwing anyone around you that pays for stuff and ultimately everyone even the ones that don't pay for anything.

The Student

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We really need to get onboard with evictions and repossessions as a nation, we’ve broken our property market completely by trying to ‘protect’ those without money and now every landlord and bank has no interest in staying

I agree with you but good luck with that.

Mike Murdock

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Hopefully this will cause a good hard look at the repossessions issue in this country. Not a single EU bank will touch Ireland because of it.

It's all well and good to keep people in homes they can't afford to pay for, and troublesome evictions taking years in the courts, but this is the end result.

Which is exactly what the cozy banking cartel here wants.

c.p.w.g.w

I have been looking at my savings, affordability of buying an upgrade...only I find out my Uncle who is living in a very up market area, hasn't paid his mortgage in 9 years, and they just had another child...

He seems to think he doesn't need to worry about the bank until the kids are all grown up...So I asked a friend who works for banks on mortgages that aren't being paid...and he said my uncle is right, no judge in this country will sign off on a repossession of that property...

Oh the uncle is driving 19BMW too, and Bragg's with deluded pride about not paying his mortgage...

My uncle isn't one of those people who needs to be protected, like a single parent who has lost their job and can't afford repayments

Gunmonkey

jmayo wrote: »

Anyone that sees the two scenarios as comparable are either fooking morons or have vest interest in screwing the rest of us.

Another more general problem is this mindset about fooking the system, getting one over the establishment, and us and them mentality.

Well the Brits fooking left this part of the island 100 years ago and the system is now us, not some mythical entity from across the water or somewhere else.

You screw the system, you screw the banks, the tax authorities and all you are doing is screwing anyone around you that pays for stuff and ultimately everyone even the ones that don't pay for anything.

Yup, "cute hoor-ism" up and down the nation. Pull one over the big man in de big house.....two fingers to de Guards or de Gov or any authority figure.......big "FECK OFF!" to anyone who tries to tell ya what to do.....dry ****e tries to ask for some of the €300000 ya borrowed from you ya tell him ta piss off he'll get it when ya feel like hurhurhur.

More I look at it this country is like a nation of 14 year olds scrumping apples and running from the farmer or dossing class and legging it from the teacher. Or the worst elements of "Working Class" yob culture giving you a carte blanche to act like a disrespecting prick to everyone who crosses your path and your some bastion of hard work and morals/"salt of the earth".

Honestly dont blame KBC or Ulster Bank, huge tracts of political capital spent defending the Strokestown thugs and every instance of an eviction like it and then pivoting around and whinging about excessive bank charges or high interest rates.

Jinglejangle69

Which parties want a ban on evictions again, I have heard it peddled a few times?

And that sanctimonious so and so Peter Mcverry also.

House for everyone and a ban on evictions.

Country is destroyed.