Cyclists, insurance and road tax

Effects

Sono Topolino wrote: »

That UPS van is parked on what used to be a parking bay - an example of how not to do cycling infrastructure.

So you'd rather remove a traffic lane, just so there would still be parking available?

Effects

EddieN75 wrote: »

That Ups van is delivering goods essential to business.

So why didn't he just park up on the street instead?

Or maybe just pull into the empty parking lot of the business he was delivering to, and everyone is happy.

AndrewJRenko

EddieN75 wrote: »

That Ups van is delivering goods essential to business.

Cycling around the van isn't a big deal.

Cyclists cycling to work in essential businesses are essential to business. Parking on the main traffic lane isn't a big deal.

You don't get to play the "essential business" card as an excuse for breaking the law.

EddieN75

Effects wrote: »

So why didn't he just park up on the street instead?

Or maybe just pull into the empty parking lot of the business he was delivering to, and everyone is happy.

Van too big. Not an ideal sized vehicle to be trying to turn or reverse in a city.

A bit of common sense please. People need come into the real world every now and then. The same individuals are over defending the work ethos of the public sector too.
Like a parallel universe at times around here.

Some people dont give a toss about anyone but themselves. If the delivery driver was dropping off their new blow up doll they wouldn't mind but if it's for someone else it's an issue

Fighting Tao

EddieN75 wrote: »

Van too big. Not an ideal sized vehicle to be trying to turn or reverse in a city.

A bit of common sense please. People need come into the real world every now and then. The same individuals are over defending the work ethos of the public sector too.
Like a parallel universe at times around here.

Some people dont give a toss about anyone but themselves.

I’m categorised as an essential worker. Is he more essential than me?

EddieN75

Fighting Tao wrote: »

I’m categorised as an essential worker. Is he more essential than me?

Cycle around the van.

Fighting Tao

EddieN75 wrote: »

Cycle around the van.

That wasn’t the question.

Is there a scale of essentialness for using infrastructure. Like someone who is an essential worker driving is more important than one who is cycling?

What is the road is chockablock with motorised vehicles? Is he still higher up the chain of essentialness?

AndrewJRenko

EddieN75 wrote: »

Van too big. Not an ideal sized vehicle to be trying to turn or reverse in a city.

So it's "too big" for the wide open open street but not "too big" for the cycle lane?

No turning or reversing involved in stopping on the street. Just stop, unload, deliver and drive off. What's the problem?

EddieN75 wrote: »

.

Some people dont give a toss about anyone but themselves. If the delivery driver was dropping off their new blow up doll they wouldn't mind but if it's for someone else it's an issue

You're right, some people don't give a toss about vulnerable road users, cyclists and pedestrians, including essential workers, older people, people with disabilities who can't see an obstruction or can't squeeze their wheelchair through a narrow gap.

But once the driver manages to save a couple of minutes off their delivery time, that's the important thing, right?

AndrewJRenko

EddieN75 wrote: »

Cycle around the van.

Why can't the van stop on the road? No big deal surely?

Paddigol

Sono Topolino wrote: »

Protected and segregated cycle lanes in cities are essential.

They're not. Safe and responsible driving and cycling is essential.

Segregated cycle lanes simply reinforce the them and us attitude displayed on every page here - "get back in your cycle lane"... "get off the road"... "there's a perfectly good cycle lane there - use it"... "we paid for your cycle lane - use it"... "bikes don't belong on the road".

Driver carelessness and recklessness is one thing. But that's human nature unfortunately and can only be improved through experience and education (as with any human activity). But without doubt 99% of the actual aggression I've encountered on the road has been from drivers outraged that I'm in the bus lane/ road rather than cycle lane. Deciding that segregated cycle lanes is the panacea to all our cycling problems is only going to amplify that type of aggression.

Just share the road and - to use a guiding rule from Boards.ie - don't be a d!ck, whether your walking, cycling or driving.

namloc1980

EddieN75 wrote: »

Cycle around the van.

He should've parked up on the road and let the cars go around him.

BabysCoffee

EddieN75 wrote: »

Van too big. Not an ideal sized vehicle to be trying to turn or reverse in a city.

A bit of common sense please. People need come into the real world every now and then. The same individuals are over defending the work ethos of the public sector too.
Like a parallel universe at times around here.

Some people dont give a toss about anyone but themselves. If the delivery driver was dropping off their new blow up doll they wouldn't mind but if it's for someone else it's an issue

Sounds like the driver needs to go for additional training if he can't manage to park his van in the correct spot in order to carry out deliveries.
Or he should be taken off the road if the only way he can manage his deliveries in the vehicle that is "too big" is by blocking a lane of cycle traffic and causes a dangerous obstruction for people on bikes i.e. vulnerable road users

EddieN75

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why can't the van stop on the road? No big deal surely?

You should ring UPS and lodge a complaint. Get the driver sanctioned/fired. The poster above this comment feels similar.

Ups.ie

Dublin
Unit 3
Mygan Park
Jamestown Road
Finglas, Dublin 11
Ireland (Republic of)
Customer Service: +353 1 52 45446


Will you be lodging a complaint or is it just "pub talk"?

Sono Topolino

Effects wrote: »

So you'd rather remove a traffic lane, just so there would still be parking available?

In most cases, yes.

breezy1985

BabysCoffee wrote: »

Sounds like the driver needs to go for additional training if he can't manage to park his van in the correct spot in order to carry out deliveries.
Or he should be taken off the road if the only way he can manage his deliveries in the vehicle that is "too big" is by blocking a lane of cycle traffic and causes a dangerous obstruction for people on bikes i.e. vulnerable road users

There are plenty of places where the correct spot doesnt exist or like in a lot of areas in Limerick the correct spot has an illegally parked car in it. Anyway the obstruction isnt dangerous you just go round the van. Plenty of spots where cyclists or cars have to go round legally parked cars or around buses stopped at stops

breezy1985

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why can't the van stop on the road? No big deal surely?

He would still have to walk across the cycle lane with the goods which I thing would be worse than having to go round the outside of the van

VonLuck

breezy1985 wrote: »

He would still have to walk across the cycle lane with the goods which I thing would be worse than having to go round the outside of the van

Hmm. Maybe he shouldn't park anywhere on the road then, eh?

AndrewJRenko

breezy1985 wrote: »

He would still have to walk across the cycle lane with the goods which I thing would be worse than having to go round the outside of the van

Walking across a cycle lane isn't a big deal, when they are unidirectional like this. Just wait for a gap in cycling traffic and push through, not so different to crossing a footpath. I guess that's why it is illegal to park on a cycle lane.

Thelonious Monk

It's no big deal really to cycle around something stopped in a bike lane, but that's not really the point. When your commute to work is one of these obstructions after another, day after day, it becomes clear that the point of cycle lanes is being defeated here and will put you in dangerous situations from time to time.

breezy1985

VonLuck wrote: »

Hmm. Maybe he shouldn't park anywhere on the road then, eh?

As I said earlier sometimes that is impossible. I don't know what magic city you live in that full of loading bays but the ones I've lived in don't have them

breezy1985

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Walking across a cycle lane isn't a big deal, when they are unidirectional like this. Just wait for a gap in cycling traffic and push through, not so different to crossing a footpath. I guess that's why it is illegal to park on a cycle lane.

I would rather take my bike around a van than between the van and the path but fair enough if you dont

Cilldara_2000

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Or to put it visually

Given our track record with everything on teh right hand side in this country, we're sort of left with nothing but helmets :pac:

AndrewJRenko

Cilldara_2000 wrote: »

Given our track record with everything on teh right hand side in this country, we're sort of left with nothing but helmets :pac:

Or else we could start working on the issues on the right instead of working on the futility of helmets?

VonLuck

breezy1985 wrote: »

As I said earlier sometimes that is impossible. I don't know what magic city you live in that full of loading bays but the ones I've lived in don't have them

That's why you pull up somewhere more suitable! You don't get to disobey the rules just because it would be inconvenient to follow them.

breezy1985

VonLuck wrote: »

That's why you pull up somewhere more suitable! You don't get to disobey the rules just because it would be inconvenient to follow them.

Somewhere suitable could be the other end of the city centre in Limerick. I would rather a quick cycle round a van than ask a delivery guy to walk 6/7 blocks with massive boxes or kegs of beer. The problem isn't the van driver it's the muppets who park illegally in the loading bays and the useless traffic warden who doesn't stop them

You are starting to sound an awful lot like those "my road" entitled drivers

AndrewJRenko

breezy1985 wrote: »

Somewhere suitable could be the other end of the city centre in Limerick. I would rather a quick cycle round a van than ask a delivery guy to walk 6/7 blocks with massive boxes or kegs of beer. The problem isn't the van driver it's the muppets who park illegally in the loading bays and the useless traffic warden who doesn't stop them

You are starting to sound an awful lot like those "my road" entitled drivers

That's up to the delivery company and the recipient to sort out. It's no surprise that regular deliveries are required, so they need to make arrangements to take in deliveries without breaking the law. We could all do our jobs quicker and easier if we got to break the law to save us a bit of time, but it's not generally a good idea.

In my experience, most of the muppets parking illegally in loading bays are other commercial drivers, taking their breakfast / lunch break, or just using them as handy parking for a day, not while loading or unloading.

breezy1985

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

That's up to the delivery company and the recipient to sort out. It's no surprise that regular deliveries are required, so they need to make arrangements to take in deliveries without breaking the law. We could all do our jobs quicker and easier if we got to break the law to save us a bit of time, but it's not generally a good idea.

In my experience, most of the muppets parking illegally in loading bays are other commercial drivers, taking their breakfast / lunch break, or just using them as handy parking for a day, not while loading or unloading.

I have been the recipient of huge deliveries every week for years now and the area had loading times where it was legal to park on double yellows due to the lack of bays anywhere nearby and even if there was some these were full artics so would not fit anyway so maybe some of these "illegal" vehicles are actually legal. I haven't worked in them all but from my experience and what I see round there are a number of pubs in Limerick where anything other than path side parking would be genuinely impossible

In Limerick from what I can tell it's offices near the loading bays are the culprit in the city centre.

AndrewJRenko

EddieN75 wrote: »

You should ring UPS and lodge a complaint. Get the driver sanctioned/fired. The poster above this comment feels similar.

Ups.ie

Dublin
Unit 3
Mygan Park
Jamestown Road
Finglas, Dublin 11
Ireland (Republic of)
Customer Service: +353 1 52 45446


Will you be lodging a complaint or is it just "pub talk"?

The complaining t-shirt is long worn out. I've done the emails, I've done the phone calls, I've done the Twitter thing (one of the big delivery companies blocked me last year for a polite, civil tweet about their driver on a footpath), I've called the Gardai, I've called the clampers.

Is there anything else you'd like me to do before we actually ask drivers to just obey the feckin law?

breezy1985 wrote: »

I have been the recipient of huge deliveries every week for years now and the area had loading times where it was legal to park on double yellows due to the lack of bays anywhere nearby and even if there was some these were full artics so would not fit anyway so maybe some of these "illegal" vehicles are actually legal. I haven't worked in them all but from my experience and what I see round there are a number of pubs in Limerick where anything other than path side parking would be genuinely impossible

In Limerick from what I can tell it's offices near the loading bays are the culprit in the city centre.

Bizarrely, it IS legal to park on double-yellows for up to 30 minutes for loading or unloading, but not on Clearways or cycle lanes. If path side parking is the only option then 1) it should be parked on the road, in the main traffic lane, and 2) it should be scheduled outside of peak traffic hours.

Here's some of today's bunch of commercial and other drivers that chose to block footpaths or cycle lanes rather than finding legal and safe parking. Some of these had spacious driveways available, or car parks across the road or inside, but always, always, always, saving the almighty driver two minutes or €2 to pay for parking trumps pedestrians and cyclists having safe journeys. Businesses like Gaswise, Dublin Meats, GWS Landscaping should really think about the image this creates for their brand.

This isn't a rare event or 'just for a few minutes'. This is constant, persistent selfishness, putting their own convenience ahead of everyone else.

EddieN75

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

The complaining t-shirt is long worn out. I've done the emails, I've done the phone calls, I've done the Twitter thing (one of the big delivery companies blocked me last year for a polite, civil tweet about their driver on a footpath), I've called the Gardai, I've called the clampers.

Is there anything else you'd like me to do before we actually ask drivers to just obey the feckin law?

Failing a call to Joe Duffy it looks like you are just going to have to put up with it

20Wheel

Its not surprising that people park in cycle lanes, the city often simply cant accommodate them. Squeeze in a jogger lane and a scooter lane while youre at it.
joggers rights, we need more jogging infrastructure.