Manchester United Teamtalk/Transfer/Gossip 23/24 - [New Thread Available]

Past30Now

Past30Now wrote: »

One of our greatest servants. Always looked out for him as we were born within a couple of weeks of one another.

Shame that he's a complete ***** at home.

Ya in the class for 92 doc didn't they say he locked scholes in a dryer and turned it on?

v3ttel

The entire list of players would surely be part of the hall of fame over time.

Voted for Keane, Scholes, Cantona, Andy Cole, Rio, Vidic. The first 3 are obvious choices. Andy Cole was one of my favourite ever strikers. Rio & Vidic had the best ever defensive partnership in the league.

For non-United players, I'd have gone for Drogba, Gerrard and Vieira.

Lord TSC

Gary "Hot Take" Lineker....

https://twitter.com/garylineker/status/1386956793029529602?s=21

In response to a Man United fan wanting the Glazers out: "Excellent, fully admire your stance. When the club can’t afford top players and gradually slide into mid table mediocrity or worse, I hope you continue to feel the same way"

The Big Easy

fergiesfolly wrote: »

So, what six did ye vote for?
Cantona
Keane
Scholes
Schmeichel
Bergkamp
Gerrard( must be best player never to win PL)

Exact same, except Cole for Scholes, personal loyalty from my childhood

v3ttel

Lord TSC wrote: »

Gary "Hot Take" Lineker....

https://twitter.com/garylineker/status/1386956793029529602?s=21

In response to a Man United fan wanting the Glazers out: "Excellent, fully admire your stance. When the club can’t afford top players and gradually slide into mid table mediocrity or worse, I hope you continue to feel the same way"

Has he confused the Glazers and City's owners?

Mitch Connor

v3ttel wrote: »

Has he confused the Glazers and City's owners?

I guess the argument could be that if United were not able to afford players through their own finances, would fans start looking for a billionaire to fund it.

Lithium93_

Lord TSC wrote: »

Gary "Hot Take" Lineker....

https://twitter.com/garylineker/status/1386956793029529602?s=21

In response to a Man United fan wanting the Glazers out: "Excellent, fully admire your stance. When the club can’t afford top players and gradually slide into mid table mediocrity or worse, I hope you continue to feel the same way"

He wouldn't be so snappy if his beloved Leicester City had The Glazers as club owners.

The Big Easy

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I guess the argument could be that if United were not able to afford players through their own finances, would fans start looking for a billionaire to fund it.

There are very few clubs in the world that would thrive under some kind of 50+1 fan ownership model and Manchester united is one of that select few.

It's about how you go from the Glazers to that, I don't know how, but it really should be the goal and the best possible outcome. Once the oil money dries up, United would be a position to dominate England (once more) like Bayern dominates Germany.

United's revenue will always be self-sustainable, the "brand" is that strong, largely thanks to Busby and Ferguson. It can withstand fallow periods but not indefinitely.

billyhead

The Big Easy wrote: »

There are very few clubs in the world that would thrive under some kind of 50+1 fan ownership model and Manchester united is one of that select few.

It's about how you go from the Glazers to that, I don't know how, but it really should be the goal and the best possible outcome. Once the oil money dries up, United would be a position to dominate England (once more) like Bayern dominates Germany.

United's revenue will always be self-sustainable, the "brand" is that strong, largely thanks to Busby and Ferguson. It can withstand fallow periods but not indefinitely.

The only realistic future owners I could see at the moment are the Saudis. Better off sticking with the Glazers. The grass isn't always greener.

The Big Easy

billyhead wrote: »

The only realistic future owners I could see at the moment are the Saudis. Better off sticking with the Glazers. The grass isn't always greener.

Yeah, it's pretty grim isn't it!?

v3ttel

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I guess the argument could be that if United were not able to afford players through their own finances, would fans start looking for a billionaire to fund it.

MUFC would have more money available if the Glazers weren't taking money out, and the club weren't paying the debt/interest.

Just seems like a strange one. Isn't Woodward close to Lineker? It probably has a lot to do with it.

billyhead

v3ttel wrote: »

MUFC would have more money available if the Glazers weren't taking money out, and the club weren't paying the debt/interest.

Just seems like a strange one. Isn't Woodward close to Lineker? It probably has a lot to do with it.

True. It's just Linekar trying to deflect criticism.

Mitch Connor

v3ttel wrote: »

MUFC would have more money available if the Glazers weren't taking money out, and the club weren't paying the debt/interest.

Just seems like a strange one. Isn't Woodward close to Lineker? It probably has a lot to do with it.

Right now, probably - but iirc debt payments and dividend aren't particularly debilitating.

United's failures over the last 8 years have not, in general terms, been because of a lack of money though. Its that the money has been terribly spent - be it on players who didn't work out, wages completely out of line with every other club in football, sacking managers, signing players without an overall vision (so players for one manager don't work for the next) etc. United have spent as much as anyone, more than most, and wasted it.

I don't think Lineker is deflecting for Woodward - his initial criticism was of Arsenal fans wanting Spotify guy to take over, saying that fans are happy out when there is a billionaire owner they like, that is what they want, not to live within the means of the club. Just look at City with their human rights abusers in charge, not a bit of criticism. Newcastle fans were protesting FOR the Saudi's.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

United's failures over the last 8 years have not, in general terms, been because of a lack of money though. Its that the money has been terribly spent

I think it can be both.

Yes, we've spent a lot, and we've spent poorly in a lot of places.

We've also underspent, relative to how much the club could have been spending.

The Glazers have taken nearly £1bn out of the club over the last decade. Imagine if they'd only taken half, and let the other half a billion be invested elsewhere. Be it in players, be it in doing up OT, they've cut down on the club's ability to absolutely dominate through sheer spending power.

Its criminal how we've somehow spent so poorly yet massively, while also never massively unlocking the true potential of the club.

The Big Easy

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Right now, probably - but iirc debt payments and dividend aren't particularly debilitating.

United's failures over the last 8 years have not, in general terms, been because of a lack of money though. Its that the money has been terribly spent - be it on players who didn't work out, wages completely out of line with every other club in football, sacking managers, signing players without an overall vision (so players for one manager don't work for the next) etc. United have spent as much as anyone, more than most, and wasted it.

I don't think Lineker is deflecting for Woodward - his initial criticism was of Arsenal fans wanting Spotify guy to take over, saying that fans are happy out when there is a billionaire owner they like, that is what they want, not to live within the means of the club. Just look at City with their human rights abusers in charge, not a bit of criticism. Newcastle fans were protesting FOR the Saudi's.

Yes, United is one of the few clubs that can compete without a billionaire owner.

Of course fans of clubs who can't compete are going to call for owners that ensure that they can in this day and age.

We are lucky as United fans not to have to sully our morality by countenancing the Saudis or any other dubious source of financial doping.

Mitch Connor

Was thinking this morning about Bailly signing a new contract, and what it could mean for signings in the summer.

I think a DM is more needed than a CB right now, and while I think Bissouma would be a good signing, and likely cheaper than Rice, I was wondering if United could look at Rice as better value in that he could be played at CB if needed. Not saying Rice would become first choice CB, but with the form of Lindelof and Maguire, maybe a top level CB signing is less of a priority for the club and having Rice at DM, with the ability to play at CB if we suffered some injuries or suspents, could be a line of thinking for the club.

PARlance

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Was thinking this morning about Bailly signing a new contract, and what it could mean for signings in the summer.

I think a DM is more needed than a CB right now, and while I think Bissouma would be a good signing, and likely cheaper than Rice, I was wondering if United could look at Rice as better value in that he could be played at CB if needed. Not saying Rice would become first choice CB, but with the form of Lindelof and Maguire, maybe a top level CB signing is less of a priority for the club and having Rice at DM, with the ability to play at CB if we suffered some injuries or suspents, could be a line of thinking for the club.

Throw Lingard into the equation and it makes even more sense for both clubs.

Mixed feelings over the Bailly contract myself. Really like and rate him but can't get away from the Jones / Rojo feel to it. He's just too injury prone... but we've far less CBs at the club now so can see lots of reasons to keep him. Higher priorities elsewhere and plenty of sense in Rice's versatility.

Mitch Connor

PARlance wrote: »

Throw Lingard into the equation and it makes even more sense for both clubs.

Mixed feelings over the Bailly contract myself. Really like and rate him but can't get away from the Jones / Rojo feel to it. He's just too injury prone... but we've far less CBs at the club now so can see lots of reasons to keep him. Higher priorities elsewhere and plenty of sense in Rice's versatility.

I'd have prefered we cut our losses on Bailly and let him leave. Just as we should have done with Jones long ago - can't beleive he is still at the club.

If United go out and spend big on a CB in the summer it will have been moronic to sign Bailly up on another big contract, but if the decision has been made that we need to keep what we have there so we can concentrate elsewhere then I'd get it.

Liam O

If Lingard was doing what he was doing while not on the United books he'd be linked with a 50m move to United. He should be kept and Dan James sold with another attacker brought in. He should have been used more (or at all) this season and has shown that he has something to contribute at United.

For his sake he should leave but I'm only interested in United and having him as a functional member of the squad over inferior players who have been used recently would be an advantage.

Mitch Connor

Liam O wrote: »

If Lingard was doing what he was doing while not on the United books he'd be linked with a 50m move to United. He should be kept and Dan James sold with another attacker brought in. He should have been used more (or at all) this season and has shown that he has something to contribute at United.

For his sake he should leave but I'm only interested in United and having him as a functional member of the squad over inferior players who have been used recently would be an advantage.

IMO Lingard and James would be different roles,. VDB is the lingard replacement (which you could also whinge about)

We do need rid of James though - replace him with someone more technically profecient. Could be Amad/Pellestri, hopefully Sancho.

Bob Harris

I've lost my patience with Dan James. He shot his load in his first 4/5 games and since then all he has shown is work rate.

He doesn't have the beating of any fullbacks with either pace or skill. He's clumsy and constantly on the deck after being brushed off the ball yet again.

Liam O

Mitch Connor wrote: »

IMO Lingard and James would be different roles,. VDB is the lingard replacement (which you could also whinge about)

We do need rid of James though - replace him with someone more technically profecient. Could be Amad/Pellestri, hopefully Sancho.

Lingard can play any role in the 3 behind the striker. Having someone like that in the squad opens up multiple bench spots so you don't have to have a specific central, right and left wing cover. I'd rather Lingard been available to play on the left recent weeks over Pogba and James.

I'd also have no problem with VDB being the cover for CM and AM though I think those positions would have to be reworked. I do think Bruno plays too high up the pitch as it is and his best recent performances have been coming deep for the ball and making the play before the assist.

A new athletic specialist DM would open up a few more options on team shape but I think Bruno's role is something that needs to be looked at, either make him a false 9 or have him much closer to the midfield as there is a cavern of space between midfield and attack that causes problems against teams sitting deep.

False Prophet

Bob Harris wrote: »

I've lost my patience with Dan James. He shot his load in his first 4/5 games and since then all he has shown is work rate.

He doesn't have the beating of any fullbacks with either pace or skill. He's clumsy and constantly on the deck after being brushed off the ball yet again.

Constantly on the deck aka winning frees is valuable to a team. His closing down and energy/pest is also valuable.
Yes he seems to lack a bit of self belief but plenty of more expensive/experienced players haven't been able to perform at Utd.
Plus dealing with losing his father and moving to utd and then covid can't be easy for the kid.
Anyway he is a fine squad player imo that just needs to back himself more at times.

loyatemu

Liam O wrote: »

Lingard can play any role in the 3 behind the striker. Having someone like that in the squad opens up multiple bench spots so you don't have to have a specific central, right and left wing cover. I'd rather Lingard been available to play on the left recent weeks over Pogba and James.

is he an impact sub though? he's had this purple patch, and previous spells of good form at United, when he's had a proper run in the team. He's not going to displace Bruno, Rashford or Pogba.

Bob Harris

False Prophet wrote: »

Constantly on the deck aka winning frees is valuable to a team. His closing down and energy/pest is also valuable.
Yes he seems to lack a bit of self belief but plenty of more expensive/experienced players haven't been able to perform at Utd.
Plus dealing with losing his father and moving to utd and then covid can't be easy for the kid.
Anyway he is a fine squad player imo that just needs to back himself more at times.

He doesn't win frees nearly as often as all the times he's on the deck. He's small and light and is brushed over easily in any 50/50 tussle. As for speed - when is the last time he outstripped anyone for pace?

He has energy and is a pest but I think you need a little more at a top club.

v3ttel

Lingard's form means that we'll get a decent fee for him. Take it and move on, rather than bringing him back again. He's had multiple chances at United and only really showed one or two good runs of form - mostly with Mourinho. He's the type that needs to play regularly. He's never going to do that at United. Especially when you consider we're in desperate need of a RW that would push him further down the pecking order. He also frees up a lot from the wage bill - far more than he should merit for his place at United.

James is 23, has a few outstanding qualities (pace, workrate). He's far from the finished article and can be very frustrating at times. He's happy enough and good enough to be a squad player.

Liam O

loyatemu wrote: »

is he an impact sub though? he's had this purple patch, and previous spells of good form at United, when he's had a proper run in the team. He's not going to displace Bruno, Rashford or Pogba.

He can come in for individual games and do a job, similar to Park. You wouldn't have said that he was an impact sub but having someone like Lingard that you can trust no matter what the occasion to work hard and perform a defined role is hard to find. It's what James does only Lingard is a better player than James.

As I said, if he was banging them in for West Ham while a West Ham player then people would be falling over themselves saying to sign him. His current goal record is unsustainable imo but no reason he can't still contribute at United imo.

Lord TSC

Bruno Fernandes about his future after retirement: "I think I want to be a manager. If it's the biggest team in the world, Man. United, I would be happy. I'm saying this right now, for people in the future being able put pressure on me to coach United."

v3ttel

Chris Smalling shared something his instagram stories, seems like it's the Roma fans seeing off the team bus and singing something about United.

No doubt he's going to have an absolute stormer as he feels he will have a point to prove. As bad as he is on the ball, he is actually very good at defensively with his pace, size, strength, aerial ability, especially when a team is sitting back.

Headshot

This really should be a very handy win for utd.

Roma have been in awful form and they are just a poor team tbh

Now i'm not saying utd are way better but they arent as bad as Roma tbh

All_in_Flynn

Headshot wrote: »

This really should be a very handy win for utd.

Roma have been in awful form and they are just a poor team tbh

Now i'm not saying utd are way better but they arent as bad as Roma tbh

We've more quality than them alright. I worry that Sunday's game will have had an impact on the legs a bit. Bruno needs a big game. He's not been playing well at all in my opinion.

If we are at it though, I think we will have too much for them over 2 legs. Clean sheet in first leg is half the battle. We don't have to end the tie tomorrow night.

grames_bond

Lord TSC wrote: »

Bruno Fernandes about his future after retirement: "I think I want to be a manager. If it's the biggest team in the world, Man. United, I would be happy. I'm saying this right now, for people in the future being able put pressure on me to coach United."

Make him the captain right now!

f*ck it, make him chairman, CEO, Grand supreme leader AND name a stand after him!

Whatsisname

https://twitter.com/JayMotty/status/1387402364408279041?s=20

Whats worse is Woodward doesn't even live in Cheshire anymore.

beakerjoe

v3ttel wrote: »

Chris Smalling shared something his instagram stories, seems like it's the Roma fans seeing off the team bus and singing something about United.

No doubt he's going to have an absolute stormer as he feels he will have a point to prove. As bad as he is on the ball, he is actually very good at defensively with his pace, size, strength, aerial ability, especially when a team is sitting back.

Hes an absolute ball watcher. Forgets to switch on fair to easily.

Just because he has a point to prove doesn't make it certain he will have stormer. He could easily let the occasion get the better of him, try to do too much to prove a point etc.

Im optimistic Cavani can get the better of him.

Liam O

The only thing I'd trust Smalling to do consistently is head the ball clear from crosses.

Whatsisname

I thought Smalling was out injured, he's been out for a few months afaik.

Him and Maguire marking eachother at corners should be a spectacle atleast :pac:

Mitch Connor

Whatsisname wrote: »

I thought Smalling was out injured, he's been out for a few months afaik.

Him and Maguire marking eachother at corners should be a spectacle atleast :pac:

He returned at the weekend.

Weepsie

Mitch Connor wrote: »

He returned at the weekend.

In which they lost to relegation battling Cagliari, though that was their 3rd win in a row.

It happened to be bt or premier this morning and I was doing work. Roma looked pretty dreadful

PARlance

v3ttel wrote: »

Lingard's form means that we'll get a decent fee for him. Take it and move on, rather than bringing him back again. He's had multiple chances at United and only really showed one or two good runs of form - mostly with Mourinho. He's the type that needs to play regularly. He's never going to do that at United. Especially when you consider we're in desperate need of a RW that would push him further down the pecking order. He also frees up a lot from the wage bill - far more than he should merit for his place at United.

James is 23, has a few outstanding qualities (pace, workrate). He's far from the finished article and can be very frustrating at times. He's happy enough and good enough to be a squad player.

I agree re Lingard but no so much about James. Nice guy and all that, honest and is quick but if we're looking to challenge for major trophies, he's just not good enough imo.

He's had two full seasons and I haven't seen any real improvement with him. I wouldn't mind if he was a back up to a back up but he's not good enough to be starting games imo. Would much prefer seeing younger lads like Amad, who looks to have a bit of someone about him, getting his minutes in future.

EltonJohn69

Smalling does a good header....... definitely superior to Maguire in that department

Lord TSC

[VillarrealNews] Local radio's Javi Mata this morning: Pau Torres is @ManUtd 's objective and is considering paying the clause. however, club and player want to try to stay one more year.

Apparently Tier 0, according to Reddit.

Hotblack Desiato

Liam O wrote: »

The only thing I'd trust Smalling to do consistently is head the ball clear from crosses.

And get caught on VAR pulling shirts

StringerBell

Lord TSC wrote: »

[VillarrealNews] Local radio's Javi Mata this morning: Pau Torres is @ManUtd 's objective and is considering paying the clause. however, club and player want to try to stay one more year.

Apparently Tier 0, according to Reddit.

I'd be very happy with him, but unless we are switching formations or selling I can't really see if given baillys new contract

Nalz

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

And get caught on VAR pulling shirts

I thought and said this too, but hasn't he been fairing okay in Italy with var?

Whatsisname

Lord TSC wrote: »

[VillarrealNews] Local radio's Javi Mata this morning: Pau Torres is @ManUtd 's objective and is considering paying the clause. however, club and player want to try to stay one more year.

Apparently Tier 0, according to Reddit.

Never seen him play but I’ve heard him described as the Spanish Lindelof who everyone seemingly wants to replace.

Think we’d be far better off signing a DM than a CB imo. I would assume Tuanzebe is leaving if we’re bringing in a CB.

Lord TSC

https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/comments/n0ltlv/european_classics_man_united_7_1_roma_april_2007/


Video of the goals from 7-1 vs Roma in 2007, for those seeking a nostalgia high.

BenK

Whatever arguments are to be made about Lindelof and Maguire, at least they're far more progressive footballers than Smalling ever was. A loyal servant and all of that but he is a very limited defender.

beakerjoe

Lord TSC wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/comments/n0ltlv/european_classics_man_united_7_1_roma_april_2007/


Video of the goals from 7-1 vs Roma in 2007, for those seeking a nostalgia high.

I miss Alan Smith. Regardless of his ability as a top player, they man had a great work ethic and didnt mind doing the dirty work.

Kerrydude1981

Lord TSC wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/comments/n0ltlv/european_classics_man_united_7_1_roma_april_2007/


Video of the goals from 7-1 vs Roma in 2007, for those seeking a nostalgia high.

that was real top class OT European night, taking teams apart and getting at them from the start

PhlegmyMoses

Whatsisname wrote: »

Never seen him play but I’ve heard him described as the Spanish Lindelof who everyone seemingly wants to replace.

Think we’d be far better off signing a DM than a CB imo. I would assume Tuanzebe is leaving if we’re bringing in a CB.

I think a proper DM is the right call as well. A lot of defensive problems stem from the midfield in football in general and as much as I like how much Fred and McT run and work hard, top class DMs they are not.