Manchester United Teamtalk/Transfer/Gossip 23/24 - [New Thread Available]

Liam O

Donny doesn't strike me as someone who would be playing more advanced than Bruno. I think the team play better the deeper Bruno plays but he's basically been a second striker since he joined.

Thought Donny would be a good link man in midfield. Granted I'm not going to judge him on a game against Ndidi and Tielemans to say that he is useless. The way he has been used this season has been baffling at times.

v3ttel

Lord TSC wrote: »

I was reading Ajax fans on Reddit talking about him last night.

They seem frustrated that we are trying to play him either as a holding mid or as a #10. They were saying he’s more of advanced than a #10 but not quite a striker, who likes to make runs into the box to get on the end of crosses the likes from other players. Like Muller at Bayern. Maybe Firminho at Liverpool? Not 100% sure on that one, but speaking on second hand experience.

They’re frustrated at the fact we’ve bought a player for a role we basically don’t play. He’s not a creative player like Bruno, and he’s not a midfield battler like Fred.

That’s not an utter defence of him mind. He’s been disappointing so far. But it feels like we bought a player thinking he’d be a certain type of player and he’s not, so he’s struggling big time.

Yesterday was only his second appearance I can remember in a 2 in CM. He actually hasn't played #10 a huge amount either. Most of the times he's played, at least in the last 5 months, have been at LAM.

To be honest, I think he's been OK mostly (apart from yesterday). He's shown enough that he has the ability to contribute. It reminds me of Diego Forlan's situation. Hugely talented, but needs to have the trust of the manager and a run of games. It's very hard for some players to show what they can do with 10 mins here and 20 mins there.

I think he can play at LAM, at #8 in a 2, or as one other CMs with the license to break forward in a 3 (similar to Pogba's best position). If Bruno was out, I think a midfield three of Pogba-New DM-Donny would be good.

pjohnson

Donny just reminds me of Veron.

Talented sure, just does not fit into the team at all.

PARlance

v3ttel wrote: »

Yesterday was only his second appearance I can remember in a 2 in CM. He actually hasn't played #10 a huge amount either. Most of the times he's played, at least in the last 5 months, have been at LAM.

To be honest, I think he's been OK mostly (apart from yesterday). He's shown enough that he has the ability to contribute. It reminds me of Diego Forlan's situation. Hugely talented, but needs to have the trust of the manager and a run of games. It's very hard for some players to show what they can do with 10 mins here and 20 mins there.

I think he can play at LAM, at #8 in a 2, or as one other CMs with the license to break forward in a 3 (similar to Pogba's best position). If Bruno was out, I think a midfield three of Pogba-New DM-Donny would be good.

I think he was bought with the view that we would be playing with 1 DM and playing 2 more advanced mids. That's the way we started the season, until Spurs happened and it hasn't really been tried again.

A New DM might bring Donny more into contention. I'd be giving him another year to see anyway.

PhlegmyMoses

Lord TSC wrote: »

I was reading Ajax fans on Reddit talking about him last night.

They seem frustrated that we are trying to play him either as a holding mid or as a #10. They were saying he’s more of advanced than a #10 but not quite a striker, who likes to make runs into the box to get on the end of crosses the likes from other players. Like Muller at Bayern. Maybe Firminho at Liverpool? Not 100% sure on that one, but speaking on second hand experience.

They’re frustrated at the fact we’ve bought a player for a role we basically don’t play. He’s not a creative player like Bruno, and he’s not a midfield battler like Fred.

That’s not an utter defence of him mind. He’s been disappointing so far. But it feels like we bought a player thinking he’d be a certain type of player and he’s not, so he’s struggling big time.

That may explain a drop off in performance but not to the level he is playing. What you have referenced there is an incredibly nuanced position that the vast majority of teams don't even play. If you can only excel in a goldilocks scenario then you should never leave the club who created one for you. I dont think it was unreasonable for Ole to expect him to be able to contribute more than this even if he isnt being played in a false 10 position.

Drumpot

Lord TSC wrote: »

I was reading Ajax fans on Reddit talking about him last night.

They seem frustrated that we are trying to play him either as a holding mid or as a #10. They were saying he’s more of advanced than a #10 but not quite a striker, who likes to make runs into the box to get on the end of crosses the likes from other players. Like Muller at Bayern. Maybe Firminho at Liverpool? Not 100% sure on that one, but speaking on second hand experience.

They’re frustrated at the fact we’ve bought a player for a role we basically don’t play. He’s not a creative player like Bruno, and he’s not a midfield battler like Fred.

That’s not an utter defence of him mind. He’s been disappointing so far. But it feels like we bought a player thinking he’d be a certain type of player and he’s not, so he’s struggling big time.

Reminds me of when we signed Mata. No real plan of where to play him but a nice signing on paper , nearly a signing for the sake of it. I don’t blame the player, he’s hardly been given any chances and I don’t blame Ole as he’s done a great job overall this season. I’d be ok giving Donny another season if there is actually a way to integrate him into whatever system Ole will be using.

Mantis Toboggan

jayo26 wrote: »

There is no possible way the ole wanted Donny.... If not then who did? Was it Woodward?

Yeah Ole didn't want him, the scouts liked him and Woodward thought he was getting a good deal at 40 million euro so snapped him up.

Mitch Connor

Completely disagree with the idea that Ole didn't want VDB. there are literally no stories, at all, even hinting at that.

There are stories about Mata.
There are stories about Fred.

There is nothing regarding VDB.

People saying Ole didn't want him are basing it on him not working out. on that basis are we going back and saying Fergie didn't want Veron?

el Fenomeno

Fans of clubs like Ajax, Dortmund etc. will always defend their old players when they flop at bigger clubs. They can't bear the thought that someone who was good enough to be one of their best players is just another run of the mill squad option at a bigger club.

Happened with Memphis, happened with Kagawa, happened with Mkhitaryan and it's happening with VDB.

He'll be sold at a loss and find his level at a lesser club in a lesser league where his old fans can lament how United used him incorrectly, to make themselves feel better.

Not everyone can make the step up, it happens.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Completely disagree with the idea that Ole didn't want VDB. there are literally no stories, at all, even hinting at that.

There are stories about Mata.
There are stories about Fred.

There is nothing regarding VDB.

People saying Ole didn't want him are basing it on him not working out. on that basis are we going back and saying Fergie didn't want Veron?

When the club makes a signing , you never hear a sitting managed say they don’t want that signing. I always think of what Hardy Reknapp said, a manager never refuses new signings , particularly if there is no alternative offered.

A managers job nowadays is not like it was before, it’s certainly nothing like football manager. They are given a squad and have to make that work. They are not as involved in signings as they might of been in the past. They get some input but that varies from club and what a managed wants and the club wants doesn’t always match up.

I’m not sure if Ole wanted Donny or not but it’s not clear where he fits into the system Ole plays with the likes of Pogba and Bruno well capable of doing whatever role Donny might be able to do. Considering the importance of players needed in other positions, it’s not clear what the benefit of buying that player last year was.

One would hope Ole has more authority this summer then last, with regards to influence in who is signed. But it’s naieve to presume Ole wanted Donny because there are no stories that he didn’t. The one thing Ole has been superb at doing is not upsetting players, supporting the players and saying nothing negative about them (even Pogba), so even if he didn’t want Donny I wouldn’t expect any stories confirming it.

I suppose we may find out more during summer (if donny leaves) or next season if he gets more games. I don’t know why he was signed , maybe he was wanted by Ole, but the clubs form for the last 8 years has been questionable with regards to whether or not the team needed them or the manager wanted them, it’s not that much of a stretch to imagine that the Donny signing was one of these.

el Fenomeno

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

United are using him incorrectly though. Most players who make the leap do so in roles that complement their abilities. Expecting him to play in double pivot (one which also makes Pogba look useless) and effect games is way off the mark. As I mentioned last night in a system like Chelseas with havertz/werner I think we'd see a different player DVBs move was terrible for the player and for the club. Unless there's a massive swing in playing style over the summer (unlikely given Bruno is here) its best to move him on sooner rather than later imo.

Whether he's played rightly or wrongly, some qualities should have shone through by now. Plenty of players can put in a shift out of position. If he's completely rigid to the point that he can't play a bit deeper in midfield, then that's a further criticism that should be called out.

I don't see a single redeeming factor of his displayed in any of his United performances.

Zeek12

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Completely disagree with the idea that Ole didn't want VDB. there are literally no stories, at all, even hinting at that.

There are stories about Mata.
There are stories about Fred.

There is nothing regarding VDB.

People saying Ole didn't want him are basing it on him not working out. on that basis are we going back and saying Fergie didn't want Veron?

A more accurate way of looking at it may be - how far down the manager's wish list was Donny?

As Drumpot said, very few managers will refuse a competent signing (assuming the player's attitude is right). Squad depth is hugely important for any side competing in the CL with all the domestic games too - and all this in a compressed Covid season.

My impression is Ole wasn't beating a drum to get this player in.

But by the same token he wasn't going to say I don't want an international midfielder with bags of CL experience.

Hardly the first time a United manager had to compromise in this way.
Weren't there similar stories from Van Gaal & Jose ?

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Completely disagree with the idea that Ole didn't want VDB. there are literally no stories, at all, even hinting at that.

My memories is that it was said Ole was on the phone and zoom calls to him a few times, selling the project and promising him the chance to play the #10 role, and that was a big reason he took the move, despite obviously not being a first team player initially.

Now, I'm sure part of that was just usual new signing fluff. And I wouldn't doubt Ole would have prefered spending €80m on Grealish rather than €40m on VDB.

But I'd agree that there's little to suggest Ole didn't want VDB. I think he absolutely wanted someone to play second string to Bruno, and I think VDB was obviously on that list, which he would have agreed to.

Sand

It's fairly damning on the ownership of club that things are so disjointed that the scouts are identifying players the manager has no purpose for. In any competent organisation, these things are aligned. VDB was probably told he was wanted/needed at the club but that's obviously not true. It undermines the club when attempting to sign other players.

Quite an amount of money has been wasted on unsuitable players and unsuitable managers and the Glazers are apparently okay with that waste. Sure, they're greedy but they're also incompetent.

It looks to me that no matter how many chances VDB is given that he is just incapable of adapting to another way of playing outside of Ajax. Not sure he could even be seen as a viable back up at this stage if Bruno was out injured for a period. It's clear he has grown up playing the Ajax way and that is all he knows and is unable to change or get on the same wavelength as the rest of the players most of the time.

It doesn't say a lot about our scouting that he was seen as our main target last summer and that there was a scramble/panic buy to get Cavani in at the last minute which seemed at the time to be just to try and save face with the supporters.

Father Hernandez

I don't think anyone can deny VDB has been underwhelming in his first season.

Whether or not he suits the system or if Ole even wanted him, I just wouldn't be dismissing him after one season even if he cost a fair amount. Some players just need a regular run of games or even a good few months to adapt.

Might sound like a VDB apolgist but he's been disappointing no denying it but on the other hand, it's been a very condensed season with a huge amount of variables.

I'm mostly looking forward to seeing how he gets on in the Euros for the Netherlands and then in his second full season at United and how much if any there will be an improvement. Will wait until then to properly analyse his addition and if it was a successful signing or not.

Mitch Connor

Sand wrote: »

It's fairly damning on the ownership of club that things are so disjointed that the scouts are identifying players the manager has no purpose for. In any competent organisation, these things are aligned. VDB was probably told he was wanted/needed at the club but that's obviously not true. It undermines the club when attempting to sign other players.

Utter speculation. Which you are presenting as if it is a fact. Making up a process and then criticising the club for your imagination.

My own speculation is VDB was signed to play and advanced role.

---

McT

---

Bruno

---

VDB

Playing the position Lingard or Pereira were used in when they played - which saw Bruno moved back further into midfield.

Pogba wasn't sold, which reduces potential game time for VDB.
It became apparent, very quickly, that the midfield set up would not work, whether it was VDB or Pogba in the side, because neither McT or Fred are good enough to take on the responsibility of being the main defensive player and Matic doesn't have the legs or mobility.

We were attempting this up to the hammering vs Spurs.

So we swapped to a Fred/McT axis with Bruno almost a second striker. This is a selection that has also seen Pogba drop out of favour, or play left side forward.

On top of this, VDB simply hasn't performed. Beyond not playing in a preferred role, he simply isn't performing. he is hesitant on the ball, second guessing himself and his touch is letting him down.

He was, imo, signed as a squad player, to be an improvement on Pereira and Lingard - and as of now it hasn't worked out. He hasn't performed and the formation planned (IMO) has switched.

That isn't to excuse VDB, but simply to put out a theory where VDB is a signing Ole was more than happy with but hasn't worked out. based on all the stories that came out at the time and since, and the change in approach from early season to now.

Mitch Connor

Exactly wrote: »

It looks to me that no matter how many chances VDB is given that he is just incapable of adapting to another way of playing outside of Ajax. Not sure he could even be seen as a viable back up at this stage if Bruno was out injured for a period. It's clear he has grown up playing the Ajax way and that is all he knows and is unable to change or get on the same wavelength as the rest of the players most of the time.

It doesn't say a lot about our scouting that he was seen as our main target last summer and that there was a scramble/panic buy to get Cavani in at the last minute which seemed at the time to be just to try and save face with the supporters.

So you think VDB was out main target. Not Sancho, but VDB.

I disagree.

I would also say VDB wasn't even the main target for the position - Grealish was but at twice the price, if he could be bought (while we still wanted and thought we would get Sancho) wasn't doable.

loyatemu

pjohnson wrote: »

Donny just reminds me of Veron.

Talented sure, just does not fit into the team at all.

Veron was a superb footballer though and we occasionally saw that at United, just not often enough and he was keeping Scholes out of the team.

He reminds me more of Forlan, just wrong place, wrong time. He'll probably do well somewhere else under a different manager and system.

Deise_2012

Has anyone seen Trevor Sinclair ranting? Jesus he is a special kind of stupid

Weepsie

el Fenomeno wrote: »

Fans of clubs like Ajax, Dortmund etc. will always defend their old players when they flop at bigger clubs. They can't bear the thought that someone who was good enough to be one of their best players is just another run of the mill squad option at a bigger club.

Happened with Memphis, happened with Kagawa, happened with Mkhitaryan and it's happening with VDB.

He'll be sold at a loss and find his level at a lesser club in a lesser league where his old fans can lament how United used him incorrectly, to make themselves feel better.

Not everyone can make the step up, it happens.

That's quite the take and a super arrogant look at where man united are and where they've come from.

Do we talk about mark Hughes as someone who couldn't cut it in Spain then? Does that explain why so few Irish and British players go to Europe and England is where it's at for only the best of the best?


Di Maria didn't settle in, but he was and still is a world class operator. What's the excuse for Pogba being brutal for best part of 4 years?


I'll say one thing though, Ajax has sold it's 3-4 most promising players in the past 2 seasons and they've all taken time to adjust, but they're a club with a very rigid structure and way of playing that is thought from the moment you join the club at any age.

Some players don't suit certain teams, but to write him off like so is a disservice. He's another in a long line of players signed by the club because they were available and not because it's what's been needed and he's barely had a look on and when he has it's been in one of 4 different positions and often only a few mins at a time.

There was never an attempt to play him for a run of games when Pogba was unavailable, with the first team, you know to integrate with them and how it's played.

I'd say he'd do very well in Germany or back I. Netherlands were it's a bit more technical and his very good off the ball movement would be used better.

fergiesfolly

I suppose a lot could depend on the summer transfer.
Could VDB be seen as Pogbas replacement on the left of midfield, should he leave.
Cannot see Donny being sold this window unless he pushes for a move.
I'd forgive him this season. Often takes players a season to acclimatize to the PL.
Partey came to Arsenal with a big reputation and hasn't set the world on fire. And he's had alot more game time

PhlegmyMoses

Germany isn't really a more technical league tbh. It is a super attacking league with high backing and fast transitions with lots of goals. He may do well there, but he doesnt exactly look like he suits that either because he is quite one paced

nullzero

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Has anyone seen Trevor Sinclair ranting? Jesus he is a special kind of stupid

He was going off on one and it was motivated by his being a City fan and nothing else.

Pure cringeworthy crap.

Mantis Toboggan

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Germany isn't really a more technical league tbh. It is a super attacking league with high backing and fast transitions with lots of goals. He may do well there, but he doesnt exactly look like he suits that either because he is quite one paced

That's what I don't understand why the scouts were so keen on him. He's slow, can't tackle, not physical and not particularly athletic and isn't a play maker. Not sure what they saw in him.

Maybe he'll improve next season but it's hard to ever see him being an important first team player.

beakerjoe

nullzero wrote: »

He was going off on one and it was motivated by his being a City fan and nothing else.

Pure cringeworthy crap.

I think hes more motivated form a West Ham POV tbh.

Sand

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Utter speculation. Which you are presenting as if it is a fact. Making up a process and then criticising the club for your imagination.

We're all speculating here. It is what the forum is for.

If you think that the managers appointed and the players signed - and often sold 1-2 years later - over the past 8 years or so can be seen as evidence of well aligned co-ordination at the club, then okay.

On top of this, VDB simply hasn't performed. Beyond not playing in a preferred role, he simply isn't performing. he is hesitant on the ball, second guessing himself and his touch is letting him down.

He looks like a player who has completed 90 minutes only 4 times this season. Most of his appearances have been for 10-20 minutes. The Spurs game wasn't a watershed where he was getting time before, but not after. He played a handful of minutes before the Spurs game, played 20 minutes in that game, and continued to play a handful of minutes after the game too.

He hasn't been tearing up trees, and again we have to speculate hes not showing anything in training. So his signing from the start was a mistake: either not good enough or not suitable for the team/manager.

That isn't to excuse VDB, but simply to put out a theory where VDB is a signing Ole was more than happy with but hasn't worked out.

Sure, we all have theories. Mine is that VDB joins a long list of poor signings made by the club over the past 8 years or so, and that reflects on the organisation of the club.

Mitch Connor

Sand wrote: »

We're all speculating here. It is what the forum is for.

If you think that the managers appointed and the players signed - and often sold 1-2 years later - over the past 8 years or so can be seen as evidence of well aligned co-ordination at the club, then okay.

We have sacked managers after 2 years, with the manager coming in having a completely different style to the manager they replace. so the players signed for manager 1 haven't been the profile of player for manager 2.

Di Maria didn't work out but he was name checked by LVG as a player he wanted well before we signed him. Blind and Rojo were signings LVG asked for.

I've no reason to think Maguire, AWB, Bruno, Cavani, VDB or any other signing under Ole were players Ole actively did not want. I don;t think Cavani or VDB were the first choices, but I don't think they were signed without Ole having a clue/desire. Nothing, nothing at all, points to Ole not wanting any of his signings.

Mitch Connor

Sand wrote: »

Sure, we all have theories. Mine is that VDB joins a long list of poor signings made by the club over the past 8 years or so, and that reflects on the organisation of the club.

that is not what you said though.

What you said was VDB was a signing Ole had no interest on, in a position that Ole didn't want to sign a player in. foisted on Ole by the scouting dept. and woodward.

I'm not arguing whether he is a poor signing. that is a matter of opinion.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We have sacked managers after 2 years, with the manager coming in having a completely different style to the manager they replace. so the players signed for manager 1 haven't been the profile of player for manager 2.

Di Maria didn't work out but he was name checked by LVG as a player he wanted well before we signed him. Blind and Rojo were signings LVG asked for.

I've no reason to think Maguire, AWB, Bruno, Cavani, VDB or any other signing under Ole were players Ole actively did not want. I don;t think Cavani or VDB were the first choices, but I don't think they were signed without Ole having a clue/desire. Nothing, nothing at all, points to Ole not wanting any of his signings.

I’d be very surprised if Most of the players bought in first year and a half under Ole were not in some way earmarked before he was made manager. We needed a centre back for a long time. Sure there was a raft of player contract extensions days and weeks after Ole was appointed , he was hardly in a position to judge the quality of those players (most of whom either left since or aren’t used).

Herrera and Shaw were actually targeted while moyes was manager and LVG just accepted those signings. In terms of Di Maria or Pogba or Mata (who was 2 time chelsea player of the year), what manager would not want these players? Mata and Di Maria In particular were players surprisinglu available and opportunistic signings as opposed to targeted players. Only a select few clubs or teams would reject these players when we signed them. The issue is whether they were the right players for the club or the kind of players that warranted such massive investments. You can forgive a bad signing or two but United’s litany of poor signings cannot be dumped at the feet of managers. LVG and Jose both alluded to the fact the club regularly didn’t get their top/primary targets. LVG actually said I believe that the club quite often got players Lower down on their list.

https://footballbh.net/2021/05/03/louis-van-gaal-had-10-world-class-transfer-targets-he-wanted-to-sign-for-manchester-united/

“Those were my top targets, but we couldn’t get any of them. I don’t know why, because as the manager I wasn’t involved in any negotiations.

“After I left, players like Mahrez and Kante ended up at Manchester City and Chelsea, while United couldn’t get them. I found that very odd.”

Nobody is saying the manager is not getting an input in players who are signed , but your comments are as bereft of facts as anybody else’s in here. None of us Know who Ole actually wanted and we prob never will as Ole doesn’t kiss and tell.

nullzero

beakerjoe wrote: »

I think hes more motivated form a West Ham POV tbh.

He's a self confessed City fan.

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

I’d be very surprised if Most of the players bought in first year and a half under Ole were not in some way earmarked before he was made manager. We needed a centre back for a long time. Sure there was a raft of player contract extensions days and weeks after Ole was appointed , he was hardly in a position to judge the quality of those players (most of whom either left since or aren’t used).

Herrera and Shaw were actually targeted while moyes was manager and LVG just accepted those signings. In terms of Di Maria or Pogba or Mata (who was 2 time chelsea player of the year), what manager would not want these players? Mata and Di Maria In particular were players surprisinglu available and opportunistic signings as opposed to targeted players. Only a select few clubs or teams would reject these players when we signed them. The issue is whether they were the right players for the club or the kind of players that warranted such massive investments. You can forgive a bad signing or two but United’s litany of poor signings cannot be dumped at the feet of managers. LVG and Jose both alluded to the fact the club regularly didn’t get their top/primary targets. LVG actually said I believe that the club quite often got players Lower down on their list.

https://footballbh.net/2021/05/03/louis-van-gaal-had-10-world-class-transfer-targets-he-wanted-to-sign-for-manchester-united/



Nobody is saying the manager is not getting an input in players who are signed , but your comments are as bereft of facts as anybody else’s in here. None of us Know who Ole actually wanted and we prob never will as Ole doesn’t kiss and tell.

Of course players were ear-marked. Why have a scouting department if you are going to need the manager to decide all the players we should target?

Manger - I want a CB with 'these' characteristics.
Scouting Dept - Here are the top rated CBs with those characteristics. Maguire is highest rated for fit and profile.
Manager - Show me the packs for the top 5.
Manager - I concur with Maguire.
Club - Tries to buy Maguire.

I think it would be more of a sign of poor structures and management if we needed Ole to be compiling the lists of targets himself rather than working with the scouting dept. to identify and prioritise players.

Whether or not the club is good at signing players is also not something I am debating. It also isn't the point being debated.

I don't think VDB was the top target for that position. I think Grealish was. I don't know if VDB was second, or third or whatever.

I'm simply saying I believe Ole wanted a midfielder for role (X). an attacking threat to improve creativity and goal scoring threat from midfield. I think VDB (and Grealish) was among the players rated for that role. I think Ole ok'd the list of players for that position and the transfer priorities such as saying if we are spending 80m on one player and 40m on another, I would prefer Sancho at 80m and VDB at 40 than Grealish at 80 and *someone* at 40m.

United are poor in the market, imo. i'm not arguing that. VDB hasn't worked out, i'm not arguing that.

I'm simply saying I don't agree with the assertion that:
(1) Ole did not want a player for the role VDB was signed.
(2) Ole did not want VDB at all.
(3) VDB was foisted upon Ole despite 1 and 2.

Shaw and Herrera were previously positioned signings that OK'd by LVG (for some reason he said no to Kross who was also positioned to be signed). They were signed within weeks of LVG arriving. Same with Bailly and Jose. Same with Pogba - though i also doubt Jose said he did not want Pogba.

However, where the Ole situation differs, is Ole was at the club 6 months before the summer window signings of Magure and AWB - sure I would agree that scouting of those players, particularly Maguire started before Ole arrived, there is no reason to think that Ole was not heavily involved in the decision to actually move for them that summer.

Mitch Connor

Women's team manager leaving at the end of the season. has done a great job - and leaving (apparently) due to the training conditions and I would guess a lack of interest from the club in rectifying her complaints. Which paint yet another bad picture of the Glazers.

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/1392487959782383622

PsychoPete

The Glazers probably think there isn't enough money to be made from the women's team to put money into it. Its ridiculous that one of biggest clubs in the world isn't giving the women's team what they need

Mitch Connor

PsychoPete wrote: »

The Glazers probably think there isn't enough money to be made from the women's team to put money into it. Its ridiculous that one of biggest clubs in the world isn't giving the women's team what they need

there is a lot of anger at the liverpool board for their treatment of the Liverpool Womens team as well.

In terms of player purchases United do seem to have done a great job. I know the women's team trains at The Cliff rather than Carrington - but I don't know of what the complaints might have been. You would have to imagine if she is resigning over it, it is poor and the club have refused to do anything about it.

billyhead

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Women's team manager leaving at the end of the season. has done a great job - and leaving (apparently) due to the training conditions and I would guess a lack of interest from the club in rectifying her complaints. Which paint yet another bad picture of the Glazers.

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/1392487959782383622

Give Giggsy the job😀

Sand

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We have sacked managers after 2 years, with the manager coming in having a completely different style to the manager they replace. so the players signed for manager 1 haven't been the profile of player for manager 2.

That my point.

I've no reason to think Maguire, AWB, Bruno, Cavani, VDB or any other signing under Ole were players Ole actively did not want. I don;t think Cavani or VDB were the first choices, but I don't think they were signed without Ole having a clue/desire. Nothing, nothing at all, points to Ole not wanting any of his signings.

Maguire, AWB, Bruno have been mainstays of Ole's team. VDB clearly isnt. Whatever Ole wants from his players, VDB doesn't have it.

It doesn't even have to be the club foisting a player on Ole. Incompetence perfectly well explains things. To use your example:

Manger - I want a player with 'these' characteristics.
Scouting Dept - Here are the top rated players with those characteristics. VDB is highest rated for fit and profile.
Manager - Show me the packs for the top 5.
Manager - Well, based on what the scouts are saying VDB seems to be the best available option.
Club - Buys VDB.
Manager - What player were you guys scouting? VDB doesn't have the characteristics I asked for.
Scouting Dept - Shrug. So coach him then.

Your Airbag

[MX Draft] Antonio Valencia retires from professional football

Whatsisname

Mitch Connor wrote: »

there is a lot of anger at the liverpool board for their treatment of the Liverpool Womens team as well.

In terms of player purchases United do seem to have done a great job. I know the women's team trains at The Cliff rather than Carrington - but I don't know of what the complaints might have been. You would have to imagine if she is resigning over it, it is poor and the club have refused to do anything about it.

Didn't realise they trained at the Cliff. I viewed an apartment directly across the road from it 3 years ago, it looks exactly like it did in the 90s, atleast the exterior anyway. I swear I read recently even Carrington is starting to show its age in comparison to more modern day facilities.

The fact the Glazers own so much land around OT and theres been 0 done to it frustrates me to no end. The area surrounding City's ground has such an immersive feel to it and then you have their academy stadium right next to the Etihad, yet our academy/women's team play in Wigan. The infrastructure in general around the Etihad is night and day to OT.

paulbok

Whatsisname wrote: »

Didn't realise they trained at the Cliff. I viewed an apartment directly across the road from it 3 years ago, it looks exactly like it did in the 90s, atleast the exterior anyway. I swear I read recently even Carrington is starting to show its age in comparison to more modern day facilities.

The fact the Glazers own so much land around OT and theres been 0 done to it frustrates me to no end. The area surrounding City's ground has such an immersive feel to it and then you have their academy stadium right next to the Etihad, yet our academy/women's team play in Wigan. The infrastructure in general around the Etihad is night and day to OT.

Thats the difference between - £1bn and +£1bn. :mad:

As for the ladies team fiasco, good job Roy wasn't in charge

https://twitter.com/Lzw9ine/status/1392531660537794567?s=19

GSPfan

If it was financially viable… I’d build a brand new 90k seater stadium beside Old Trafford to move into. Then dismantle the large stands of Old Trafford to reduce its capacity to around 25k. This would keep the spiritual home of United active and in use for all teams other than the first team. It could also be built with a retractable roof to cater for concerts etc.

Basically I think ploughing money into Old Trafford is not worth it at this stage. But I’d hate to demolish it also.

BenK

While it's nothing to write home about really in the grand scheme of things, it's nice for a change not to be involved in the annual grind to scrape into the top 4. Over to you Chelsea, Leicester and Liverpool...

PsychoPete

BenK wrote: »

While it's nothing to write home about really in the grand scheme of things, it's nice for a change not to be involved in the annual grind to scrape into the top 4. Over to you Chelsea, Leicester and Liverpool West Ham...

Just wanted to correct you on that one

GSPfan

BenK wrote: »

While it's nothing to write home about really in the grand scheme of things, it's nice for a change not to be involved in the annual grind to scrape into the top 4. Over to you Chelsea, Leicester and Liverpool...

It’s more than just nice for me. It’s delightful.

Every year around this time I’m deflated and wishing the season to end. This year I’m genuinely sad it’s nearly over.

PhlegmyMoses

I agree. Its nice going into every game and knowing that you are in with a chance of winning. Knowing that you will likely see a nice bit of quality, often from a home grown player but also likely from a player that wants to be at the club. This is a nice group and I hope they get some silverware to show for it.

GSPfan

This game tomorrow against Liverpool would be amazing if we can beat them. It guarantees 2nd place and would allow the likes of Amad game time in the last two games.

There’s of course the satisfaction of keeping Liverpool out of the CL too but the sicko in me hopes they get into the EL. Liverpool having no European football at all is worse in my mind.

Hotblack Desiato

GSPfan wrote: »

Basically I think ploughing money into Old Trafford is not worth it at this stage.

Why?
The south stand is a problem that can absolutely be fixed if the will is there.


Also this stuff we hear so often about playing in the EL is so much worse for fixtures than playing in the CL -

PL Sat - CL Tue - PL Sat = 2 days off then 3 days off

PL Sat - CL Wed - PL Sat = 3 days off then 2 days off

PL Sun - EL Thu - PL Sun = 3 days off then 2 days off

What's the difference?

Backstreet Moyes

Surprised United are second favorites as they will be well up for it

Liverpool have to go for it which should suit United

Also Cavani should run the centre backs all over the place

Mantis Toboggan

Important game tonight especially with Chelsea losing last night, defeat for Liverpool should keep them out of the Champions league next year.

S.M.B.

Back to back defeats would be a real disappointment but don't think it would dent our chances of second place.

It would be nice to heavily rotate the following week against Fulham and Wolves too.

I'm curious to know if Ole would hold any weight in the unbeaten away record or whether it would be irrelevant when it comes to picking his starting XI against Wolves.