Manchester United Teamtalk/Transfer/Gossip 23/24 - [New Thread Available]

El Gato De Negocios

S.M.B. wrote: »

Back to back defeats would be a real disappointment but don't think it would dent our chances of second place.

It would be nice to heavily rotate the following week against Fulham and Wolves too.

I'm curious to know if Ole would hold any weight in the unbeaten away record or whether it would be irrelevant when it comes to picking his starting XI against Wolves.

Be surprised if it was much of a consideration tbh, nobody will remember / care about an away loss in the last game of season but they will damn sure remember winning a European trophy. I'd be happy to see the same team that played against Leicester line out tbh.

pjohnson

I'll settle for the match going ahead tbh.

The_Kew_Tour

I would presume he field a side much like Tuesday night against Wolves. Can see a fairly strong side v Fulham next Tuesday. Gives them 8 days then to be prepared for EL final so they should be fine.

Mitch Connor

pjohnson wrote: »

I'll settle for the match going ahead tbh.

Big police presence already around OT, and from what I can gather while there will be a protest at the game there will not be the same numbers there were the previous time.

But, I would also assume that those going tonight are more likely to be the same group as the ones who got onto the pitch or stopped the players from leaving the hotel.

So while the numbers will (it seems) be smaller, the desire to disrupt will probably be the same.

Hopefully there are no clashes between the police and the fans.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Big police presence already around OT, and from what I can gather while there will be a protest at the game there will not be the same numbers there were the previous time.

But, I would also assume that those going tonight are more likely to be the same group as the ones who got onto the pitch or stopped the players from leaving the hotel.

So while the numbers will (it seems) be smaller, the desire to disrupt will probably be the same.

Hopefully there are no clashes between the police and the fans.

If they cause trouble or disruption they will damage the cause. There’s a lot of goodwill from their last protest. They need to be clever about this, alas I think you are right and there will be a few morons potentially causing trouble.

All_in_Flynn

No Maguire is a massive loss tonight. Assume Bailly will come in. I'm just constantly on the edge of my seat with him.

Presume with Mason starting on Tuesday, he will bench tonight with Rashford on the right and Pogba from the left. Pogba will have to keep track of Trent.

Winning tonight would allow us to properly manage the squad for the next couple weeks before the final. Think we will find it tough though.

Drumpot

Touch of class from Klopp, always liked him as a manager and he could of tried to get the boot in here......

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/57091961

Ole Gunnar Solskjaer's side won 3-1 away to Aston Villa on Sunday but a side showing 10 changes lost 2-1 at home to Leicester City on Tuesday.

"To play Sunday-Tuesday-Thursday is a crime," Klopp said on Wednesday.

Following Leicester's win over a much-changed United - which took the Foxes above Chelsea to third in the table - dethroned champions Liverpool are sixth, seven points adrift of the Champions League places.

They have one game in hand on West Ham directly above them, two on Chelsea following their defeat by Arsenal on Wednesday, and two on Leicester who are nine points ahead.

"It is not the fault of Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and the players," Klopp added, when asked about the Manchester United boss making 10 changes against Leicester.

"My question to myself was: 'Would I have done the same?' Yes. You have to. You have to."

"The explanation from the Premier League was that no other team should suffer because of the things that happened in Manchester," Klopp said.

"Let me say it like this. That didn't work out pretty well. A little bit West Ham [suffered], a little bit Liverpool [suffered].

"But if we don't qualify for the Champions League it is not the fault of Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and his team selection or the Premier League, it is our fault."

el Fenomeno

Just finished that Ferguson documentary. Jesus, you'd want a strong set of heart strings to get through that last scene without welling up.

Mitch Connor

All_in_Flynn wrote: »

No Maguire is a massive loss tonight. Assume Bailly will come in. I'm just constantly on the edge of my seat with him.

Presume with Mason starting on Tuesday, he will bench tonight with Rashford on the right and Pogba from the left. Pogba will have to keep track of Trent.

Winning tonight would allow us to properly manage the squad for the next couple weeks before the final. Think we will find it tough though.

This was the team announced first time around:

https://twitter.com/Ankaman616/status/1388864914635247619

Bailly in for Maguire and then a question over whether it is Cavani or Greenwood that start, I would guess.

I do wonder if he could look at Pogba on the right rather than left - good delivery of the ball and I'd be happier defensively with Rashford and Shaw on the left with TAA and Salah out that side.

Bleating Lamb

Father Hernandez wrote: »

I don't think anyone can deny VDB has been underwhelming in his first season.

Whether or not he suits the system or if Ole even wanted him, I just wouldn't be dismissing him after one season even if he cost a fair amount. Some players just need a regular run of games or even a good few months to adapt.

Might sound like a VDB apolgist but he's been disappointing no denying it but on the other hand, it's been a very condensed season with a huge amount of variables.

I'm mostly looking forward to seeing how he gets on in the Euros for the Netherlands and then in his second full season at United and how much if any there will be an improvement. Will wait until then to properly analyse his addition and if it was a successful signing or not. Quote]



Donny to me appears like a player who is very one paced and it is almost as if he is running through treacle when he is moving into space,I presume that the Utd scouts noticed this facet of his game when they watched him:(

In fairness to him, Ole never gave him a run of 3 or 4 games to start in before Christmas to see how he fitted into the squad. Ole could have told him that he would be starting certain games close together and that he might be taken off after 60 mins but that was just to bed him in slowly and that he didn't need to feel he had played poorly if subbed off.
That would have being good man management. If Donny was playing crap in a couple of those games then likes of Mata,Pogba or Bruno could come on to get the team back in the game....and Donny would go home after game happy enough to have got his 60 mins iykwim......and feel he was getting a fair shot at the club.

I reckon Donny hasn't shown enough in training all Season for Ole to feel he can play and trust him when given a specific role in games.His immediate future at the club depends on what the clubs overall budget and strategy is for possible incomings and outgoings this Summer.

If selling him makes the difference between signing someone like Rice for 60m or not selling him means Utd only can afford someone like Bissouma for 30m I for one would like to see him moved on.

If Ole and the Board feel that it's worth giving him another Season to show his possible value I am okay with that as long as they get a few players like, Mata, Fred,Matic,Pereira or Lingard sold to bring in the extra funds needed to sign better players like Rice ....and not have to have to settle for lesser players as transfer kitty is smaller.

xtal191

https://twitter.com/vishy_united/status/1392782674520002564

Sirsok

As a United fan in work I was made look back on this day 9 years ago. The name Aguero still haunts me.

https://scoreline.ie/on-this-day-manchester-city-win-the-english-premier-league-for-the-first-time/

Mitch Connor

xtal191 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/vishy_united/status/1392782674520002564

None of them football people, all about the finance. Which is what you would have expected, but still disappointing. No intention of a structure that puts football first.

I did wonder if two positions could be created, with someone like VDS taking football ownership and Arnold (or other) taking corporate ownership, but no talk of it.

Expected, but bitterly disapppointing and would further underscore why the fans are protesting.

The_Kew_Tour

This aged well, very well indeed. Law ya legend ya.

https://twitter.com/stusfootyflash/status/1392393341350858759?s=21

GSPfan

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Why?
The south stand is a problem that can absolutely be fixed if the will is there.


Also this stuff we hear so often about playing in the EL is so much worse for fixtures than playing in the CL -

PL Sat - CL Tue - PL Sat = 2 days off then 3 days off

PL Sat - CL Wed - PL Sat = 3 days off then 2 days off

PL Sun - EL Thu - PL Sun = 3 days off then 2 days off

What's the difference?

Re: The Stadium… I’m not going to pretend I know the exact snag list of all the problems but the South Stand being backed onto a railway makes construction very costly by all reports. The roof is in need of repairs. The facilities at the stadium are basic and not in comparison with modern stadiums. I’m pretty sure I read there can be no major European finals at the stadium due to the lack of being able to drive a Beebau onto the pitch. If Spurs modern stadium cost 1 billion and it would cost half of that to build the South Stand then you have to consider if it’s worth it.

Re: The Europa League… I remember wondering about this a while ago as to why clubs in the EL struggle in the league. It’s definitely a real thing.
I can’t remember who said it but an interesting explanation I heard was that the routine of players playing on a Saturday and then going home to enjoy their Saturday night and Sunday with their kids and partners is disrupted. It means for almost the entire season they are working every Sunday which effects people. It’s not a physical thing, more so a mental thing.

PhlegmyMoses

Mitch Connor wrote: »

None of them football people, all about the finance. Which is what you would have expected, but still disappointing. No intention of a structure that puts football first.

I did wonder if two positions could be created, with someone like VDS taking football ownership and Arnold (or other) taking corporate ownership, but no talk of it.

Expected, but bitterly disapppointing and would further underscore why the fans are protesting.

If I was VDS I wouldnt go near it. Would spend 90% of his time batting away Qs about the owners. He can't be that hard up for cash to want a role like that

Mitch Connor

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

If I was VDS I wouldnt go near it. Would spend 90% of his time batting away Qs about the owners. He can't be that hard up for cash to want a role like that

he very purposefully did not distance himself from the job last week - saying he would only work at either United or Ajax, the clubs he has a love for. So i have no doubt he was interested.

El Gato De Negocios

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

This aged well, very well indeed. Law ya legend ya.

https://twitter.com/stusfootyflash/status/1392393341350858759?s=21

After watching the Fergie, the muppet in me has got to thinking that maybe, just maybe, the EL final could be Oles FA Cup final.

PhlegmyMoses

Mitch Connor wrote: »

he very purposefully did not distance himself from the job last week - saying he would only work at either United or Ajax, the clubs he has a love for. So i have no doubt he was interested.

Yeah, I saw that interview, I just dont know why he would give himself the headache

Mitch Connor

GSPfan wrote: »

Re: The Stadium… I’m not going to pretend I know the exact snag list of all the problems but the South Stand being backed onto a railway makes construction very costly by all reports. The roof is in need of repairs. The facilities at the stadium are basic and not in comparison with modern stadiums. I’m pretty sure I read there can be no major European finals at the stadium due to the lack of being able to drive a Beebau onto the pitch. If Spurs modern stadium cost 1 billion and it would cost half of that to build the South Stand then you have to consider if it’s worth it.

Re: The Europa League… I remember wondering about this a while ago as to why clubs in the EL struggle in the league. It’s definitely a real thing.
I can’t remember who said it but an interesting explanation I heard was that the routine of players playing on a Saturday and then going home to enjoy their Saturday night and Sunday with their kids and partners is disrupted. It means for almost the entire season they are working every Sunday which effects people. It’s not a physical thing, more so a mental thing.

Remember reading that part of the reason United have looked at building a new stadium is because of non-football events. that Old Trafford, in general, does not have the facilities or layout to host concerts etc - and a new stadium would allow them to build better concourse and corporate stuctures to facilitate other events.

They can't have gone to far on their reviews of this though, because if there was any kind of outline plan for what a new stadium could be and where it could be located, it would have leaked over the years. There can only have been a general review rather than any kind of real planning.

I would love to see United start to develop the land around OT into a real area, like City have done.

Build a smaller ground for Reserve, Academy and Womens football. Build a small training centre for match day prep. A United Hotel as well, though with Hotel Football across the road maybe not needed.

Cookiemunster

GSPfan wrote: »

Re: The Stadium… I’m not going to pretend I know the exact snag list of all the problems but the South Stand being backed onto a railway makes construction very costly by all reports. The roof is in need of repairs. The facilities at the stadium are basic and not in comparison with modern stadiums. I’m pretty sure I read there can be no major European finals at the stadium due to the lack of being able to drive a Beebau onto the pitch. If Spurs modern stadium cost 1 billion and it would cost half of that to build the South Stand then you have to consider if it’s worth it.

Drive a what onto the pitch?

OT has issues and needs serious upgrades, but I doubt it's off the list of possible European final venues. The San Siro hosted the CL final in 2016 and that hasn't had an upgrade since 1990. The Millennium Stadium hosted in 2017 and hasn't been upgraded since it opened in 1998 and has inferior corporate facilities to OT.

I think the reason OT hasn't hosted since 2003 is that the club doesn't have any interest in hosting.

Mitch Connor

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Yeah, I saw that interview, I just dont know why he would give himself the headache

Thinking about it.... could he have had an eye on the protests?

He may not have an interest in working for the Glazers, for reasons you allude to. But could he have been positioning himself for prospective new owners? Anyone who bought the club would likely need to bring in people to run the club for them. Any new owner bringing in VDS to be the face of the club from a governance point of view would be off to a flier. Thinking similar to the City guys bring in tiki begiristain and the barca fellas to run the club for them. Not the same role, but you get the idea.

Just wild speculation on my part, obviously, but I don't think it is insane - anyone can see there is at least the possibility of change, and if the ownership does change, there will be job openings.

I also said when Woodward announced he was leaving, that you could argue an internal appointment could be pointing at a Glazer sale - in that they are just looking to keep things ticking, while an external appointment would arguably show they are 'commited' (as much as they are) to the long term in that an external appointment requires more effort, vetting and vision.

El Gato De Negocios

Fact of the day.

Liverpool have never played a league game at Old Trafford as PL champions.

PhlegmyMoses

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Thinking about it.... could he have had an eye on the protests?

He may not have an interest in working for the Glazers, for reasons you allude to. But could he have been positioning himself for prospective new owners? Anyone who bought the club would likely need to bring in people to run the club for them. Any new owner bringing in VDS to be the face of the club from a governance point of view would be off to a flier. Thinking similar to the City guys bring in tiki begiristain and the barca fellas to run the club for them. Not the same role, but you get the idea.

Just wild speculation on my part, obviously, but I don't think it is insane - anyone can see there is at least the possibility of change, and if the ownership does change, there will be job openings.

I also said when Woodward announced he was leaving, that you could argue an internal appointment could be pointing at a Glazer sale - in that they are just looking to keep things ticking, while an external appointment would arguably show they are 'commited' (as much as they are) to the long term in that an external appointment requires more effort, vetting and vision.

Yeah, bringing in a guy with VDS skills etc for a new ownership structure would be a no brained and it would be a step up for him.

But right now he would just be a lightning rod for fan ire after a while which just seems needless. Ole was that for a while and will become that again at some stage but at least he has built his career from Norway to this. VDS would be leaving a top set up to Uniteds mess

El Gato De Negocios

El Gato De Negocios wrote: »

Fact of the day.

Liverpool have never played a league game at Old Trafford as PL champions.

They didnt even get to hold the title for a full year either having won it near the end of July!

Mitch Connor

Tribalism aside, it is sh1t that they didn't get to do a stadium walk or the like with the trophy in front of a full house. After waiting so long, and winning the title in such a dominant fashion.

I'm still annoyed United didn't get to parade the double in 08 because of Rangers fans.

el Fenomeno

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Tribalism aside, it is sh1t that they didn't get to do a stadium walk or the like with the trophy in front of a full house. After waiting so long, and winning the title in such a dominant fashion.

Yeah that's a real shame.

S.M.B.

You would think that there's little reason (on-field reason anyway, it's hard to no what effect the protests will have) for this United team to not take this game to Liverpool as opposed to the more cautious approach of recent visits.

TheCitizen

Are United likely to field the first pick tonight? 9/5 looks a decent price if theyre playing first string.

Headshot

Another protest seemingly happening today

Great to see but it should be done at every home game tbh

Mitch Connor

TheCitizen wrote: »

Are United likely to field the first pick tonight? 9/5 looks a decent price if theyre playing first string.

Would imagine they will, a few question marks but I'd be certain we'll see

Henders, AWB, Bailly, Lindelof, Shaw, McT, Fred, Bruno, Pogba, Rashford.

The only real question mark is Cavani or Greenwood. Cavani wasn't in the named 11 in the postponed game, but greenwood started tuesday (but also came off after 60 or so).

Hotblack Desiato

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

This aged well, very well indeed. Law ya legend ya.

https://twitter.com/stusfootyflash/status/1392393341350858759?s=21

After we won the replay I drank all of a nearly full bottle of Bacardi, ended up crawling up the stairs into bed on my hands and knees and was hung over for three days

Hotblack Desiato

GSPfan wrote: »

Re: The Stadium… I’m not going to pretend I know the exact snag list of all the problems but the South Stand being backed onto a railway makes construction very costly by all reports.

More difficult but certainly not impossible. The old Lansdowne Road stand was built over the DART line in the 80s. You need possession of the line over 3-4 days (Christmas or Easter), power down and put up a temporary structure and then build away over that.

Ideally the club would have taken the opportunity when building the 3 new stands to move the pitch further away from the line.

The roof is in need of repairs.

That was the south stand roof. The whole south stand is in need of replacement, it's well over 50 years old, nearly 60 I think.

The facilities at the stadium are basic and not in comparison with modern stadiums. I’m pretty sure I read there can be no major European finals at the stadium due to the lack of being able to drive a Beebau onto the pitch.

https://web.archive.org/web/20101210194219/http://www.manutd.com/en/Visit-Old-Trafford/Virtual-Tour.aspx?section=%7BB0531F7F-9461-406D-81A9-ACA2AF687CC9%7D

"The roof of the tunnel can be hydraulically lifted as high as 25 feet to allow large vehicles through the tunnel area."

If Spurs modern stadium cost 1 billion and it would cost half of that to build the South Stand then you have to consider if it’s worth it.

Why do you think it would cost £500 million to replace the south stand though?

Spurs also had to acquire some existing land/buildings which would have been far from cheap.

It’s not a physical thing, more so a mental thing.

Professional footballers don't have a normal working week anyway. I think it's a great excuse though.

TheCitizen

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Would imagine they will, a few question marks but I'd be certain we'll see

Henders, AWB, Bailly, Lindelof, Shaw, McT, Fred, Bruno, Pogba, Rashford.

The only real question mark is Cavani or Greenwood. Cavani wasn't in the named 11 in the postponed game, but greenwood started tuesday (but also came off after 60 or so).

11/10 DNB is what I went for.

El Gato De Negocios

S.M.B. wrote: »

You would think that there's little reason (on-field reason anyway, it's hard to no what effect the protests will have) for this United team to not take this game to Liverpool as opposed to the more cautious approach of recent visits.

Its an intriguing battle. We have nothing to play for in the league but Liverpool have to go for the win. We have been at our best when teams come at us. Fabinho in at centre half really limits their midfield. Im actually pretty confident we can get a win. Obviously they cannot be written off but its as good an opportunity as we've had in recent times for us to beat them. We beat them comfortably enough in the cup when we just went for it.

FourFourRED

https://twitter.com/dtathletic/status/1392883210703486978?s=21

“ There is another bus at team hotel but this is official one (and the tyres have just been let down)”

Dozyart

I find it hard to believe theres any players on that bus....surely the team coach would have a police escort?

Lord TSC

Apparently whoever blocked them in slashed the tyres too, lol.

Cookiemunster

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

That was the south stand roof. The whole south stand is in need of replacement, it's well over 50 years old, nearly 60 I think.

The roof leaked last season at the corner of the Stretford End and the SAF stand.
https://youtu.be/04dpKLrcw0E

xtal191

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/1392887693353365506

Hotblack Desiato

Cookiemunster wrote: »

The roof leaked last season at the corner of the Stretford End and the SAF stand.

Wot I said, sarf stand innit

chupacabra

Some of the chants going on at the protest are a bit over the top. *clutches pearls*

Hotblack Desiato

LFC bus is moving again

https://twitter.com/DTathletic/status/1392888768005279753

Hotblack Desiato

United players are at the stadium so if their opponents don't turn up they'll just have to forfeit :pac:

https://twitter.com/ManUtd/status/1392896871732027393

wanderer100

Great turnout

https://twitter.com/footballdaily/status/1392899335285772289?s=20

xtal191

https://twitter.com/hirstclass/status/1392901071014662145

xtal191

https://twitter.com/samuelluckhurst/status/1392899948283301891?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1392899948283301891%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

GSPfan

I lose all respect for these protests as soon any part of it turns into drunk football hooliganism.

Trying to get games called off is one thing through non violent obstructionism but throwing flares and hassling police is ridiculous.

GSPfan

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Drive a what onto the pitch?

A beebau. An Ambulance or even a Fire Engine. Take your pick.

Beebau beebau beebau.

adox

Liverpool are already in the stadium.