Manchester United Teamtalk/Transfer/Gossip 23/24 - [New Thread Available]

Talisman

Pussyhands wrote: »

How much did Liverpools league winning squad cost?

The players that made league appearances for Liverpool in the 2019/20 season cost a total of £515M.

Alisson (Roma £65M)
Adrian (Bosman £0)
Alexander-Arnold (Academy £0)
van Dijk (Southampton £75M)
Matip (Bosman £0)
Gomez (Charlton £4M)
Lovren (Southampton £35M)
Robertson (Hull City £8M)
Williams (Academy £0)
Fabinho (Monaco £40M)
Wijnaldum (Newcastle £25M)
Henderson (Sunderland £16M)
Oxlade-Chamberlain (Arsenal £35M)
Milner (Bosman £0)
Lallana (Southampton £25M)
Keita (RB Leipzig £52M)
Minamino (RB Salzburg £7M)
Jones (Academy £0)
Mane (Southampton £34M)
Salah (Roma £37M)
Firmino (Hoffenheim £29M)
Shaqiri (Stoke City £13M)
Origi (Lille £11M)
Elliott (Fulham £4M)

£515M / 99 = £5.2M per point

unplayable

13 years ago today what a night

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfH-fL8ZdUU

Lord TSC

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

Athletic reporting Utd would be interested in Ronaldo re-signing over the summer. Hope that isnt true, would be on a bigger deal that DDG at 36.

He'd also bang in 25 goals next season, elevate us to genuine League contenders and help towards going deep into the CL.

Mitch Connor

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

disagree, scoring goals isnt this teams problem, stopping goals+progressing the ball from midfield is this sides issue. he'd be the striker with cavani/greenwood, do we need another 1 year stop gap in that position? a rw+dm is needed this summer not an ageing ronaldo. Juve would have thought he'd have propelled them to CL success, look how thats gone. Pinning hopes and building teams around ageing players isnt a good strategy.

We scored 1 goal in a 1-1 draw with West Brom, and same vs Fulham. We scored 1 at home in a loss to Sheffield United. Scoring goals is a problem for United.

in terms of transfer fee he would cost very little, probably similar to Ings.

Yes, RW and DM are needed, but I don't think anyone advocating for signing Ronaldo or Ings are saying otherwise. In fact, I am saying signing Ronaldo or Ings probably allows funds to be spent on those positions - where as signing Haaland or Kane likely uses up either all of the budget or only leaves enough for a squad/cheap addition.

fatherted1969

Pussyhands wrote: »

That's down to Klopp, not the scouts.

We were linked with Jimenez for 75m...Liverpool out of nowhere sign Jota for 40m and he turns out to be excellent. Just like Salah was bought for 35m and no one thought anything of it and look what he's done.

Put Steve Bruce in the Liverpool job with the same scouts and they wouldn't be winning leagues.

Is Jota not injury prone ? How many games has he missed with injury this season ?

On another note I baffles me at times when people compare price tags from 4 seasons ago as if a player could still be bought for this amount now. All just to throw a dig

fatherted1969

Pussyhands wrote: »

Poch, Tuchel were available. No coincidence Chelsea improved by sacking Lampard and replaced him with a top manager.

There's others who could win us the league. They may not if they were given a chance, but I believe they could.

Ole, I don't think can win us a league.

Tuchel had a bottomless pit of money at PSG, winning the French league is an absolute minimum of whats expected of him and he got sacked for not even doing that. Poch has no credentials for a title challenge either, that being said it wouldn't bother me if they managed Utd. Chelsea bought well last year and I'd fully expect them to challenge next season if he can manage the expectations of the owner

Utd have a bit to go yet with the squad but I'm happy enough with how its going with Ole. Need 3 starting players in this summer though

Mitch Connor

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

yeah which is my point, progressing the ball is more of an issue against these teams which is down to midfielders. expecting someone like mctominay to progress the ball at this stage is futile hes incapable. fred is ok but is too streaky.

imo going into next season with Cavani as the only proper number 9 would be stupid, and if a cheap and smart deal could be done for Ronaldo or Ings, allowing us to buy a new midfielder and Shanco, I think it would be great business.

We cannot and should not being relying on Martial to be that striker, and Cavani has also proven that while he can be relied up when he plays, his playing time has to be managed, and that will likely be not better next season as he will be that bit older.

Lucas Hood

Wouldn't be surprised to see Martial replace Memphis at Lyon.

Robson99

Mitch Connor wrote: »

imo going into next season with Cavani as the only proper number 9 would be stupid, and if a cheap and smart deal could be done for Ronaldo or Ings, allowing us to buy a new midfielder and Shanco, I think it would be great business.

We cannot and should not being relying on Martial to be that striker, and Cavani has also proven that while he can be relied up when he plays, his playing time has to be managed, and that will likely be not better next season as he will be that bit older.

Ronaldo / Ings, Varane and Rice should be achievable however just not sure that Ronaldo or Ings are what we need. Ronaldo past his best and is Ings really good enough...I'm not sure.
Would love Kane but that will probably blow our budget.
The Serbian striker who plays with Fiorentina Vlahovic might be an option for CF.

Mitch Connor

Robson99 wrote: »

Ronaldo / Ings, Varane and Rice should be achievable however just not sure that Ronaldo or Ings are what we need. Ronaldo past his best and is Ings really good enough...I'm not sure.
Would love Kane but that will probably blow our budget.
The Serbian striker who plays with Fiorentina Vlahovic might be an option for CF.

Vlahovic is very interesting, but you are probably looking at 70 or so for him.

I think we could sign him, and another starter signing (Varane or Rice for example) but not another player like Sancho, imo.

I reckon we can get 1 top attacking - so the choice would be Sancho and Ings (for example) vs Vlahovic and... no idea who the cheap winger would be.

EltonJohn69

Ronaldo would definitely make things interesting

Liam O

Lucas Hood wrote: »

Wouldn't be surprised to see Martial replace Memphis at Lyon.

It would surprise me as he's probably on 3-5 times the wage at the moment.

Lord TSC

Liam O wrote: »

It would surprise me as he's probably on 3-5 times the wage at the moment.

If he goes, no matter where it is, we will likely be subsidising some wages. Same with DDG. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be moving them on though. Getting a chunk of their wages off the books and a fee of some sort is better than having expensive deadweights on the bench.

Pussyhands

fatherted1969 wrote: »

Is Jota not injury prone ? How many games has he missed with injury this season ?

On another note I baffles me at times when people compare price tags from 4 seasons ago as if a player could still be bought for this amount now. All just to throw a dig

Higuain was bought for 90m euros 5 years ago, let's not act like 35m pounds was an outrageous amount. Salah wasn't anywhere near being talked about as a player that could score 30 goals a season.

TRC10

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

not many managers win things, counting out a manager for not winning isnt the best way to go about things.

I just think it's funny that some people here think that Poch is the answer, and appointing him is the magic bullet to winning titles, when he had a team of players like Lloris, Walker, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Erikson, Ali, Son and Kane, and failed to win anything in 6th years. Not even a cup. And now he's about to lose the PSG league with PSG.

Pussyhands

Mitch Connor wrote: »

imo going into next season with Cavani as the only proper number 9 would be stupid, and if a cheap and smart deal could be done for Ronaldo or Ings, allowing us to buy a new midfielder and Shanco, I think it would be great business.

We cannot and should not being relying on Martial to be that striker, and Cavani has also proven that while he can be relied up when he plays, his playing time has to be managed, and that will likely be not better next season as he will be that bit older.

Agreed, everyone is loving Cavani at the minute and have him down as our best striker but he started off well, then went on a bit of a barren run and had injuries and now he's back in form again.

From gameweek 11 - gameweek 30 he scored 4 goals. (that's 21 games due to 2 double gameweeks)

pjohnson

Ronaldo would obviously help with progressing the ball forward.

Sure he may be playing as a striker last few years but I cant see any issue putting him on the right again (or anywhere in the front 3) he doesn't appear to be declining in the least and still has his pace, dribbling, strength, aerial prowess etc.

Ronaldo may be 35 but he seems to be that special type like Ibra/Cavani where age is actually completely meaningless. Sure we probably cant sell him on for much profit but christ he will instantly improve the team considerably.

ShooterSF

So who gets the number 7 jersey?

StringerBell

TRC10 wrote: »

I just think it's funny that some people here think that Poch is the answer, and appointing him is the magic bullet to winning titles, when he had a team of players like Lloris, Walker, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Erikson, Ali, Son and Kane, and failed to win anything in 6th years. Not even a cup. And now he's about to lose the PSG league with PSG.

Who here thinks appointing poch is the magic bullet to winning titles?

v3ttel

StringerBell wrote: »

Who here thinks appointing poch is the magic bullet to winning titles?

In fairness, there were plenty of posts here calling for Poch to replace Ole.

Sirsok

On this day in 2008 Manchester United beat Chelsea on penalties after scores tied at 1-1 after extra time to win the Champions League

I was in Christy's Bar and here's that story!

https://scoreline.ie/on-this-day-2008-uefa-champions-league-final-manchester-united-versus-chelsea/

Also same day United beat Palace in the FA Cup final a few years back

el Fenomeno

Sirsok wrote: »

On this day in 2008 Manchester United beat Chelsea on penalties after scores tied at 1-1 after extra time to win the Champions League

I was in Christy's Bar and here's that story!

https://scoreline.ie/on-this-day-2008-uefa-champions-league-final-manchester-united-versus-chelsea/

Also same day United beat Palace in the FA Cup final a few years back

I was in a pub in Belfast that was packed to the rafters. After Anelka missed, a United fan who was trolling Chelsea fans all night got a bit too in their face with celebrations, and promptly got glassed over the head by one of them.

We left fairly sharpish. That was my first live glassing.

Your Airbag

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

because he is a far superior manager. proof is in what he did with his 2 jobs in the PL. hes not a magic bullet especially with city around but i dont think its even a question as to whether or not he would be an upgrade.

Not too sure why this topic is even being discussed tbh, Ole is in no danger of losing his job.

Serous question, if Ole wins us the Europa and we finish in 2nd then thats more than Poch has achieved with two English clubs and done is less time than Ole. Doesn't that then make Ole the superior manager? Also far superior is a stretch.

StringerBell

v3ttel wrote: »

In fairness, there were plenty of posts here calling for Poch to replace Ole.

That's not what was said though, or what I asked.

It was a specific statement so am curious to know who here said he is a magic bullet to winning titles

Lord TSC

Monserrat Rotten Parrot wrote: »

Not too sure why this topic is even being discussed tbh, Ole is in no danger of losing his job.

Because at one stage, there was a hunger for Poch to replace Ole, Poch will forever be brought up by people defending Ole, especially if he struggles at PSG. Its a weird inferiority complex. I've not seen anyone bring up Poch for months, except for those trying to defend Ole. Most people who seemed to want Poch dropped him as a replacement subject once he was no longer available.

StringerBell

Your Airbag wrote: »

Serous question, if Ole wins us the Europa and we finish in 2nd then thats more than Poch has achieved with two English clubs and done is less time than Ole. Doesn't that then make Ole the superior manager? Also far superior is a stretch.

Not sure really, it certainly narrows the gap between them. I have never been the biggest fan of Poch but would certainly hold him in higher regard currently than Ole.

Ole would definitely be making a strong case by winning the trophy and back to back cl qualification. Of course the quality of the players has to come into it but it would deserve respect. This season hasn't really done Poch any favours, I think it takes even more shine off him and ole reaching a final and maintaining a strong league campaign has improved his.

My own opinion of Ole, and how far he can take the team, how good he is as a manager is well documented at this point but I don't hesitate to credit where it's due. It's a big opportunity for him to get over a hump this season and if he does it he will deserve the credit for it, forgetting why we are in the competition to begin with.

Pussyhands

Your Airbag wrote: »

Serous question, if Ole wins us the Europa and we finish in 2nd then thats more than Poch has achieved with two English clubs and done is less time than Ole. Doesn't that then make Ole the superior manager? Also far superior is a stretch.

You're really comparing achievements of Spurs and Utd?

By the way, reaching a CL final is 100 times more of an achievement than winning the losers trophy. Maybe Jose shouldn't have qualified us for a Champions League knockout round v Sevilla, sure he'd have been better off getting relegated to Europa and having easy rounds v Ludo.


Europa league doesn't matter at all as a trophy, it's up there with the league cup for me.

Sure when we were in the final with Jose, no one really cared about the trophy, it was 99% about qualifying for the CL and then signing Griezmann...

And actually, what Poch did with Spurs was an insane achievement. I think it's a far greater achievement than Ole who took over a team that finished 2nd the year previous and won the Europa league 18 months previous....

Ole is getting judged against Mourinhos lowest point as if that was the true level of the team. The fact Ole came in and immediately, without training or players, went on a winning streak and collected one of the highest points total of his tenure in that season, show us that the players Ole took over were very good.

paulbok

el Fenomeno wrote: »

I was in a pub in Belfast that was packed to the rafters. After Anelka missed, a United fan who was trolling Chelsea fans all night got a bit too in their face with celebrations, and promptly got glassed over the head by one of them.

We left fairly sharpish. That was my first live glassing.

First? :eek::eek:

Lord TSC

Simon Stone, BBC: OGS not expecting Harry Maguire to be fit for the Europa League final despite last night's appearance without protective boot. "He is walking but it is a long way from there to running. We will give him every chance but I don’t think we will see him in Gdansk."

Zeek12

Have to hope we go with Lindelof + Tuanzebe then (assuming Maguire won't make it).

Bailly and Lindelof together are just never convincing as a pair.
And a European final is hardly the night to expect that will change.

TRC10

Lord TSC wrote: »

Because at one stage, there was a hunger for Poch to replace Ole, Poch will forever be brought up by people defending Ole, especially if he struggles at PSG. Its a weird inferiority complex. I've not seen anyone bring up Poch for months, except for those trying to defend Ole. Most people who seemed to want Poch dropped him as a replacement subject once he was no longer available.

Pussyhands wrote: »

Poch, Tuchel were available. No coincidence Chelsea improved by sacking Lampard and replaced him with a top manager.

There's others who could win us the league. They may not if they were given a chance, but I believe they could.

Ole, I don't think can win us a league.

.

Pussyhands

Nuno gone from wolves. Must be going to Spurs

Mitch Connor

Zeek12 wrote: »

Have to hope we go with Lindelof + Tuanzebe then (assuming Maguire won't make it).

Bailly and Lindelof together are just never convincing as a pair.
And a European final is hardly the night to expect that will change.

taking speculation into account for my thinking here - Lindelof and Bailly have to be the starters.

Speculation: We are after a new CB.
Fact: Bailly signed a new contract
Speculation: A new CB signed would see Tuanzebe being sold (Maguire, New CB, Lindelof, Bailly).

If the above speculation proves true, how can we rate Tuanzebe above Bailly and start Tuanzebe over him in a final.

Whatsisname

Nuno leaving Wolves. I'll take one Neves and one Neto please.

Zeek12

Mitch Connor wrote: »

taking speculation into account for my thinking here - Lindelof and Bailly have to be the starters.

Speculation: We are after a new CB.
Fact: Bailly signed a new contract
Speculation: A new CB signed would see Tuanzebe being sold (Maguire, New CB, Lindelof, Bailly).

If the above speculation proves true, how can we rate Tuanzebe above Bailly and start Tuanzebe over him in a final.

There is not very much to choose between them. And neither pairing is great.
But personally I would prefer Tuanzebe. Bailly's performance against Liverpool was worrying.

Given how open we look defensively without Maguire (and we really do look fragile), maybe Ole will consider 3 CBs?

Its worked for him before in some big games. Could have Shaw as the 3rd CB.

dave_o_brien

Mitch Connor wrote: »

taking speculation into account for my thinking here - Lindelof and Bailly have to be the starters.

Speculation: We are after a new CB.
Fact: Bailly signed a new contract
Speculation: A new CB signed would see Tuanzebe being sold (Maguire, New CB, Lindelof, Bailly).

If the above speculation proves true, how can we rate Tuanzebe above Bailly and start Tuanzebe over him in a final.

Untestable hypothesis.

piplip87

I see Aletico are open to sending Felix on his way. Looking at a swap for Griezman. I wonder would Martial do as a swap there ?

piplip87

Whatsisname wrote: »

Nuno leaving Wolves. I'll take one Neves and one Neto please.

Match made in Nuno hasn't won a trophy either.

KH25

Whatsisname wrote: »

Nuno leaving Wolves. I'll take one Neves and one Neto please.

Would absolutely take Neves.

Cookiemunster

piplip87 wrote: »

I see Aletico are open to sending Felix on his way. Looking at a swap for Griezman. I wonder would Martial do as a swap there ?

They sold Griezmann for €120m and spent that on Felix. Not a hope Martial is worth anywhere near that.

el Fenomeno

paulbok wrote: »

First? :eek::eek:

I later saw a girl glass another girl at a festival, but it was one of those plastic pint cups and to be honest, she came out worse as the force of squishing the cup projected most of the beer back on top of herself.

TRC10

Pussyhands wrote: »

Maybe Jose shouldn't have qualified us for a Champions League knockout round v Sevilla, sure he'd have been better off getting relegated to Europa and having easy rounds v Ludo.

Europa league doesn't matter at all as a trophy, it's up there with the league cup for me.

That first part is a complete strawman, literally nobody is saying that.

If the EL really doesn't matter as a trophy to you, you're saying you don't care if we win or lose on Wednesday....yeah, somehow i doubt that.

Mitch Connor

We won't sell the club to any player on the promise of Europa glory.
We certainly won't when we are a CL club at the start of the season.

But we are in the final, and winning the EL will sell the club as a better prospect to players than losing it on Wednesday night. Plus, trophies and celebration is what fans should be about.

beno619

DM_7 wrote: »

United were not a high performing side adding depth to a strong squad with those signings, they were trying to fill massive gaps in the side.

Hmm I'm not sure I agree with this. The United squad had finished 2nd with our highest points total post Fergie and the season before that picked up the League Cup and Europa League.

The start of the 18/19 season was truly terrible but I feel there's some amount of revisionism going on about the situation we were in when Jose was fired, that is unless you believe Jose was performing miracles with a bunch of pub players in the first place ?

Hotblack Desiato

Pussyhands wrote: »

Europa league doesn't matter at all as a trophy, it's up there with the league cup for me.

Were you saying that about the CWC in '91? :rolleyes:

beno619

beno619 wrote: »

Hmm I'm not sure I agree with this. The United squad had finished 2nd with our highest points total post Fergie and the season before that picked up the League Cup and Europa League.

The start of the 18/19 season was truly terrible but I feel there's some amount of revisionism going on about the situation we were in when Jose was fired, that is unless you believe Jose was performing miracles with a bunch of pub players in the first place ?

The squad didn't really. We don't have a squad capable of covering if we get any injuries as we are seeing now with Maguire injured. We played a full strength team in practically every match with the odd change across the front 3.

When you think back to the glory days and some of the back up players we had. Compare some of the below to the options we have now for rotation or if someone is out injured and you will see how far off we are having enough depth in our squad and team even in some positions.

John O'Shea
Phil Neville
Henning Berg
Nicky Butt
Jesper Blomqvist
Darren Fletcher
Teddy Sheringham
Ole himself
Park Ji Sung

That's just off the top of my head. All players the could come in for a period of games and big games at that and not lessen the overall quality of the team. We have a team now with Fred and McTominay as the central midfield. They are the worst partnership in a long time and we are going nowhere until positions like that are improved on.

Adamocovic

Personally think some fans need a reality check.

We’re not in the position to turn our noses up at the prospect of winning the Europa league.

No matter how beneath it seems to feel for some fans we should be looking to win it, and I wouldn’t judge any player or fan who takes joy out of winning it.

DM_7

beno619 wrote: »

Hmm I'm not sure I agree with this. The United squad had finished 2nd with our highest points total post Fergie and the season before that picked up the League Cup and Europa League.

The start of the 18/19 season was truly terrible but I feel there's some amount of revisionism going on about the situation we were in when Jose was fired, that is unless you believe Jose was performing miracles with a bunch of pub players in the first place ?

I think your quote excludes the context about the players who left since then which is a key item to consider, United were not just buying to kick on and improve on players with previous options moving to squad and rotation roles, they were buying to replace people full stop.

It was not like City buying Mahrez to add to Sterling and Silva for example.

Most of what United have done since then has only allowed them to keep pace with the kind of results they were getting but now, due to the age profile of the squad, the club can start making the Mahrez type signing.

To me United were a good side back then, no more and not high performing in terms of really in the reckoning for the league ot champions league. Second was a good season but the squad base was still low conpared to the output that fans desire (Able to win a league and or champions league) The loss the Sevilla was perfect example of where the squad was.

In 17/18 the United side included Young as first choice left back, Valencia as Right back, Smalling at CB. All are gone. The two main forwards are gone (Lukaku and Sanchez), gone from midfield is Herrera. Lingard is gone on loan. Matic is now a squad player replaced by other players already at the club (Fred and McT). Mata and Jones are as good as gone. Fellaini, Darmian and Rojo were relatively minor squad players but are gone.

xtal191

Adamocovic

Exactly wrote: »

The squad didn't really. We don't have a squad capable of covering if we get any injuries as we are seeing now with Maguire injured. We played a full strength team in practically every match with the odd change across the front 3.

When you think back to the glory days and some of the back up players we had. Compare some of the below to the options we have now for rotation or if someone is out injured and you will see how far off we are having enough depth in our squad and team even in some positions.

John O'Shea
Phil Neville
Henning Berg
Nicky Butt
Jesper Blomqvist
Darren Fletcher
Teddy Sheringham
Ole himself
Park Ji Sung

That's just off the top of my head. All players the could come in for a period of games and big games at that and not lessen the overall quality of the team. We have a team now with Fred and McTominay as the central midfield. They are the worst partnership in a long time and we are going nowhere until positions like that are improved on.

List had me thinking a bit.

It’s mad to think Ole who had a reputation of being a super sub or bench player finished his career with us as our 7th all time top scorer (correct me if wrong).

It’s a shame he had those injury plagued season. Although he was an irregular starter he consistently was chipping in goals during the season. Think nearly half his appearances came off the bench.

Pretty sure during the treble season he pitched in with 12 league goals despite only starting 9 league games.

Really could do with a backup player who can be a consistent scorer these days.