Arlene, Edwin, her replacement and his replacement as leader of the DUP

Shebean

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Northern Ireland made a profit for the rest of Britain from foundation into the 1960s when the Civil Rights crowd started up. They are hard working people and if it wasn't for the distraction of violence would be an economic powerhouse. The South doesn't want the North because the Southern Irish elites know that they would soon end up playing second fiddle to Northerners in an enlarged state.

Them and their call for equal rights and an end to an apartheid state, the blaggards :rolleyes:

Do you think that 'crowd' were sitting around bored one day and decided to find something to do? I wouldn't be speaking on the north if that was my level of knowledge on the 'civil rights crowd'.
You've a point about the southern 'elites' to be fair.


The DUP are set for a split I reckon. They are coming apart.

Strazdas

AdrianG08 wrote: »

Some drama, who would have thought it would be Poots and Givern who would usher in the Irish language act and insist that the rest of the party fall into line and accept differing identities on the island.

https://twitter.com/rtenews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1405490715820539906%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.rte.ie%2Fnews%2F2021%2F0617%2F1228654-northern-ireland-latest%2F

Did Sammy Wilson not vote in favour of Poots? He was supposedly shouting the odds "NEVER" etc.. at Poots during the party meeting last night.

So does this mean Arlene was ousted because she was too opposed to the Irish language act again?

This part is definitely weird. It was rumoured that the hardliners / fanatics within the party such as Wilson and Paisley Jr were strongly pro-Poots, but it seems Wilson has already turned on him.

FrancieBrady

Strazdas wrote: »

This part is definitely weird. It was rumoured that the hardliners / fanatics within the party such as Wilson and Paisley Jr were strongly pro-Poots, but it seems Wilson has already turned on him.

Seems to be three factions emerging. Foster's, Poots, and now Sammy's

blanch152

TheCitizen wrote: »

Of course there is if you say so LOL. Who is articulating this “third way” exactly. They’re keeping it under wraps perhaps?

BonnieSituation wrote: »

No there's not.

But you're more than welcome to lead a third way and a renegotiation if you wish. That's the great thing about democracy.

Off you go now to build your consensus.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

This republican has asked you to point to a politician/politic party advocating for an Independent NI. You have, as yet, not provided any.

As yet you have only created the illusion that this is all in your head. The last bastion of partitionists and belligerent Unionists is an 'independent NI' traditionally.

Do you think that is how it will play out in a border poll, those two ideologies will coalesce to offer an alternative to a UI?

I have posted reading material on here already several times.

https://www.finegael.ie/speech-of-the-tanaiste-leo-varadkar-at-the-opening-of-the-2021-fine-gael-ard-fheis/

"There are three minorities, one that defines itself as British and Unionist, another as Irish and Nationalist, and a third and growing middle ground, many born since the Good Friday Agreement, who refuse to be defined in this way. They see themselves as both Irish and British or perhaps simply Northern Irish"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/globalassets/documents/raise/knowledge_exchange/briefing_papers/series4/northern_ireland_identity_garry_mcnicholl_policy_document.pdf

"Northern Irishness does appear to be a real common ingroup identity,
inclusive of both Protestants and Catholics. It is associated with pro-social attitudes towards outgroup members so that prejudice is at
a lower level than with Irish or British identifiers. Based on our theoretical assumptions not only is this identity correlated with more
supportive attitudes to social mixing, but that contact is in fact its cause. "

https://www.ark.ac.uk/ARK/sites/default/files/2021-03/update138_0.pdf

"it is important that
the rejection of traditional patterns of
identity are acknowledged by politicians,
policy makers, and especially by those
implementing the New Decade New
Approach document"

There is a lesson in that last quote for you guys.

The fear in your posts can be felt through the internet.

AdrianG08

Strazdas wrote: »

This part is definitely weird. It was rumoured that the hardliners / fanatics within the party such as Wilson and Paisley Jr were strongly pro-Poots, but it seems Wilson has already turned on him.

Its funny because everyone presumed that it would have been Donaldson who would have tried to soft soap it and "appease nationalists" if he was allowed lead the DUP.

Now it seems that Donaldson (who was pro Arlene Foster I believe) is teaming up with Sammy and Nigel Dodds to try and oppose Poots. Its getting more confusing by the minute

They have all backed themselves into corners in fairness, none of them really have a move left that will appease the hardliners but also get things moving politically in the north.

All with the backdrop of the UK government telling them to go feck themselves. Apart from Boris obviously, who is still talking nonsense trying to make it look like he is everyones friend.

I have this picture of Johnson sitting in his office mouthing off on the phone passionately defending the sacred Union and NI's place in that, only to hang up the phone and laugh loudly with his toff tory mates claiming "those ulstermen are at it again".

Claw Hammer

pixelburp wrote: »

Got a source for the first bit? It's a big claim and so I'm sure you have some figures to show this success.

https://factcheckni.org/articles/how-dependent-is-stormont-on-westminster-subvention/

realdanbreen

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Embarrassing really.

Paisley junior would disgust his father.

Anyone can Clearly see he is well and truly buckled on stage with “van the man”.

The only thing that would have disgusted old man Paisley would be the fact that junior doesn't appear to have inherited the same amount of bigotry that his father had.

Faugheen

Meanwhile, Arlene:

https://twitter.com/arlenefosteruk/status/1405514842895699971?s=21

realdanbreen

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We have 100 years of evidence that NI was designed to be ungovernable by itself. 25 years evidence that it is even difficult being run under the auspices of an international agreement.

Simply not true.

We have absolutely no evidence of that as NI has never been free of Britains influence . Most people nowadays , apart from those whose minds and often bodies, are entrenched in ghettos, do not give two hoots about republicanis/unionism , they just want a decent and fair quality of life. apart from the aforementioned diehards, most have also grown weary of all the religious nonsense.

Strazdas

AdrianG08 wrote: »

Its funny because everyone presumed that it would have been Donaldson who would have tried to soft soap it and "appease nationalists" if he was allowed lead the DUP.

Now it seems that Donaldson (who was pro Arlene Foster I believe) is teaming up with Sammy and Nigel Dodds to try and oppose Poots. Its getting more confusing by the minute

They have all backed themselves into corners in fairness, none of them really have a move left that will appease the hardliners but also get things moving politically in the north.

All with the backdrop of the UK government telling them to go feck themselves. Apart from Boris obviously, who is still talking nonsense trying to make it look like he is everyones friend.

I have this picture of Johnson sitting in his office mouthing off on the phone passionately defending the sacred Union and NI's place in that, only to hang up the phone and laugh loudly with his toff tory mates claiming "those ulstermen are at it again".

It is clearly a very deeply divided party with a fundamentalist wing and a slightly more moderate one but it would appear that even within this, some individuals are switching sides for tactical reasons. Can it even survive as a party? These divisions seem really big.

TheCitizen

blanch152 wrote: »

I have posted reading material on here already several times.

https://www.finegael.ie/speech-of-the-tanaiste-leo-varadkar-at-the-opening-of-the-2021-fine-gael-ard-fheis/

"There are three minorities, one that defines itself as British and Unionist, another as Irish and Nationalist, and a third and growing middle ground, many born since the Good Friday Agreement, who refuse to be defined in this way. They see themselves as both Irish and British or perhaps simply Northern Irish"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/globalassets/documents/raise/knowledge_exchange/briefing_papers/series4/northern_ireland_identity_garry_mcnicholl_policy_document.pdf

"Northern Irishness does appear to be a real common ingroup identity,
inclusive of both Protestants and Catholics. It is associated with pro-social attitudes towards outgroup members so that prejudice is at
a lower level than with Irish or British identifiers. Based on our theoretical assumptions not only is this identity correlated with more
supportive attitudes to social mixing, but that contact is in fact its cause. "

https://www.ark.ac.uk/ARK/sites/default/files/2021-03/update138_0.pdf

"it is important that
the rejection of traditional patterns of
identity are acknowledged by politicians,
policy makers, and especially by those
implementing the New Decade New
Approach document"

There is a lesson in that last quote for you guys.

The fear in your posts can be felt through the internet.

“The fear”, what fear? If enough of them want to create an Independent Northern Ireland they can go ahead. The reports you’re referring do not translate to the possibility of an Independent Northern Ireland. They may refer to a breaking down of that traditional identity politics which is no harm at all and makes a United Ireland more feasible. There’s no sense at all of a political agenda around an Independent Northern Ireland from those articles you linked. Why are you so fearful and set against a potential United Ireland?

maccored

realdanbreen wrote: »

Simply not true.

We have absolutely no evidence of that as NI has never been free of Britains influence . Most people nowadays , apart from those whose minds and often bodies, are entrenched in ghettos, do not give two hoots about republicanis/unionism , they just want a decent and fair quality of life. apart from the aforementioned diehards, most have also grown weary of all the religious nonsense.

plenty of evidence over the past 100 years to show NI cant viably rule itself. It lasted about a decade before costing more to run it than it made

Tyrone212

Stephen Nolan

Breaking :
Source tells me Peter Robinson believes Edwin Poots “cannot survive this” , the party “must make change quickly” because it is “currently a laughing stock”
I understand Robinson believes Poots is currently “beneath the water line”

Haha

realdanbreen

maccored wrote: »

plenty of evidence over the past 100 years to show NI cant viably rule itself. It lasted about a decade before costing more to run it than it made

Show me where or when NI has ever been allowed to operate as a completely independent non secrarian state free from religious bigotry and interference from Britain and elsewhere, it simply hasn't happened.

Junkyard Tom

blanch152 wrote: »

The fear in your posts can be felt through the internet.

The only fear on display is yours at the prospect of a United Ireland, it's palpable.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

I have posted reading material on here already several times.

https://www.finegael.ie/speech-of-the-tanaiste-leo-varadkar-at-the-opening-of-the-2021-fine-gael-ard-fheis/

"There are three minorities, one that defines itself as British and Unionist, another as Irish and Nationalist, and a third and growing middle ground, many born since the Good Friday Agreement, who refuse to be defined in this way. They see themselves as both Irish and British or perhaps simply Northern Irish"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/globalassets/documents/raise/knowledge_exchange/briefing_papers/series4/northern_ireland_identity_garry_mcnicholl_policy_document.pdf

"Northern Irishness does appear to be a real common ingroup identity,
inclusive of both Protestants and Catholics. It is associated with pro-social attitudes towards outgroup members so that prejudice is at
a lower level than with Irish or British identifiers. Based on our theoretical assumptions not only is this identity correlated with more
supportive attitudes to social mixing, but that contact is in fact its cause. "

https://www.ark.ac.uk/ARK/sites/default/files/2021-03/update138_0.pdf

"it is important that
the rejection of traditional patterns of
identity are acknowledged by politicians,
policy makers, and especially by those
implementing the New Decade New
Approach document"

There is a lesson in that last quote for you guys.

The fear in your posts can be felt through the internet.

Whenever you are ready to post where anybody but frightened partitionists or belligerent Unionists are advcating politically for an Independent NI, fire away blanch.

Junkyard Tom

realdanbreen wrote: »

Show me where or when NI has ever been allowed to operate as a completely independent non secrarian state free from religious bigotry and interference from Britain and elsewhere, it simply hasn't happened.

It was designed as a sectarian enclave for Protestants/Unionists, it was designed to fail, and it looks like it's all coming to an end with a fizzle.

Frankly, the desire to build a political wall around it, and trap those who want out within its dysfunction, is little but a sadistic partitionist torture-fantasy.

Dempo1

Faugheen wrote: »

Meanwhile, Arlene:

https://twitter.com/arlenefosteruk/status/1405514842895699971?s=21

I'd say she's like a Cheshire cat, who's just got a bowl of cream for dessert at the moment

Dempo1

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Stephen Nolan

Breaking :
Source tells me Peter Robinson believes Edwin Poots “cannot survive this” , the party “must make change quickly” because it is “currently a laughing stock”
I understand Robinson believes Poots is currently “beneath the water line”

Haha

Stephen Nolan, another Tulip, kind of reminds me of Billy Bunter

Jizique

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Seems to be three factions emerging. Foster's, Poots, and now Sammy's

So with 3 factions, we need to add the LVF to the DUP/UDA/UVF mix

ohnonotgmail

Faugheen wrote: »

Meanwhile, Arlene:

https://twitter.com/arlenefosteruk/status/1405514842895699971?s=21

Living well is the best revenge.

Strazdas

The big game changer would / will be Scotland voting for independence. The whole raison d'etre of the 'United Kingdom' was the union between England and Scotland.

Scotland withdrawing from it would be a huge event and have major implications for the island of Ireland.

FrancieBrady

'A meeting of the executive officers of the DUP will shortly inform Poots they have no confidence in him' according to RTE.

Yikes...events moving fast.

breezy1985

FrancieBrady wrote: »

'A meeting of the executive officers of the DUP will shortly inform Poots they have no confidence in him' according to RTE.

Yikes...events moving fast.

How can you have no confidence in they guy you just elected ?

Tyrone212

Dempo1 wrote: »

Stephen Nolan, another Tulip, kind of reminds me of Billy Bunter

Yes he's not at all likeable.

Dempo1

breezy1985 wrote: »

How can you have no confidence in they guy you just elected ?

It's called NI politics

FrancieBrady

Dempo1 wrote: »

It's called NI politics

Nearly as bad as trying to get an Agriculture minister to stick here.

Dempo1

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nearly as bad as trying to get an Agriculture minister to stick here.

touché

josip

FrancieBrady wrote: »

'A meeting of the executive officers of the DUP will shortly inform Poots they have no confidence in him' according to RTE.

Yikes...events moving fast.

Too fast, the longer he stays the more damage he will do to the DUP.

votecounts

https://mobile.twitter.com/thejournal_ie/status/1405556996682797056


Hard to believe, that his leadership could come to an end so quickly. Is this all because of an Irish Language Act that they agreed to 15 years ago.